GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.

Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
and great product!

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off.

And this is important to the Honda new group because ...?

Stewart DIBBS

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off.

And this is important to the Honda new group because ...?

Stewart DIBBS

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

Well Hondas are priced high due to their perceived quality so if gm has
closed the gap Honda has new competition!! Important to the group
because if you're looking for a car, might want to look at gm

Stewart DIBBS wrote:
> <hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>
>>The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off.
>
>
> And this is important to the Honda new group because ...?
>
> Stewart DIBBS
>
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

Well Hondas are priced high due to their perceived quality so if gm has
closed the gap Honda has new competition!! Important to the group
because if you're looking for a car, might want to look at gm

Stewart DIBBS wrote:
> <hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>
>>The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off.
>
>
> And this is important to the Honda new group because ...?
>
> Stewart DIBBS
>
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> .... While Buick and Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all
> other makes,


I'm sure you meant to say "reliability", but could you please reveal the
source of this conclusion. What study or what survey says so?

Bob




the
> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>
> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> and great product!
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> .... While Buick and Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all
> other makes,


I'm sure you meant to say "reliability", but could you please reveal the
source of this conclusion. What study or what survey says so?

Bob




the
> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>
> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> and great product!
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

"sam" <justwantsmore@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:11er02ofb6pcfe8@news.supernews.com...
> Well Hondas are priced high due to their perceived quality so if gm has
> closed the gap Honda has new competition!! Important to the group because
> if you're looking for a car, might want to look at gm

Owning a GM is okay if you have a good deal with the local tow truck
operation. I speak from experience {;^(

But I'm much better now, I've been a happy and satisfied Honda owner since
1979.

Brian

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

"sam" <justwantsmore@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:11er02ofb6pcfe8@news.supernews.com...
> Well Hondas are priced high due to their perceived quality so if gm has
> closed the gap Honda has new competition!! Important to the group because
> if you're looking for a car, might want to look at gm

Owning a GM is okay if you have a good deal with the local tow truck
operation. I speak from experience {;^(

But I'm much better now, I've been a happy and satisfied Honda owner since
1979.

Brian

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

Well you won't get reliability in a GM piece of , what have you been
smoking?

Honda and Toyota haven't has to resort to employe pricing, because there
sales are not in the toilet like the big 3.

Tom


<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>
> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> and great product!
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

Well you won't get reliability in a GM piece of , what have you been
smoking?

Honda and Toyota haven't has to resort to employe pricing, because there
sales are not in the toilet like the big 3.

Tom


<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>
> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> and great product!
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

If your looking for a headache look at a GM product!

Tom


"sam" <justwantsmore@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:11er02ofb6pcfe8@news.supernews.com...
> Well Hondas are priced high due to their perceived quality so if gm has
> closed the gap Honda has new competition!! Important to the group because
> if you're looking for a car, might want to look at gm
>
> Stewart DIBBS wrote:
>> <hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
>> news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>>
>>>The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off.
>>
>>
>> And this is important to the Honda new group because ...?
>>
>> Stewart DIBBS

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

If your looking for a headache look at a GM product!

Tom


"sam" <justwantsmore@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:11er02ofb6pcfe8@news.supernews.com...
> Well Hondas are priced high due to their perceived quality so if gm has
> closed the gap Honda has new competition!! Important to the group because
> if you're looking for a car, might want to look at gm
>
> Stewart DIBBS wrote:
>> <hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
>> news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>>
>>>The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off.
>>
>>
>> And this is important to the Honda new group because ...?
>>
>> Stewart DIBBS

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

what studys show that JUST the reliablity is making GM increase in sales?
Have you looked on the side of the road lately? Theres GM's reliability!

<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>
> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> and great product!
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

what studys show that JUST the reliablity is making GM increase in sales?
Have you looked on the side of the road lately? Theres GM's reliability!

<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>
> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> and great product!
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

hunkman7@excite.com wrote:
> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>
> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> and great product!
>


Interesting. We own a 2003 Honda Accord and a 2002 Olds Silhoette.
Both have spent more time in the shop than I would expect to see. The
Honda just got a new transmission under warranty while the Olds is
presently having the A/C condensor replaced at a cost of $900.

The Honda has gone through brake pads much faster than one would expect
and needed new rotors sooner than any other car I have ever owned.

My personal experience is that GM has been improving quality in recent
years while Honda has been cutting corners. The gap is not what it used
to be.

Johnj

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

hunkman7@excite.com wrote:
> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>
> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> and great product!
>


Interesting. We own a 2003 Honda Accord and a 2002 Olds Silhoette.
Both have spent more time in the shop than I would expect to see. The
Honda just got a new transmission under warranty while the Olds is
presently having the A/C condensor replaced at a cost of $900.

The Honda has gone through brake pads much faster than one would expect
and needed new rotors sooner than any other car I have ever owned.

My personal experience is that GM has been improving quality in recent
years while Honda has been cutting corners. The gap is not what it used
to be.

Johnj

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

"Shawn Taylor" <accordpower99@cox.net> wrote in message
news:_ygHe.64328$FP2.55658@lakeread03...
> what studys show that JUST the reliablity is making GM increase in sales?
> Have you looked on the side of the road lately? Theres GM's reliability!

That shows that they have added the reliability that their products will
break down more. {;^)

Brian

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

"Shawn Taylor" <accordpower99@cox.net> wrote in message
news:_ygHe.64328$FP2.55658@lakeread03...
> what studys show that JUST the reliablity is making GM increase in sales?
> Have you looked on the side of the road lately? Theres GM's reliability!

That shows that they have added the reliability that their products will
break down more. {;^)

Brian

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

I could not care less about what happens at GM. Honda products are not
perfect just way better then anything GM builds here. Honda has never
needed to resort to pricing discounts to sell their cars and have a
reputation for quality second to nobody and high resale too boot. Now even
in GM's Saturn Vue you will find a HONDA 3.5 v-6 engine , appears like they
know whats good also. Scott

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

I could not care less about what happens at GM. Honda products are not
perfect just way better then anything GM builds here. Honda has never
needed to resort to pricing discounts to sell their cars and have a
reputation for quality second to nobody and high resale too boot. Now even
in GM's Saturn Vue you will find a HONDA 3.5 v-6 engine , appears like they
know whats good also. Scott

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

zonie wrote:
> I could not care less about what happens at GM. Honda products are not
> perfect just way better then anything GM builds here. Honda has never
> needed to resort to pricing discounts to sell their cars and have a
> reputation for quality second to nobody and high resale too boot. Now even
> in GM's Saturn Vue you will find a HONDA 3.5 v-6 engine , appears like they
> know whats good also. Scott

---------------------------

I wouldn't buy a Saturn Vue if it came with THREE Honda engines in it .
.. . You can't turn a sow's ear into a silk purse. Resale value may be a
bit better on that version, but time will tell :-(

'Curly'

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

zonie wrote:
> I could not care less about what happens at GM. Honda products are not
> perfect just way better then anything GM builds here. Honda has never
> needed to resort to pricing discounts to sell their cars and have a
> reputation for quality second to nobody and high resale too boot. Now even
> in GM's Saturn Vue you will find a HONDA 3.5 v-6 engine , appears like they
> know whats good also. Scott

---------------------------

I wouldn't buy a Saturn Vue if it came with THREE Honda engines in it .
.. . You can't turn a sow's ear into a silk purse. Resale value may be a
bit better on that version, but time will tell :-(

'Curly'

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>
> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> and great product!
>
GM resorted to the big discounts to move their huge SUVs. They have a few
models that have fared fairly well in Consumer Reports reliability
ratings -- like Buick LeSabre and the like, but Cadillac is still in the
toilet. I would never trade my Prelude for anything GM makes -- and that
includes a Corvette. And, I have owned a couple Corvettes before.

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>
> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> and great product!
>
GM resorted to the big discounts to move their huge SUVs. They have a few
models that have fared fairly well in Consumer Reports reliability
ratings -- like Buick LeSabre and the like, but Cadillac is still in the
toilet. I would never trade my Prelude for anything GM makes -- and that
includes a Corvette. And, I have owned a couple Corvettes before.

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

I wasnt trying to say the rest of the car was any good. Just making a
statement . I woundnt have one either. Honda for me. Scott

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

I wasnt trying to say the rest of the car was any good. Just making a
statement . I woundnt have one either. Honda for me. Scott

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

zonie wrote:
> Honda has never
> needed to resort to pricing discounts to sell their cars

You must be forgetting the first generation Odyssey and that hack job
built by Isuzu and sold by Honda. Isuzu called their version to Rodeo.
I can not remember the Honda name.

Honda also has rebates on several models right now, including the
Accord. They just don't call 'em rebates. They call it "marketing
support" to the dealerships and the number is hidden from customers.

see:
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2005/hond...ves.3.6.Honda*

In a way this is more devious than a straight up rebate as if you don't
know about it you may not get as good of a deal as a more informed
person does.


Yes, GM currently is discounting it's vehicles more than Honda is, but
that is not the same thing as it is to say that Honda "never needed to
resort to pricing discounts". Your statement simply isn't true.



John

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

zonie wrote:
> Honda has never
> needed to resort to pricing discounts to sell their cars

You must be forgetting the first generation Odyssey and that hack job
built by Isuzu and sold by Honda. Isuzu called their version to Rodeo.
I can not remember the Honda name.

Honda also has rebates on several models right now, including the
Accord. They just don't call 'em rebates. They call it "marketing
support" to the dealerships and the number is hidden from customers.

see:
http://www.edmunds.com/new/2005/hond...ves.3.6.Honda*

In a way this is more devious than a straight up rebate as if you don't
know about it you may not get as good of a deal as a more informed
person does.


Yes, GM currently is discounting it's vehicles more than Honda is, but
that is not the same thing as it is to say that Honda "never needed to
resort to pricing discounts". Your statement simply isn't true.



John

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

Best thing about my Honda and others I see, the paint isn't falling off,
like I've seen on alot of GM and Chrysler products, if either manufacture
had any balls they would re-paint those vehicles at no cost to the owner.

Tom


"TWW" <twaugh5@cox.net> wrote in message
news:54yHe.54605$rb6.13378@lakeread07...
>
> <hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
>> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
>> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
>> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
>> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
>> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
>> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>>
>> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
>> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
>> and great product!
>>
> GM resorted to the big discounts to move their huge SUVs. They have a few
> models that have fared fairly well in Consumer Reports reliability
> ratings -- like Buick LeSabre and the like, but Cadillac is still in the
> toilet. I would never trade my Prelude for anything GM makes -- and that
> includes a Corvette. And, I have owned a couple Corvettes before.
>
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

Best thing about my Honda and others I see, the paint isn't falling off,
like I've seen on alot of GM and Chrysler products, if either manufacture
had any balls they would re-paint those vehicles at no cost to the owner.

Tom


"TWW" <twaugh5@cox.net> wrote in message
news:54yHe.54605$rb6.13378@lakeread07...
>
> <hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
>> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
>> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
>> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
>> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
>> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
>> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>>
>> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
>> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
>> and great product!
>>
> GM resorted to the big discounts to move their huge SUVs. They have a few
> models that have fared fairly well in Consumer Reports reliability
> ratings -- like Buick LeSabre and the like, but Cadillac is still in the
> toilet. I would never trade my Prelude for anything GM makes -- and that
> includes a Corvette. And, I have owned a couple Corvettes before.
>
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

rjdriver wrote:
> <hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> > .... While Buick and Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all
> > other makes,
>
>
> I'm sure you meant to say "reliability", but could you please reveal the
> source of this conclusion. What study or what survey says so?
>
> Bob
>

Sure, the source of this information is the 2005 JD Powers Survey and
yes, I meant 'reliability'. Thanks!

>
>
>
> the
> > recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> > market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> > increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> > on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> > is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
> >
> > Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> > Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> > and great product!
> >

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

rjdriver wrote:
> <hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
> news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
> > .... While Buick and Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all
> > other makes,
>
>
> I'm sure you meant to say "reliability", but could you please reveal the
> source of this conclusion. What study or what survey says so?
>
> Bob
>

Sure, the source of this information is the 2005 JD Powers Survey and
yes, I meant 'reliability'. Thanks!

>
>
>
> the
> > recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
> > market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
> > increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
> > on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
> > is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
> >
> > Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
> > Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
> > and great product!
> >

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

With recent transmission problems Honda has some catching up to do.
Besides, they are now also starting to fall behind on technology. Rear
drum brakes on the 2005 Accord? And the interior is in bad need of
updating. Tsk, tsk.

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

With recent transmission problems Honda has some catching up to do.
Besides, they are now also starting to fall behind on technology. Rear
drum brakes on the 2005 Accord? And the interior is in bad need of
updating. Tsk, tsk.

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

The market sets car prices, not the manufacturers. That being said, both the
new and the used car market prices HON/TOY products to last about 150,000
miles. Sure, many go much longer and still have some residual worth at
150,000 miles. At 150,000 miles, they become "might last longer"
vehicles...but not a great bet. But for GM/FORD the market prices them to go
only to 100,000 miles before it's worth merely a residual "might last
longer" value. That's why a loaded CR-V can command $23,000 while you can
find a similar Ford Escape that they can only get $18,000 for (after all the
rebate shenanigans). The market is recognizing that the Escape approaches
crap at 100,000 miles while the CR-V probably won't approach crap until
150,000 miles. The HON/TOY is actually cheaper to own. Here the 'Scape costs
18 cents/mile while the CR-V costs 15 cents/mile. And while most people
don't own a car from showroom to junkyard, this same pricing pattern will
show up at resale time so, again, even for the 2-3 year owner, the HON/TOY
is cheaper than the GM/FORD to own. (I will say that with the depth of the
GM/FORD rebates today, their cost per mile is approaching that of HON/TOY.
But, of course, cutting prices enough to compensate people for this 50,000
durability gap is killing both GM and FORD in the process).


"twfsa" <uksatw@qwest.net> wrote in message
news:CKBHe.54616$rb6.9905@lakeread07...
> Best thing about my Honda and others I see, the paint isn't falling off,
> like I've seen on alot of GM and Chrysler products, if either manufacture
> had any balls they would re-paint those vehicles at no cost to the owner.
>
> Tom
>
>
> "TWW" <twaugh5@cox.net> wrote in message
> news:54yHe.54605$rb6.13378@lakeread07...
>>
>> <hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
>> news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>>> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
>>> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
>>> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
>>> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
>>> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
>>> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
>>> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>>>
>>> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
>>> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
>>> and great product!
>>>
>> GM resorted to the big discounts to move their huge SUVs. They have a
>> few
>> models that have fared fairly well in Consumer Reports reliability
>> ratings -- like Buick LeSabre and the like, but Cadillac is still in the
>> toilet. I would never trade my Prelude for anything GM makes -- and that
>> includes a Corvette. And, I have owned a couple Corvettes before.
>>
>>
>
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

The market sets car prices, not the manufacturers. That being said, both the
new and the used car market prices HON/TOY products to last about 150,000
miles. Sure, many go much longer and still have some residual worth at
150,000 miles. At 150,000 miles, they become "might last longer"
vehicles...but not a great bet. But for GM/FORD the market prices them to go
only to 100,000 miles before it's worth merely a residual "might last
longer" value. That's why a loaded CR-V can command $23,000 while you can
find a similar Ford Escape that they can only get $18,000 for (after all the
rebate shenanigans). The market is recognizing that the Escape approaches
crap at 100,000 miles while the CR-V probably won't approach crap until
150,000 miles. The HON/TOY is actually cheaper to own. Here the 'Scape costs
18 cents/mile while the CR-V costs 15 cents/mile. And while most people
don't own a car from showroom to junkyard, this same pricing pattern will
show up at resale time so, again, even for the 2-3 year owner, the HON/TOY
is cheaper than the GM/FORD to own. (I will say that with the depth of the
GM/FORD rebates today, their cost per mile is approaching that of HON/TOY.
But, of course, cutting prices enough to compensate people for this 50,000
durability gap is killing both GM and FORD in the process).


"twfsa" <uksatw@qwest.net> wrote in message
news:CKBHe.54616$rb6.9905@lakeread07...
> Best thing about my Honda and others I see, the paint isn't falling off,
> like I've seen on alot of GM and Chrysler products, if either manufacture
> had any balls they would re-paint those vehicles at no cost to the owner.
>
> Tom
>
>
> "TWW" <twaugh5@cox.net> wrote in message
> news:54yHe.54605$rb6.13378@lakeread07...
>>
>> <hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
>> news:1122854121.042620.110020@g44g2000cwa.googlegr oups.com...
>>> The many changes made by GM appear to be paying off. While Buick and
>>> Cadillac models are now tops in relibility over all other makes, the
>>> recent incentives have pushed sales up 41 %. GM has increased its
>>> market share from 23% last year to 31% this year. This is expected to
>>> increase, as GM drops the incentive programs in favor of lower prices
>>> on most models. GM sales in Europe have risen 28% over 2004, while it
>>> is closing in on Volkswagen, which is the number one seller in China.
>>>
>>> Among the losers is Toyota, which is taken the brunt of the General
>>> Motors offensive. It is hard to beat great prices, great reliability
>>> and great product!
>>>
>> GM resorted to the big discounts to move their huge SUVs. They have a
>> few
>> models that have fared fairly well in Consumer Reports reliability
>> ratings -- like Buick LeSabre and the like, but Cadillac is still in the
>> toilet. I would never trade my Prelude for anything GM makes -- and that
>> includes a Corvette. And, I have owned a couple Corvettes before.
>>
>>
>
>

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122981830.913324.20980@g14g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com...
> With recent transmission problems Honda has some catching up to do.
> Besides, they are now also starting to fall behind on technology. Rear
> drum brakes on the 2005 Accord? And the interior is in bad need of
> updating. Tsk, tsk.

I'd prefer to have drums rather than disks on the rear of my Accord. The
primary reason is that they last so much longer and don't have to be
serviced/checked every six months.

Brian

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

<hunkman7@excite.com> wrote in message
news:1122981830.913324.20980@g14g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com...
> With recent transmission problems Honda has some catching up to do.
> Besides, they are now also starting to fall behind on technology. Rear
> drum brakes on the 2005 Accord? And the interior is in bad need of
> updating. Tsk, tsk.

I'd prefer to have drums rather than disks on the rear of my Accord. The
primary reason is that they last so much longer and don't have to be
serviced/checked every six months.

Brian

Re: GM tops reliability and regains market share
 

Rear drums are only on the DX or LX, EX gets discs. You most not know
Honda's too well. I'm most everybody on here has owned GM cars in the
past. Thats why we have Honda's now. I have worked in a Chevy garage for
33 years. I see GM at its best and worst. Honda is having a bit af trouble
with tranmissions at present. Right now in our shop in Phoenix we have 6
Malibu's and Impala's all waiting for new engines. 3.5 V-6 and we have
already done 4 others, and we are just one dealer. Imagine how mant other
engines are failing nationwide. Crankshaft key breaks and pistons hit
valves. All have less than 3000 miles , owners not happy. Any body can
make errors when building cars. But GM is the master at it. Dont forget
what G.M.C. stands for,
Garage Mechanics Companion. hehehe