Fuel pump goblins
This isn't actually a honda problem, but I hope someone here can give me
some insight into what is happening & why. I have a 93 Nissan pickup w/ electric fuel pump in gas tank. When it works, it works fine.. until you shut engine off. It doesn't quit when engine is running - regardless of how long it runs - 1 mile or 50. but after turning engine off, fuel pump may or may not run. If it doesn't, it won't work again until it sits a day or so. Based on the schematic, I thought the problem was with the ECU to the fuel pump relay, so I pulled the relay & jumped the circuit. It seemed to work fine - started it several times over next couple of days - even let it run & get up to operating temp, shut off & restarted fine. Then drove it about 5 mi., and it wouldn't start afterward. Still wouldn't start 3 hrs later, but started & drove it home about 20 hrs later. Turned off & wouldn't start. I guess I need to replace fuel pump, but I'm baffled as to why pump works fine and continues to run as long as engine is running. It seems like a bad pump would quit on the road instead of only when engine is turned off. |
Re: Fuel pump goblins
jim L wrote:
> This isn't actually a honda problem, but I hope someone here can give me > some insight into what is happening & why. > > I have a 93 Nissan pickup w/ electric fuel pump in gas tank. When it works, > it works fine.. until you shut engine off. It doesn't quit when engine is > running - regardless of how long it runs - 1 mile or 50. but after turning > engine off, fuel pump may or may not run. If it doesn't, it won't work > again until it sits a day or so. > Based on the schematic, I thought the problem was with the ECU to the fuel > pump relay, so I pulled the relay & jumped the circuit. It seemed to work > fine - started it several times over next couple of days - even let it run > & get up to operating temp, shut off & restarted fine. > > Then drove it about 5 mi., and it wouldn't start afterward. Still wouldn't > start 3 hrs later, but started & drove it home about 20 hrs later. Turned > off & wouldn't start. > > I guess I need to replace fuel pump, but I'm baffled as to why pump works > fine and continues to run as long as engine is running. It seems like a bad > pump would quit on the road instead of only when engine is turned off. > > honda have been plagued by the solder on their main relay cracking. and the symptoms are exactly the same as you describe. [if nissan use mitsuba relays,] go to tegger.com, check out the resolution, then see if it works for you. |
Re: Fuel pump goblins
jim beam <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in
news:SKidnSNLZsh3o33VnZ2dnUVZ_qLinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t: > jim L wrote: >> This isn't actually a honda problem, but I hope someone here can give >> me some insight into what is happening & why. >> >> I have a 93 Nissan pickup w/ electric fuel pump in gas tank. When it >> works, it works fine.. until you shut engine off. It doesn't quit >> when engine is running - regardless of how long it runs - 1 mile or >> 50. but after turning engine off, fuel pump may or may not run. If >> it doesn't, it won't work again until it sits a day or so. >> Based on the schematic, I thought the problem was with the ECU to the >> fuel pump relay, so I pulled the relay & jumped the circuit. It >> seemed to work fine - started it several times over next couple of >> days - even let it run & get up to operating temp, shut off & >> restarted fine. >> >> Then drove it about 5 mi., and it wouldn't start afterward. Still >> wouldn't start 3 hrs later, but started & drove it home about 20 hrs >> later. Turned off & wouldn't start. >> >> I guess I need to replace fuel pump, but I'm baffled as to why pump >> works fine and continues to run as long as engine is running. It >> seems like a bad pump would quit on the road instead of only when >> engine is turned off. >> >> > > honda have been plagued by the solder on their main relay cracking. > and the symptoms are exactly the same as you describe. [if nissan use > mitsuba relays,] go to tegger.com, check out the resolution, then see > if it works for you. > it's certainly a lot easier to replace or resolder the relay than to change a fuel pump. -- Jim Yanik jyanik at kua.net |
Re: Fuel pump goblins
"jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message news:SKidnSNLZsh3o33VnZ2dnUVZ_qLinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t... > jim L wrote: >> This isn't actually a honda problem, but I hope someone here can give me >> some insight into what is happening & why. >> >> I have a 93 Nissan pickup w/ electric fuel pump in gas tank. When it >> works, it works fine.. until you shut engine off. It doesn't quit when >> engine is running - regardless of how long it runs - 1 mile or 50. but >> after turning engine off, fuel pump may or may not run. If it doesn't, >> it won't work again until it sits a day or so. >> Based on the schematic, I thought the problem was with the ECU to the >> fuel pump relay, so I pulled the relay & jumped the circuit. It seemed >> to work fine - started it several times over next couple of days - even >> let it run & get up to operating temp, shut off & restarted fine. >> >> Then drove it about 5 mi., and it wouldn't start afterward. Still >> wouldn't start 3 hrs later, but started & drove it home about 20 hrs >> later. Turned off & wouldn't start. >> >> I guess I need to replace fuel pump, but I'm baffled as to why pump works >> fine and continues to run as long as engine is running. It seems like a >> bad pump would quit on the road instead of only when engine is turned >> off. >> >> > > honda have been plagued by the solder on their main relay cracking. and > the symptoms are exactly the same as you describe. [if nissan use mitsuba > relays,] go to tegger.com, check out the resolution, then see if it works > for you. Hi Jim - thanks for the reply I read Tegger's entry on the mitsuba relays and Michael's description of what happens with a Dry Solder socket. It's enlightning - but not encouragong - looks like i'll have to drop the tank and pull the fuel pump. My best gestimate is that the bad solder connection is somewhere whithin the fuel pump assembly. I have power to fuel pump with my jumped circuit - so main relay isn't the problem. I was hoping for an easier fix - but at least knowing how it could happen is positive. Jim |
Re: Fuel pump goblins
PS
is there anyone here who knows about elec fuel pumps? I may want to try & fix this one. Autozone wants $199 for replacement, & Ebeay has some for $70, but many say "all except US built King cab" which is what I have. If I pull the pump I don't mind paying for replacement if it works but I want it to work. "jim L" <jtl57@bellsouth.net> wrote in message news:raYDk.35289$IB6.6860@bignews8.bellsouth.net.. . > > "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message > news:SKidnSNLZsh3o33VnZ2dnUVZ_qLinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t... >> jim L wrote: >>> This isn't actually a honda problem, but I hope someone here can give me >>> some insight into what is happening & why. >>> >>> I have a 93 Nissan pickup w/ electric fuel pump in gas tank. When it >>> works, it works fine.. until you shut engine off. It doesn't quit when >>> engine is running - regardless of how long it runs - 1 mile or 50. but >>> after turning engine off, fuel pump may or may not run. If it doesn't, >>> it won't work again until it sits a day or so. >>> Based on the schematic, I thought the problem was with the ECU to the >>> fuel pump relay, so I pulled the relay & jumped the circuit. It seemed >>> to work fine - started it several times over next couple of days - >>> even let it run & get up to operating temp, shut off & restarted fine. >>> >>> Then drove it about 5 mi., and it wouldn't start afterward. Still >>> wouldn't start 3 hrs later, but started & drove it home about 20 hrs >>> later. Turned off & wouldn't start. >>> >>> I guess I need to replace fuel pump, but I'm baffled as to why pump >>> works fine and continues to run as long as engine is running. It seems >>> like a bad pump would quit on the road instead of only when engine is >>> turned off. >>> >>> >> >> honda have been plagued by the solder on their main relay cracking. and >> the symptoms are exactly the same as you describe. [if nissan use >> mitsuba relays,] go to tegger.com, check out the resolution, then see if >> it works for you. > > Hi Jim - thanks for the reply > I read Tegger's entry on the mitsuba relays and Michael's description of > what happens with a Dry > Solder socket. It's enlightning - but not encouragong - looks like > i'll have to drop the tank and pull the fuel pump. My best gestimate is > that the bad solder connection is somewhere whithin the fuel pump > assembly. I have power to fuel pump with my jumped circuit - so main > relay isn't the problem. I was hoping for an easier fix - but at least > knowing how it could happen is positive. > > Jim > |
Re: Fuel pump goblins
jim L wrote:
> "jim beam" <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote in message > news:SKidnSNLZsh3o33VnZ2dnUVZ_qLinZ2d@speakeasy.ne t... >> jim L wrote: >>> This isn't actually a honda problem, but I hope someone here can give me >>> some insight into what is happening & why. >>> >>> I have a 93 Nissan pickup w/ electric fuel pump in gas tank. When it >>> works, it works fine.. until you shut engine off. It doesn't quit when >>> engine is running - regardless of how long it runs - 1 mile or 50. but >>> after turning engine off, fuel pump may or may not run. If it doesn't, >>> it won't work again until it sits a day or so. >>> Based on the schematic, I thought the problem was with the ECU to the >>> fuel pump relay, so I pulled the relay & jumped the circuit. It seemed >>> to work fine - started it several times over next couple of days - even >>> let it run & get up to operating temp, shut off & restarted fine. >>> >>> Then drove it about 5 mi., and it wouldn't start afterward. Still >>> wouldn't start 3 hrs later, but started & drove it home about 20 hrs >>> later. Turned off & wouldn't start. >>> >>> I guess I need to replace fuel pump, but I'm baffled as to why pump works >>> fine and continues to run as long as engine is running. It seems like a >>> bad pump would quit on the road instead of only when engine is turned >>> off. >>> >>> >> honda have been plagued by the solder on their main relay cracking. and >> the symptoms are exactly the same as you describe. [if nissan use mitsuba >> relays,] go to tegger.com, check out the resolution, then see if it works >> for you. > > Hi Jim - thanks for the reply > I read Tegger's entry on the mitsuba relays and Michael's description of > what happens with a Dry > Solder socket. It's enlightning - but not encouragong - looks like i'll > have to drop the tank and pull the fuel pump. My best gestimate is that the > bad solder connection is somewhere whithin the fuel pump assembly. I have > power to fuel pump with my jumped circuit - so main relay isn't the > problem. regardless, you need to methodical about this and eliminate known failure points. start with the relay and then test the wiring - both sides. you should be able to pull that without dropping the tank. fyi, although you probably know this, it's ***EXTREMELY*** dangerous to run fuel injection without main relay cutoff being active - what you have with the jumped relay. crashed car, trapped inside, continuing to pump gas onto a flaming engine... you'll take weeks to grow your hair back. > I was hoping for an easier fix - but at least knowing how it > could happen is positive. > > Jim > > |
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