Odometer Class Action Suit?
#91
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Odometer Class Action Suit?
I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
"Mile 37,800". If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect, then 1)
the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false; 2) both of the trip
meters also incorrectly state miles traveled; 3) Honda owners can not
sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
actual miles driven; 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
high, due to the overstated odometer.
chand
Gordon McGrew wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>
> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
> >anyway.
> >
> >Anyone else question their odometer?
> >
> >Bill Radio
> >
>
> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>
> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>
> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>
> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
"Mile 37,800". If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect, then 1)
the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false; 2) both of the trip
meters also incorrectly state miles traveled; 3) Honda owners can not
sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
actual miles driven; 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
high, due to the overstated odometer.
chand
Gordon McGrew wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>
> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
> >anyway.
> >
> >Anyone else question their odometer?
> >
> >Bill Radio
> >
>
> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>
> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>
> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>
> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
#92
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Odometer Class Action Suit?
I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
"Mile 37,800". If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect, then 1)
the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false; 2) both of the trip
meters also incorrectly state miles traveled; 3) Honda owners can not
sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
actual miles driven; 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
high, due to the overstated odometer.
chand
Gordon McGrew wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>
> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
> >anyway.
> >
> >Anyone else question their odometer?
> >
> >Bill Radio
> >
>
> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>
> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>
> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>
> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
"Mile 37,800". If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect, then 1)
the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false; 2) both of the trip
meters also incorrectly state miles traveled; 3) Honda owners can not
sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
actual miles driven; 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
high, due to the overstated odometer.
chand
Gordon McGrew wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>
> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
> >anyway.
> >
> >Anyone else question their odometer?
> >
> >Bill Radio
> >
>
> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>
> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>
> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>
> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
#93
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Odometer Class Action Suit?
I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
"Mile 37,800". If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect, then 1)
the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false; 2) both of the trip
meters also incorrectly state miles traveled; 3) Honda owners can not
sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
actual miles driven; 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
high, due to the overstated odometer.
chand
Gordon McGrew wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>
> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
> >anyway.
> >
> >Anyone else question their odometer?
> >
> >Bill Radio
> >
>
> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>
> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>
> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>
> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
"Mile 37,800". If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect, then 1)
the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false; 2) both of the trip
meters also incorrectly state miles traveled; 3) Honda owners can not
sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
actual miles driven; 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
high, due to the overstated odometer.
chand
Gordon McGrew wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>
> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
> >anyway.
> >
> >Anyone else question their odometer?
> >
> >Bill Radio
> >
>
> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>
> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>
> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>
> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
#94
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Odometer Class Action Suit?
I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
"Mile 37,800". If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect, then 1)
the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false; 2) both of the trip
meters also incorrectly state miles traveled; 3) Honda owners can not
sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
actual miles driven; 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
high, due to the overstated odometer.
chand
Gordon McGrew wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>
> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
> >anyway.
> >
> >Anyone else question their odometer?
> >
> >Bill Radio
> >
>
> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>
> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>
> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>
> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
"Mile 37,800". If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect, then 1)
the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false; 2) both of the trip
meters also incorrectly state miles traveled; 3) Honda owners can not
sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
actual miles driven; 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
high, due to the overstated odometer.
chand
Gordon McGrew wrote:
> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>
> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
> >anyway.
> >
> >Anyone else question their odometer?
> >
> >Bill Radio
> >
>
> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>
> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>
> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>
> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
#95
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Odometer Class Action Suit?
On 18 Jan 2007 20:29:42 -0800, clodhoppers18@gmail.com wrote:
>I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
>"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
>suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
>is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
>"Mile 37,800".
This implies that the odometers are reading 5% high. Therefore you
get a 5% extension in your warranty. That seems fair.
>If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect,
Have you checked it?
> then 1)
>the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
>factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false;
The odometer does not affect your actual mileage of course. If you
mean that you are measuring your MPG and the number is 5% higher than
reality, then you need to factor that into your calculation. If you
are referring to the EPA estimate, then rest assured that the estimate
is in no way dependent on the accuracy of the odometer.
>2) both of the trip
>meters also incorrectly state miles traveled;
You need to factor this in, but I don't see how you have been harmed
by this.
>3) Honda owners can not
>sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
>reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
>actual miles driven;
This may or may not be a valid point. But consider that, to the
extent that used Odysseys compete with each other for buyers, they are
all at an equal disadvantage. To the extent that they compete with
other cars, we don't know how accurate those cars' odometers are. I
can tell you that +5% is pretty typical for odometer accuracy.
> 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
>high, due to the overstated odometer.
If you pay taxes on this basis, then you are overpaying. Where are
you that calculates taxes this way? I have never heard of this and it
seems ripe for cheating by periodically disconnecting the odometer.
I would have a hard time working up much anger about this.
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
>> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>>
>> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
>> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
>> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
>> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
>> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
>> >anyway.
>> >
>> >Anyone else question their odometer?
>> >
>> >Bill Radio
>> >
>>
>> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
>> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
>> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
>> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
>> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
>> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
>> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>>
>> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
>> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
>> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
>> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
>> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
>> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
>> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>>
>> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
>> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
>> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
>> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
>> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
>> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
>> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
>> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
>> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
>> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
>> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
>> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>>
>> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
>> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
>> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
>I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
>"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
>suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
>is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
>"Mile 37,800".
This implies that the odometers are reading 5% high. Therefore you
get a 5% extension in your warranty. That seems fair.
>If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect,
Have you checked it?
> then 1)
>the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
>factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false;
The odometer does not affect your actual mileage of course. If you
mean that you are measuring your MPG and the number is 5% higher than
reality, then you need to factor that into your calculation. If you
are referring to the EPA estimate, then rest assured that the estimate
is in no way dependent on the accuracy of the odometer.
>2) both of the trip
>meters also incorrectly state miles traveled;
You need to factor this in, but I don't see how you have been harmed
by this.
>3) Honda owners can not
>sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
>reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
>actual miles driven;
This may or may not be a valid point. But consider that, to the
extent that used Odysseys compete with each other for buyers, they are
all at an equal disadvantage. To the extent that they compete with
other cars, we don't know how accurate those cars' odometers are. I
can tell you that +5% is pretty typical for odometer accuracy.
> 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
>high, due to the overstated odometer.
If you pay taxes on this basis, then you are overpaying. Where are
you that calculates taxes this way? I have never heard of this and it
seems ripe for cheating by periodically disconnecting the odometer.
I would have a hard time working up much anger about this.
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
>> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>>
>> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
>> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
>> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
>> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
>> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
>> >anyway.
>> >
>> >Anyone else question their odometer?
>> >
>> >Bill Radio
>> >
>>
>> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
>> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
>> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
>> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
>> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
>> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
>> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>>
>> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
>> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
>> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
>> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
>> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
>> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
>> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>>
>> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
>> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
>> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
>> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
>> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
>> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
>> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
>> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
>> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
>> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
>> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
>> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>>
>> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
>> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
>> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
#96
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Odometer Class Action Suit?
On 18 Jan 2007 20:29:42 -0800, clodhoppers18@gmail.com wrote:
>I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
>"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
>suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
>is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
>"Mile 37,800".
This implies that the odometers are reading 5% high. Therefore you
get a 5% extension in your warranty. That seems fair.
>If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect,
Have you checked it?
> then 1)
>the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
>factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false;
The odometer does not affect your actual mileage of course. If you
mean that you are measuring your MPG and the number is 5% higher than
reality, then you need to factor that into your calculation. If you
are referring to the EPA estimate, then rest assured that the estimate
is in no way dependent on the accuracy of the odometer.
>2) both of the trip
>meters also incorrectly state miles traveled;
You need to factor this in, but I don't see how you have been harmed
by this.
>3) Honda owners can not
>sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
>reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
>actual miles driven;
This may or may not be a valid point. But consider that, to the
extent that used Odysseys compete with each other for buyers, they are
all at an equal disadvantage. To the extent that they compete with
other cars, we don't know how accurate those cars' odometers are. I
can tell you that +5% is pretty typical for odometer accuracy.
> 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
>high, due to the overstated odometer.
If you pay taxes on this basis, then you are overpaying. Where are
you that calculates taxes this way? I have never heard of this and it
seems ripe for cheating by periodically disconnecting the odometer.
I would have a hard time working up much anger about this.
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
>> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>>
>> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
>> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
>> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
>> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
>> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
>> >anyway.
>> >
>> >Anyone else question their odometer?
>> >
>> >Bill Radio
>> >
>>
>> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
>> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
>> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
>> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
>> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
>> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
>> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>>
>> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
>> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
>> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
>> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
>> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
>> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
>> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>>
>> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
>> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
>> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
>> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
>> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
>> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
>> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
>> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
>> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
>> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
>> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
>> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>>
>> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
>> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
>> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
>I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
>"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
>suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
>is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
>"Mile 37,800".
This implies that the odometers are reading 5% high. Therefore you
get a 5% extension in your warranty. That seems fair.
>If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect,
Have you checked it?
> then 1)
>the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
>factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false;
The odometer does not affect your actual mileage of course. If you
mean that you are measuring your MPG and the number is 5% higher than
reality, then you need to factor that into your calculation. If you
are referring to the EPA estimate, then rest assured that the estimate
is in no way dependent on the accuracy of the odometer.
>2) both of the trip
>meters also incorrectly state miles traveled;
You need to factor this in, but I don't see how you have been harmed
by this.
>3) Honda owners can not
>sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
>reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
>actual miles driven;
This may or may not be a valid point. But consider that, to the
extent that used Odysseys compete with each other for buyers, they are
all at an equal disadvantage. To the extent that they compete with
other cars, we don't know how accurate those cars' odometers are. I
can tell you that +5% is pretty typical for odometer accuracy.
> 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
>high, due to the overstated odometer.
If you pay taxes on this basis, then you are overpaying. Where are
you that calculates taxes this way? I have never heard of this and it
seems ripe for cheating by periodically disconnecting the odometer.
I would have a hard time working up much anger about this.
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
>> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>>
>> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
>> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
>> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
>> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
>> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
>> >anyway.
>> >
>> >Anyone else question their odometer?
>> >
>> >Bill Radio
>> >
>>
>> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
>> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
>> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
>> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
>> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
>> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
>> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>>
>> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
>> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
>> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
>> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
>> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
>> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
>> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>>
>> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
>> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
>> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
>> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
>> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
>> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
>> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
>> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
>> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
>> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
>> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
>> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>>
>> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
>> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
>> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
#97
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Odometer Class Action Suit?
On 18 Jan 2007 20:29:42 -0800, clodhoppers18@gmail.com wrote:
>I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
>"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
>suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
>is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
>"Mile 37,800".
This implies that the odometers are reading 5% high. Therefore you
get a 5% extension in your warranty. That seems fair.
>If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect,
Have you checked it?
> then 1)
>the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
>factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false;
The odometer does not affect your actual mileage of course. If you
mean that you are measuring your MPG and the number is 5% higher than
reality, then you need to factor that into your calculation. If you
are referring to the EPA estimate, then rest assured that the estimate
is in no way dependent on the accuracy of the odometer.
>2) both of the trip
>meters also incorrectly state miles traveled;
You need to factor this in, but I don't see how you have been harmed
by this.
>3) Honda owners can not
>sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
>reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
>actual miles driven;
This may or may not be a valid point. But consider that, to the
extent that used Odysseys compete with each other for buyers, they are
all at an equal disadvantage. To the extent that they compete with
other cars, we don't know how accurate those cars' odometers are. I
can tell you that +5% is pretty typical for odometer accuracy.
> 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
>high, due to the overstated odometer.
If you pay taxes on this basis, then you are overpaying. Where are
you that calculates taxes this way? I have never heard of this and it
seems ripe for cheating by periodically disconnecting the odometer.
I would have a hard time working up much anger about this.
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
>> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>>
>> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
>> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
>> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
>> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
>> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
>> >anyway.
>> >
>> >Anyone else question their odometer?
>> >
>> >Bill Radio
>> >
>>
>> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
>> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
>> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
>> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
>> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
>> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
>> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>>
>> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
>> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
>> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
>> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
>> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
>> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
>> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>>
>> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
>> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
>> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
>> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
>> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
>> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
>> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
>> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
>> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
>> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
>> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
>> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>>
>> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
>> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
>> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
>I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
>"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
>suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
>is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
>"Mile 37,800".
This implies that the odometers are reading 5% high. Therefore you
get a 5% extension in your warranty. That seems fair.
>If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect,
Have you checked it?
> then 1)
>the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
>factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false;
The odometer does not affect your actual mileage of course. If you
mean that you are measuring your MPG and the number is 5% higher than
reality, then you need to factor that into your calculation. If you
are referring to the EPA estimate, then rest assured that the estimate
is in no way dependent on the accuracy of the odometer.
>2) both of the trip
>meters also incorrectly state miles traveled;
You need to factor this in, but I don't see how you have been harmed
by this.
>3) Honda owners can not
>sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
>reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
>actual miles driven;
This may or may not be a valid point. But consider that, to the
extent that used Odysseys compete with each other for buyers, they are
all at an equal disadvantage. To the extent that they compete with
other cars, we don't know how accurate those cars' odometers are. I
can tell you that +5% is pretty typical for odometer accuracy.
> 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
>high, due to the overstated odometer.
If you pay taxes on this basis, then you are overpaying. Where are
you that calculates taxes this way? I have never heard of this and it
seems ripe for cheating by periodically disconnecting the odometer.
I would have a hard time working up much anger about this.
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
>> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>>
>> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
>> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
>> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
>> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
>> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
>> >anyway.
>> >
>> >Anyone else question their odometer?
>> >
>> >Bill Radio
>> >
>>
>> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
>> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
>> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
>> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
>> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
>> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
>> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>>
>> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
>> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
>> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
>> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
>> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
>> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
>> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>>
>> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
>> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
>> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
>> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
>> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
>> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
>> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
>> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
>> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
>> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
>> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
>> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>>
>> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
>> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
>> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
#98
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Odometer Class Action Suit?
On 18 Jan 2007 20:29:42 -0800, clodhoppers18@gmail.com wrote:
>I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
>"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
>suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
>is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
>"Mile 37,800".
This implies that the odometers are reading 5% high. Therefore you
get a 5% extension in your warranty. That seems fair.
>If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect,
Have you checked it?
> then 1)
>the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
>factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false;
The odometer does not affect your actual mileage of course. If you
mean that you are measuring your MPG and the number is 5% higher than
reality, then you need to factor that into your calculation. If you
are referring to the EPA estimate, then rest assured that the estimate
is in no way dependent on the accuracy of the odometer.
>2) both of the trip
>meters also incorrectly state miles traveled;
You need to factor this in, but I don't see how you have been harmed
by this.
>3) Honda owners can not
>sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
>reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
>actual miles driven;
This may or may not be a valid point. But consider that, to the
extent that used Odysseys compete with each other for buyers, they are
all at an equal disadvantage. To the extent that they compete with
other cars, we don't know how accurate those cars' odometers are. I
can tell you that +5% is pretty typical for odometer accuracy.
> 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
>high, due to the overstated odometer.
If you pay taxes on this basis, then you are overpaying. Where are
you that calculates taxes this way? I have never heard of this and it
seems ripe for cheating by periodically disconnecting the odometer.
I would have a hard time working up much anger about this.
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
>> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>>
>> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
>> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
>> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
>> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
>> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
>> >anyway.
>> >
>> >Anyone else question their odometer?
>> >
>> >Bill Radio
>> >
>>
>> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
>> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
>> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
>> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
>> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
>> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
>> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>>
>> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
>> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
>> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
>> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
>> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
>> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
>> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>>
>> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
>> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
>> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
>> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
>> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
>> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
>> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
>> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
>> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
>> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
>> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
>> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>>
>> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
>> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
>> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
>I am a Honda owner and am furious. I received a copy of the
>"settlement" in the mail yesterday. The only ones benefiting from the
>suit are the attorneys that filed the case. The only benefit I can get
>is "any out of pocket expenses occurring between "Mile 36,000" and
>"Mile 37,800".
This implies that the odometers are reading 5% high. Therefore you
get a 5% extension in your warranty. That seems fair.
>If the mileage on the odometer is incorrect,
Have you checked it?
> then 1)
>the MPG is not as good as was promoted and the advertising that
>factored into my decision to buy a Honda was false;
The odometer does not affect your actual mileage of course. If you
mean that you are measuring your MPG and the number is 5% higher than
reality, then you need to factor that into your calculation. If you
are referring to the EPA estimate, then rest assured that the estimate
is in no way dependent on the accuracy of the odometer.
>2) both of the trip
>meters also incorrectly state miles traveled;
You need to factor this in, but I don't see how you have been harmed
by this.
>3) Honda owners can not
>sell their used Hondas for their actual value since the odometer
>reading, which is a factor in the sales price, will overstate the
>actual miles driven;
This may or may not be a valid point. But consider that, to the
extent that used Odysseys compete with each other for buyers, they are
all at an equal disadvantage. To the extent that they compete with
other cars, we don't know how accurate those cars' odometers are. I
can tell you that +5% is pretty typical for odometer accuracy.
> 4) vehicle usage taxes owed will be erroneously
>high, due to the overstated odometer.
If you pay taxes on this basis, then you are overpaying. Where are
you that calculates taxes this way? I have never heard of this and it
seems ripe for cheating by periodically disconnecting the odometer.
I would have a hard time working up much anger about this.
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Wed, 27 Dec 2006 23:47:05 -0700, "Bill Radio"
>> <Wireless@MountainWirelessNOSPAN.com> wrote:
>>
>> >I just received paperwork from the feds concerning a suit that will acheive
>> >Class Action status on Accord odometers. Of all cars, our '05 Accord is the
>> >most accurate! I do, however, have a different car that has a similar 3-4%
>> >error on the speedometer & odometer. So, now I'm wondering how common a
>> >problem is this? If I switch tire sizes, it all goes out the window,
>> >anyway.
>> >
>> >Anyone else question their odometer?
>> >
>> >Bill Radio
>> >
>>
>> For decades, manufacturers have intentionally aimed for calibration
>> which was as much as 10% above reality. There are a number of
>> advantages to this - the owner thinks he is getting better gas
>> mileage, the car is lasting longer, maintenance intervals come sooner
>> and replacement of the vehicle will come earlier if the decision is
>> based on the odometer. That said, it seems like the odometers have
>> become more accurate over the last 10 - 15 years.
>>
>> As you point out, tire size can throw off the odometer no matter how
>> well it was calibrated. Even tire wear and inflation will have minor
>> effects. Also, different brands/models of tires can vary slightly in
>> size, even if they have the same size designation. Add in a
>> reasonable production tolerance and a desire to error on the high side
>> and you can have perhaps a +4% error even though the manufacturer made
>> a good faith effort to deliver an accurate instrument.
>>
>> That said, if the manufacturer can be shown to have intentionally
>> delivered a significantly miscalibrated odometer, it might be cause
>> for legal action to recover loses associated with excess vehicle
>> depreciation. To win this, I think they should have to show that the
>> manufacturer in question was significantly worse than comparable cars
>> in this regard since the value of a used vehicle is compared to others
>> on the market. The manufacturer could argue that the odometer
>> measures "odometer miles" which are comparable with other used
>> vehicles within the make if not between makes. He could even argue
>> that, if his make is worse than other in this regard, that the
>> over-optimistic odometer reading has given his brand a reputation for
>> quality that compensates for the excess mileage.
>>
>> Do the papers provided by the court mention any specific level of
>> inaccuracy? If they can't show that the cars average at least +4%
>> with original tires, the case is bogus IMO.
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