Jim Mowreader

In article <s%Ddb.39387$TM4.5169@pd7tw2no>,
"Harvey Loria" <Harvey.Loria@shaw.ca> wrote:

> Let's set the record straight! I will quote extensively from Consumer
> Reports of July 1996, "The surprising Truth about motor oils": "Modern
> motor oils needn't be changed as often as oils did years ago. . .
>
> Even in the severe driving conditions that a NYC taxi endures, we noted no
> benefit from changing the oil

I didn't think much of this study.

A NYC taxi is turned off oh, maybe once a day when they fuel it, so they
won't blow up the filling station with static from the car. It doesn't
have a chance to accumulate water in the oil, because the oil never
cools.

Jim Mowreader's Accord is started early in the morning, driven ten
miles, shut down for nine hours, restarted, driven ten miles, shut down
for an hour and a half, restarted and driven three miles, shut down for
six hours...you get the idea. Lots of stop-and-go, lots of idle time.
And they picked a car that is fairly easy on its oil--one with a big
V-6.

If I was designing the test, I wouldn't have used NYC cabs. I'd have
used Geo Metros (they have 1-litre 3-cylinder engines), and run the test
in Missoula, Montana, which is for Montana an urban area. Lots of
stop-and-go, plenty of "get on the Interstate and drive flat out"
activity, and a much harsher test of the oil. Either that, or use
motorcycles--their engine oil lubricates the gearbox too, hence the
viscosity improvers get a real torture test as they're run through the
heavy gearing.

wolf00359

After I bought our '03 Accord EX 5speed I called my mechanic...whom by
the way sold my '94 Accord EX with 285K miles for $500...which is what
the dealer was offering me as a trade-in value. Anyway, while I was
asking him if he wanted to buy it...he suggested I change the oil on
the new Accord at 650 miles and to not drive the engine hard. Reason:
Brand new engine will need all internal parts to set in. As it does
there will be debris, very small debris, that will come off. Some of
it will be traped in the oil filter but some will recycle into the
engine. This will in the long run cause engine damage. I did exactly
what he suggested...from there on he suggested every 3K miles.

I've learned to trust Dave, my mechanic. My Honda rarely...I mean
rarely needed to be repaired...except for the five sets of tires I went
thru, 4 sets of breaks, 2 sets of rotors, 2nd mufler install with
catalyc converter and some other major exhaust pipe that cost a
bundle.

And by the way...the oil change for the '03 Accord EX is more
expensive..it requires 5/20..or something like that....

Enought talk....


--
wolf00359
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wolf00359

After I bought our '03 Accord EX 5speed I called my mechanic...whom by
the way sold my '94 Accord EX with 285K miles for $500...which is what
the dealer was offering me as a trade-in value. Anyway, while I was
asking him if he wanted to buy it...he suggested I change the oil on
the new Accord at 650 miles and to not drive the engine hard. Reason:
Brand new engine will need all internal parts to set in. As it does
there will be debris, very small debris, that will come off. Some of
it will be traped in the oil filter but some will recycle into the
engine. This will in the long run cause engine damage. I did exactly
what he suggested...from there on he suggested every 3K miles.

I've learned to trust Dave, my mechanic. My Honda rarely...I mean
rarely needed to be repaired...except for the five sets of tires I went
thru, 4 sets of breaks, 2 sets of rotors, 2nd mufler install with
catalyc converter and some other major exhaust pipe that cost a
bundle.

And by the way...the oil change for the '03 Accord EX is more
expensive..it requires 5/20..or something like that....

Enought talk....


--
wolf00359
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted via RealCarAudio.com - The checkmate of the caraudio community.
http://www.RealCarAudio.com
wolf00359's Profile: http://www.realcaraudio.com/forums/m...fo&userid=2057
View this thread: http://www.realcaraudio.com/forums/s...?threadid=8757

wolf00359

After I bought our '03 Accord EX 5speed I called my mechanic...whom by
the way sold my '94 Accord EX with 285K miles for $500...which is what
the dealer was offering me as a trade-in value. Anyway, while I was
asking him if he wanted to buy it...he suggested I change the oil on
the new Accord at 650 miles and to not drive the engine hard. Reason:
Brand new engine will need all internal parts to set in. As it does
there will be debris, very small debris, that will come off. Some of
it will be traped in the oil filter but some will recycle into the
engine. This will in the long run cause engine damage. I did exactly
what he suggested...from there on he suggested every 3K miles.

I've learned to trust Dave, my mechanic. My Honda rarely...I mean
rarely needed to be repaired...except for the five sets of tires I went
thru, 4 sets of breaks, 2 sets of rotors, 2nd mufler install with
catalyc converter and some other major exhaust pipe that cost a
bundle.

And by the way...the oil change for the '03 Accord EX is more
expensive..it requires 5/20..or something like that....

Enought talk....


--
wolf00359
------------------------------------------------------------------------
Posted via RealCarAudio.com - The checkmate of the caraudio community.
http://www.RealCarAudio.com
wolf00359's Profile: http://www.realcaraudio.com/forums/m...fo&userid=2057
View this thread: http://www.realcaraudio.com/forums/s...?threadid=8757

Pete

"wolf00359" <wolf00359.vbngz@realcaraudio.com> wrote in message
news:wolf00359.vbngz@realcaraudio.com...
> he suggested I change the oil on
> the new Accord at 650 miles and to not drive the engine hard. Reason:
> Brand new engine will need all internal parts to set in. As it does
> there will be debris, very small debris, that will come off. Some of
> it will be traped in the oil filter but some will recycle into the
> engine. This will in the long run cause engine damage.

The minute debirs that floats around, suspended in oil is actualy doing a
job there. It helps polish out any rough surfaces in a brand new engine.
That's partly how the break-in takes place. And that's why it should be
left there for as long as Honda recommends to finish this job. Otherwise,
your engine will not be properly broken-in.


> I've learned to trust Dave, my mechanic.

Does Dave know more about this engine than Honda engineers that designed it?
Why would Honda suggest something that would "cause engine damage",
especially right at the beginning, when there is almost 3 full years of
warranty still remaining?


> And by the way...the oil change for the '03 Accord EX is more
> expensive..it requires 5/20..or something like that....

And? 5w-20 is no more expensive than other oil grades, unless you choose to
buy it from a Honda dealer of course.

Cheers,

Pete

Pete

"wolf00359" <wolf00359.vbngz@realcaraudio.com> wrote in message
news:wolf00359.vbngz@realcaraudio.com...
> he suggested I change the oil on
> the new Accord at 650 miles and to not drive the engine hard. Reason:
> Brand new engine will need all internal parts to set in. As it does
> there will be debris, very small debris, that will come off. Some of
> it will be traped in the oil filter but some will recycle into the
> engine. This will in the long run cause engine damage.

The minute debirs that floats around, suspended in oil is actualy doing a
job there. It helps polish out any rough surfaces in a brand new engine.
That's partly how the break-in takes place. And that's why it should be
left there for as long as Honda recommends to finish this job. Otherwise,
your engine will not be properly broken-in.


> I've learned to trust Dave, my mechanic.

Does Dave know more about this engine than Honda engineers that designed it?
Why would Honda suggest something that would "cause engine damage",
especially right at the beginning, when there is almost 3 full years of
warranty still remaining?


> And by the way...the oil change for the '03 Accord EX is more
> expensive..it requires 5/20..or something like that....

And? 5w-20 is no more expensive than other oil grades, unless you choose to
buy it from a Honda dealer of course.

Cheers,

Pete

Pete

"wolf00359" <wolf00359.vbngz@realcaraudio.com> wrote in message
news:wolf00359.vbngz@realcaraudio.com...
> he suggested I change the oil on
> the new Accord at 650 miles and to not drive the engine hard. Reason:
> Brand new engine will need all internal parts to set in. As it does
> there will be debris, very small debris, that will come off. Some of
> it will be traped in the oil filter but some will recycle into the
> engine. This will in the long run cause engine damage.

The minute debirs that floats around, suspended in oil is actualy doing a
job there. It helps polish out any rough surfaces in a brand new engine.
That's partly how the break-in takes place. And that's why it should be
left there for as long as Honda recommends to finish this job. Otherwise,
your engine will not be properly broken-in.


> I've learned to trust Dave, my mechanic.

Does Dave know more about this engine than Honda engineers that designed it?
Why would Honda suggest something that would "cause engine damage",
especially right at the beginning, when there is almost 3 full years of
warranty still remaining?


> And by the way...the oil change for the '03 Accord EX is more
> expensive..it requires 5/20..or something like that....

And? 5w-20 is no more expensive than other oil grades, unless you choose to
buy it from a Honda dealer of course.

Cheers,

Pete

TL

On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 03:44:45 GMT, wolf00359
<wolf00359.vbngz@realcaraudio.com> wrote:

>
>After I bought our '03 Accord EX 5speed I called my mechanic...whom by
>the way sold my '94 Accord EX with 285K miles for $500...which is what
>the dealer was offering me as a trade-in value. Anyway, while I was
>asking him if he wanted to buy it...he suggested I change the oil on
>the new Accord at 650 miles and to not drive the engine hard. Reason:
>Brand new engine will need all internal parts to set in. As it does
>there will be debris, very small debris, that will come off. Some of
>it will be traped in the oil filter but some will recycle into the
>engine. This will in the long run cause engine damage. I did exactly
>what he suggested...from there on he suggested every 3K miles.
>
>I've learned to trust Dave, my mechanic. My Honda rarely...I mean
>rarely needed to be repaired...except for the five sets of tires I went
>thru, 4 sets of breaks, 2 sets of rotors, 2nd mufler install with
>catalyc converter and some other major exhaust pipe that cost a
>bundle.
>
>And by the way...the oil change for the '03 Accord EX is more
>expensive..it requires 5/20..or something like that....
>
>Enought talk....

The Honda manual makes it clear that they strongly recommend that you
leave the initial oil in the engine for the specified interval. I've
heard from others in this group that there is a special break-in oil
in the car. I can't confirm that, but their specific instructions not
to do the first oil change until the right mileage would support that
notion. Note they don't just put the interval in the maintenance
chart. They specifically say not to do the first one early.

I'm glad you have a mechanic you trust and like. But why would you
assume that he knows more about how to properly break-in this engine
than the engineers that designed it? Why would Honda recommend so
strongly a first change approach if it was so obvious that it can
damage the engine?

TL

On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 03:44:45 GMT, wolf00359
<wolf00359.vbngz@realcaraudio.com> wrote:

>
>After I bought our '03 Accord EX 5speed I called my mechanic...whom by
>the way sold my '94 Accord EX with 285K miles for $500...which is what
>the dealer was offering me as a trade-in value. Anyway, while I was
>asking him if he wanted to buy it...he suggested I change the oil on
>the new Accord at 650 miles and to not drive the engine hard. Reason:
>Brand new engine will need all internal parts to set in. As it does
>there will be debris, very small debris, that will come off. Some of
>it will be traped in the oil filter but some will recycle into the
>engine. This will in the long run cause engine damage. I did exactly
>what he suggested...from there on he suggested every 3K miles.
>
>I've learned to trust Dave, my mechanic. My Honda rarely...I mean
>rarely needed to be repaired...except for the five sets of tires I went
>thru, 4 sets of breaks, 2 sets of rotors, 2nd mufler install with
>catalyc converter and some other major exhaust pipe that cost a
>bundle.
>
>And by the way...the oil change for the '03 Accord EX is more
>expensive..it requires 5/20..or something like that....
>
>Enought talk....

The Honda manual makes it clear that they strongly recommend that you
leave the initial oil in the engine for the specified interval. I've
heard from others in this group that there is a special break-in oil
in the car. I can't confirm that, but their specific instructions not
to do the first oil change until the right mileage would support that
notion. Note they don't just put the interval in the maintenance
chart. They specifically say not to do the first one early.

I'm glad you have a mechanic you trust and like. But why would you
assume that he knows more about how to properly break-in this engine
than the engineers that designed it? Why would Honda recommend so
strongly a first change approach if it was so obvious that it can
damage the engine?

TL

On Wed, 15 Oct 2003 03:44:45 GMT, wolf00359
<wolf00359.vbngz@realcaraudio.com> wrote:

>
>After I bought our '03 Accord EX 5speed I called my mechanic...whom by
>the way sold my '94 Accord EX with 285K miles for $500...which is what
>the dealer was offering me as a trade-in value. Anyway, while I was
>asking him if he wanted to buy it...he suggested I change the oil on
>the new Accord at 650 miles and to not drive the engine hard. Reason:
>Brand new engine will need all internal parts to set in. As it does
>there will be debris, very small debris, that will come off. Some of
>it will be traped in the oil filter but some will recycle into the
>engine. This will in the long run cause engine damage. I did exactly
>what he suggested...from there on he suggested every 3K miles.
>
>I've learned to trust Dave, my mechanic. My Honda rarely...I mean
>rarely needed to be repaired...except for the five sets of tires I went
>thru, 4 sets of breaks, 2 sets of rotors, 2nd mufler install with
>catalyc converter and some other major exhaust pipe that cost a
>bundle.
>
>And by the way...the oil change for the '03 Accord EX is more
>expensive..it requires 5/20..or something like that....
>
>Enought talk....

The Honda manual makes it clear that they strongly recommend that you
leave the initial oil in the engine for the specified interval. I've
heard from others in this group that there is a special break-in oil
in the car. I can't confirm that, but their specific instructions not
to do the first oil change until the right mileage would support that
notion. Note they don't just put the interval in the maintenance
chart. They specifically say not to do the first one early.

I'm glad you have a mechanic you trust and like. But why would you
assume that he knows more about how to properly break-in this engine
than the engineers that designed it? Why would Honda recommend so
strongly a first change approach if it was so obvious that it can
damage the engine?

Jay A

Many of you may not believe the following, many more of you may think I am
crazy, but I am 50 years old, have owned 7 cars in the last 32 years, have
never owned a car that did not get at least 200,000 miles on it before I
traded it in, and in every single instance, after the first year of
ownership, never did I change the oil in any of them prior to at least
30,000 miles, if at least that little. Call me lucky? Call me crazy? Well, I
have always felt that if someone who wants to sell you oil, he will try and
sell you as much of it, and as often as he can talk you into it.

Jay A

Many of you may not believe the following, many more of you may think I am
crazy, but I am 50 years old, have owned 7 cars in the last 32 years, have
never owned a car that did not get at least 200,000 miles on it before I
traded it in, and in every single instance, after the first year of
ownership, never did I change the oil in any of them prior to at least
30,000 miles, if at least that little. Call me lucky? Call me crazy? Well, I
have always felt that if someone who wants to sell you oil, he will try and
sell you as much of it, and as often as he can talk you into it.

Jay A

Many of you may not believe the following, many more of you may think I am
crazy, but I am 50 years old, have owned 7 cars in the last 32 years, have
never owned a car that did not get at least 200,000 miles on it before I
traded it in, and in every single instance, after the first year of
ownership, never did I change the oil in any of them prior to at least
30,000 miles, if at least that little. Call me lucky? Call me crazy? Well, I
have always felt that if someone who wants to sell you oil, he will try and
sell you as much of it, and as often as he can talk you into it.

Jay A

Many of you may not believe the following, many more of you may think I am
crazy, but I am 50 years old, have owned 7 cars in the last 32 years, have
never owned a car that did not get at least 200,000 miles on it before I
traded it in, and in every single instance, after the first year of
ownership, never did I change the oil in any of them prior to at least
30,000 miles, if at least that little. Call me lucky? Call me crazy? Well, I
have always felt that if someone who wants to sell you oil, he will try and
sell you as much of it, and as often as he can talk you into it.

Robert Upward

I'm glad that works for you, but I've never heard of anyone having a
problem because they changed their oil too often.

Rob


"Jay A" <jayfromca@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:r8%rb.35387$p9.28144@nwrddc02.gnilink.net...
> Many of you may not believe the following, many more of you may think I am
> crazy, but I am 50 years old, have owned 7 cars in the last 32 years, have
> never owned a car that did not get at least 200,000 miles on it before I
> traded it in, and in every single instance, after the first year of
> ownership, never did I change the oil in any of them prior to at least
> 30,000 miles, if at least that little. Call me lucky? Call me crazy? Well,
I
> have always felt that if someone who wants to sell you oil, he will try
and
> sell you as much of it, and as often as he can talk you into it.
>
>
>
>