96 accord a/c problem
 

96 accord, 65k miles, max a/c, both fans are on at radiator, clutch is
engaged on compressor, system was charged by one of those cans with a gauge
on it from a store (not me) - but it still blows warm air - any suggestions
to troubleshoot?
Rocky

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

Rocky wrote:
> 96 accord, 65k miles, max a/c, both fans are on at radiator, clutch is
> engaged on compressor, system was charged by one of those cans with a gauge
> on it from a store (not me) - but it still blows warm air - any suggestions
> to troubleshoot?
> Rocky

Could be a number of things. So it really needs to be checked by
someone in person. You say someone charged it. How did they
determine it needed it? Did they use the proper refrigerant?
Did it work for a while right after they did that, or made no
difference? You say the clutch is engaged.. So.. That means
it's not off on the low pressure switch. You need to check the
pressures again. It could be a ducting/vacuum problem with the
ducts. It could have a clogged orifice, or a bad expansion valve.
"This can happen if a dryer bag blows apart and shreds fer
instance." Really need more info to go much farther. Like I say,
if you don't know A/C systems, you probably oughta get it checked
by someone who does. Trying to repair an A/C system with little
knowledge can be expensive. I just talked to a guy the other day
that went that route. He had a R-12 system that was just low..
Needed a charge. Well, he decided to use the freeze 12 replacement,
instead of R-12. This is itself is ok, if done right, but he added the

freeze 12 on top of the R-12, without first dumping the R-12,
and doing a good vacuum. R-12 and freeze 12 DO NOT MIX.
Freeze 12 is appx 80% 134a... Mix that with R-12 and Houston,
we have a problem. Well, he did that, and it didn't work.
He decided to take it to a place to vacuum, and start over with
all freeze 12, as he had a hunch they didn't want to mix.
Well, the dummies at place #2 thought it was just low, or whatever,
and evidentally charged it with even more refrigerant.
I'm not sure why they didn't dump it as he requested... Maybe they
thought he was in error, or just ignored him??
Not sure, being I wasn't there. They blew the whole thing. Seals
started leaking left and right, and the whole thing was pretty much
trashed. Now he's fixing to pay 1500 bucks for a new 134a system
by competant mechanics. Moral... be careful. You could cost
yourself more money than just letting someone who knows
what they are doing look at it in the first place.
BTW, I'm no car A/C expert, as I don't work on cars. But I do
do residential A/C and Heating, so I do know what I'm doing pretty
much.
I can work on car systems, but I hate em... Too much greasy work vs
working on a house or commercial system where everything is out
in the open and easy to deal with. You never know.. Your problem
could be real serious, or it could be as simple as a blown vac hose..
IE: the ac is working, but it's ducting hot air, etc, etc.. If you
work
on this, you at least need a good service manual.
MK

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

Rocky wrote:
> 96 accord, 65k miles, max a/c, both fans are on at radiator, clutch is
> engaged on compressor, system was charged by one of those cans with a gauge
> on it from a store (not me) - but it still blows warm air - any suggestions
> to troubleshoot?
> Rocky

Could be a number of things. So it really needs to be checked by
someone in person. You say someone charged it. How did they
determine it needed it? Did they use the proper refrigerant?
Did it work for a while right after they did that, or made no
difference? You say the clutch is engaged.. So.. That means
it's not off on the low pressure switch. You need to check the
pressures again. It could be a ducting/vacuum problem with the
ducts. It could have a clogged orifice, or a bad expansion valve.
"This can happen if a dryer bag blows apart and shreds fer
instance." Really need more info to go much farther. Like I say,
if you don't know A/C systems, you probably oughta get it checked
by someone who does. Trying to repair an A/C system with little
knowledge can be expensive. I just talked to a guy the other day
that went that route. He had a R-12 system that was just low..
Needed a charge. Well, he decided to use the freeze 12 replacement,
instead of R-12. This is itself is ok, if done right, but he added the

freeze 12 on top of the R-12, without first dumping the R-12,
and doing a good vacuum. R-12 and freeze 12 DO NOT MIX.
Freeze 12 is appx 80% 134a... Mix that with R-12 and Houston,
we have a problem. Well, he did that, and it didn't work.
He decided to take it to a place to vacuum, and start over with
all freeze 12, as he had a hunch they didn't want to mix.
Well, the dummies at place #2 thought it was just low, or whatever,
and evidentally charged it with even more refrigerant.
I'm not sure why they didn't dump it as he requested... Maybe they
thought he was in error, or just ignored him??
Not sure, being I wasn't there. They blew the whole thing. Seals
started leaking left and right, and the whole thing was pretty much
trashed. Now he's fixing to pay 1500 bucks for a new 134a system
by competant mechanics. Moral... be careful. You could cost
yourself more money than just letting someone who knows
what they are doing look at it in the first place.
BTW, I'm no car A/C expert, as I don't work on cars. But I do
do residential A/C and Heating, so I do know what I'm doing pretty
much.
I can work on car systems, but I hate em... Too much greasy work vs
working on a house or commercial system where everything is out
in the open and easy to deal with. You never know.. Your problem
could be real serious, or it could be as simple as a blown vac hose..
IE: the ac is working, but it's ducting hot air, etc, etc.. If you
work
on this, you at least need a good service manual.
MK

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

Rocky wrote:
> 96 accord, 65k miles, max a/c, both fans are on at radiator, clutch is
> engaged on compressor, system was charged by one of those cans with a gauge
> on it from a store (not me) - but it still blows warm air - any suggestions
> to troubleshoot?
> Rocky

Could be a number of things. So it really needs to be checked by
someone in person. You say someone charged it. How did they
determine it needed it? Did they use the proper refrigerant?
Did it work for a while right after they did that, or made no
difference? You say the clutch is engaged.. So.. That means
it's not off on the low pressure switch. You need to check the
pressures again. It could be a ducting/vacuum problem with the
ducts. It could have a clogged orifice, or a bad expansion valve.
"This can happen if a dryer bag blows apart and shreds fer
instance." Really need more info to go much farther. Like I say,
if you don't know A/C systems, you probably oughta get it checked
by someone who does. Trying to repair an A/C system with little
knowledge can be expensive. I just talked to a guy the other day
that went that route. He had a R-12 system that was just low..
Needed a charge. Well, he decided to use the freeze 12 replacement,
instead of R-12. This is itself is ok, if done right, but he added the

freeze 12 on top of the R-12, without first dumping the R-12,
and doing a good vacuum. R-12 and freeze 12 DO NOT MIX.
Freeze 12 is appx 80% 134a... Mix that with R-12 and Houston,
we have a problem. Well, he did that, and it didn't work.
He decided to take it to a place to vacuum, and start over with
all freeze 12, as he had a hunch they didn't want to mix.
Well, the dummies at place #2 thought it was just low, or whatever,
and evidentally charged it with even more refrigerant.
I'm not sure why they didn't dump it as he requested... Maybe they
thought he was in error, or just ignored him??
Not sure, being I wasn't there. They blew the whole thing. Seals
started leaking left and right, and the whole thing was pretty much
trashed. Now he's fixing to pay 1500 bucks for a new 134a system
by competant mechanics. Moral... be careful. You could cost
yourself more money than just letting someone who knows
what they are doing look at it in the first place.
BTW, I'm no car A/C expert, as I don't work on cars. But I do
do residential A/C and Heating, so I do know what I'm doing pretty
much.
I can work on car systems, but I hate em... Too much greasy work vs
working on a house or commercial system where everything is out
in the open and easy to deal with. You never know.. Your problem
could be real serious, or it could be as simple as a blown vac hose..
IE: the ac is working, but it's ducting hot air, etc, etc.. If you
work
on this, you at least need a good service manual.
MK

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

nm5k@wt.net wrote in
news:1155205353.443626.21130@p79g2000cwp.googlegro ups.com:

>
> Rocky wrote:
>> 96 accord, 65k miles, max a/c, both fans are on at radiator, clutch
>> is engaged on compressor, system was charged by one of those cans
>> with a gauge on it from a store (not me) - but it still blows warm
>> air - any suggestions to troubleshoot?
>> Rocky
>
> Could be a number of things. So it really needs to be checked by
> someone in person. You say someone charged it. How did they
> determine it needed it? Did they use the proper refrigerant?
> Did it work for a while right after they did that, or made no
> difference? You say the clutch is engaged.. So.. That means
> it's not off on the low pressure switch. You need to check the
> pressures again. It could be a ducting/vacuum problem with the
> ducts. It could have a clogged orifice, or a bad expansion valve.
> "This can happen if a dryer bag blows apart and shreds fer
> instance." Really need more info to go much farther. Like I say,
> if you don't know A/C systems, you probably oughta get it checked
> by someone who does. Trying to repair an A/C system with little
> knowledge can be expensive. I just talked to a guy the other day
> that went that route. He had a R-12 system that was just low..
> Needed a charge. Well, he decided to use the freeze 12 replacement,
> instead of R-12. This is itself is ok, if done right, but he added
> the
>
> freeze 12 on top of the R-12, without first dumping the R-12,
> and doing a good vacuum. R-12 and freeze 12 DO NOT MIX.
> Freeze 12 is appx 80% 134a... Mix that with R-12 and Houston,
> we have a problem. Well, he did that, and it didn't work.
> He decided to take it to a place to vacuum, and start over with
> all freeze 12, as he had a hunch they didn't want to mix.
> Well, the dummies at place #2 thought it was just low, or whatever,
> and evidentally charged it with even more refrigerant.
> I'm not sure why they didn't dump it as he requested... Maybe they
> thought he was in error, or just ignored him??
> Not sure, being I wasn't there. They blew the whole thing. Seals
> started leaking left and right, and the whole thing was pretty much
> trashed. Now he's fixing to pay 1500 bucks for a new 134a system
> by competant mechanics. Moral... be careful. You could cost
> yourself more money than just letting someone who knows
> what they are doing look at it in the first place.
> BTW, I'm no car A/C expert, as I don't work on cars. But I do
> do residential A/C and Heating, so I do know what I'm doing pretty
> much.
> I can work on car systems, but I hate em... Too much greasy work vs
> working on a house or commercial system where everything is out
> in the open and easy to deal with. You never know.. Your problem
> could be real serious, or it could be as simple as a blown vac hose..
> IE: the ac is working, but it's ducting hot air, etc, etc.. If you
> work
> on this, you at least need a good service manual.
> MK
>
>

My 94 Integra uses R134a,it would seem like a 96 Honda would too.

I wonder if his compressor is not compressing anymore?
No compressed freon;no expansion and cooling.
Maybe the compressor seals are gone.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

nm5k@wt.net wrote in
news:1155205353.443626.21130@p79g2000cwp.googlegro ups.com:

>
> Rocky wrote:
>> 96 accord, 65k miles, max a/c, both fans are on at radiator, clutch
>> is engaged on compressor, system was charged by one of those cans
>> with a gauge on it from a store (not me) - but it still blows warm
>> air - any suggestions to troubleshoot?
>> Rocky
>
> Could be a number of things. So it really needs to be checked by
> someone in person. You say someone charged it. How did they
> determine it needed it? Did they use the proper refrigerant?
> Did it work for a while right after they did that, or made no
> difference? You say the clutch is engaged.. So.. That means
> it's not off on the low pressure switch. You need to check the
> pressures again. It could be a ducting/vacuum problem with the
> ducts. It could have a clogged orifice, or a bad expansion valve.
> "This can happen if a dryer bag blows apart and shreds fer
> instance." Really need more info to go much farther. Like I say,
> if you don't know A/C systems, you probably oughta get it checked
> by someone who does. Trying to repair an A/C system with little
> knowledge can be expensive. I just talked to a guy the other day
> that went that route. He had a R-12 system that was just low..
> Needed a charge. Well, he decided to use the freeze 12 replacement,
> instead of R-12. This is itself is ok, if done right, but he added
> the
>
> freeze 12 on top of the R-12, without first dumping the R-12,
> and doing a good vacuum. R-12 and freeze 12 DO NOT MIX.
> Freeze 12 is appx 80% 134a... Mix that with R-12 and Houston,
> we have a problem. Well, he did that, and it didn't work.
> He decided to take it to a place to vacuum, and start over with
> all freeze 12, as he had a hunch they didn't want to mix.
> Well, the dummies at place #2 thought it was just low, or whatever,
> and evidentally charged it with even more refrigerant.
> I'm not sure why they didn't dump it as he requested... Maybe they
> thought he was in error, or just ignored him??
> Not sure, being I wasn't there. They blew the whole thing. Seals
> started leaking left and right, and the whole thing was pretty much
> trashed. Now he's fixing to pay 1500 bucks for a new 134a system
> by competant mechanics. Moral... be careful. You could cost
> yourself more money than just letting someone who knows
> what they are doing look at it in the first place.
> BTW, I'm no car A/C expert, as I don't work on cars. But I do
> do residential A/C and Heating, so I do know what I'm doing pretty
> much.
> I can work on car systems, but I hate em... Too much greasy work vs
> working on a house or commercial system where everything is out
> in the open and easy to deal with. You never know.. Your problem
> could be real serious, or it could be as simple as a blown vac hose..
> IE: the ac is working, but it's ducting hot air, etc, etc.. If you
> work
> on this, you at least need a good service manual.
> MK
>
>

My 94 Integra uses R134a,it would seem like a 96 Honda would too.

I wonder if his compressor is not compressing anymore?
No compressed freon;no expansion and cooling.
Maybe the compressor seals are gone.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

nm5k@wt.net wrote in
news:1155205353.443626.21130@p79g2000cwp.googlegro ups.com:

>
> Rocky wrote:
>> 96 accord, 65k miles, max a/c, both fans are on at radiator, clutch
>> is engaged on compressor, system was charged by one of those cans
>> with a gauge on it from a store (not me) - but it still blows warm
>> air - any suggestions to troubleshoot?
>> Rocky
>
> Could be a number of things. So it really needs to be checked by
> someone in person. You say someone charged it. How did they
> determine it needed it? Did they use the proper refrigerant?
> Did it work for a while right after they did that, or made no
> difference? You say the clutch is engaged.. So.. That means
> it's not off on the low pressure switch. You need to check the
> pressures again. It could be a ducting/vacuum problem with the
> ducts. It could have a clogged orifice, or a bad expansion valve.
> "This can happen if a dryer bag blows apart and shreds fer
> instance." Really need more info to go much farther. Like I say,
> if you don't know A/C systems, you probably oughta get it checked
> by someone who does. Trying to repair an A/C system with little
> knowledge can be expensive. I just talked to a guy the other day
> that went that route. He had a R-12 system that was just low..
> Needed a charge. Well, he decided to use the freeze 12 replacement,
> instead of R-12. This is itself is ok, if done right, but he added
> the
>
> freeze 12 on top of the R-12, without first dumping the R-12,
> and doing a good vacuum. R-12 and freeze 12 DO NOT MIX.
> Freeze 12 is appx 80% 134a... Mix that with R-12 and Houston,
> we have a problem. Well, he did that, and it didn't work.
> He decided to take it to a place to vacuum, and start over with
> all freeze 12, as he had a hunch they didn't want to mix.
> Well, the dummies at place #2 thought it was just low, or whatever,
> and evidentally charged it with even more refrigerant.
> I'm not sure why they didn't dump it as he requested... Maybe they
> thought he was in error, or just ignored him??
> Not sure, being I wasn't there. They blew the whole thing. Seals
> started leaking left and right, and the whole thing was pretty much
> trashed. Now he's fixing to pay 1500 bucks for a new 134a system
> by competant mechanics. Moral... be careful. You could cost
> yourself more money than just letting someone who knows
> what they are doing look at it in the first place.
> BTW, I'm no car A/C expert, as I don't work on cars. But I do
> do residential A/C and Heating, so I do know what I'm doing pretty
> much.
> I can work on car systems, but I hate em... Too much greasy work vs
> working on a house or commercial system where everything is out
> in the open and easy to deal with. You never know.. Your problem
> could be real serious, or it could be as simple as a blown vac hose..
> IE: the ac is working, but it's ducting hot air, etc, etc.. If you
> work
> on this, you at least need a good service manual.
> MK
>
>

My 94 Integra uses R134a,it would seem like a 96 Honda would too.

I wonder if his compressor is not compressing anymore?
No compressed freon;no expansion and cooling.
Maybe the compressor seals are gone.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

"Jim Yanik" <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote in message
news:Xns981B7C6E5B8FCjyanikkuanet@129.250.170.84.. .
>
> My 94 Integra uses R134a,it would seem like a 96 Honda would too.
>
> I wonder if his compressor is not compressing anymore?
> No compressed freon;no expansion and cooling.
> Maybe the compressor seals are gone.
>
> --
> Jim Yanik

Well, not actually the seals or the charge would be gone. But the valves are
a common problem in compressors, and they will give that sort of symptom. I
don't have the tools or expertise to say any more than that, but... if the
vacuum side of the compressor plumbing is cold when the A/C has been running
a couple minutes - cold enough to be uncomfortable if you grip it for ten
seconds - the problem is in the air mixing. If not, it's time to take it to
a professional.

Mike

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

"Jim Yanik" <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote in message
news:Xns981B7C6E5B8FCjyanikkuanet@129.250.170.84.. .
>
> My 94 Integra uses R134a,it would seem like a 96 Honda would too.
>
> I wonder if his compressor is not compressing anymore?
> No compressed freon;no expansion and cooling.
> Maybe the compressor seals are gone.
>
> --
> Jim Yanik

Well, not actually the seals or the charge would be gone. But the valves are
a common problem in compressors, and they will give that sort of symptom. I
don't have the tools or expertise to say any more than that, but... if the
vacuum side of the compressor plumbing is cold when the A/C has been running
a couple minutes - cold enough to be uncomfortable if you grip it for ten
seconds - the problem is in the air mixing. If not, it's time to take it to
a professional.

Mike

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

"Jim Yanik" <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote in message
news:Xns981B7C6E5B8FCjyanikkuanet@129.250.170.84.. .
>
> My 94 Integra uses R134a,it would seem like a 96 Honda would too.
>
> I wonder if his compressor is not compressing anymore?
> No compressed freon;no expansion and cooling.
> Maybe the compressor seals are gone.
>
> --
> Jim Yanik

Well, not actually the seals or the charge would be gone. But the valves are
a common problem in compressors, and they will give that sort of symptom. I
don't have the tools or expertise to say any more than that, but... if the
vacuum side of the compressor plumbing is cold when the A/C has been running
a couple minutes - cold enough to be uncomfortable if you grip it for ten
seconds - the problem is in the air mixing. If not, it's time to take it to
a professional.

Mike

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

Michael Pardee wrote:
> "Jim Yanik" <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote in message
> news:Xns981B7C6E5B8FCjyanikkuanet@129.250.170.84.. .
> >
> > My 94 Integra uses R134a,it would seem like a 96 Honda would too.
> >
> > I wonder if his compressor is not compressing anymore?
> > No compressed freon;no expansion and cooling.
> > Maybe the compressor seals are gone.
> >
> > --
> > Jim Yanik
>
> Well, not actually the seals or the charge would be gone. But the valves are
> a common problem in compressors, and they will give that sort of symptom. I
> don't have the tools or expertise to say any more than that, but... if the
> vacuum side of the compressor plumbing is cold when the A/C has been running
> a couple minutes - cold enough to be uncomfortable if you grip it for ten
> seconds - the problem is in the air mixing. If not, it's time to take it to
> a professional.
>
> Mike

It could be the valves, but more than likely not. He will need a set
of gauges to check for that. Bad valves will show as a lack of pumping

power. IE: The low side doesn't pull down low enough, and the high side
not high enough. Usually a car compressor that would have that problem
probably ran low on oil for a good while. I see bad valves on home
units
more often than I do car units. Usually the car units, it's leaky
seals,
restriction in the metering, yada, yada.. I can't say what refrigerant
he
has, but it could be 134a.. It'll say somewhere, and also the type of
service valve will give a clue.
MK

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

Michael Pardee wrote:
> "Jim Yanik" <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote in message
> news:Xns981B7C6E5B8FCjyanikkuanet@129.250.170.84.. .
> >
> > My 94 Integra uses R134a,it would seem like a 96 Honda would too.
> >
> > I wonder if his compressor is not compressing anymore?
> > No compressed freon;no expansion and cooling.
> > Maybe the compressor seals are gone.
> >
> > --
> > Jim Yanik
>
> Well, not actually the seals or the charge would be gone. But the valves are
> a common problem in compressors, and they will give that sort of symptom. I
> don't have the tools or expertise to say any more than that, but... if the
> vacuum side of the compressor plumbing is cold when the A/C has been running
> a couple minutes - cold enough to be uncomfortable if you grip it for ten
> seconds - the problem is in the air mixing. If not, it's time to take it to
> a professional.
>
> Mike

It could be the valves, but more than likely not. He will need a set
of gauges to check for that. Bad valves will show as a lack of pumping

power. IE: The low side doesn't pull down low enough, and the high side
not high enough. Usually a car compressor that would have that problem
probably ran low on oil for a good while. I see bad valves on home
units
more often than I do car units. Usually the car units, it's leaky
seals,
restriction in the metering, yada, yada.. I can't say what refrigerant
he
has, but it could be 134a.. It'll say somewhere, and also the type of
service valve will give a clue.
MK

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

Michael Pardee wrote:
> "Jim Yanik" <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote in message
> news:Xns981B7C6E5B8FCjyanikkuanet@129.250.170.84.. .
> >
> > My 94 Integra uses R134a,it would seem like a 96 Honda would too.
> >
> > I wonder if his compressor is not compressing anymore?
> > No compressed freon;no expansion and cooling.
> > Maybe the compressor seals are gone.
> >
> > --
> > Jim Yanik
>
> Well, not actually the seals or the charge would be gone. But the valves are
> a common problem in compressors, and they will give that sort of symptom. I
> don't have the tools or expertise to say any more than that, but... if the
> vacuum side of the compressor plumbing is cold when the A/C has been running
> a couple minutes - cold enough to be uncomfortable if you grip it for ten
> seconds - the problem is in the air mixing. If not, it's time to take it to
> a professional.
>
> Mike

It could be the valves, but more than likely not. He will need a set
of gauges to check for that. Bad valves will show as a lack of pumping

power. IE: The low side doesn't pull down low enough, and the high side
not high enough. Usually a car compressor that would have that problem
probably ran low on oil for a good while. I see bad valves on home
units
more often than I do car units. Usually the car units, it's leaky
seals,
restriction in the metering, yada, yada.. I can't say what refrigerant
he
has, but it could be 134a.. It'll say somewhere, and also the type of
service valve will give a clue.
MK

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

<nm5k@wt.net> wrote in message
news:1155292719.924815.228670@m73g2000cwd.googlegr oups.com...
>
> I can't say what refrigerant
> he
> has, but it could be 134a.. It'll say somewhere, and also the type of
> service valve will give a clue.
> MK
>
In a '96 I'm certain it is 134a. CFCs were banned from production and
consumption effective January 1, 1994 for signatories of the Montreal
Protocol.

Mike

Re: 96 accord a/c problem
 

<nm5k@wt.net> wrote in message
news:1155292719.924815.228670@m73g2000cwd.googlegr oups.com...
>
> I can't say what refrigerant
> he
> has, but it could be 134a.. It'll say somewhere, and also the type of
> service valve will give a clue.
> MK
>
In a '96 I'm certain it is 134a. CFCs were banned from production and
consumption effective January 1, 1994 for signatories of the Montreal
Protocol.

Mike