Hate crimes are a load of B/S
01-11-2006, 07:09 PM
#1
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Hate crimes are a load of B/S
Hate crimes are ridiculous. If a white guy kills a white guy it might be 15
years - if a white guy kills a black guy it might be 15 - but maybe the
state decides to push hate crime charges and now it's 25 years.
The crime is no different - murder is murder - so why is the sentence
different? When the white man is murdered it's 15 years, and the black man,
25 (if hate crime charges stick). Does that mean the black man was more
valuable to society?
That's why the punishment is more severe? What the @#%$ - I don't care what
motivated you to kill the guy - it's the act itself that should be punished.
When you go down that road...really, a hate crime isn't a hate crime so much
as it's a thought crime. And what direction will society take when 'thought'
crimes become the norm?
If we have laws against murdering a guy because he's black - why not have
laws against murdering a guy because he's a dentist? Everybody has their own
personal motivation for why they murder someone.
For whatever reason, they hate the person that they murder (or don't care at
all) - shouldn't they be protected by some sort of hate crime too? Why can
you only hate someone based on ethnicity, sexual orientation, religion or
nationality? I can find lots of other things to hate in a person.
The thing is that the law doesn't cover all of its bases when trying to
pursue the endeavour of thought crimes such as these - so instead, to
preserve equality in the law there shouldn't be any hate charges. It's
impossible to cover every reason you could have to hate someone that would
motivate you to do the crime - so the only way to equally cover them all is
to NOT cover them.
Now the dentist that was murdered because he was an obnoxious a$$hole or
whatever, whatever reason the murderer had to hate him - the laws protecting
him are just the same as the laws protecting some black guy. And that's the
way it should be.
It just seems so stupid to me that they'd write a law into existence that
tacks on years to your sentence for what motivated you to commit the crime.
Why not have laws against hating people that are a$$holes? They're citizens
too, right? How does one even prove your motivation behind a crime when it
is so intangible as thought? Who defines what hate is?
Having additional charges filed against the perpetrator just because of the
victim's background is racist if you ask me. Especially when everyone was
equally protected by the law against killing a guy. Now we have laws that
protect minorities and **** more than the laws against committing the crime
in general and rarely do they ever protect us. Is that right? No. Absolutely
not.
-Hate crime charges rarely protect whites from blatant racial motivations
behind crimes committed against them.
I really don't want to make this argument one to protect whites - although
that certainly is an issue - this is more about the inhereht racism (in the
true sense of the word) that lies within the very existence of the hate
crime.
Essentially - it seems that it is a worse crime to kill a black man because
you hate him because he is black - than it is to kill a white man because
you hate him because he slept with your wife. Murder is murder. The sentance
should be the same.
years - if a white guy kills a black guy it might be 15 - but maybe the
state decides to push hate crime charges and now it's 25 years.
The crime is no different - murder is murder - so why is the sentence
different? When the white man is murdered it's 15 years, and the black man,
25 (if hate crime charges stick). Does that mean the black man was more
valuable to society?
That's why the punishment is more severe? What the @#%$ - I don't care what
motivated you to kill the guy - it's the act itself that should be punished.
When you go down that road...really, a hate crime isn't a hate crime so much
as it's a thought crime. And what direction will society take when 'thought'
crimes become the norm?
If we have laws against murdering a guy because he's black - why not have
laws against murdering a guy because he's a dentist? Everybody has their own
personal motivation for why they murder someone.
For whatever reason, they hate the person that they murder (or don't care at
all) - shouldn't they be protected by some sort of hate crime too? Why can
you only hate someone based on ethnicity, sexual orientation, religion or
nationality? I can find lots of other things to hate in a person.
The thing is that the law doesn't cover all of its bases when trying to
pursue the endeavour of thought crimes such as these - so instead, to
preserve equality in the law there shouldn't be any hate charges. It's
impossible to cover every reason you could have to hate someone that would
motivate you to do the crime - so the only way to equally cover them all is
to NOT cover them.
Now the dentist that was murdered because he was an obnoxious a$$hole or
whatever, whatever reason the murderer had to hate him - the laws protecting
him are just the same as the laws protecting some black guy. And that's the
way it should be.
It just seems so stupid to me that they'd write a law into existence that
tacks on years to your sentence for what motivated you to commit the crime.
Why not have laws against hating people that are a$$holes? They're citizens
too, right? How does one even prove your motivation behind a crime when it
is so intangible as thought? Who defines what hate is?
Having additional charges filed against the perpetrator just because of the
victim's background is racist if you ask me. Especially when everyone was
equally protected by the law against killing a guy. Now we have laws that
protect minorities and **** more than the laws against committing the crime
in general and rarely do they ever protect us. Is that right? No. Absolutely
not.
-Hate crime charges rarely protect whites from blatant racial motivations
behind crimes committed against them.
I really don't want to make this argument one to protect whites - although
that certainly is an issue - this is more about the inhereht racism (in the
true sense of the word) that lies within the very existence of the hate
crime.
Essentially - it seems that it is a worse crime to kill a black man because
you hate him because he is black - than it is to kill a white man because
you hate him because he slept with your wife. Murder is murder. The sentance
should be the same.
01-12-2006, 01:31 AM
#2
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ok i didnt read the whole thing... so correct me if im missing something... hate crime charges are not give jus for a white person killing a black person or VISE VERSA... there givin when the reason for the killing has to do with the color of the person...
01-12-2006, 01:50 AM
#3
Well... i disagree. People commit murder for various reasons. Sometimes a crime of passion, sometimes hate and sometimes for retribution/payback etc etc.
Point is, there definitely is a difference between killing someone cause they raped your child, stole 10million $ from you, or jacked your civic. Hate crimes are retarded.. "oh look at whitey ford over there, lets go do him in". In the end the result is the same which has to have a foreseen punishment, 14 years max (which is sad), but addon depending on the crime.
Its not just about 'black' people its about most all the diverse cultures out there. I don’t believe you’ll see the term hate crime used often when a white man is killed by a group of non whites, but at some point they will throw the book at someone to make a point.
Certain people have gotten on the pedestal and use the race card often and have fully taken advantage of the political stage.
In most cases you wont see a group of white folks protesting city hall because they feel they’re being profiled.....(take into consideration that over 90% of violent crime is committed by non-whites)... but you get the point. Racism is still very much alive for everyone.
The real problem is that the people committing these crimes are trying to pass the buck. Blame their social status on their reasoning for murder. Ok, so you rob 7/11 for some bread, hotdogs and a warm jacket. That’s life, you need to survive. The government and the person who’s guilty need to find a helpful proactive resolution. Kill the 7/11 attendant cause he was not your ‘color’ as well, well, you should be hung, not locked up.
In my eyes the pre meditation of a crime & motive makes a big difference, and in the eyes of the court it also makes a difference. Killing a white or black man because he pulled a knife on you is one thing, killing him cause he doesn’t look like you is another. That is a hate crime and in no way the same as a crime of passion, though the result are similar.
I really feel the best resolve that in the end would save tax payers money is a speedy trial and if found guilty capital punishment. No more vacations for these people. Put them in general population...again, im talking about the Paul Bernardos of the world, not John Smith whose robbed 2 stores to get food for his starving child..
Its sad but racism is still very alive and kicking. Not everyone hates the other in this world, but many are spoiling it.
Point is, there definitely is a difference between killing someone cause they raped your child, stole 10million $ from you, or jacked your civic. Hate crimes are retarded.. "oh look at whitey ford over there, lets go do him in". In the end the result is the same which has to have a foreseen punishment, 14 years max (which is sad), but addon depending on the crime.
Its not just about 'black' people its about most all the diverse cultures out there. I don’t believe you’ll see the term hate crime used often when a white man is killed by a group of non whites, but at some point they will throw the book at someone to make a point.
Certain people have gotten on the pedestal and use the race card often and have fully taken advantage of the political stage.
In most cases you wont see a group of white folks protesting city hall because they feel they’re being profiled.....(take into consideration that over 90% of violent crime is committed by non-whites)... but you get the point. Racism is still very much alive for everyone.
The real problem is that the people committing these crimes are trying to pass the buck. Blame their social status on their reasoning for murder. Ok, so you rob 7/11 for some bread, hotdogs and a warm jacket. That’s life, you need to survive. The government and the person who’s guilty need to find a helpful proactive resolution. Kill the 7/11 attendant cause he was not your ‘color’ as well, well, you should be hung, not locked up.
In my eyes the pre meditation of a crime & motive makes a big difference, and in the eyes of the court it also makes a difference. Killing a white or black man because he pulled a knife on you is one thing, killing him cause he doesn’t look like you is another. That is a hate crime and in no way the same as a crime of passion, though the result are similar.
I really feel the best resolve that in the end would save tax payers money is a speedy trial and if found guilty capital punishment. No more vacations for these people. Put them in general population...again, im talking about the Paul Bernardos of the world, not John Smith whose robbed 2 stores to get food for his starving child..
Its sad but racism is still very alive and kicking. Not everyone hates the other in this world, but many are spoiling it.
01-12-2006, 08:47 AM
#4
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there is almost no difference in punishment for if you kill somebody that raped your preadolescent child , or if you kill somebody because they gave you the finger ...
but if you kill somebody with a different skin color , that's different ...
and then again , you have killing a cop , who'se only purpose in life is to slightly lower the IQ average in his demographic area . and then you don't get 25 , u get shot , so u don't go to prison for 35 and be an idol to the inmates
anywais , no sweat , society's ed up anyways , this is just an extra oddity out of the many it has to offer
but if you kill somebody with a different skin color , that's different ...
and then again , you have killing a cop , who'se only purpose in life is to slightly lower the IQ average in his demographic area . and then you don't get 25 , u get shot , so u don't go to prison for 35 and be an idol to the inmates
anywais , no sweat , society's ed up anyways , this is just an extra oddity out of the many it has to offer
Last edited by Zapa; 01-12-2006 at 08:53 AM.
01-12-2006, 09:38 AM
#5
Originally Posted by Zapa
there is almost no difference in punishment for if you kill somebody that raped your preadolescent child , or if you kill somebody because they gave you the finger ...
but if you kill somebody with a different skin color , that's different ...
and then again , you have killing a cop , who'se only purpose in life is to slightly lower the IQ average in his demographic area . and then you don't get 25 , u get shot , so u don't go to prison for 35 and be an idol to the inmates
anywais , no sweat , society's ed up anyways , this is just an extra oddity out of the many it has to offer
but if you kill somebody with a different skin color , that's different ...
and then again , you have killing a cop , who'se only purpose in life is to slightly lower the IQ average in his demographic area . and then you don't get 25 , u get shot , so u don't go to prison for 35 and be an idol to the inmates
anywais , no sweat , society's ed up anyways , this is just an extra oddity out of the many it has to offer
As for police officers. They have to score higher than 80% on the general aptitude exam, which according to some stats ive heard, 75% of the people fail. Though many cops are ******, I don’t think all are door stops.
Yes, society is totally ed. Where you have cops harass you to leave Timmies and threaten charges yet rarely lay charges at a street race. Makes no sense. Wish the media would talk about that, but all they want to do is sell papers…
01-12-2006, 03:13 PM
#6
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its wierd how whenever something shocking happens everybody talks about it, and all the politicians talk about how laws have to be changed, but then some time passes and all those politicians forget everything they promised.
i'm not really talking about anything in particular, just a general observation.
case in point, when the girl was killed on boxing day, all the politicians just used that to promote themselves by saying how they will lower the crime rate and take away all the guns from the streets and what not, but once the elections are over they will totally forget everything they promised... its a real shame.
i'm not really talking about anything in particular, just a general observation.
case in point, when the girl was killed on boxing day, all the politicians just used that to promote themselves by saying how they will lower the crime rate and take away all the guns from the streets and what not, but once the elections are over they will totally forget everything they promised... its a real shame.
01-12-2006, 07:25 PM
#10
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Originally Posted by badassmuther
Do I really care if some murderer gets 10 more years...nope...lock em up.
would it matter if a white person murdered say a portugese person? would the media consider it a hate crime then? or is it only with extremely visible ethnicities? cuz I rarely hear about hate crimes unless its with black or white people, or with asian ppl, indian, arabic, iraqi etc...
is it a hate crime if a dutch person murders someone from the phillipines?
wut qualifies a crime as a hate crime?
wut if the person hated ppl with brown hair, or big noses?
race shouldn't enter in to it really.
01-12-2006, 07:27 PM
#11
Originally Posted by GTXsimon
but you shouldn't get 10 more years because the person is a different color than you are.
would it matter if a white person murdered say a portugese person? would the media consider it a hate crime then? or is it only with extremely visible ethnicities? cuz I rarely hear about hate crimes unless its with black or white people, or with asian ppl, indian, arabic, iraqi etc...
is it a hate crime if a dutch person murders someone from the phillipines?
wut qualifies a crime as a hate crime?
wut if the person hated ppl with brown hair, or big noses?
race shouldn't enter in to it really.
would it matter if a white person murdered say a portugese person? would the media consider it a hate crime then? or is it only with extremely visible ethnicities? cuz I rarely hear about hate crimes unless its with black or white people, or with asian ppl, indian, arabic, iraqi etc...
is it a hate crime if a dutch person murders someone from the phillipines?
wut qualifies a crime as a hate crime?
wut if the person hated ppl with brown hair, or big noses?
race shouldn't enter in to it really.
Just kidding ers
01-12-2006, 07:36 PM
#13
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Originally Posted by Nastyzed
I work with porkchops and all consider themselves to be of white european ancestry??
Originally Posted by 2TONE_93GT
You should get points for killing a portugese person
Just kidding ers
Just kidding ers
01-12-2006, 09:43 PM
#14
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OK, most people seem to like my opinion, so here goes. I think that this country is too lax on it's laws. Before you start in on me about being anti-Canadian, and all the other crap that's been said to me, I'm wearing a Team Canada hockey jersey, and you've all seen my van. I've got a pic of my old Omni, and I'll post it if anyone cares to see that paint job.
Anyway, if you kill someone, I don't care if it's crime of passion, hate, whatever, I beleive in eye for an eye. You deserve to die if you kill someone. I wish they would stick Bernardo in Gen Pop, so that bastard can get what he deserves. Murdering anyone, race, colour, nationality, religious beliefs, anything, should be punishable by death.
Now, that I'm on a rant, DUI/DWI should be an immediate BAN from driving PERMANANTLY. Now before anyone starts in, my FATHER is currently wanted on a bench warrant for this, and has no liscense, no insurance, and I have called the police on him when he has driven drunk. And I would do it to anyone.
As for most other driving offences, well, I've got speeding tickets like most other people, so I'm not going to go off on that, BUT, if you kill someone with your vehicle, YOU are supposed to be in control of that vehicle, so it is murder. Now I realize that if someone else hits you, and as a result you kill someone, that's not your fault, but we need to have stronger laws regarding things like this. Murder should not be a 15 year term. It should be execution. There is a vid kicking around of the execution of a murderer somewhere in the Middle East, I don't know where, where the family of the person killed, carried out the execution. Not a bad idea. I've seen another one, that is Afghanistan, and it's punishment for rape. They cut off your dick, right in the middle of the square, with the women who you raped, watching. Again, not a bad idea. Now honestly, neither of these are ever going to happen here, because we are "civilized". BULLSHIT. If we were civilized, kids wouldn't be getting shot on the streets. Give it another 6 months, the way it's going, and TO is going to be no better than Detroit.
The really sad part about it is, it took a 15 year old WHITE girl to get killed before anyone really freaked out. WTF?!? So black people, according to the local government aren't as important? Bullshit. The steps that are supposedly being implemented, are racist. Nothing was done until a white 15 year old girl was shot. What about all those young black kids, that never even make the front page let alone get this kind of response.
Anyway, that's enough. And my 2l 16v engine is here, so I'm done. Feel free to disagree with my opinion, that's why we're here.
Anyway, if you kill someone, I don't care if it's crime of passion, hate, whatever, I beleive in eye for an eye. You deserve to die if you kill someone. I wish they would stick Bernardo in Gen Pop, so that bastard can get what he deserves. Murdering anyone, race, colour, nationality, religious beliefs, anything, should be punishable by death.
Now, that I'm on a rant, DUI/DWI should be an immediate BAN from driving PERMANANTLY. Now before anyone starts in, my FATHER is currently wanted on a bench warrant for this, and has no liscense, no insurance, and I have called the police on him when he has driven drunk. And I would do it to anyone.
As for most other driving offences, well, I've got speeding tickets like most other people, so I'm not going to go off on that, BUT, if you kill someone with your vehicle, YOU are supposed to be in control of that vehicle, so it is murder. Now I realize that if someone else hits you, and as a result you kill someone, that's not your fault, but we need to have stronger laws regarding things like this. Murder should not be a 15 year term. It should be execution. There is a vid kicking around of the execution of a murderer somewhere in the Middle East, I don't know where, where the family of the person killed, carried out the execution. Not a bad idea. I've seen another one, that is Afghanistan, and it's punishment for rape. They cut off your dick, right in the middle of the square, with the women who you raped, watching. Again, not a bad idea. Now honestly, neither of these are ever going to happen here, because we are "civilized". BULLSHIT. If we were civilized, kids wouldn't be getting shot on the streets. Give it another 6 months, the way it's going, and TO is going to be no better than Detroit.
The really sad part about it is, it took a 15 year old WHITE girl to get killed before anyone really freaked out. WTF?!? So black people, according to the local government aren't as important? Bullshit. The steps that are supposedly being implemented, are racist. Nothing was done until a white 15 year old girl was shot. What about all those young black kids, that never even make the front page let alone get this kind of response.
Anyway, that's enough. And my 2l 16v engine is here, so I'm done. Feel free to disagree with my opinion, that's why we're here.
01-12-2006, 10:32 PM
#15
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"they only did somthing about it when a white girl was killed".. Do you know how many countless incidents happen that dont make it to papers?
a few months back in new york a group of blacks attacked 3 12 year old white girls in a park beat them down screaming black power and such.. Looks for it on the net. If the situation was reversed and it was a group of white guys beating on 3 12 year old black girls it would have been plastered on every local broadcast and paper all over north america. I belive even the president would have had to make a speach how this madness must stop.
Black lives are more valuble then whites and thats exacley why. Black supremacy is at all time high these days. Think you know your favorite rapper? think again..
"Now I'm black but black people trip 'cause white people like me; white people like me I but don't like them. . . . I don't hate whites, I just gotta death wish for motherers that ain't right";
--"Race War"; Ice-T, Home Invasion, 1993, Priority Records, Thorn EMI; now called The EMI Group, United Kingdom.
"To all my Universal Soldier's: stay at attention while I strategize an invasion; the mission be assassination, snipers hitting Caucasians with semi-automatic shots heard around the world; my plot is to control the globe and hold the world hostage. . . . see, I got a war plan more deadlier than Hitler. . . . lyrical specialist, underworld . . . . keep the unity thick like mud. . . . I pulling out gats , launching deadly attacks";
--"Blood for Blood"; Killarmy, Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars, 1997, Wu-Tang Records, Priority Records, The EMI Group, United Kingdom.
"Bust a Glock; devils get shot. . . . when God give the word me herd like the buffalo through the neighborhood; watch me blast. . . . I'm killing more crackers than Bosnia-Herzegovina, each and everyday. . . . don't bust until you see the whites of his eyes, the whites of his skin. . . . Louis Farrakhan . . . Bloods and CRIPS, and little old me, and we all getting ready for the enemy";
-- "Enemy"; Ice Cube, Lethal Injection, 1993, Priority Records, Thorn EMI; now called The EMI Group, United Kingdom.
"Rhymes is rugged like burnt buildings in Harlem; the Ol Dirty Bastard. . . . I'm also militant. . . . snatching devils up by the hair, then cut his head off";
--"Cuttin Headz"; Ol Dirty Bastard, Return of the 36 Chambers: the Dirty Version; 1995, Elektra Entertainment, Time Warner, USA.
just a sample of a few. Sickening these lyrics were mass produced and are probibly available at your local HMV. What would happen if eminem did like that??
a few months back in new york a group of blacks attacked 3 12 year old white girls in a park beat them down screaming black power and such.. Looks for it on the net. If the situation was reversed and it was a group of white guys beating on 3 12 year old black girls it would have been plastered on every local broadcast and paper all over north america. I belive even the president would have had to make a speach how this madness must stop.
Black lives are more valuble then whites and thats exacley why. Black supremacy is at all time high these days. Think you know your favorite rapper? think again..
"Now I'm black but black people trip 'cause white people like me; white people like me I but don't like them. . . . I don't hate whites, I just gotta death wish for motherers that ain't right";
--"Race War"; Ice-T, Home Invasion, 1993, Priority Records, Thorn EMI; now called The EMI Group, United Kingdom.
"To all my Universal Soldier's: stay at attention while I strategize an invasion; the mission be assassination, snipers hitting Caucasians with semi-automatic shots heard around the world; my plot is to control the globe and hold the world hostage. . . . see, I got a war plan more deadlier than Hitler. . . . lyrical specialist, underworld . . . . keep the unity thick like mud. . . . I pulling out gats , launching deadly attacks";
--"Blood for Blood"; Killarmy, Silent Weapons for Quiet Wars, 1997, Wu-Tang Records, Priority Records, The EMI Group, United Kingdom.
"Bust a Glock; devils get shot. . . . when God give the word me herd like the buffalo through the neighborhood; watch me blast. . . . I'm killing more crackers than Bosnia-Herzegovina, each and everyday. . . . don't bust until you see the whites of his eyes, the whites of his skin. . . . Louis Farrakhan . . . Bloods and CRIPS, and little old me, and we all getting ready for the enemy";
-- "Enemy"; Ice Cube, Lethal Injection, 1993, Priority Records, Thorn EMI; now called The EMI Group, United Kingdom.
"Rhymes is rugged like burnt buildings in Harlem; the Ol Dirty Bastard. . . . I'm also militant. . . . snatching devils up by the hair, then cut his head off";
--"Cuttin Headz"; Ol Dirty Bastard, Return of the 36 Chambers: the Dirty Version; 1995, Elektra Entertainment, Time Warner, USA.
just a sample of a few. Sickening these lyrics were mass produced and are probibly available at your local HMV. What would happen if eminem did like that??