Gremlins in my civic - help!!
 

94 Civic EX 5 speed.

Intermittent ( now not so intermittent ) problems.

Initially I thought I had problem with a dead spot in the starter. It
would occasionally not want to crank, but I could hear solenoid or relay
click when turning key to start. most times it started fine, no dragging.
and push start or moving car in gear worked.

Yesterday, something different happened to cause me to think it's possibly
ingnition switch or something similar. Engine was warm - had driven about
15 miles. Tried to start it, It would fire up, then die w/ no idiot
lights. happened repeatedly - start - run & die. If I turned ig on, would
get idiot lights , but the would go off when i cranked and it fired, and
stay off. Finally, I backed key a hair from run position & lights came on.
Check Engine light went out after about 3-4 secs but rest of lights stayed
on. I cranked it & it started & ran fine. I drove home w/o investigating
furthur. Note ! all other elec worked like they were supposed to depending
on key position - a/c blower, windows, radio, horn, etc - just engine
circuits & idiot lights seem affected.

Got it home, & it started & ran fine all day yesterday.
This morning, started up & went a couple miles. accidently killed it at red
lights, and it wouldnt start. This time, no solenoid or relay click. Had
to get a push start & took care of errand w/o turning it off. Got home, and
still wont start. ( I'm sure it will with a push start )

Any ideas from people here?

Also - where is Clutch interlock switch located. I couldnt find it on
petal - there is another switch for the cruise control that senses petal
up.

Also, is check engine light supposed to turn off w/ engine not running in on
pos?

Jim

Re: Gremlins in my civic - help!!
 

BTW I did find clutch interlock switch @ top of petal - It stopped raining
long enough to climb underneath. Haven't figured out yet how to unplug the
2 wires yet to jump or test.

Re: Gremlins in my civic - help!!
 

On Sep 11, 11:27 am, "jim L" <jt...@bellsouth.net> wrote:
> 94 Civic EX 5 speed.
>
> Intermittent ( now not so intermittent ) problems.
>
> Initially I thought I had problem with a dead spot in the starter. It
> would occasionally not want to crank, but I could hear solenoid or relay
> click when turning key to start. most times it started fine, no dragging.
> and push start or moving car in gear worked.
>
> Yesterday, something different happened to cause me to think it's possibly
> ingnition switch or something similar. Engine was warm - had drivenabout
> 15 miles. Tried to start it, It would fire up, then die w/ no idiot
> lights. happened repeatedly - start - run & die. If I turned ig on, would
> get idiot lights , but the would go off when i cranked and it fired, and
> stay off. Finally, I backed key a hair from run position & lights cameon.
> Check Engine light went out after about 3-4 secs but rest of lights stayed
> on. I cranked it & it started & ran fine. I drove home w/o investigating
> furthur. Note ! all other elec worked like they were supposed to depending
> on key position - a/c blower, windows, radio, horn, etc - just engine
> circuits & idiot lights seem affected.
>
> Got it home, & it started & ran fine all day yesterday.
> This morning, started up & went a couple miles. accidently killed it at red
> lights, and it wouldnt start. This time, no solenoid or relay click.. Had
> to get a push start & took care of errand w/o turning it off. Got home, and
> still wont start. ( I'm sure it will with a push start )
>
> Any ideas from people here?
>
> Also - where is Clutch interlock switch located. I couldnt find it on
> petal - there is another switch for the cruise control that senses petal
> up.
>
> Also, is check engine light supposed to turn off w/ engine not running inon
> pos?
>
> Jim

This is the classic symptom of a bad ignition switch. There was a
massive recall on them that may have included your car. Check with
the dealer.

Re: Gremlins in my civic - help!!
 

"jim L" <jtl57@bellsouth.net> wrote in
news:RBbyk.31270$Ep1.7770@bignews2.bellsouth.net:

> 94 Civic EX 5 speed.
>
> Intermittent ( now not so intermittent ) problems.
>
> Initially I thought I had problem with a dead spot in the starter.
> It would occasionally not want to crank, but I could hear solenoid or
> relay click when turning key to start. most times it started fine,
> no dragging. and push start or moving car in gear worked.
>
> Yesterday, something different happened to cause me to think it's
> possibly ingnition switch or something similar. Engine was warm -
> had driven about 15 miles. Tried to start it, It would fire up,
> then die w/ no idiot lights.




Bingo. Ignition switch.


--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Re: Gremlins in my civic - help!!
 

Tegger <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in news:Xns9B16B6305949tegger@
208.90.168.18:

> "jim L" <jtl57@bellsouth.net> wrote in
> news:RBbyk.31270$Ep1.7770@bignews2.bellsouth.net:
>
>> 94 Civic EX 5 speed.
>>
>> Intermittent ( now not so intermittent ) problems.
>>
>> Initially I thought I had problem with a dead spot in the starter.
>> It would occasionally not want to crank, but I could hear solenoid or
>> relay click when turning key to start. most times it started fine,
>> no dragging. and push start or moving car in gear worked.
>>
>> Yesterday, something different happened to cause me to think it's
>> possibly ingnition switch or something similar. Engine was warm -
>> had driven about 15 miles. Tried to start it, It would fire up,
>> then die w/ no idiot lights.
>
>
>
>
> Bingo. Ignition switch.
>
>



You may want to have a look at this page:
http://www.tegger.com/hondafaq/ignit...tch/index.html

and this one:
http://www.visualimpressions.ca/switch/

--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Re: Gremlins in my civic - help!!
 

Thanks Tegger, I've been looking at your site and explanation. I guess
I''ve eliminated the clutc interlock, because I jumped it & still no go. I
can start car by jumping solenoid, so I'll have to get by that way till I
can get another switch before tackling accessing switch - as that's my only
transportation for now.

Any ideas on best place to get replacement switch from?
BTW - the problem with starting & dying & lights hasn't happened today -
just starter circuit.

I'm curious about starter cut relay which shows up in series w/ interlock
switch on wiring diagram. any ideas on how to determine if it may be a
culprit?

Jim
"Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message
news:Xns9B16B6305949tegger@208.90.168.18...
> "jim L" <jtl57@bellsouth.net> wrote in
> news:RBbyk.31270$Ep1.7770@bignews2.bellsouth.net:
>
>> 94 Civic EX 5 speed.
>>
>> Intermittent ( now not so intermittent ) problems.
>>
>> Initially I thought I had problem with a dead spot in the starter.
>> It would occasionally not want to crank, but I could hear solenoid or
>> relay click when turning key to start. most times it started fine,
>> no dragging. and push start or moving car in gear worked.
>>
>> Yesterday, something different happened to cause me to think it's
>> possibly ingnition switch or something similar. Engine was warm -
>> had driven about 15 miles. Tried to start it, It would fire up,
>> then die w/ no idiot lights.
>
>
>
>
> Bingo. Ignition switch.
>
>
> --
> Tegger
>
> The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
> www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Re: Gremlins in my civic - help!!
 

"jim L" <jtl57@bellsouth.net> wrote in
news:S5hyk.27123$XB4.5955@bignews9.bellsouth.net:

> Thanks Tegger, I've been looking at your site and explanation. I
> guess I''ve eliminated the clutc interlock, because I jumped it &
> still no go. I can start car by jumping solenoid, so I'll have to get
> by that way till I can get another switch before tackling accessing
> switch - as that's my only transportation for now.
>
> Any ideas on best place to get replacement switch from?



The dealer. Or a car at the wreckers. I'd recommend a brand-new OEM one
though.

If you know how to solder, go cheap and refurbish yours as per the page I
referenced. Do it right and that's your fix anyway.



--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Re: Gremlins in my civic - help!!
 

"jim L" <jtl57@bellsouth.net> wrote in
news:S5hyk.27123$XB4.5955@bignews9.bellsouth.net:


>
> I'm curious about starter cut relay which shows up in series w/
> interlock switch on wiring diagram. any ideas on how to determine if
> it may be a culprit?


best to take out the main relay,open it up and resolder it,and eliminate it
as a trouble source....without spending any money on parts.

Tegger's excellent site also tells about how to do that.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Re: Gremlins in my civic -UPDATE - thanks tegger
 

Hi - removed switch - Contacts are pitted exactly as in your how-to. I
dressed contacts with file, and attempted to fill in pits with solder, but
didn't work well - Iron didn't get hot enought & i think i need flux as
well. reassemmled and it is working for now. I'm ordering another used OEM
switch - $70.00 + shipping.

BTW the starting circuit problem was the clutch interlock switch. It seems
to me that a bushing to contact the switch was missing from the clutch petal
arm I wonder how it managed to work at all. At any rate there was no room
for more than one finger up in there - so I couldn't get a bolt or anything
into the hole, but i did manage to get a ball of duct tape into the arm
behind the switch sticky side out that is serving the purpose, and the
interlock works as advertised now.

Jim


"jim L" <jtl57@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:RBbyk.31270$Ep1.7770@bignews2.bellsouth.net.. .
> 94 Civic EX 5 speed.
>
> Intermittent ( now not so intermittent ) problems.
>
> Initially I thought I had problem with a dead spot in the starter. It
> would occasionally not want to crank, but I could hear solenoid or relay
> click when turning key to start. most times it started fine, no
> dragging. and push start or moving car in gear worked.
>
> Yesterday, something different happened to cause me to think it's possibly
> ingnition switch or something similar. Engine was warm - had driven
> about 15 miles. Tried to start it, It would fire up, then die w/ no
> idiot lights. happened repeatedly - start - run & die. If I turned ig
> on, would get idiot lights , but the would go off when i cranked and it
> fired, and stay off. Finally, I backed key a hair from run position &
> lights came on. Check Engine light went out after about 3-4 secs but rest
> of lights stayed on. I cranked it & it started & ran fine. I drove
> home w/o investigating furthur. Note ! all other elec worked like they
> were supposed to depending on key position - a/c blower, windows, radio,
> horn, etc - just engine circuits & idiot lights seem affected.
>
> Got it home, & it started & ran fine all day yesterday.
> This morning, started up & went a couple miles. accidently killed it at
> red lights, and it wouldnt start. This time, no solenoid or relay click.
> Had to get a push start & took care of errand w/o turning it off. Got
> home, and still wont start. ( I'm sure it will with a push start )
>
> Any ideas from people here?
>
> Also - where is Clutch interlock switch located. I couldnt find it on
> petal - there is another switch for the cruise control that senses petal
> up.
>
> Also, is check engine light supposed to turn off w/ engine not running in
> on pos?
>
> Jim
>

Re: Gremlins in my civic -UPDATE - thanks tegger
 

"jim L" <jtl57@bellsouth.net> wrote in
news:P7Tyk.27974$XB4.12755@bignews9.bellsouth.net:

> Hi - removed switch - Contacts are pitted exactly as in your
> how-to. I dressed contacts with file, and attempted to fill in pits
> with solder, but didn't work well - Iron didn't get hot enought & i
> think i need flux as well. reassemmled and it is working for now.
> I'm ordering another used OEM switch - $70.00 + shipping.
>
> BTW the starting circuit problem was the clutch interlock switch. It
> seems to me that a bushing to contact the switch was missing from the
> clutch petal arm I wonder how it managed to work at all. At any rate
> there was no room for more than one finger up in there - so I couldn't
> get a bolt or anything into the hole, but i did manage to get a ball
> of duct tape into the arm behind the switch sticky side out that is
> serving the purpose, and the interlock works as advertised now.



That little coin of plastic is maybe two bucks at the dealer. You can just
buy a new one and pop it on.

Thanks for the update.


--
Tegger

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Re: Gremlins in my civic -UPDATE - thanks tegger
 

"Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message >>


>
> That little coin of plastic is maybe two bucks at the dealer. You can just
> buy a new one and pop it on.
>

That's good to know - The one for the cruise control switch was missing as
well, but I just put a machine bolt into it & adjusted the switch. If the
ball shifts when the glue on the tape dries up, I'll get one.

BTW - I got some flux & solder & a better iron so I think I'll try & fill
the pits in the old switch - leave bottom cover off & monitor it. It gets
warm - i guess around 130-140 deg at post after 5- 7 minutes of driving as
it is.
Since I have to pull switch again to route cables thru column, I'll try to
make a better repair, & figure if it doesn't get any warmer than that after
an hour or two of operation, figure it may last.

Jim

Re: Gremlins in my civic -UPDATE - thanks tegger
 

"jim L" <jtl57@bellsouth.net> wrote in
news:kSYyk.29373$kh2.18353@bignews3.bellsouth.net:

>
> "Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message >>
>
>
>>
>> That little coin of plastic is maybe two bucks at the dealer. You can
>> just buy a new one and pop it on.
>>
>
> That's good to know - The one for the cruise control switch was
> missing as well, but I just put a machine bolt into it & adjusted the
> switch. If the ball shifts when the glue on the tape dries up, I'll
> get one.

better get one for the BRAKE pedal,too.
On my 94 Integra GSR,that plug crumbled and the brake lights stayed on
until I pulled a fuse.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Re: Gremlins in my civic -UPDATE - thanks tegger
 

Good Idea Jim. I have a look at it

"Jim Yanik" <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote in message
news:Xns9B1958A449F63jyanikkuanet@74.209.136.85...
> "jim L" <jtl57@bellsouth.net> wrote in
> news:kSYyk.29373$kh2.18353@bignews3.bellsouth.net:
>
>>
>> "Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message >>
>>
>>
>>>
>>> That little coin of plastic is maybe two bucks at the dealer. You can
>>> just buy a new one and pop it on.
>>>
>>
>> That's good to know - The one for the cruise control switch was
>> missing as well, but I just put a machine bolt into it & adjusted the
>> switch. If the ball shifts when the glue on the tape dries up, I'll
>> get one.
>
> better get one for the BRAKE pedal,too.
> On my 94 Integra GSR,that plug crumbled and the brake lights stayed on
> until I pulled a fuse.
>
> --
> Jim Yanik
> jyanik
> at
> kua.net

Re: Gremlins in my civic -UPDATE - thanks tegger
 

jim L wrote:
> "Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message >>
>
>
>> That little coin of plastic is maybe two bucks at the dealer. You can just
>> buy a new one and pop it on.
>>
>
> That's good to know - The one for the cruise control switch was missing as
> well, but I just put a machine bolt into it & adjusted the switch. If the
> ball shifts when the glue on the tape dries up, I'll get one.
>
> BTW - I got some flux & solder & a better iron so I think I'll try & fill
> the pits in the old switch - leave bottom cover off & monitor it. It gets
> warm - i guess around 130-140 deg at post after 5- 7 minutes of driving as
> it is.

take all the junk off your key chain and make sure you return the key to
the full "run" position after starting, don't just release it and rely
on spring pressure. this makes sure the terminal face areas are in full
contact and that will keep temperature down. you only get heating if
the contact area is reduced for some reason.



> Since I have to pull switch again to route cables thru column, I'll try to
> make a better repair, & figure if it doesn't get any warmer than that after
> an hour or two of operation, figure it may last.
>
> Jim
>
>