1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

OK, this is a new one on me. After its 29th oil change, my '91 Accord's
maintenance indicator refuses to reset when I try to push the key into
the slot. There is more resistance than normal and though I have now
pushed fairly hard, I am reluctant to push *too* hard. Anyone know what
might have happened or whether this is easy to fix?

(Yes, I wrote the mileage down so I change the oil on time for #30 at
224K. No, I'm not going to buy a new instrument cluster for a car that
just had its 19th birthday.)

--
JRE

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in news:hdu3e9$98n$1@news.eternal-
september.org:

> OK, this is a new one on me. After its 29th oil change, my '91 Accord's
> maintenance indicator refuses to reset when I try to push the key into
> the slot. There is more resistance than normal and though I have now
> pushed fairly hard, I am reluctant to push *too* hard. Anyone know what
> might have happened or whether this is easy to fix?


One of the FAQ'est of the FAQs. See here:
<http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/maintenance-reqd-light.html>

This page does show up in Google, but you have to try several times.



--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

Tegger wrote:
> JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in news:hdu3e9$98n$1@news.eternal-
> september.org:
>
>> OK, this is a new one on me. After its 29th oil change, my '91 Accord's
>> maintenance indicator refuses to reset when I try to push the key into
>> the slot. There is more resistance than normal and though I have now
>> pushed fairly hard, I am reluctant to push *too* hard. Anyone know what
>> might have happened or whether this is easy to fix?
>
>
> One of the FAQ'est of the FAQs. See here:
> <http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/maintenance-reqd-light.html>
>
> This page does show up in Google, but you have to try several times.

No, no, no. This is not the MIL, aka "Check Engine" light. It's not
connected to the computer and does not indicate an engine or emissions
malfunction. (And, yes, I know how to jumper the pins and read the
blinking code if the MIL does happen to come on.) It's not even a light!

This is the *mechanical* service due indicator on a '91 that shows in a
window below the odometer to show whether an oil service is due, and it
changes from green to yellow to red as one approaches 7,500 miles from
the last reset. It's mechanically reset by pushing the key into a slot
that resets the mechanism. Behind the window is a wheel I suspect is
mechanically driven by the odometer's hundreds position wheel, but I
have never had one apart to look. It could equally well be geared from
a stepper motor driven off pulses from the vehicle speed sensor but the
mechanical solution seems likely to have been cheaper since there's
probably already one of those driving the odometer and plastic gears
cost less than good stepper motors.

Anyway, it refused to reset after the oil change over the weekend. I've
tried every 25-30 miles or so since then, and when I got home tonight I
tried again and it reset! I have no idea what had it hung up and was
wondering if anyone knew how it worked. I'm still curious. Anyone know
what might have happened?

--
JRE

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
news:hdv7tg$5gq$1@news.eternal-september.org:

> Tegger wrote:
>> JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
>> news:hdu3e9$98n$1@news.eternal- september.org:
>>
>>> OK, this is a new one on me. After its 29th oil change, my '91
>>> Accord's maintenance indicator refuses to reset when I try to push
>>> the key into the slot. There is more resistance than normal and
>>> though I have now pushed fairly hard, I am reluctant to push *too*
>>> hard. Anyone know what might have happened or whether this is easy
>>> to fix?
>>
>>
>> One of the FAQ'est of the FAQs. See here:
>> <http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/maintenance-reqd-light.html>
>>
>> This page does show up in Google, but you have to try several times.
>
> No, no, no. This is not the MIL, aka "Check Engine" light. It's not
> connected to the computer and does not indicate an engine or emissions
> malfunction.



You never even looked at the page I referenced. You never even read its
NAME.


> (And, yes, I know how to jumper the pins and read the
> blinking code if the MIL does happen to come on.) It's not even a
> light!



Did I SAY it was the MIL? Of course not. I knew exactly what you needed and
the page I referenced deals with exactly that.



>
> Anyway, it refused to reset after the oil change over the weekend.
> I've tried every 25-30 miles or so since then, and when I got home
> tonight I tried again and it reset! I have no idea what had it hung
> up and was wondering if anyone knew how it worked. I'm still curious.
> Anyone know what might have happened?
>


Did you have any of the car's exterior lights on at any point? As the page
I referenced says, that's a common reason why the Maint. Req'd. light won't
turn off.


--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

Tegger wrote:
> JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
> news:hdv7tg$5gq$1@news.eternal-september.org:
>
>> Tegger wrote:
>>> JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
>>> news:hdu3e9$98n$1@news.eternal- september.org:
>>>
>>>> OK, this is a new one on me. After its 29th oil change, my '91
>>>> Accord's maintenance indicator refuses to reset when I try to push
>>>> the key into the slot. There is more resistance than normal and
>>>> though I have now pushed fairly hard, I am reluctant to push *too*
>>>> hard. Anyone know what might have happened or whether this is easy
>>>> to fix?
>>>
>>> One of the FAQ'est of the FAQs. See here:
>>> <http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/maintenance-reqd-light.html>
>>>
>>> This page does show up in Google, but you have to try several times.
>> No, no, no. This is not the MIL, aka "Check Engine" light. It's not
>> connected to the computer and does not indicate an engine or emissions
>> malfunction.
>
> You never even looked at the page I referenced. You never even read its
> NAME.

Tegger, please take a deep breath and read this entire post before
responding.

Actually, I *did* read the page's name and even glanced at it *despite*
the name. I scanned it (too quickly, it seems) looking for anything
even remotely related to what I was talking about and I thought you
meant the MIL because it's the only resettable light in my Accord. I
apologize.

But on rereading the entire thing carefully, I must conclude that...

On my car, the maintenance indicator is *still* not a light!

So it seems you never read my posts carefully, either. Even the first
one said it was a '91, which as it happens predates the introduction of
service indicator lights in Accords. And the second post said the
indicator was mechanical in the second paragraph in addition to my
writing that it was not in any way connected to the computer in the
first post.

>> (And, yes, I know how to jumper the pins and read the
>> blinking code if the MIL does happen to come on.) It's not even a
>> light!
>
>
> Did I SAY it was the MIL? Of course not. I knew exactly what you needed and
> the page I referenced deals with exactly that.

It's true you did not say it was the MIL. But you didn't know exactly
what I needed, and the page you pointed to does not address it. The
page you pointed to has to do with resetting service indicator LIGHTS.
This service indicator is MECHANICAL as it says in my second post. So
*both* of us would appear to have reading comprehension problems, OK?

>> Anyway, it refused to reset after the oil change over the weekend.
>> I've tried every 25-30 miles or so since then, and when I got home
>> tonight I tried again and it reset! I have no idea what had it hung
>> up and was wondering if anyone knew how it worked. I'm still curious.
>> Anyone know what might have happened?
>>
> Did you have any of the car's exterior lights on at any point? As the page
> I referenced says, that's a common reason why the Maint. Req'd. light won't
> turn off.

Tegger, IT'S NOT A LIGHT. I could have the interior or exterior lights
on or off, the car running or the ignition switch in any position, the
key in the ignition (if I wasn't using it to reset the indicator, that
is) or out, the radio playing, the dome light on, the air conditioner
running, and the horn blowing with the car on jack stands, and it would
make no difference whatsoever. This maintenance indicator can even be
reset *while you're driving the car* using anything that will fit in the
slot (though Honda quite properly recommends against this in the owner's
manual).

The owner's and service manuals (the OEM Honda manual with the silver
cover, not an aftermarket one) are very specific about the reset
procedure. They say to put the car's key into the reset slot and push.
That's the *entire* procedure. I'm not exactly new to this. Did I
mention I'd done this 28 times before on this car? Also, my '90 Civic
had the same kind of indicator. I *know* how to reset it. Honest!

(I tried to find the page in the owner's manual to point you to, but
Honda's website has only selected segments of the PDFs for this model
and year with odd pointers here and there from within the segments for
some reason and I stopped spending time trying to get there.)

So, all that said, I'm hoping we have perhaps reached an understanding.
I'll read what you write more carefully in the future. I promise.
OK? Will you do the same for my posts?

With all that out of the way...does anyone have any idea what might
actually have happened? Is there some window of mileage during which
this thing normally won't reset that I happened to hit?

--
JRE

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

On Tue, 17 Nov 2009 21:45:49 -0500, JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid>
wrote:

>Tegger wrote:
>> JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
>> news:hdv7tg$5gq$1@news.eternal-september.org:
>>
>>> Tegger wrote:
>>>> JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
>>>> news:hdu3e9$98n$1@news.eternal- september.org:
>>>>
>>>>> OK, this is a new one on me. After its 29th oil change, my '91
>>>>> Accord's maintenance indicator refuses to reset when I try to push
>>>>> the key into the slot. There is more resistance than normal and
>>>>> though I have now pushed fairly hard, I am reluctant to push *too*
>>>>> hard. Anyone know what might have happened or whether this is easy
>>>>> to fix?
>>>>
>>>> One of the FAQ'est of the FAQs. See here:
>>>> <http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/maintenance-reqd-light.html>
>>>>
>>>> This page does show up in Google, but you have to try several times.
>>> No, no, no. This is not the MIL, aka "Check Engine" light. It's not
>>> connected to the computer and does not indicate an engine or emissions
>>> malfunction.
>>
>> You never even looked at the page I referenced. You never even read its
>> NAME.
>
>Tegger, please take a deep breath and read this entire post before
>responding.
>
>Actually, I *did* read the page's name and even glanced at it *despite*
>the name. I scanned it (too quickly, it seems) looking for anything
>even remotely related to what I was talking about and I thought you
>meant the MIL because it's the only resettable light in my Accord. I
>apologize.
>
>But on rereading the entire thing carefully, I must conclude that...
>
>On my car, the maintenance indicator is *still* not a light!
>
>So it seems you never read my posts carefully, either. Even the first
>one said it was a '91, which as it happens predates the introduction of
> service indicator lights in Accords. And the second post said the
>indicator was mechanical in the second paragraph in addition to my
>writing that it was not in any way connected to the computer in the
>first post.
>
>>> (And, yes, I know how to jumper the pins and read the
>>> blinking code if the MIL does happen to come on.) It's not even a
>>> light!
>>
>>
>> Did I SAY it was the MIL? Of course not. I knew exactly what you needed and
>> the page I referenced deals with exactly that.
>
>It's true you did not say it was the MIL. But you didn't know exactly
>what I needed, and the page you pointed to does not address it. The
>page you pointed to has to do with resetting service indicator LIGHTS.
>This service indicator is MECHANICAL as it says in my second post. So
>*both* of us would appear to have reading comprehension problems, OK?
>
>>> Anyway, it refused to reset after the oil change over the weekend.
>>> I've tried every 25-30 miles or so since then, and when I got home
>>> tonight I tried again and it reset! I have no idea what had it hung
>>> up and was wondering if anyone knew how it worked. I'm still curious.
>>> Anyone know what might have happened?
>>>
>> Did you have any of the car's exterior lights on at any point? As the page
>> I referenced says, that's a common reason why the Maint. Req'd. light won't
>> turn off.
>
>Tegger, IT'S NOT A LIGHT. I could have the interior or exterior lights
>on or off, the car running or the ignition switch in any position, the
>key in the ignition (if I wasn't using it to reset the indicator, that
>is) or out, the radio playing, the dome light on, the air conditioner
>running, and the horn blowing with the car on jack stands, and it would
>make no difference whatsoever. This maintenance indicator can even be
>reset *while you're driving the car* using anything that will fit in the
>slot (though Honda quite properly recommends against this in the owner's
>manual).
>
>The owner's and service manuals (the OEM Honda manual with the silver
>cover, not an aftermarket one) are very specific about the reset
>procedure. They say to put the car's key into the reset slot and push.
> That's the *entire* procedure. I'm not exactly new to this. Did I
>mention I'd done this 28 times before on this car? Also, my '90 Civic
>had the same kind of indicator. I *know* how to reset it. Honest!
>
>(I tried to find the page in the owner's manual to point you to, but
>Honda's website has only selected segments of the PDFs for this model
>and year with odd pointers here and there from within the segments for
>some reason and I stopped spending time trying to get there.)
>
>So, all that said, I'm hoping we have perhaps reached an understanding.
> I'll read what you write more carefully in the future. I promise.
>OK? Will you do the same for my posts?
>
>With all that out of the way...does anyone have any idea what might
>actually have happened? Is there some window of mileage during which
>this thing normally won't reset that I happened to hit?


I have a 91 Accord and I always thought that indicator was some sort
of ribbon. But I never had a problem pressing a key into it to reset
it. Maybe something fell into the mechanism and a good bump in the
road knocked it loose? Stuff on my car falls off all the time -
luckily nothing too important. The latest to go is the stuff holding
the "carpeting" onto the doors. I need to try some gorilla glue type
of thing for that.

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

dgk wrote:
<snip>
>
> I have a 91 Accord and I always thought that indicator was some sort
> of ribbon. But I never had a problem pressing a key into it to reset
> it. Maybe something fell into the mechanism and a good bump in the
> road knocked it loose? Stuff on my car falls off all the time -
> luckily nothing too important. The latest to go is the stuff holding
> the "carpeting" onto the doors. I need to try some gorilla glue type
> of thing for that.

If you look very carefully when it's changing from green to yellow or
from yellow to red, you can discern that the border between the colors
is a radial line, and that the indicator rotates about an axis above and
to the right of the window. While it might not be a complete disc, it's
at least a segment of a wheel.

It's hard to imagine what could fall into the instrument cluster, but
perhaps something small inside it came loose and landed in the wrong
place. I was thinking that perhaps there might be a part of the
rotation in which the wheel might be locked mechanically by the
mechanism and I just never tried to reset it while it was in that
"window." But who knows?

And, yeah, the carpeting is falling off my doors, too. And the sun
visors split at the "seams," losing little flakes of what used to be the
foam inside every time they were removed until I glued them back together.

Aside from the maintenance indicator, the latest "development" is that
the rear door handles don't self-return to their rest positions any
more. I'll have to take the inside door panels off to find out why and
fix them, which I'll probably do this weekend. Maybe I'll glue the
carpet back onto them, but I'll probably just remove it instead. The
dive gear I carry in the back seat won't mind (grin).

But I really cannot complain. Since I bought it new in November 1990
this car has probably cost me less than two car payments' worth of
unexpected repair parts (that is, excluding normal maintenance items).
It's the Energizer Bunny of cars. It just keeps going.

--
JRE

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

JRE wrote:
> dgk wrote:
> <snip>
>>
>> I have a 91 Accord and I always thought that indicator was some sort
>> of ribbon. But I never had a problem pressing a key into it to reset
>> it. Maybe something fell into the mechanism and a good bump in the
>> road knocked it loose? Stuff on my car falls off all the time -
>> luckily nothing too important. The latest to go is the stuff holding
>> the "carpeting" onto the doors. I need to try some gorilla glue type
>> of thing for that.
>
> If you look very carefully when it's changing from green to yellow or
> from yellow to red, you can discern that the border between the colors
> is a radial line, and that the indicator rotates about an axis above and
> to the right of the window. While it might not be a complete disc, it's
> at least a segment of a wheel.
>
> It's hard to imagine what could fall into the instrument cluster, but
> perhaps something small inside it came loose and landed in the wrong
> place. I was thinking that perhaps there might be a part of the
> rotation in which the wheel might be locked mechanically by the
> mechanism and I just never tried to reset it while it was in that
> "window." But who knows?
>
> And, yeah, the carpeting is falling off my doors, too. And the sun
> visors split at the "seams," losing little flakes of what used to be the
> foam inside every time they were removed until I glued them back together.
>
> Aside from the maintenance indicator, the latest "development" is that
> the rear door handles don't self-return to their rest positions any
> more. I'll have to take the inside door panels off to find out why and
> fix them, which I'll probably do this weekend. Maybe I'll glue the
> carpet back onto them, but I'll probably just remove it instead. The
> dive gear I carry in the back seat won't mind (grin).
>
> But I really cannot complain. Since I bought it new in November 1990
> this car has probably cost me less than two car payments' worth of
> unexpected repair parts (that is, excluding normal maintenance items).
> It's the Energizer Bunny of cars. It just keeps going.
>


It's not uncommon for plastic devices in the dash to fail after a couple
hundred thousand miles.

Just pay attention to mileage and change oil accordingly.

JT

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
news:hdvn6e$85l$1@news.eternal-september.org:


>
> So, all that said, I'm hoping we have perhaps reached an
> understanding.
> I'll read what you write more carefully in the future. I promise.
> OK? Will you do the same for my posts?



I called it a "light" because I've never personally actually seen the setup
you describe. I automatically assumed there was a lamp associated with it,
since lamps are almost ubiquitous in automotive information and warning
systems.

So I learned something today.



--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

In article <Xns9CC7C9CD2E867tegger@208.90.168.18>, invalid@invalid.inv
says...
> JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
> news:hdvn6e$85l$1@news.eternal-september.org:
>
>
> >
> > So, all that said, I'm hoping we have perhaps reached an
> > understanding.
> > I'll read what you write more carefully in the future. I promise.
> > OK? Will you do the same for my posts?
>
>
>
> I called it a "light" because I've never personally actually seen the setup
> you describe. I automatically assumed there was a lamp associated with it,
> since lamps are almost ubiquitous in automotive information and warning
> systems.
>
> So I learned something today.

IIRC, mechanical maintenance required indicators that were reset with a
key were pretty common on older Hondas - our '86 Accord had one.

Dave

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

Dave Garrett <dave@compassnet.com> wrote in
news:MPG.256f9f244675807698a2b1@208.90.168.18:

> In article <Xns9CC7C9CD2E867tegger@208.90.168.18>, invalid@invalid.inv
> says...
>> JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
>> news:hdvn6e$85l$1@news.eternal-september.org:
>>
>>
>> >
>> > So, all that said, I'm hoping we have perhaps reached an
>> > understanding.
>> > I'll read what you write more carefully in the future. I
>> > promise.
>> > OK? Will you do the same for my posts?
>>
>>
>>
>> I called it a "light" because I've never personally actually seen the
>> setup you describe. I automatically assumed there was a lamp
>> associated with it, since lamps are almost ubiquitous in automotive
>> information and warning systems.
>>
>> So I learned something today.
>
> IIRC, mechanical maintenance required indicators that were reset with
> a key were pretty common on older Hondas - our '86 Accord had one.
>
> Dave
>
>


Then it's time for me to do another junkyard crawl, with specific focus on
finding the multicolored twirly wheel that represents Honda's first attempt
at a Maintenance Minder.

--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 18:30:33 -0600, Dave Garrett <dave@compassnet.com>
wrote:

>IIRC, mechanical maintenance required indicators that were reset with a
>key were pretty common on older Hondas - our '86 Accord had one.

sounds familiar ... since I had an 87 Accord ...

J.

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

On 11/19/09 8:57 PM, in article h81cg554uvck0k6gn2lva0gba5dlu6tgls@4ax.com,
"JRStern" <JRStern@foobar.invalid> wrote:

> On Thu, 19 Nov 2009 18:30:33 -0600, Dave Garrett <dave@compassnet.com>
> wrote:
>
>> IIRC, mechanical maintenance required indicators that were reset with a
>> key were pretty common on older Hondas - our '86 Accord had one.
>
> sounds familiar ... since I had an 87 Accord ...
>
> J.
>
The one on our '81 Accord and the one on our '96 Odyssey were essentially
identical.

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

In article <Xns9CC8D4A67C74Ftegger@208.90.168.18>, invalid@invalid.inv
says...
> Dave Garrett <dave@compassnet.com> wrote in
> news:MPG.256f9f244675807698a2b1@208.90.168.18:
>
> > In article <Xns9CC7C9CD2E867tegger@208.90.168.18>, invalid@invalid.inv
> > says...
> >> JRE <nothing@nowhere.invalid> wrote in
> >> news:hdvn6e$85l$1@news.eternal-september.org:
> >>
> >>
> >> >
> >> > So, all that said, I'm hoping we have perhaps reached an
> >> > understanding.
> >> > I'll read what you write more carefully in the future. I
> >> > promise.
> >> > OK? Will you do the same for my posts?
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> I called it a "light" because I've never personally actually seen the
> >> setup you describe. I automatically assumed there was a lamp
> >> associated with it, since lamps are almost ubiquitous in automotive
> >> information and warning systems.
> >>
> >> So I learned something today.
> >
> > IIRC, mechanical maintenance required indicators that were reset with
> > a key were pretty common on older Hondas - our '86 Accord had one.
> >
> > Dave
> >
> >
>
>
> Then it's time for me to do another junkyard crawl, with specific focus on
> finding the multicolored twirly wheel that represents Honda's first attempt
> at a Maintenance Minder.

Apparently I haven't been paying attention recently, as I somehow
completely forgot that my 2000 Civic Si also has a mechanical
maintenance required indicator until I glanced at the gauges today and
suddently remembered this thread. It's a different design than the older
ones, with the color indicator only visible through a small square port
cut in the speedo faceplate.

Marginal iPhone pic here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/25362330@N02/4133052296/

The port is directly under the "M" in "Maintenance Required", and the
key-operated reset switch is to the lower left of the speedo. It's hard
to see in the photo, but the indicator is orange, and you can see from
the odometer that it's almost time for the 75K service.

Dave

Re: 1991 Accord Service Indicator
 

Dave Garrett wrote:
<snip>
>
> Apparently I haven't been paying attention recently, as I somehow
> completely forgot that my 2000 Civic Si also has a mechanical
> maintenance required indicator until I glanced at the gauges today and
> suddently remembered this thread. It's a different design than the older
> ones, with the color indicator only visible through a small square port
> cut in the speedo faceplate.
>
> Marginal iPhone pic here:
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/25362330@N02/4133052296/
>
> The port is directly under the "M" in "Maintenance Required", and the
> key-operated reset switch is to the lower left of the speedo. It's hard
> to see in the photo, but the indicator is orange, and you can see from
> the odometer that it's almost time for the 75K service.
>
> Dave
>

Other than its location and size (your window appears very slightly
smaller), and the color (mine turns from green to yellow to red, with no
orange), this looks the same as the one on my '91. Mine is under the
tach rather than under the speedometer, and my odometer is on the left
under and to the right of the tach with the trip odometer to its right.

Its proximity to the odometer in both cases supports my theory that it's
gear-driven from the odometer rather than being driven separately, but
of course until someone pulls one apart and looks it's impossible to know.


--
JRE