Re: my 2004 civic obeys new fuel economy law
Gordon McGrew wrote:
> On Tue, 01 Jan 2008 00:24:20 GMT, Jeff <kidsdoc2000@hotmail.com> > wrote: > >> Gordon McGrew wrote: >>> On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 14:20:54 GMT, Jeff <kidsdoc2000@hotmail.com> >>> wrote: >>> >>>> jim beam wrote: >>>>> DJ NoMore wrote: >>>>>> Woody wrote: >>>>>>> The 36 mpg is not an individual car standard, it is a measure that >>>>>>> all autos manufactured by a company has to meet. >>>>>>> >>>>>> Oh, do I ever know that one. In 2000, I had a 2000 model year truck >>>>>> that was no where near what the EPA rating was. I thought to myself, >>>>>> did they measure EPA and throw in a downhill factor or something? I >>>>>> got 11 MPG in the city and 16 MPG on the highway and I think the >>>>>> sticker claimed 14/20... yeah right. I won't even tell you how bad it >>>>>> was when pulling my 3,000 pound mobile DJ trailer around, but it was >>>>>> SINGLE digits and I had an additional $50 to $150 charge if I had to >>>>>> travel out of town! >>>>>> >>>>>> OTOH, before my 2007 Accord EX-L V6 6MT was totaled this past October, >>>>>> I managed to eek out 31 to 33 MPG on my SEVEN trips from Louisiana to >>>>>> Florida between February and May 2007. I thought that was pretty good >>>>>> for a car that could hit 60 MPH in six seconds flat. Not bad for a 30 >>>>>> MPG highway rating per the sticker. At least my experience with my >>>>>> Hondas is that they were always close to or better than the sticker >>>>>> EPA MPG rating whereas my domestic brand cars never once hit the EPA >>>>>> rating on the sticker. >>>>> epa ratings are done on a rolling road - i'm interested to see how they >>>>> take vehicle weight into account in that scenario, if at all. >>>> They don't. >>>> >>>> Jeff >>> Not true. The vehicle weight is factored into the calculation which >>> yields the reported estimate. >> Evidence please. > > Vehicles are placed in "inertia weight classes" based on their weight > in 500 Lb. increments. (Too course in my judgement but that is the > way it is.) That is so that the vehicle maker doesn't have to submit several different vehicles that are nearly identical, except for different weights. But, if say a 3000-lb car gets 30 mpg on the highway test, the number isn't adjusted. however, if the vehicle maker has a 3500 car that is nearly identical, there is a formula that can be used to estimate the mileage the 3500-lb car would get based on the mileage the 3000-lb car obtained. So the vehicle maker can test either car and estimate the mileage of the other car or the vehicle maker can test both cars to get the estimates. > <http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=ccab9e991dc3344fff9261057c8e6e08&rg n=div5&view=text&node=40:29.0.1.4.41&idno=40%5D> <...> >> The mileage is determined by the Sec. of Transportation, not the EPA. >> And there is no standard for determining how the mileage is measured. > > > The test procedure is codified in the Code of Federal Regulations (see > above link) which reads in part: I am talking about the new requirements, as seen in the Energy Independence Act of 2007 (http://www.rules.house.gov/110/text/...HamdToSamd.pdf), not the requirements for the 2008 cars. Jeff |
Re: my 2004 civic obeys new fuel economy law
On Wed, 02 Jan 2008 03:03:18 GMT, Jeff <kidsdoc2000@hotmail.com>
wrote: >Gordon McGrew wrote: >> On Tue, 01 Jan 2008 00:24:20 GMT, Jeff <kidsdoc2000@hotmail.com> >> wrote: >> >>> Gordon McGrew wrote: >>>> On Mon, 31 Dec 2007 14:20:54 GMT, Jeff <kidsdoc2000@hotmail.com> >>>> wrote: >>>> >>>>> jim beam wrote: >>>>>> DJ NoMore wrote: >>>>>>> Woody wrote: >>>>>>>> The 36 mpg is not an individual car standard, it is a measure that >>>>>>>> all autos manufactured by a company has to meet. >>>>>>>> >>>>>>> Oh, do I ever know that one. In 2000, I had a 2000 model year truck >>>>>>> that was no where near what the EPA rating was. I thought to myself, >>>>>>> did they measure EPA and throw in a downhill factor or something? I >>>>>>> got 11 MPG in the city and 16 MPG on the highway and I think the >>>>>>> sticker claimed 14/20... yeah right. I won't even tell you how bad it >>>>>>> was when pulling my 3,000 pound mobile DJ trailer around, but it was >>>>>>> SINGLE digits and I had an additional $50 to $150 charge if I had to >>>>>>> travel out of town! >>>>>>> >>>>>>> OTOH, before my 2007 Accord EX-L V6 6MT was totaled this past October, >>>>>>> I managed to eek out 31 to 33 MPG on my SEVEN trips from Louisiana to >>>>>>> Florida between February and May 2007. I thought that was pretty good >>>>>>> for a car that could hit 60 MPH in six seconds flat. Not bad for a 30 >>>>>>> MPG highway rating per the sticker. At least my experience with my >>>>>>> Hondas is that they were always close to or better than the sticker >>>>>>> EPA MPG rating whereas my domestic brand cars never once hit the EPA >>>>>>> rating on the sticker. >>>>>> epa ratings are done on a rolling road - i'm interested to see how they >>>>>> take vehicle weight into account in that scenario, if at all. >>>>> They don't. >>>>> >>>>> Jeff >>>> Not true. The vehicle weight is factored into the calculation which >>>> yields the reported estimate. >>> Evidence please. >> >> Vehicles are placed in "inertia weight classes" based on their weight >> in 500 Lb. increments. (Too course in my judgement but that is the >> way it is.) > >That is so that the vehicle maker doesn't have to submit several >different vehicles that are nearly identical, except for different >weights. But, if say a 3000-lb car gets 30 mpg on the highway test, the >number isn't adjusted. however, if the vehicle maker has a 3500 car that >is nearly identical, there is a formula that can be used to estimate the >mileage the 3500-lb car would get based on the mileage the 3000-lb car >obtained. So the vehicle maker can test either car and estimate the >mileage of the other car or the vehicle maker can test both cars to get >the estimates. I don't think that is exactly the way it works, but in any event, the (approximate) weight of the vehicle is accounted for. > >> <http://ecfr.gpoaccess.gov/cgi/t/text/text-idx?c=ecfr&sid=ccab9e991dc3344fff9261057c8e6e08&rg n=div5&view=text&node=40:29.0.1.4.41&idno=40%5D> ><...> > >>> The mileage is determined by the Sec. of Transportation, not the EPA. >>> And there is no standard for determining how the mileage is measured. >> >> >> The test procedure is codified in the Code of Federal Regulations (see >> above link) which reads in part: > >I am talking about the new requirements, as seen in the Energy >Independence Act of 2007 >(http://www.rules.house.gov/110/text/...HamdToSamd.pdf), not the >requirements for the 2008 cars. AFAIK, the 2007 legislation changes the CAFE mileage standard that each manufacturer must meet (or pay a fine.) The method of testing has not changed. Do you have a source indicating otherwise? > >Jeff |
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