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Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
In article <9qbkb.2170$W16.332@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.n et>, "News
Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > After searching several forums and this NG for a similar issue, I was > wondering if anyone has experienced a hydraulic leaking issue with a 5-speed > Accord EX? I picked this car up in March this year, drove it 7,500 miles, > had already performed the initial oil change, and was plenty happy when the > clutch went totally soft this week while driving to work. Turns out the > hydraulic pump for the clutch leaked (the dealer said it was a > manufacturer's defect) and needed to be replaced. With a broken-in 2003 > Honda, I was blown away something like this could go wrong so early in the > car's lifetime. > > Anyway, they fixed it and I was happy, although somewhat displeased with my > first Honda ever (after several bad GM experiences, I decided on Honda after > considering a Toyota Solara and Nissan Altima). > > As luck would have it, ten minutes after I left the dealer, the clutch went > soft again and I could not get the 5-speed into any gear at all. Stranded - > again. The 2003 Accord is being loaded now onto a flatbed so they can fix > again, and I will surely need a rental car for a few days. > > Sorry for the diatribe, but I must be the sole statistical anomaly here (or > am I) - has anyone else seen a hydraulic clutch go bad (leaking to the point > of ensuring you cannot get into gear) on a 2003 Accord EX coupe with a > 5-speed? This is the standard 2.4L engine obviously. Your vehicle is still under warranty--let the dealer do the work. If you do it yourself or hire a private mechanic to do it--Honda will use this as an escuse to not do work on the specific problem. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The
towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent at all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this car is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. The non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and this may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic outsells the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed 2.4L 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than just the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem on their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell knows. We'll see................. "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message news:billbjohnson555-1910031828500001@pm5-broad-127.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > In article <9qbkb.2170$W16.332@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.n et>, "News > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > After searching several forums and this NG for a similar issue, I was > > wondering if anyone has experienced a hydraulic leaking issue with a 5-speed > > Accord EX? I picked this car up in March this year, drove it 7,500 miles, > > had already performed the initial oil change, and was plenty happy when the > > clutch went totally soft this week while driving to work. Turns out the > > hydraulic pump for the clutch leaked (the dealer said it was a > > manufacturer's defect) and needed to be replaced. With a broken-in 2003 > > Honda, I was blown away something like this could go wrong so early in the > > car's lifetime. > > > > Anyway, they fixed it and I was happy, although somewhat displeased with my > > first Honda ever (after several bad GM experiences, I decided on Honda after > > considering a Toyota Solara and Nissan Altima). > > > > As luck would have it, ten minutes after I left the dealer, the clutch went > > soft again and I could not get the 5-speed into any gear at all. Stranded - > > again. The 2003 Accord is being loaded now onto a flatbed so they can fix > > again, and I will surely need a rental car for a few days. > > > > Sorry for the diatribe, but I must be the sole statistical anomaly here (or > > am I) - has anyone else seen a hydraulic clutch go bad (leaking to the point > > of ensuring you cannot get into gear) on a 2003 Accord EX coupe with a > > 5-speed? This is the standard 2.4L engine obviously. > > Your vehicle is still under warranty--let the dealer do the work. If you > do it yourself or hire a private mechanic to do it--Honda will use this as > an escuse to not do work on the specific problem. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The
towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent at all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this car is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. The non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and this may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic outsells the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed 2.4L 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than just the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem on their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell knows. We'll see................. "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message news:billbjohnson555-1910031828500001@pm5-broad-127.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > In article <9qbkb.2170$W16.332@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.n et>, "News > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > After searching several forums and this NG for a similar issue, I was > > wondering if anyone has experienced a hydraulic leaking issue with a 5-speed > > Accord EX? I picked this car up in March this year, drove it 7,500 miles, > > had already performed the initial oil change, and was plenty happy when the > > clutch went totally soft this week while driving to work. Turns out the > > hydraulic pump for the clutch leaked (the dealer said it was a > > manufacturer's defect) and needed to be replaced. With a broken-in 2003 > > Honda, I was blown away something like this could go wrong so early in the > > car's lifetime. > > > > Anyway, they fixed it and I was happy, although somewhat displeased with my > > first Honda ever (after several bad GM experiences, I decided on Honda after > > considering a Toyota Solara and Nissan Altima). > > > > As luck would have it, ten minutes after I left the dealer, the clutch went > > soft again and I could not get the 5-speed into any gear at all. Stranded - > > again. The 2003 Accord is being loaded now onto a flatbed so they can fix > > again, and I will surely need a rental car for a few days. > > > > Sorry for the diatribe, but I must be the sole statistical anomaly here (or > > am I) - has anyone else seen a hydraulic clutch go bad (leaking to the point > > of ensuring you cannot get into gear) on a 2003 Accord EX coupe with a > > 5-speed? This is the standard 2.4L engine obviously. > > Your vehicle is still under warranty--let the dealer do the work. If you > do it yourself or hire a private mechanic to do it--Honda will use this as > an escuse to not do work on the specific problem. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The
towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent at all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this car is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. The non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and this may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic outsells the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed 2.4L 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than just the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem on their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell knows. We'll see................. "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message news:billbjohnson555-1910031828500001@pm5-broad-127.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > In article <9qbkb.2170$W16.332@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.n et>, "News > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > After searching several forums and this NG for a similar issue, I was > > wondering if anyone has experienced a hydraulic leaking issue with a 5-speed > > Accord EX? I picked this car up in March this year, drove it 7,500 miles, > > had already performed the initial oil change, and was plenty happy when the > > clutch went totally soft this week while driving to work. Turns out the > > hydraulic pump for the clutch leaked (the dealer said it was a > > manufacturer's defect) and needed to be replaced. With a broken-in 2003 > > Honda, I was blown away something like this could go wrong so early in the > > car's lifetime. > > > > Anyway, they fixed it and I was happy, although somewhat displeased with my > > first Honda ever (after several bad GM experiences, I decided on Honda after > > considering a Toyota Solara and Nissan Altima). > > > > As luck would have it, ten minutes after I left the dealer, the clutch went > > soft again and I could not get the 5-speed into any gear at all. Stranded - > > again. The 2003 Accord is being loaded now onto a flatbed so they can fix > > again, and I will surely need a rental car for a few days. > > > > Sorry for the diatribe, but I must be the sole statistical anomaly here (or > > am I) - has anyone else seen a hydraulic clutch go bad (leaking to the point > > of ensuring you cannot get into gear) on a 2003 Accord EX coupe with a > > 5-speed? This is the standard 2.4L engine obviously. > > Your vehicle is still under warranty--let the dealer do the work. If you > do it yourself or hire a private mechanic to do it--Honda will use this as > an escuse to not do work on the specific problem. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
In article <x7Ukb.4431$S52.803@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.n et>, "News
Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The > towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent at > all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this car > is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect > (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service > center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. The > non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not > something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. > Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. > > I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and this > may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic outsells > the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed 2.4L > 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than just > the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem on > their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell > knows. You may be right--this could be a bigger issue than just the problem with your car. Many car companies try to keep problems that effect lots of cars a secret from the public. They usually just fix the problems under the warranty program as the owners bring them in for service. They will notify the Honda mechanics via of special notices so they can fix the problems on those effected vehicles. Rarely ever do car companies annouce a major recall since a major recall will in most cases appear as a major news story and no car company likes it to happen. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
In article <x7Ukb.4431$S52.803@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.n et>, "News
Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The > towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent at > all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this car > is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect > (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service > center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. The > non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not > something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. > Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. > > I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and this > may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic outsells > the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed 2.4L > 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than just > the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem on > their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell > knows. You may be right--this could be a bigger issue than just the problem with your car. Many car companies try to keep problems that effect lots of cars a secret from the public. They usually just fix the problems under the warranty program as the owners bring them in for service. They will notify the Honda mechanics via of special notices so they can fix the problems on those effected vehicles. Rarely ever do car companies annouce a major recall since a major recall will in most cases appear as a major news story and no car company likes it to happen. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
In article <x7Ukb.4431$S52.803@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.n et>, "News
Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The > towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent at > all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this car > is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect > (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service > center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. The > non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not > something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. > Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. > > I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and this > may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic outsells > the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed 2.4L > 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than just > the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem on > their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell > knows. You may be right--this could be a bigger issue than just the problem with your car. Many car companies try to keep problems that effect lots of cars a secret from the public. They usually just fix the problems under the warranty program as the owners bring them in for service. They will notify the Honda mechanics via of special notices so they can fix the problems on those effected vehicles. Rarely ever do car companies annouce a major recall since a major recall will in most cases appear as a major news story and no car company likes it to happen. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
Us an update to this NG....
The root cause of the issue was this: a metal piece in very close proximity to the clutch mechanism had rubbed a small metal hose that connects the clutch slave cylinder to the clutch master cylinder to the point that this small hose had developed a "pinhole" leak analogous to a copper water pipe. Hence, when the slave clutch cylinder was originally replaced, the dealer thought that was the problem, seeing as it was covered with hydraulic fluid. However, they did not notice or find through testing that the slave cylinder was fine, but the small metal pipe that connects the slave and master clutch cylinders had a tiny leak. So 30 minutes after I drove the "fixed" Accord off the lot and applied the clutch a few times, all the hydraulic fluid again completely leaked out of the system and clutch pressure went away with no functioning hydraulic system. The repair report said something about the proximity of this pipe in relation to another unrelated engine component, after several thousand miles, could cause friction activity leading to a leak. As Oklahoma has crappy roads, this jostling of the car over the last six months may have contributed to an early failure. So, the end result - Honda fabricated a new design (or they had a local shop do it) for this small pipe and made one for this Accord that ensures there is no contact with it and any other piece of the clutch or engine assembly, hence solving this issue. I am quite perplexed that computer-assisted modeling and accelerated life testing, in the thousands of variables that were probably used, did not catch this design flaw. Being Six Sigma and ISO trained, the end analysis tells me that there was definitely an error made in this area of the vehicle insofar as design. Oh well, it's purring again and all seems to be well. It's so nice to get rid of that Ford Focus and relax in my car's environment. I'll give Honda one thing - their road and engine noise suppression is excellent. The sound tolerances remind me of a Lexus. Thanks for listening. Ciao. "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message news:billbjohnson555-2110031026490001@pm3-broad-201.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > In article <x7Ukb.4431$S52.803@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.n et>, "News > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The > > towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent at > > all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this car > > is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect > > (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service > > center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. The > > non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not > > something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. > > Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. > > > > I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and this > > may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic outsells > > the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed 2.4L > > 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than just > > the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem on > > their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell > > knows. > > You may be right--this could be a bigger issue than just the problem with > your car. Many car companies try to keep problems that effect lots of cars > a secret from the public. They usually just fix the problems under the > warranty program as the owners bring them in for service. They will notify > the Honda mechanics via of special notices so they can fix the problems on > those effected vehicles. Rarely ever do car companies annouce a major > recall since a major recall will in most cases appear as a major news > story and no car company likes it to happen. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
Us an update to this NG....
The root cause of the issue was this: a metal piece in very close proximity to the clutch mechanism had rubbed a small metal hose that connects the clutch slave cylinder to the clutch master cylinder to the point that this small hose had developed a "pinhole" leak analogous to a copper water pipe. Hence, when the slave clutch cylinder was originally replaced, the dealer thought that was the problem, seeing as it was covered with hydraulic fluid. However, they did not notice or find through testing that the slave cylinder was fine, but the small metal pipe that connects the slave and master clutch cylinders had a tiny leak. So 30 minutes after I drove the "fixed" Accord off the lot and applied the clutch a few times, all the hydraulic fluid again completely leaked out of the system and clutch pressure went away with no functioning hydraulic system. The repair report said something about the proximity of this pipe in relation to another unrelated engine component, after several thousand miles, could cause friction activity leading to a leak. As Oklahoma has crappy roads, this jostling of the car over the last six months may have contributed to an early failure. So, the end result - Honda fabricated a new design (or they had a local shop do it) for this small pipe and made one for this Accord that ensures there is no contact with it and any other piece of the clutch or engine assembly, hence solving this issue. I am quite perplexed that computer-assisted modeling and accelerated life testing, in the thousands of variables that were probably used, did not catch this design flaw. Being Six Sigma and ISO trained, the end analysis tells me that there was definitely an error made in this area of the vehicle insofar as design. Oh well, it's purring again and all seems to be well. It's so nice to get rid of that Ford Focus and relax in my car's environment. I'll give Honda one thing - their road and engine noise suppression is excellent. The sound tolerances remind me of a Lexus. Thanks for listening. Ciao. "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message news:billbjohnson555-2110031026490001@pm3-broad-201.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > In article <x7Ukb.4431$S52.803@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.n et>, "News > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The > > towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent at > > all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this car > > is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect > > (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service > > center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. The > > non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not > > something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. > > Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. > > > > I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and this > > may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic outsells > > the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed 2.4L > > 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than just > > the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem on > > their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell > > knows. > > You may be right--this could be a bigger issue than just the problem with > your car. Many car companies try to keep problems that effect lots of cars > a secret from the public. They usually just fix the problems under the > warranty program as the owners bring them in for service. They will notify > the Honda mechanics via of special notices so they can fix the problems on > those effected vehicles. Rarely ever do car companies annouce a major > recall since a major recall will in most cases appear as a major news > story and no car company likes it to happen. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
Us an update to this NG....
The root cause of the issue was this: a metal piece in very close proximity to the clutch mechanism had rubbed a small metal hose that connects the clutch slave cylinder to the clutch master cylinder to the point that this small hose had developed a "pinhole" leak analogous to a copper water pipe. Hence, when the slave clutch cylinder was originally replaced, the dealer thought that was the problem, seeing as it was covered with hydraulic fluid. However, they did not notice or find through testing that the slave cylinder was fine, but the small metal pipe that connects the slave and master clutch cylinders had a tiny leak. So 30 minutes after I drove the "fixed" Accord off the lot and applied the clutch a few times, all the hydraulic fluid again completely leaked out of the system and clutch pressure went away with no functioning hydraulic system. The repair report said something about the proximity of this pipe in relation to another unrelated engine component, after several thousand miles, could cause friction activity leading to a leak. As Oklahoma has crappy roads, this jostling of the car over the last six months may have contributed to an early failure. So, the end result - Honda fabricated a new design (or they had a local shop do it) for this small pipe and made one for this Accord that ensures there is no contact with it and any other piece of the clutch or engine assembly, hence solving this issue. I am quite perplexed that computer-assisted modeling and accelerated life testing, in the thousands of variables that were probably used, did not catch this design flaw. Being Six Sigma and ISO trained, the end analysis tells me that there was definitely an error made in this area of the vehicle insofar as design. Oh well, it's purring again and all seems to be well. It's so nice to get rid of that Ford Focus and relax in my car's environment. I'll give Honda one thing - their road and engine noise suppression is excellent. The sound tolerances remind me of a Lexus. Thanks for listening. Ciao. "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message news:billbjohnson555-2110031026490001@pm3-broad-201.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > In article <x7Ukb.4431$S52.803@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.n et>, "News > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The > > towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent at > > all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this car > > is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect > > (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service > > center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. The > > non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not > > something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. > > Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. > > > > I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and this > > may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic outsells > > the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed 2.4L > > 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than just > > the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem on > > their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell > > knows. > > You may be right--this could be a bigger issue than just the problem with > your car. Many car companies try to keep problems that effect lots of cars > a secret from the public. They usually just fix the problems under the > warranty program as the owners bring them in for service. They will notify > the Honda mechanics via of special notices so they can fix the problems on > those effected vehicles. Rarely ever do car companies annouce a major > recall since a major recall will in most cases appear as a major news > story and no car company likes it to happen. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
In article <y7hlb.236$wc3.9@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net> , "News
Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > Us an update to this NG.... > > The root cause of the issue was this: a metal piece in very close proximity > to the clutch mechanism had rubbed a small metal hose that connects the > clutch slave cylinder to the clutch master cylinder to the point that this > small hose had developed a "pinhole" leak analogous to a copper water pipe. > > Hence, when the slave clutch cylinder was originally replaced, the dealer > thought that was the problem, seeing as it was covered with hydraulic fluid. > However, they did not notice or find through testing that the slave cylinder > was fine, but the small metal pipe that connects the slave and master clutch > cylinders had a tiny leak. So 30 minutes after I drove the "fixed" Accord > off the lot and applied the clutch a few times, all the hydraulic fluid > again completely leaked out of the system and clutch pressure went away with > no functioning hydraulic system. > > The repair report said something about the proximity of this pipe in > relation to another unrelated engine component, after several thousand > miles, could cause friction activity leading to a leak. As Oklahoma has > crappy roads, this jostling of the car over the last six months may have > contributed to an early failure. > > So, the end result - Honda fabricated a new design (or they had a local shop > do it) for this small pipe and made one for this Accord that ensures there > is no contact with it and any other piece of the clutch or engine assembly, > hence solving this issue. > > I am quite perplexed that computer-assisted modeling and accelerated life > testing, in the thousands of variables that were probably used, did not > catch this design flaw. Being Six Sigma and ISO trained, the end analysis > tells me that there was definitely an error made in this area of the vehicle > insofar as design. > > Oh well, it's purring again and all seems to be well. It's so nice to get > rid of that Ford Focus and relax in my car's environment. I'll give Honda > one thing - their road and engine noise suppression is excellent. The sound > tolerances remind me of a Lexus. > > Thanks for listening. > > Ciao. > > > "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message > news:billbjohnson555-2110031026490001@pm3-broad-201.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > > In article <x7Ukb.4431$S52.803@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.n et>, "News > > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > > > Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The > > > towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent > at > > > all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this > car > > > is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect > > > (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service > > > center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. > The > > > non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not > > > something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. > > > Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. > > > > > > I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and > this > > > may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic > outsells > > > the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed > 2.4L > > > 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than > just > > > the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem > on > > > their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell > > > knows. > > > > You may be right--this could be a bigger issue than just the problem with > > your car. Many car companies try to keep problems that effect lots of cars > > a secret from the public. They usually just fix the problems under the > > warranty program as the owners bring them in for service. They will notify > > the Honda mechanics via of special notices so they can fix the problems on > > those effected vehicles. Rarely ever do car companies annouce a major > > recall since a major recall will in most cases appear as a major news > > story and no car company likes it to happen. I'm glad that your problem has now been fixed to your satisfaction. You might call the mechanic and ask him to advise Honda Inc. of the problem so they can repair the problem in the same way related to many other vehicles that have the same problem. They can also correct the design flaw on next year's model of the same vehicle. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
In article <y7hlb.236$wc3.9@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net> , "News
Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > Us an update to this NG.... > > The root cause of the issue was this: a metal piece in very close proximity > to the clutch mechanism had rubbed a small metal hose that connects the > clutch slave cylinder to the clutch master cylinder to the point that this > small hose had developed a "pinhole" leak analogous to a copper water pipe. > > Hence, when the slave clutch cylinder was originally replaced, the dealer > thought that was the problem, seeing as it was covered with hydraulic fluid. > However, they did not notice or find through testing that the slave cylinder > was fine, but the small metal pipe that connects the slave and master clutch > cylinders had a tiny leak. So 30 minutes after I drove the "fixed" Accord > off the lot and applied the clutch a few times, all the hydraulic fluid > again completely leaked out of the system and clutch pressure went away with > no functioning hydraulic system. > > The repair report said something about the proximity of this pipe in > relation to another unrelated engine component, after several thousand > miles, could cause friction activity leading to a leak. As Oklahoma has > crappy roads, this jostling of the car over the last six months may have > contributed to an early failure. > > So, the end result - Honda fabricated a new design (or they had a local shop > do it) for this small pipe and made one for this Accord that ensures there > is no contact with it and any other piece of the clutch or engine assembly, > hence solving this issue. > > I am quite perplexed that computer-assisted modeling and accelerated life > testing, in the thousands of variables that were probably used, did not > catch this design flaw. Being Six Sigma and ISO trained, the end analysis > tells me that there was definitely an error made in this area of the vehicle > insofar as design. > > Oh well, it's purring again and all seems to be well. It's so nice to get > rid of that Ford Focus and relax in my car's environment. I'll give Honda > one thing - their road and engine noise suppression is excellent. The sound > tolerances remind me of a Lexus. > > Thanks for listening. > > Ciao. > > > "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message > news:billbjohnson555-2110031026490001@pm3-broad-201.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > > In article <x7Ukb.4431$S52.803@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.n et>, "News > > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > > > Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The > > > towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent > at > > > all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this > car > > > is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect > > > (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service > > > center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. > The > > > non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not > > > something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. > > > Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. > > > > > > I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and > this > > > may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic > outsells > > > the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed > 2.4L > > > 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than > just > > > the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem > on > > > their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell > > > knows. > > > > You may be right--this could be a bigger issue than just the problem with > > your car. Many car companies try to keep problems that effect lots of cars > > a secret from the public. They usually just fix the problems under the > > warranty program as the owners bring them in for service. They will notify > > the Honda mechanics via of special notices so they can fix the problems on > > those effected vehicles. Rarely ever do car companies annouce a major > > recall since a major recall will in most cases appear as a major news > > story and no car company likes it to happen. I'm glad that your problem has now been fixed to your satisfaction. You might call the mechanic and ask him to advise Honda Inc. of the problem so they can repair the problem in the same way related to many other vehicles that have the same problem. They can also correct the design flaw on next year's model of the same vehicle. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
In article <y7hlb.236$wc3.9@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net> , "News
Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > Us an update to this NG.... > > The root cause of the issue was this: a metal piece in very close proximity > to the clutch mechanism had rubbed a small metal hose that connects the > clutch slave cylinder to the clutch master cylinder to the point that this > small hose had developed a "pinhole" leak analogous to a copper water pipe. > > Hence, when the slave clutch cylinder was originally replaced, the dealer > thought that was the problem, seeing as it was covered with hydraulic fluid. > However, they did not notice or find through testing that the slave cylinder > was fine, but the small metal pipe that connects the slave and master clutch > cylinders had a tiny leak. So 30 minutes after I drove the "fixed" Accord > off the lot and applied the clutch a few times, all the hydraulic fluid > again completely leaked out of the system and clutch pressure went away with > no functioning hydraulic system. > > The repair report said something about the proximity of this pipe in > relation to another unrelated engine component, after several thousand > miles, could cause friction activity leading to a leak. As Oklahoma has > crappy roads, this jostling of the car over the last six months may have > contributed to an early failure. > > So, the end result - Honda fabricated a new design (or they had a local shop > do it) for this small pipe and made one for this Accord that ensures there > is no contact with it and any other piece of the clutch or engine assembly, > hence solving this issue. > > I am quite perplexed that computer-assisted modeling and accelerated life > testing, in the thousands of variables that were probably used, did not > catch this design flaw. Being Six Sigma and ISO trained, the end analysis > tells me that there was definitely an error made in this area of the vehicle > insofar as design. > > Oh well, it's purring again and all seems to be well. It's so nice to get > rid of that Ford Focus and relax in my car's environment. I'll give Honda > one thing - their road and engine noise suppression is excellent. The sound > tolerances remind me of a Lexus. > > Thanks for listening. > > Ciao. > > > "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message > news:billbjohnson555-2110031026490001@pm3-broad-201.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > > In article <x7Ukb.4431$S52.803@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.n et>, "News > > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > > > Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The > > > towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent > at > > > all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this > car > > > is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect > > > (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service > > > center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. > The > > > non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not > > > something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. > > > Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. > > > > > > I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and > this > > > may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic > outsells > > > the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed > 2.4L > > > 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than > just > > > the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem > on > > > their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell > > > knows. > > > > You may be right--this could be a bigger issue than just the problem with > > your car. Many car companies try to keep problems that effect lots of cars > > a secret from the public. They usually just fix the problems under the > > warranty program as the owners bring them in for service. They will notify > > the Honda mechanics via of special notices so they can fix the problems on > > those effected vehicles. Rarely ever do car companies annouce a major > > recall since a major recall will in most cases appear as a major news > > story and no car company likes it to happen. I'm glad that your problem has now been fixed to your satisfaction. You might call the mechanic and ask him to advise Honda Inc. of the problem so they can repair the problem in the same way related to many other vehicles that have the same problem. They can also correct the design flaw on next year's model of the same vehicle. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
Thanks Bill,
I have done this - the Honda dealer, where the Accord was fixed twice under warranty, communicated the entire episode to Honda's American HQ (Engineering Dept). They said this information is now in a national database to red flag similar repairs/issues that may be caused by this flaw. No word on how it will be rectified in the 2004 model. Just glad to have the ride back. <EOM> "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message news:billbjohnson555-2210031239470001@pm5-broad-70.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > In article <y7hlb.236$wc3.9@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net> , "News > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > Us an update to this NG.... > > > > The root cause of the issue was this: a metal piece in very close proximity > > to the clutch mechanism had rubbed a small metal hose that connects the > > clutch slave cylinder to the clutch master cylinder to the point that this > > small hose had developed a "pinhole" leak analogous to a copper water pipe. > > > > Hence, when the slave clutch cylinder was originally replaced, the dealer > > thought that was the problem, seeing as it was covered with hydraulic fluid. > > However, they did not notice or find through testing that the slave cylinder > > was fine, but the small metal pipe that connects the slave and master clutch > > cylinders had a tiny leak. So 30 minutes after I drove the "fixed" Accord > > off the lot and applied the clutch a few times, all the hydraulic fluid > > again completely leaked out of the system and clutch pressure went away with > > no functioning hydraulic system. > > > > The repair report said something about the proximity of this pipe in > > relation to another unrelated engine component, after several thousand > > miles, could cause friction activity leading to a leak. As Oklahoma has > > crappy roads, this jostling of the car over the last six months may have > > contributed to an early failure. > > > > So, the end result - Honda fabricated a new design (or they had a local shop > > do it) for this small pipe and made one for this Accord that ensures there > > is no contact with it and any other piece of the clutch or engine assembly, > > hence solving this issue. > > > > I am quite perplexed that computer-assisted modeling and accelerated life > > testing, in the thousands of variables that were probably used, did not > > catch this design flaw. Being Six Sigma and ISO trained, the end analysis > > tells me that there was definitely an error made in this area of the vehicle > > insofar as design. > > > > Oh well, it's purring again and all seems to be well. It's so nice to get > > rid of that Ford Focus and relax in my car's environment. I'll give Honda > > one thing - their road and engine noise suppression is excellent. The sound > > tolerances remind me of a Lexus. > > > > Thanks for listening. > > > > Ciao. > > > > > > "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message > > news:billbjohnson555-2110031026490001@pm3-broad-201.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > > > In article <x7Ukb.4431$S52.803@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.n et>, "News > > > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > > > > > Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The > > > > towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent > > at > > > > all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this > > car > > > > is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect > > > > (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service > > > > center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. > > The > > > > non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not > > > > something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. > > > > Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. > > > > > > > > I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and > > this > > > > may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic > > outsells > > > > the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed > > 2.4L > > > > 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than > > just > > > > the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem > > on > > > > their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell > > > > knows. > > > > > > You may be right--this could be a bigger issue than just the problem with > > > your car. Many car companies try to keep problems that effect lots of cars > > > a secret from the public. They usually just fix the problems under the > > > warranty program as the owners bring them in for service. They will notify > > > the Honda mechanics via of special notices so they can fix the problems on > > > those effected vehicles. Rarely ever do car companies annouce a major > > > recall since a major recall will in most cases appear as a major news > > > story and no car company likes it to happen. > > I'm glad that your problem has now been fixed to your satisfaction. You > might call the mechanic and ask him to advise Honda Inc. of the problem so > they can repair the problem in the same way related to many other vehicles > that have the same problem. They can also correct the design flaw on next > year's model of the same vehicle. |
Re: 2003 Accord EX Coupe - hydraulic cluctch issue?
Thanks Bill,
I have done this - the Honda dealer, where the Accord was fixed twice under warranty, communicated the entire episode to Honda's American HQ (Engineering Dept). They said this information is now in a national database to red flag similar repairs/issues that may be caused by this flaw. No word on how it will be rectified in the 2004 model. Just glad to have the ride back. <EOM> "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message news:billbjohnson555-2210031239470001@pm5-broad-70.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > In article <y7hlb.236$wc3.9@newsread3.news.pas.earthlink.net> , "News > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > Us an update to this NG.... > > > > The root cause of the issue was this: a metal piece in very close proximity > > to the clutch mechanism had rubbed a small metal hose that connects the > > clutch slave cylinder to the clutch master cylinder to the point that this > > small hose had developed a "pinhole" leak analogous to a copper water pipe. > > > > Hence, when the slave clutch cylinder was originally replaced, the dealer > > thought that was the problem, seeing as it was covered with hydraulic fluid. > > However, they did not notice or find through testing that the slave cylinder > > was fine, but the small metal pipe that connects the slave and master clutch > > cylinders had a tiny leak. So 30 minutes after I drove the "fixed" Accord > > off the lot and applied the clutch a few times, all the hydraulic fluid > > again completely leaked out of the system and clutch pressure went away with > > no functioning hydraulic system. > > > > The repair report said something about the proximity of this pipe in > > relation to another unrelated engine component, after several thousand > > miles, could cause friction activity leading to a leak. As Oklahoma has > > crappy roads, this jostling of the car over the last six months may have > > contributed to an early failure. > > > > So, the end result - Honda fabricated a new design (or they had a local shop > > do it) for this small pipe and made one for this Accord that ensures there > > is no contact with it and any other piece of the clutch or engine assembly, > > hence solving this issue. > > > > I am quite perplexed that computer-assisted modeling and accelerated life > > testing, in the thousands of variables that were probably used, did not > > catch this design flaw. Being Six Sigma and ISO trained, the end analysis > > tells me that there was definitely an error made in this area of the vehicle > > insofar as design. > > > > Oh well, it's purring again and all seems to be well. It's so nice to get > > rid of that Ford Focus and relax in my car's environment. I'll give Honda > > one thing - their road and engine noise suppression is excellent. The sound > > tolerances remind me of a Lexus. > > > > Thanks for listening. > > > > Ciao. > > > > > > "Bill B. Johnson" <billbjohnson555@nospamhotmail.com> wrote in message > > news:billbjohnson555-2110031026490001@pm3-broad-201.snlo.dialup.fix.net... > > > In article <x7Ukb.4431$S52.803@newsread4.news.pas.earthlink.n et>, "News > > > Scout" <scoutnews@earthlink.net> wrote: > > > > > > > Very true - it is still very much in warranty (only 7,000 miles). The > > > > towing and rental cars have all been courtesy of Honda (no money spent > > at > > > > all from me), so it is not that much of a nuisance at this time, as this > > car > > > > is a lease anyway (I never buy cars). However, if it is a design defect > > > > (and now I have seen both leaking mechanisms at the dealer's service > > > > center), I would insist on a new car with an automatic transmission. > > The > > > > non-confidence of being on a road trip and this happening again is not > > > > something I want. A mechanical problem that happens once is one thing. > > > > Twice makes me think real hard about alternatives. > > > > > > > > I listened to the dealer talking to Honda Engineering in California and > > this > > > > may be a larger issue than just my car. Apparently, the automatic > > outsells > > > > the standard by 100-1, so there are not tens of thousands of 5-speed > > 2.4L > > > > 2003 Accord Coupes on the road - yet. If this is a bigger problem than > > just > > > > the fluke of it happening to me twice, they have a big potential problem > > on > > > > their hands. I doubt this would escalate into a recall, but who the hell > > > > knows. > > > > > > You may be right--this could be a bigger issue than just the problem with > > > your car. Many car companies try to keep problems that effect lots of cars > > > a secret from the public. They usually just fix the problems under the > > > warranty program as the owners bring them in for service. They will notify > > > the Honda mechanics via of special notices so they can fix the problems on > > > those effected vehicles. Rarely ever do car companies annouce a major > > > recall since a major recall will in most cases appear as a major news > > > story and no car company likes it to happen. > > I'm glad that your problem has now been fixed to your satisfaction. You > might call the mechanic and ask him to advise Honda Inc. of the problem so > they can repair the problem in the same way related to many other vehicles > that have the same problem. They can also correct the design flaw on next > year's model of the same vehicle. |
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