Re: Holy crap people are misinformed
 

I certainly agree with you. I didn't realize that people were disagreeing
with this fact. Oddly enough anybody can learn this just watching an hour
of NHRA 1/4 mile action on the weekend.

I think I learned that in high school before I went to UTI in Phoenix for
formal training.

CaptainKrunch


"Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote in message
news:lUlNb.54022$sv6.131334@attbi_s52...
> "Jim" <jkc84xx@optonline(take this and XX out).net> writes:
>
> > I agree that the fuel wouldn't combust the same in cold air as it would
in
> > warm so more liquid fuel may slip by causing bad mileage.
>
> I never cease to be amazed at the quality physics and chemistry lessons
> doled out on the various auto groups on a regular basis.
>
> Cold air is MORE dense than warm air, and thus, per unit volume, there is
> more oxygen and more combustion power. By temperature alone, an engine
> should deliver more power in colder air.
>
>

Re: Holy crap people are misinformed
 

I certainly agree with you. I didn't realize that people were disagreeing
with this fact. Oddly enough anybody can learn this just watching an hour
of NHRA 1/4 mile action on the weekend.

I think I learned that in high school before I went to UTI in Phoenix for
formal training.

CaptainKrunch


"Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote in message
news:lUlNb.54022$sv6.131334@attbi_s52...
> "Jim" <jkc84xx@optonline(take this and XX out).net> writes:
>
> > I agree that the fuel wouldn't combust the same in cold air as it would
in
> > warm so more liquid fuel may slip by causing bad mileage.
>
> I never cease to be amazed at the quality physics and chemistry lessons
> doled out on the various auto groups on a regular basis.
>
> Cold air is MORE dense than warm air, and thus, per unit volume, there is
> more oxygen and more combustion power. By temperature alone, an engine
> should deliver more power in colder air.
>
>

Re: Holy crap people are misinformed
 

No kidding man. I've seen people on these groups say such things as:

- "My battery was leaking electrons onto the chassis of the car, so I got a
static shock when I stepped out of the vehicle"
- "CDs are hot when they come out of the CD player because the laser has
been focused on them for so long"

"CaptainKrunch" <nothing@nobody.com> writes:

> I certainly agree with you. I didn't realize that people were disagreeing
> with this fact. Oddly enough anybody can learn this just watching an hour
> of NHRA 1/4 mile action on the weekend.
>
> "Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote:
>
>> Cold air is MORE dense than warm air, and thus, per unit volume, there is
>> more oxygen and more combustion power. By temperature alone, an engine
>> should deliver more power in colder air.

Re: Holy crap people are misinformed
 

No kidding man. I've seen people on these groups say such things as:

- "My battery was leaking electrons onto the chassis of the car, so I got a
static shock when I stepped out of the vehicle"
- "CDs are hot when they come out of the CD player because the laser has
been focused on them for so long"

"CaptainKrunch" <nothing@nobody.com> writes:

> I certainly agree with you. I didn't realize that people were disagreeing
> with this fact. Oddly enough anybody can learn this just watching an hour
> of NHRA 1/4 mile action on the weekend.
>
> "Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote:
>
>> Cold air is MORE dense than warm air, and thus, per unit volume, there is
>> more oxygen and more combustion power. By temperature alone, an engine
>> should deliver more power in colder air.

Re: Holy crap people are misinformed
 

No kidding man. I've seen people on these groups say such things as:

- "My battery was leaking electrons onto the chassis of the car, so I got a
static shock when I stepped out of the vehicle"
- "CDs are hot when they come out of the CD player because the laser has
been focused on them for so long"

"CaptainKrunch" <nothing@nobody.com> writes:

> I certainly agree with you. I didn't realize that people were disagreeing
> with this fact. Oddly enough anybody can learn this just watching an hour
> of NHRA 1/4 mile action on the weekend.
>
> "Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote:
>
>> Cold air is MORE dense than warm air, and thus, per unit volume, there is
>> more oxygen and more combustion power. By temperature alone, an engine
>> should deliver more power in colder air.

Re: Holy crap people are misinformed
 

No kidding man. I've seen people on these groups say such things as:

- "My battery was leaking electrons onto the chassis of the car, so I got a
static shock when I stepped out of the vehicle"
- "CDs are hot when they come out of the CD player because the laser has
been focused on them for so long"

"CaptainKrunch" <nothing@nobody.com> writes:

> I certainly agree with you. I didn't realize that people were disagreeing
> with this fact. Oddly enough anybody can learn this just watching an hour
> of NHRA 1/4 mile action on the weekend.
>
> "Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote:
>
>> Cold air is MORE dense than warm air, and thus, per unit volume, there is
>> more oxygen and more combustion power. By temperature alone, an engine
>> should deliver more power in colder air.

Re: 2003 Accord losing MPG on highway
 

On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:44:40 GMT, "Jim" <jkc84xx@optonline(take this
and XX out).net> wrote:
>I agree that the fuel wouldn't combust the same in cold air as it would in
>warm so more liquid fuel may slip by causing bad mileage.

It better not, or the car will pollute like mad.

I don't think it happens, either, that's what all these engine
computers are all about.

J.

Re: 2003 Accord losing MPG on highway
 

On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:44:40 GMT, "Jim" <jkc84xx@optonline(take this
and XX out).net> wrote:
>I agree that the fuel wouldn't combust the same in cold air as it would in
>warm so more liquid fuel may slip by causing bad mileage.

It better not, or the car will pollute like mad.

I don't think it happens, either, that's what all these engine
computers are all about.

J.

Re: 2003 Accord losing MPG on highway
 

On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:44:40 GMT, "Jim" <jkc84xx@optonline(take this
and XX out).net> wrote:
>I agree that the fuel wouldn't combust the same in cold air as it would in
>warm so more liquid fuel may slip by causing bad mileage.

It better not, or the car will pollute like mad.

I don't think it happens, either, that's what all these engine
computers are all about.

J.

Re: 2003 Accord losing MPG on highway
 

On Wed, 14 Jan 2004 22:44:40 GMT, "Jim" <jkc84xx@optonline(take this
and XX out).net> wrote:
>I agree that the fuel wouldn't combust the same in cold air as it would in
>warm so more liquid fuel may slip by causing bad mileage.

It better not, or the car will pollute like mad.

I don't think it happens, either, that's what all these engine
computers are all about.

J.

Re: Holy crap people are misinformed
 

"Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote in message
> "CaptainKrunch" <nothing@nobody.com> writes:
> > "Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote:
> >> Cold air is MORE dense, and thus, ...more combustion power.

> > I certainly agree with you.

> - "CDs are hot when they come out of the CD player because the laser has
> been focused on them for so long"

Colder air is denser... mass air detected more air coming in, squirted
more gas. The fuel curve also changes when the engine is cold and that
may waste more fuel. Because the air was dense, it will expand with
greater pressure and power when mixed with gas and ignited. This is
also a big reason why nitrous works. Nitrous cools the air charge to -
70F or something which makes is much more dense. Also nitrous adds
more oxygen to the combustion but that's unrelated to what we're
talking about here.

My CDRs are hot when they come out of the CD burner because the
laser has been writing on them for so long.

Re: Holy crap people are misinformed
 

"Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote in message
> "CaptainKrunch" <nothing@nobody.com> writes:
> > "Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote:
> >> Cold air is MORE dense, and thus, ...more combustion power.

> > I certainly agree with you.

> - "CDs are hot when they come out of the CD player because the laser has
> been focused on them for so long"

Colder air is denser... mass air detected more air coming in, squirted
more gas. The fuel curve also changes when the engine is cold and that
may waste more fuel. Because the air was dense, it will expand with
greater pressure and power when mixed with gas and ignited. This is
also a big reason why nitrous works. Nitrous cools the air charge to -
70F or something which makes is much more dense. Also nitrous adds
more oxygen to the combustion but that's unrelated to what we're
talking about here.

My CDRs are hot when they come out of the CD burner because the
laser has been writing on them for so long.

Re: Holy crap people are misinformed
 

"Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote in message
> "CaptainKrunch" <nothing@nobody.com> writes:
> > "Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote:
> >> Cold air is MORE dense, and thus, ...more combustion power.

> > I certainly agree with you.

> - "CDs are hot when they come out of the CD player because the laser has
> been focused on them for so long"

Colder air is denser... mass air detected more air coming in, squirted
more gas. The fuel curve also changes when the engine is cold and that
may waste more fuel. Because the air was dense, it will expand with
greater pressure and power when mixed with gas and ignited. This is
also a big reason why nitrous works. Nitrous cools the air charge to -
70F or something which makes is much more dense. Also nitrous adds
more oxygen to the combustion but that's unrelated to what we're
talking about here.

My CDRs are hot when they come out of the CD burner because the
laser has been writing on them for so long.

Re: Holy crap people are misinformed
 

"Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote in message
> "CaptainKrunch" <nothing@nobody.com> writes:
> > "Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote:
> >> Cold air is MORE dense, and thus, ...more combustion power.

> > I certainly agree with you.

> - "CDs are hot when they come out of the CD player because the laser has
> been focused on them for so long"

Colder air is denser... mass air detected more air coming in, squirted
more gas. The fuel curve also changes when the engine is cold and that
may waste more fuel. Because the air was dense, it will expand with
greater pressure and power when mixed with gas and ignited. This is
also a big reason why nitrous works. Nitrous cools the air charge to -
70F or something which makes is much more dense. Also nitrous adds
more oxygen to the combustion but that's unrelated to what we're
talking about here.

My CDRs are hot when they come out of the CD burner because the
laser has been writing on them for so long.

Re: Holy crap people are misinformed
 

"Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote in
news:fCmNb.52937$Rc4.204985@attbi_s54:

> "Jim Yanik" <jyanik@abuse.gov> writes:
>
>> "Chris Aseltine" <ophidian@newsnation.com> wrote:
>>
>>> Cold air is MORE dense than warm air, and thus, per unit volume,
>>> there is more oxygen and more combustion power. By temperature
>>> alone, an engine should deliver more power in colder air.
>>
>> But that means more fuel will be used per mile.
>> More power just means the motor spins up to a given RPM faster.
>
> How about, you can step on the gas pedal less for the same amount of
> power output? Less gas pedal = higher fuel mileage. Nice try though.
>
>

The fuel-air ratio has to stay constant for proper stoichiometry,so backing
off the throttle means you reduce the volume of air(even though it's
denser).Modern electronic fuel injection monitors exhaust O2 content and
adjusts fuel mix to keep it within specs(closed loop).In the newer OBD2
cars,the incoming air is measured,too.(temperature)

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik-at-kua.net