Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

Howard H wrote:
> "hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
>
>>for the right price i would use the more advanced motor oil 5w-20. more
>>than likely it is a better oil for your car. your owners manual was
>>written before that oil was even thought of probably and now it's out and
>>if your manual could be rewritten it may actually be calling for w20. i
>>wouldn't worry about it. if the car is running good and you talk to the
>>dealer and they tell you its a better oil. than you can use it.
>
>
> Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed reccomendations that may differ
> from your owners manual. The industry specifications continue to change and
> as oils improve they become better for your vehicle even though they may be
> a different weight.
>


Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated oils, but oil quality
and oil weight are two different things.

Ford went to considerable trouble to publish service bulletins showing
which older models were demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after
Ford switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20. However, I have
never seen any similar publication from Honda, which makes one wonder if
there are issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not specify it
when new.

By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for using 5W-20 is for
improved fuel economy over 5W-30 and bragged about the expected 0.6%
improvement. Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able to
detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.

John

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

John Horner wrote:
> Howard H wrote:
>
>> "hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
>>
>>> for the right price i would use the more advanced motor oil 5w-20.
>>> more than likely it is a better oil for your car. your owners manual
>>> was written before that oil was even thought of probably and now it's
>>> out and if your manual could be rewritten it may actually be calling
>>> for w20. i wouldn't worry about it. if the car is running good and
>>> you talk to the dealer and they tell you its a better oil. than you
>>> can use it.
>>
>>
>>
>> Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed reccomendations that may
>> differ from your owners manual. The industry specifications continue
>> to change and as oils improve they become better for your vehicle even
>> though they may be a different weight.
>>
>
>
> Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated oils, but oil quality
> and oil weight are two different things.
>
> Ford went to considerable trouble to publish service bulletins showing
> which older models were demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after
> Ford switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20. However, I have
> never seen any similar publication from Honda, which makes one wonder if
> there are issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not specify it
> when new.
>
> By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for using 5W-20 is for
> improved fuel economy over 5W-30 and bragged about the expected 0.6%
> improvement. Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able to
> detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
>
> John

ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing, or are doing it to
cut corners/save money. it's their corporate culture.

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

John Horner wrote:
>
> Howard H wrote:
> > "hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
> >
> >>for the right price i would use the more advanced motor oil 5w-20. more
> >>than likely it is a better oil for your car. your owners manual was
> >>written before that oil was even thought of probably and now it's out and
> >>if your manual could be rewritten it may actually be calling for w20. i
> >>wouldn't worry about it. if the car is running good and you talk to the
> >>dealer and they tell you its a better oil. than you can use it.
> >
> >
> > Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed reccomendations that may differ
> > from your owners manual. The industry specifications continue to change and
> > as oils improve they become better for your vehicle even though they may be
> > a different weight.
> >
>
> Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated oils, but oil quality
> and oil weight are two different things.
>
> Ford went to considerable trouble to publish service bulletins showing
> which older models were demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after
> Ford switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20. However, I have
> never seen any similar publication from Honda, which makes one wonder if
> there are issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not specify it
> when new.
>
> By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for using 5W-20 is for
> improved fuel economy over 5W-30 and bragged about the expected 0.6%
> improvement. Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able to
> detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
>
> John



You bring up an interesting point regarding the use of "lighter" engine
oils as relates to mileage goals.

The question in my mind is, "Are the current materials used in engine
internal parts such as pistons, valves, crankshafts, engine blocks,
camshafts etc. substantially the same as say an early 1980's Honda?"

JT

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

My 2001 owners manual says "5W-20 oil is formulated for year-round
protection of your Honda, to
improve cold weather starting, and
to help your engine use less fuel".
Is Honda only concerned about cold weather? What about extreme hot weather?
Does a 5W-20, 5W-30 or 5W-40 not have the same cold weather protection?
I would prefer hot weather protection also.
I think the main reason for recommending this oil is as stated to "use LESS
FUEL".
Any comments?

"hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
> for the right price i would use the more advanced motor oil 5w-20. more
than
> likely it is a better oil for your car. your owners manual was written
> before that oil was even thought of probably and now it's out and if your
> manual could be rewritten it may actually be calling for w20. i wouldn't
> worry about it. if the car is running good and you talk to the dealer and
> they tell you its a better oil. than you can use it.
>
>
> -jeff
> "Grahame" <grahame.news@sympatico.ca> wrote in message
> news:OPXuf.34502$X25.703433@news20.bellglobal.com. ..
> > Tell the advisor that you do not want to pay for the more expensive
5W-20
> > oil when the cheaper 5W-30 is just fine for your vehicle.
> >
> > "eh" <eh@nospam.com> wrote in message
> > news:tOEuf.56$L96.175@news.oracle.com...
> >> Dear Experts,
> >>
> >> I bring my 98 4-cyl Accord to Honda dealer for regular oil change.
> >> Lately, they started use 5-20 oil for oil changes for all the cars.
> >> The advisor told me that unless I explicitly tell them otherwise, they
> >> will be using 5-20 oil as default.
> >>
> >> My question is: Since my car is not new(7 years, 105K miles),
> >> can I still use 5-20 engine oil? Will it offer less protection than
> >> 5-30 or 10-40? After all, 5-20 oil is newer and more expensive.
> >>
> >> Some people tell me to switch to 10-40 oil as car ages. When should
> >> I be switching to that grade?
> >>
> >> Thanks for your help in advance.
> >>
> >> EZ
> >>
> >>
> >
> >
>
>

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

================================================== ============================
TOPIC: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.a...a2cc3970410acd
================================================== ============================

> Date: Fri, Jan 6 2006 6:43 am
> From: jim beam
>
> John Horner wrote:
> > Howard H wrote:
> >
> > > "hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
> > >
> > > > for the right price i would use the more advanced
> > > > motor oil 5w-20. more than likely it is a better
> > > > oil for your car. your owners manual was written
> > > > before that oil was even thought of probably and
> > > > now it's out and if your manual could be
> > > > rewritten it may actually be calling for w20. i
> > > > wouldn't worry about it. if the car is running
> > > > good and you talk to the dealer and they tell you
> > > > its a better oil. than you can use it.



5W-20 oil is not "more advanced" than 10W-30, it's just
a different viscosity.



> > > Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed
> > > reccomendations that may differ from your owners
> > > manual. The industry specifications continue to
> > > change and as oils improve they become better for
> > > your vehicle even though they may be a different
> > > weight.



Stick with the viscosity specified for your car. It is
safer to err at a higher viscosity.



> > Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated
> > oils, but oil quality and oil weight are two
> > different things.
> >
> > Ford went to considerable trouble to publish
> > service bulletins showing which older models were
> > demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after
> > Ford switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20.
> > However, I have never seen any similar publication
> > from Honda, which makes one wonder if there are
> > issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not
> > specify it when new.
> >
> > By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for
> > using 5W-20 is for improved fuel economy over 5W-30
> > and bragged about the expected 0.6% improvement.
> > Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able
> > to detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
> >
> > John
>
> ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing,
> or are doing it to cut corners/save money. it's their
> corporate culture.



There are idiots, but it's not Ford's engineers who don't
know what they are talking. And, they "cut corners/save
money" doesn't make sense if they "went to considerable
trouble to publish ..."


..

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

================================================== ============================
TOPIC: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.a...a2cc3970410acd
================================================== ============================

> Date: Fri, Jan 6 2006 6:43 am
> From: jim beam
>
> John Horner wrote:
> > Howard H wrote:
> >
> > > "hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
> > >
> > > > for the right price i would use the more advanced
> > > > motor oil 5w-20. more than likely it is a better
> > > > oil for your car. your owners manual was written
> > > > before that oil was even thought of probably and
> > > > now it's out and if your manual could be
> > > > rewritten it may actually be calling for w20. i
> > > > wouldn't worry about it. if the car is running
> > > > good and you talk to the dealer and they tell you
> > > > its a better oil. than you can use it.



5W-20 oil is not "more advanced" than 10W-30, it's just
a different viscosity.



> > > Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed
> > > reccomendations that may differ from your owners
> > > manual. The industry specifications continue to
> > > change and as oils improve they become better for
> > > your vehicle even though they may be a different
> > > weight.



Stick with the viscosity specified for your car. It is
safer to err at a higher viscosity.



> > Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated
> > oils, but oil quality and oil weight are two
> > different things.
> >
> > Ford went to considerable trouble to publish
> > service bulletins showing which older models were
> > demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after
> > Ford switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20.
> > However, I have never seen any similar publication
> > from Honda, which makes one wonder if there are
> > issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not
> > specify it when new.
> >
> > By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for
> > using 5W-20 is for improved fuel economy over 5W-30
> > and bragged about the expected 0.6% improvement.
> > Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able
> > to detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
> >
> > John
>
> ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing,
> or are doing it to cut corners/save money. it's their
> corporate culture.



There are idiots, but it's not Ford's engineers who don't
know what they are talking. And, they "cut corners/save
money" doesn't make sense if they "went to considerable
trouble to publish ..."

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

================================================== ============================
TOPIC: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.a...a2cc3970410acd
================================================== ============================

> Date: Fri, Jan 6 2006 6:43 am
> From: jim beam
>
> John Horner wrote:
> > Howard H wrote:
> >
> > > "hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
> > >
> > > > for the right price i would use the more advanced
> > > > motor oil 5w-20. more than likely it is a better
> > > > oil for your car. your owners manual was written
> > > > before that oil was even thought of probably and
> > > > now it's out and if your manual could be
> > > > rewritten it may actually be calling for w20. i
> > > > wouldn't worry about it. if the car is running
> > > > good and you talk to the dealer and they tell you
> > > > its a better oil. than you can use it.



5W-20 oil is not "more advanced" than 10W-30, it's just
a different viscosity.



> > > Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed
> > > reccomendations that may differ from your owners
> > > manual. The industry specifications continue to
> > > change and as oils improve they become better for
> > > your vehicle even though they may be a different
> > > weight.



Stick with the viscosity specified for your car. It is
safer to err at a higher viscosity.



> > Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated
> > oils, but oil quality and oil weight are two
> > different things.
> >
> > Ford went to considerable trouble to publish
> > service bulletins showing which older models were
> > demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after
> > Ford switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20.
> > However, I have never seen any similar publication
> > from Honda, which makes one wonder if there are
> > issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not
> > specify it when new.
> >
> > By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for
> > using 5W-20 is for improved fuel economy over 5W-30
> > and bragged about the expected 0.6% improvement.
> > Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able
> > to detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
> >
> > John
>
> ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing,
> or are doing it to cut corners/save money. it's their
> corporate culture.



There are idiots, but it's not them who don't know what
they are talking. And, "[they] cut corners/save money"
doesn't make sense if "[they] went to considerable
trouble to publish ...]"

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

================================================== ============================
TOPIC: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.a...a2cc3970410acd
================================================== ============================

> Date: Fri, Jan 6 2006 6:43 am
> From: jim beam
>
> John Horner wrote:
> > Howard H wrote:
> >
> > > "hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
> > >
> > > > for the right price i would use the more advanced
> > > > motor oil 5w-20. more than likely it is a better
> > > > oil for your car. your owners manual was written
> > > > before that oil was even thought of probably and
> > > > now it's out and if your manual could be
> > > > rewritten it may actually be calling for w20. i
> > > > wouldn't worry about it. if the car is running
> > > > good and you talk to the dealer and they tell you
> > > > its a better oil. than you can use it.



5W-20 oil is not "more advanced" than 10W-30, it's just
a different viscosity.



> > > Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed
> > > reccomendations that may differ from your owners
> > > manual. The industry specifications continue to
> > > change and as oils improve they become better for
> > > your vehicle even though they may be a different
> > > weight.



Stick with the viscosity specified for your car. It is
safer to err at a higher viscosity.



> > Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated
> > oils, but oil quality and oil weight are two
> > different things.
> >
> > Ford went to considerable trouble to publish
> > service bulletins showing which older models were
> > demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after
> > Ford switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20.
> > However, I have never seen any similar publication
> > from Honda, which makes one wonder if there are
> > issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not
> > specify it when new.
> >
> > By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for
> > using 5W-20 is for improved fuel economy over 5W-30
> > and bragged about the expected 0.6% improvement.
> > Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able
> > to detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
> >
> > John
>
> ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing,
> or are doing it to cut corners/save money. it's their
> corporate culture.



There are idiots, but it's not Ford's engineers who don't
know what they are talking. And, they "cut corners/save
money" doesn't make sense if they "went to considerable
trouble to publish ..."

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

================================================== ============================
TOPIC: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
http://groups.google.com/group/alt.a...a2cc3970410acd
================================================== ============================

> Date: Fri, Jan 6 2006 6:43 am
> From: jim beam
>
> John Horner wrote:
> > Howard H wrote:
> >
> > > "hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
> > >
> > > > for the right price i would use the more advanced
> > > > motor oil 5w-20. more than likely it is a better
> > > > oil for your car. your owners manual was written
> > > > before that oil was even thought of probably and
> > > > now it's out and if your manual could be
> > > > rewritten it may actually be calling for w20. i
> > > > wouldn't worry about it. if the car is running
> > > > good and you talk to the dealer and they tell you
> > > > its a better oil. than you can use it.



5W-20 oil is not "more advanced" than 10W-30, it's just
a different viscosity.



> > > Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed
> > > reccomendations that may differ from your owners
> > > manual. The industry specifications continue to
> > > change and as oils improve they become better for
> > > your vehicle even though they may be a different
> > > weight.



Stick with the viscosity specified for your car. It is
safer to err at a higher viscosity.



> > Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated
> > oils, but oil quality and oil weight are two
> > different things.
> >
> > Ford went to considerable trouble to publish
> > service bulletins showing which older models were
> > demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after
> > Ford switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20.
> > However, I have never seen any similar publication
> > from Honda, which makes one wonder if there are
> > issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not
> > specify it when new.
> >
> > By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for
> > using 5W-20 is for improved fuel economy over 5W-30
> > and bragged about the expected 0.6% improvement.
> > Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able
> > to detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
> >
> > John
>
> ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing,
> or are doing it to cut corners/save money. it's their
> corporate culture.



There are idiots, but it's not them who don't know what
they are talking. And, "[they] cut corners/save money"
doesn't make sense if "[they] went to considerable
trouble to publish ...]"

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

karl wrote:
> ================================================== ============================
> TOPIC: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
> http://groups.google.com/group/alt.a...a2cc3970410acd
> ================================================== ============================
>
>
>>Date: Fri, Jan 6 2006 6:43 am
>>From: jim beam
>>
>>John Horner wrote:
>>
>>> Howard H wrote:
>>>
>>>
>>>>"hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prod igy.net...
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>for the right price i would use the more advanced
>>>>>motor oil 5w-20. more than likely it is a better
>>>>>oil for your car. your owners manual was written
>>>>>before that oil was even thought of probably and
>>>>>now it's out and if your manual could be
>>>>>rewritten it may actually be calling for w20. i
>>>>>wouldn't worry about it. if the car is running
>>>>>good and you talk to the dealer and they tell you
>>>>>its a better oil. than you can use it.
>
>
>
>
> 5W-20 oil is not "more advanced" than 10W-30, it's just
> a different viscosity.
>
>
>
>
>>>>Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed
>>>>reccomendations that may differ from your owners
>>>>manual. The industry specifications continue to
>>>>change and as oils improve they become better for
>>>>your vehicle even though they may be a different
>>>>weight.
>
>
>
>
> Stick with the viscosity specified for your car. It is
> safer to err at a higher viscosity.
>
>
>
>
>>>Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated
>>>oils, but oil quality and oil weight are two
>>>different things.
>>>
>>>Ford went to considerable trouble to publish
>>>service bulletins showing which older models were
>>>demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after
>>>Ford switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20.
>>>However, I have never seen any similar publication
>>>from Honda, which makes one wonder if there are
>>>issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not
>>>specify it when new.
>>>
>>>By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for
>>>using 5W-20 is for improved fuel economy over 5W-30
>>>and bragged about the expected 0.6% improvement.
>>>Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able
>>>to detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
>>>
>>> John
>>
>>ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing,
>>or are doing it to cut corners/save money. it's their
>>corporate culture.
>
>
>
>
> There are idiots, but it's not them who don't know what
> they are talking. And, "[they] cut corners/save money"
> doesn't make sense if "[they] went to considerable
> trouble to publish ...]"
>
so, do you know much about cars? do you know about 3 vs. 5 bearing
crankshafts? do you know about cast cranks vs. forged? do you know
about high silica brake pads? transmission clutch pack quality? how
about tolerances? suv rollover? solid rear axles straight out of the
20's? leaf springs? red rear turn signals to save 2 bulbs and a few
yards of wire? dude, no kidding, there's not a single nut, bolt, strand
of wire, or even paint particle on a ford that is not the cheapest they
think they can get away with. not one single thing.

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

jim beam wrote:
> karl wrote:
>> ================================================== ============================
>> TOPIC: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
>> http://groups.google.com/group/alt.a...a2cc3970410acd
>> ================================================== ============================
>>
>>
>>> Date: Fri, Jan 6 2006 6:43 am
>>> From: jim beam
>>>
>>> John Horner wrote:
>>>
>>>> Howard H wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>> "hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>> news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>> for the right price i would use the more advanced
>>>>>> motor oil 5w-20. more than likely it is a better
>>>>>> oil for your car. your owners manual was written
>>>>>> before that oil was even thought of probably and
>>>>>> now it's out and if your manual could be
>>>>>> rewritten it may actually be calling for w20. i
>>>>>> wouldn't worry about it. if the car is running
>>>>>> good and you talk to the dealer and they tell you
>>>>>> its a better oil. than you can use it.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> 5W-20 oil is not "more advanced" than 10W-30, it's just
>> a different viscosity.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>>> Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed
>>>>> reccomendations that may differ from your owners
>>>>> manual. The industry specifications continue to
>>>>> change and as oils improve they become better for
>>>>> your vehicle even though they may be a different
>>>>> weight.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Stick with the viscosity specified for your car. It is
>> safer to err at a higher viscosity.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>>> Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated
>>>> oils, but oil quality and oil weight are two
>>>> different things.
>>>>
>>>> Ford went to considerable trouble to publish
>>>> service bulletins showing which older models were
>>>> demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after
>>>> Ford switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20.
>>>> However, I have never seen any similar publication
>>>> from Honda, which makes one wonder if there are
>>>> issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not
>>>> specify it when new.
>>>>
>>>> By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for
>>>> using 5W-20 is for improved fuel economy over 5W-30
>>>> and bragged about the expected 0.6% improvement.
>>>> Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able
>>>> to detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
>>>>
>>>> John
>>>
>>> ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing,
>>> or are doing it to cut corners/save money. it's their
>>> corporate culture.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> There are idiots, but it's not them who don't know what
>> they are talking. And, "[they] cut corners/save money"
>> doesn't make sense if "[they] went to considerable
>> trouble to publish ...]"
>>
> so, do you know much about cars? do you know about 3 vs. 5 bearing
> crankshafts? do you know about cast cranks vs. forged? do you know
> about high silica brake pads? transmission clutch pack quality? how
> about tolerances? suv rollover? solid rear axles straight out of the
> 20's? leaf springs? red rear turn signals to save 2 bulbs and a few
> yards of wire? dude, no kidding, there's not a single nut, bolt,
> strand of wire, or even paint particle on a ford that is not the
> cheapest they think they can get away with. not one single thing.

It's called "meeting the minimum specification".......

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

L Alpert wrote:
> jim beam wrote:
>
>>karl wrote:
>>
>>>=============================================== ===============================
>>>TOPIC: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
>>>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.a...a2cc3970410acd
>>>=============================================== ===============================
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>Date: Fri, Jan 6 2006 6:43 am
>>>>From: jim beam
>>>>
>>>>John Horner wrote:
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>Howard H wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>"hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.pr odigy.net...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>for the right price i would use the more advanced
>>>>>>>motor oil 5w-20. more than likely it is a better
>>>>>>>oil for your car. your owners manual was written
>>>>>>>before that oil was even thought of probably and
>>>>>>>now it's out and if your manual could be
>>>>>>>rewritten it may actually be calling for w20. i
>>>>>>>wouldn't worry about it. if the car is running
>>>>>>>good and you talk to the dealer and they tell you
>>>>>>>its a better oil. than you can use it.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>5W-20 oil is not "more advanced" than 10W-30, it's just
>>>a different viscosity.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed
>>>>>>reccomendations that may differ from your owners
>>>>>>manual. The industry specifications continue to
>>>>>>change and as oils improve they become better for
>>>>>>your vehicle even though they may be a different
>>>>>>weight.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Stick with the viscosity specified for your car. It is
>>>safer to err at a higher viscosity.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated
>>>>>oils, but oil quality and oil weight are two
>>>>>different things.
>>>>>
>>>>>Ford went to considerable trouble to publish
>>>>>service bulletins showing which older models were
>>>>>demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after
>>>>>Ford switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20.
>>>>>However, I have never seen any similar publication
>>>>>from Honda, which makes one wonder if there are
>>>>>issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not
>>>>>specify it when new.
>>>>>
>>>>>By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for
>>>>>using 5W-20 is for improved fuel economy over 5W-30
>>>>>and bragged about the expected 0.6% improvement.
>>>>>Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able
>>>>>to detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
>>>>>
>>>>>John
>>>>
>>>>ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing,
>>>>or are doing it to cut corners/save money. it's their
>>>>corporate culture.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>There are idiots, but it's not them who don't know what
>>>they are talking. And, "[they] cut corners/save money"
>>>doesn't make sense if "[they] went to considerable
>>>trouble to publish ...]"
>>>
>>
>>so, do you know much about cars? do you know about 3 vs. 5 bearing
>>crankshafts? do you know about cast cranks vs. forged? do you know
>>about high silica brake pads? transmission clutch pack quality? how
>>about tolerances? suv rollover? solid rear axles straight out of the
>>20's? leaf springs? red rear turn signals to save 2 bulbs and a few
>>yards of wire? dude, no kidding, there's not a single nut, bolt,
>>strand of wire, or even paint particle on a ford that is not the
>>cheapest they think they can get away with. not one single thing.
>
>
> It's called "meeting the minimum specification".......
>
>
which begs the question, if ford quality is 30% of toyota quality, why
isn't ford price 30% of toyota price? [rhetorical]

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

> Date: Mon, Jan 9 2006 6:19 am
> From: jim beam
>
> > Date: Sun, Jan 8 2006 6:58 pm
> > From: "karl"
> >
> > ================================================== ==
> > TOPIC: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
> > http://groups.google.com/group/alt.a...a2cc3970410acd
> > ================================================== ==
> >
> > > Date: Fri, Jan 6 2006 6:43 am
> > > From: jim beam
> > >
> > > John Horner wrote:
> > > > Howard H wrote:
> > > >
> > > > > "hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > > > news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.prodigy. net...
> > > > >
> > > > > > for the right price i would use the more
> > > > > > advanced motor oil 5w-20. more than likely it
> > > > > > is a better oil for your car. your owners
> > > > > > manual was written before that oil was even
> > > > > > thought of probably and now it's out and if
> > > > > > your manual could be rewritten it may actually
> > > > > > be calling for w20. i wouldn't worry about it.
> > > > > > if the car is running good and you talk to the
> > > > > > dealer and they tell you its a better oil. than
> > > > > > you can use it.
> >
> >
> >
> > 5W-20 oil is not "more advanced" than 10W-30, it's
> > just a different viscosity.
> >
> >
> >
> > > > > Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed
> > > > > reccomendations that may differ from your
> > > > > owners manual. The industry specifications
> > > > > continue to change and as oils improve they
> > > > > become better for your vehicle even though they
> > > > > may be a different weight.
> >
> >
> >
> > Stick with the viscosity specified for your car.
> > It is safer to err at a higher viscosity.
> >
> >
> >
> > > > Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated
> > > > oils, but oil quality and oil weight are two
> > > > different things.
> > > >
> > > > Ford went to considerable trouble to publish
> > > > service bulletins showing which older models were
> > > > demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after Ford
> > > > switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20.
> > > > However, I have never seen any similar publication
> > > > from Honda, which makes one wonder if there are
> > > > issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not
> > > > specify it when new.
> > > >
> > > > By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for
> > > > using 5W-20 is for improved fuel economy over 5W-30
> > > > and bragged about the expected 0.6% improvement.
> > > > Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able
> > > > to detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
> > > >
> > > > John
> > >
> > > ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing,
> > > or are doing it to cut corners/save money. it's their
> > > corporate culture.
> >
> >
> >
> > There are idiots, but it's not Ford's engineers who
> > don't know what they are talking. And, they "cut
> > corners/save money" doesn't make sense if they "went
> > to considerable trouble to publish ..."
> >
> so, do you know much about cars? do you know about 3
> vs. 5 bearing crankshafts? do you know about cast
> cranks vs. forged? do you know about high silica brake
> pads? transmission clutch pack quality? how about
> tolerances? suv rollover? solid rear axles straight out
> of the 20's? leaf springs? red rear turn signals to
> save 2 bulbs and a few yards of wire? dude, no
> kidding, there's not a single nut, bolt, strand of
> wire, or even paint particle on a ford that is not the
> cheapest they think they can get away with. not one
> single thing.



No, jim, I do not know much about cars.
Why do you ask? Your question has no bearing on the
issue at hand.
The issue is substituting 5W-20 for 10W-30.
Do you have anything useful to add?
And, jim, I do keep my mouth shut on matters I do not
understand. How about you?

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

karl wrote:
>>Date: Mon, Jan 9 2006 6:19 am
>>From: jim beam
>>
>>
>>>Date: Sun, Jan 8 2006 6:58 pm
>>>From: "karl"
>>>
>>>=============================================== =====
>>>TOPIC: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
>>>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.a...a2cc3970410acd
>>>=============================================== =====
>>>
>>>
>>>>Date: Fri, Jan 6 2006 6:43 am
>>>>From: jim beam
>>>>
>>>>John Horner wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>Howard H wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>>"hondaman" <jeffscomp@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>>>>>>news:FDYuf.61595$tV6.25497@newssvr27.news.pr odigy.net...
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>>for the right price i would use the more
>>>>>>>advanced motor oil 5w-20. more than likely it
>>>>>>>is a better oil for your car. your owners
>>>>>>>manual was written before that oil was even
>>>>>>>thought of probably and now it's out and if
>>>>>>>your manual could be rewritten it may actually
>>>>>>>be calling for w20. i wouldn't worry about it.
>>>>>>>if the car is running good and you talk to the
>>>>>>>dealer and they tell you its a better oil. than
>>>>>>>you can use it.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>5W-20 oil is not "more advanced" than 10W-30, it's
>>>just a different viscosity.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>>Well said! As oils evolve Honda has changed
>>>>>>reccomendations that may differ from your
>>>>>>owners manual. The industry specifications
>>>>>>continue to change and as oils improve they
>>>>>>become better for your vehicle even though they
>>>>>>may be a different weight.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>Stick with the viscosity specified for your car.
>>>It is safer to err at a higher viscosity.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>>>Certainly I would use the latest SM / GF-4 rated
>>>>>oils, but oil quality and oil weight are two
>>>>>different things.
>>>>>
>>>>>Ford went to considerable trouble to publish
>>>>>service bulletins showing which older models were
>>>>>demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after Ford
>>>>>switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20.
>>>>>However, I have never seen any similar publication
>>>>>from Honda, which makes one wonder if there are
>>>>>issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not
>>>>>specify it when new.
>>>>>
>>>>>By the way, Ford stated that the primary reason for
>>>>>using 5W-20 is for improved fuel economy over 5W-30
>>>>>and bragged about the expected 0.6% improvement.
>>>>>Somehow I don't think any of us would ever be able
>>>>>to detect a less than 1% fuel economy improvement.
>>>>>
>>>>>John
>>>>
>>>>ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing,
>>>>or are doing it to cut corners/save money. it's their
>>>>corporate culture.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>There are idiots, but it's not Ford's engineers who
>>>don't know what they are talking. And, they "cut
>>>corners/save money" doesn't make sense if they "went
>>>to considerable trouble to publish ..."
>>>
>>
>>so, do you know much about cars? do you know about 3
>>vs. 5 bearing crankshafts? do you know about cast
>>cranks vs. forged? do you know about high silica brake
>>pads? transmission clutch pack quality? how about
>>tolerances? suv rollover? solid rear axles straight out
>>of the 20's? leaf springs? red rear turn signals to
>>save 2 bulbs and a few yards of wire? dude, no
>>kidding, there's not a single nut, bolt, strand of
>>wire, or even paint particle on a ford that is not the
>>cheapest they think they can get away with. not one
>>single thing.
>
>
>
>
> No, jim, I do not know much about cars.
> Why do you ask? Your question has no bearing on the
> issue at hand.
> The issue is substituting 5W-20 for 10W-30.
> Do you have anything useful to add?
> And, jim, I do keep my mouth shut on matters I do not
> understand. How about you?
>
so why are you defending ford, contrary to any reason for anyone that's
examined their design, production technology and quality?

Re: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
 

> Date: Mon, Jan 9 2006 7:12 pm
> From: jim beam
>
> >Date: Mon, Jan 9 2006 6:51 pm
> >From: "karl"
> >
> >>Date: Mon, Jan 9 2006 6:19 am
> >>From: jim beam
> >>
> >>
> >>>Date: Sun, Jan 8 2006 6:58 pm
> >>>From: "karl"
> >>>
> >>>=============================================== =====
> >>>TOPIC: 5-20 oil on 98 Accord-I4?
> >>>http://groups.google.com/group/alt.a...a2cc3970410acd
> >>>=============================================== =====
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>>Date: Fri, Jan 6 2006 6:43 am
> >>>>From: jim beam
> >>>>
> >>>>John Horner wrote:

snip

> >>>>>Ford went to considerable trouble to publish
> >>>>>service bulletins showing which older models were
> >>>>>demonstrated to be compatible with 5W-20 after Ford
> >>>>>switched most of their new vehicles to 5W-20.
> >>>>>However, I have never seen any similar publication
> >>>>>from Honda, which makes one wonder if there are
> >>>>>issues with using 5W-20 in Hondas which did not
> >>>>>specify it when new.

snip

> >>>>>John
> >>>>
> >>>>ford are idiots that don't know what they're doing,
> >>>>or are doing it to cut corners/save money. it's their
> >>>>corporate culture.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>There are idiots, but it's not Ford's engineers who
> >>>don't know what they are talking. And, they "cut
> >>>corners/save money" doesn't make sense if they "went
> >>>to considerable trouble to publish ..."
> >>>
> >>
> >>so, do you know much about cars? do you know about 3
> >>vs. 5 bearing crankshafts? do you know about cast
> >>cranks vs. forged? do you know about high silica brake
> >>pads? transmission clutch pack quality? how about
> >>tolerances? suv rollover? solid rear axles straight out
> >>of the 20's? leaf springs? red rear turn signals to
> >>save 2 bulbs and a few yards of wire? dude, no
> >>kidding, there's not a single nut, bolt, strand of
> >>wire, or even paint particle on a ford that is not the
> >>cheapest they think they can get away with. not one
> >>single thing.
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > No, jim, I do not know much about cars.
> > Why do you ask? Your question has no bearing on the
> > issue at hand.
> > The issue is substituting 5W-20 for 10W-30.
> > Do you have anything useful to add?
> > And, jim, I do keep my mouth shut on matters I do not
> > understand. How about you?
> >
> so why are you defending ford, contrary to any reason
> for anyone that's examined their design, production
> technology and quality?



Here we go again. When you have nothing useful to say
about the sugject at hand you talk about something else.
You do this frequently. Jim, you don't have to post;
relax.

Ford did the right thing, they published, according to
John, which of their older models can savely be switched
to 5W-20. But you call them idiots.