odometer class action suit
#16
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: odometer class action suit
On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 14:43:51 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
wrote:
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Sat, 03 Mar 2007 15:49:22 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Dave Kelsen wrote:
>>>> On 3/3/2007 7:09 AM L Alpert spake these words of knowledge:
>>>>
>>>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:00:33 -0800, jim beam
>>>>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> rick++ wrote:
>>>>>>>> Radio says Honda settled, but I didnt see the exact terms.
>>>>>>>> I received a letter in Dec saying that I was a member of this
>>>>>>>> suit. The proposed settlement was that Honda would pay for
>>>>>>>> repairs inccurred up to 38K miles instead of 36K due to
>>>>>>>> inaccuracies
>>>>>>>> in odometers. Plus leasees would have 2K mileage overchanges
>>>>>>>> refunded.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I do not know if 5% odometer inaccuracies are consider
>>>>>>>> engineering norm or rather sloppy by current standards.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> domestics only have to be 90% accurate. that's /twice/ as sloppy
>>>>>>> as you're alleging there's a problem with. a lawsuit for 5%
>>>>>>> between miles 36k & 38k??? that's utter bull.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't know - not all together bad. There has long been a
>>>>>> practice to target the odo to be 5% on the high side.
>>>>>> Manufacturers are now put on notice that they will be accountable
>>>>>> for the full mileage as promised.
>>>>>
>>>>> While we all get an extra 5% (that's1800 miles on a 36K warranty),
>>>>> the law firm that took on this class action got about (from what I
>>>>> read) 9 million bucks. Who's best interests were served?
>>>>
>>>> Is this a trick question? Given your numbers the easy answer is
>>>> Honda owners with less than 37800 miles on the clock, and the law
>>>> firm. Were you thinking this was some sort of either/or proposition?
>>>
>>> I'd bet that the lawyers will take in more than Honda will render in
>>> added warranty service. Now, if they extended the 36 months time
>>> frame by 1.8 months, I'm sure that would have helped much more <sic>.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> RFT!!!
>>>> Dave Kelsen
>>
>> Other winners: Lease holders who had to pay for excess mileage when
>> they turned in their cars. Also everyone who buys a new Honda (or
>> other brand as they are all taking note) who will get a car with an
>> accurate odometer and won't have to sue to get the full warranty/lease
>> term for which they paid. Is that worth maybe $10 per car on the
>> average? That would be about $1.6 Billion for consumers over the next
>> ten years. The lawyer's share comes to 0.6%, paid for by Honda.
>> You're welcome.
>
>I'd be willing to bet that 9MM in revenue for the law firm will be much
>higher to the corporate percentage than the $10 is to any one consumer.
And that would be relevant... how?
This is the point of class action lawsuits. A company can make
significant money ripping off thousands or millions of consumers for a
few bucks each. No one instance of rip-off would justify legal action
(try to find a lawyer who will sue for $1000 and charge less than
$1000 for his work.) But collectively, the consumers can sue and the
total damages make it worthwhile for a law firm to take the case.
This is a great example of the free market at work. A law firm sees
a profit opportunity in helping organize consumers into a body, a
corporation if you will, to recover money which is rightfully owed to
them. If he is correct in his judgment that the case can be won and
he conducts it well enough to win it (or to get the corporation to
settle) he will make a profit. If he miss-judges the merit of the
suit, or he bungles the execution, he may lose his substantial
investment.
Businesses do not avoid cheating people out of the goodness of their
corporate hearts. They avoid it when they perceive that it is in
their financial best interest not to cheat the consumer. Class action
law suits are one thing that keeps them honest. Small claims court is
another. Businesses would like to eliminate both and run their subtle
PR campaigns to disparage lawyers who do class action suits. Don't be
duped.
wrote:
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Sat, 03 Mar 2007 15:49:22 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Dave Kelsen wrote:
>>>> On 3/3/2007 7:09 AM L Alpert spake these words of knowledge:
>>>>
>>>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:00:33 -0800, jim beam
>>>>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> rick++ wrote:
>>>>>>>> Radio says Honda settled, but I didnt see the exact terms.
>>>>>>>> I received a letter in Dec saying that I was a member of this
>>>>>>>> suit. The proposed settlement was that Honda would pay for
>>>>>>>> repairs inccurred up to 38K miles instead of 36K due to
>>>>>>>> inaccuracies
>>>>>>>> in odometers. Plus leasees would have 2K mileage overchanges
>>>>>>>> refunded.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I do not know if 5% odometer inaccuracies are consider
>>>>>>>> engineering norm or rather sloppy by current standards.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> domestics only have to be 90% accurate. that's /twice/ as sloppy
>>>>>>> as you're alleging there's a problem with. a lawsuit for 5%
>>>>>>> between miles 36k & 38k??? that's utter bull.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I don't know - not all together bad. There has long been a
>>>>>> practice to target the odo to be 5% on the high side.
>>>>>> Manufacturers are now put on notice that they will be accountable
>>>>>> for the full mileage as promised.
>>>>>
>>>>> While we all get an extra 5% (that's1800 miles on a 36K warranty),
>>>>> the law firm that took on this class action got about (from what I
>>>>> read) 9 million bucks. Who's best interests were served?
>>>>
>>>> Is this a trick question? Given your numbers the easy answer is
>>>> Honda owners with less than 37800 miles on the clock, and the law
>>>> firm. Were you thinking this was some sort of either/or proposition?
>>>
>>> I'd bet that the lawyers will take in more than Honda will render in
>>> added warranty service. Now, if they extended the 36 months time
>>> frame by 1.8 months, I'm sure that would have helped much more <sic>.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> RFT!!!
>>>> Dave Kelsen
>>
>> Other winners: Lease holders who had to pay for excess mileage when
>> they turned in their cars. Also everyone who buys a new Honda (or
>> other brand as they are all taking note) who will get a car with an
>> accurate odometer and won't have to sue to get the full warranty/lease
>> term for which they paid. Is that worth maybe $10 per car on the
>> average? That would be about $1.6 Billion for consumers over the next
>> ten years. The lawyer's share comes to 0.6%, paid for by Honda.
>> You're welcome.
>
>I'd be willing to bet that 9MM in revenue for the law firm will be much
>higher to the corporate percentage than the $10 is to any one consumer.
And that would be relevant... how?
This is the point of class action lawsuits. A company can make
significant money ripping off thousands or millions of consumers for a
few bucks each. No one instance of rip-off would justify legal action
(try to find a lawyer who will sue for $1000 and charge less than
$1000 for his work.) But collectively, the consumers can sue and the
total damages make it worthwhile for a law firm to take the case.
This is a great example of the free market at work. A law firm sees
a profit opportunity in helping organize consumers into a body, a
corporation if you will, to recover money which is rightfully owed to
them. If he is correct in his judgment that the case can be won and
he conducts it well enough to win it (or to get the corporation to
settle) he will make a profit. If he miss-judges the merit of the
suit, or he bungles the execution, he may lose his substantial
investment.
Businesses do not avoid cheating people out of the goodness of their
corporate hearts. They avoid it when they perceive that it is in
their financial best interest not to cheat the consumer. Class action
law suits are one thing that keeps them honest. Small claims court is
another. Businesses would like to eliminate both and run their subtle
PR campaigns to disparage lawyers who do class action suits. Don't be
duped.
#17
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: odometer class action suit
Gordon McGrew wrote:
> On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 14:43:51 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>> On Sat, 03 Mar 2007 15:49:22 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dave Kelsen wrote:
>>>>> On 3/3/2007 7:09 AM L Alpert spake these words of knowledge:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>>>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:00:33 -0800, jim beam
>>>>>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> rick++ wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Radio says Honda settled, but I didnt see the exact terms.
>>>>>>>>> I received a letter in Dec saying that I was a member of this
>>>>>>>>> suit. The proposed settlement was that Honda would pay for
>>>>>>>>> repairs inccurred up to 38K miles instead of 36K due to
>>>>>>>>> inaccuracies
>>>>>>>>> in odometers. Plus leasees would have 2K mileage overchanges
>>>>>>>>> refunded.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I do not know if 5% odometer inaccuracies are consider
>>>>>>>>> engineering norm or rather sloppy by current standards.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> domestics only have to be 90% accurate. that's /twice/ as sloppy
>>>>>>>> as you're alleging there's a problem with. a lawsuit for 5%
>>>>>>>> between miles 36k & 38k??? that's utter bull.
>>>>>>> I don't know - not all together bad. There has long been a
>>>>>>> practice to target the odo to be 5% on the high side.
>>>>>>> Manufacturers are now put on notice that they will be accountable
>>>>>>> for the full mileage as promised.
>>>>>> While we all get an extra 5% (that's1800 miles on a 36K warranty),
>>>>>> the law firm that took on this class action got about (from what I
>>>>>> read) 9 million bucks. Who's best interests were served?
>>>>> Is this a trick question? Given your numbers the easy answer is
>>>>> Honda owners with less than 37800 miles on the clock, and the law
>>>>> firm. Were you thinking this was some sort of either/or proposition?
>>>> I'd bet that the lawyers will take in more than Honda will render in
>>>> added warranty service. Now, if they extended the 36 months time
>>>> frame by 1.8 months, I'm sure that would have helped much more <sic>.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> RFT!!!
>>>>> Dave Kelsen
>>> Other winners: Lease holders who had to pay for excess mileage when
>>> they turned in their cars. Also everyone who buys a new Honda (or
>>> other brand as they are all taking note) who will get a car with an
>>> accurate odometer and won't have to sue to get the full warranty/lease
>>> term for which they paid. Is that worth maybe $10 per car on the
>>> average? That would be about $1.6 Billion for consumers over the next
>>> ten years. The lawyer's share comes to 0.6%, paid for by Honda.
>>> You're welcome.
>> I'd be willing to bet that 9MM in revenue for the law firm will be much
>> higher to the corporate percentage than the $10 is to any one consumer.
>
> And that would be relevant... how?
>
> This is the point of class action lawsuits. A company can make
> significant money ripping off thousands or millions of consumers for a
> few bucks each.
<snip remaining drivel>
"rip off"??? dude, are you out of your freakin' mind? you're talking
about the difference between a 5% and 10% inaccuracy, which is within
the limits of those requited by the d.o.t. and certainly less than that
of other manufacturers. tire pressure alone can account for more of a
problem. and the economic impact is what exactly? and since there's no
technical grounds for your position, do you instead have evidence of
fraud instead? were honda subpoenaed for corporate memos directing
their engineers to deliberately fudge instrumentation? no?
if you want to shill for domestic manufacturers, declare that. don't
pose as "an outraged member of the public".
> On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 14:43:51 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>> On Sat, 03 Mar 2007 15:49:22 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> Dave Kelsen wrote:
>>>>> On 3/3/2007 7:09 AM L Alpert spake these words of knowledge:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>>>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:00:33 -0800, jim beam
>>>>>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> rick++ wrote:
>>>>>>>>> Radio says Honda settled, but I didnt see the exact terms.
>>>>>>>>> I received a letter in Dec saying that I was a member of this
>>>>>>>>> suit. The proposed settlement was that Honda would pay for
>>>>>>>>> repairs inccurred up to 38K miles instead of 36K due to
>>>>>>>>> inaccuracies
>>>>>>>>> in odometers. Plus leasees would have 2K mileage overchanges
>>>>>>>>> refunded.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I do not know if 5% odometer inaccuracies are consider
>>>>>>>>> engineering norm or rather sloppy by current standards.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> domestics only have to be 90% accurate. that's /twice/ as sloppy
>>>>>>>> as you're alleging there's a problem with. a lawsuit for 5%
>>>>>>>> between miles 36k & 38k??? that's utter bull.
>>>>>>> I don't know - not all together bad. There has long been a
>>>>>>> practice to target the odo to be 5% on the high side.
>>>>>>> Manufacturers are now put on notice that they will be accountable
>>>>>>> for the full mileage as promised.
>>>>>> While we all get an extra 5% (that's1800 miles on a 36K warranty),
>>>>>> the law firm that took on this class action got about (from what I
>>>>>> read) 9 million bucks. Who's best interests were served?
>>>>> Is this a trick question? Given your numbers the easy answer is
>>>>> Honda owners with less than 37800 miles on the clock, and the law
>>>>> firm. Were you thinking this was some sort of either/or proposition?
>>>> I'd bet that the lawyers will take in more than Honda will render in
>>>> added warranty service. Now, if they extended the 36 months time
>>>> frame by 1.8 months, I'm sure that would have helped much more <sic>.
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> RFT!!!
>>>>> Dave Kelsen
>>> Other winners: Lease holders who had to pay for excess mileage when
>>> they turned in their cars. Also everyone who buys a new Honda (or
>>> other brand as they are all taking note) who will get a car with an
>>> accurate odometer and won't have to sue to get the full warranty/lease
>>> term for which they paid. Is that worth maybe $10 per car on the
>>> average? That would be about $1.6 Billion for consumers over the next
>>> ten years. The lawyer's share comes to 0.6%, paid for by Honda.
>>> You're welcome.
>> I'd be willing to bet that 9MM in revenue for the law firm will be much
>> higher to the corporate percentage than the $10 is to any one consumer.
>
> And that would be relevant... how?
>
> This is the point of class action lawsuits. A company can make
> significant money ripping off thousands or millions of consumers for a
> few bucks each.
<snip remaining drivel>
"rip off"??? dude, are you out of your freakin' mind? you're talking
about the difference between a 5% and 10% inaccuracy, which is within
the limits of those requited by the d.o.t. and certainly less than that
of other manufacturers. tire pressure alone can account for more of a
problem. and the economic impact is what exactly? and since there's no
technical grounds for your position, do you instead have evidence of
fraud instead? were honda subpoenaed for corporate memos directing
their engineers to deliberately fudge instrumentation? no?
if you want to shill for domestic manufacturers, declare that. don't
pose as "an outraged member of the public".
#18
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: odometer class action suit
On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 09:20:50 -0800, jim beam wrote:
> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 14:43:51 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 03 Mar 2007 15:49:22 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Dave Kelsen wrote:
>>>>>> On 3/3/2007 7:09 AM L Alpert spake these words of knowledge:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:00:33 -0800, jim beam
>>>>>>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> rick++ wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Radio says Honda settled, but I didnt see the exact terms.
>>>>>>>>>> I received a letter in Dec saying that I was a member of this
>>>>>>>>>> suit. The proposed settlement was that Honda would pay for
>>>>>>>>>> repairs inccurred up to 38K miles instead of 36K due to
>>>>>>>>>> inaccuracies
>>>>>>>>>> in odometers. Plus leasees would have 2K mileage overchanges
>>>>>>>>>> refunded.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I do not know if 5% odometer inaccuracies are consider
>>>>>>>>>> engineering norm or rather sloppy by current standards.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> domestics only have to be 90% accurate. that's /twice/ as sloppy
>>>>>>>>> as you're alleging there's a problem with. a lawsuit for 5%
>>>>>>>>> between miles 36k & 38k??? that's utter bull.
>>>>>>>> I don't know - not all together bad. There has long been a
>>>>>>>> practice to target the odo to be 5% on the high side.
>>>>>>>> Manufacturers are now put on notice that they will be accountable
>>>>>>>> for the full mileage as promised.
>>>>>>> While we all get an extra 5% (that's1800 miles on a 36K warranty),
>>>>>>> the law firm that took on this class action got about (from what I
>>>>>>> read) 9 million bucks. Who's best interests were served?
>>>>>> Is this a trick question? Given your numbers the easy answer is
>>>>>> Honda owners with less than 37800 miles on the clock, and the law
>>>>>> firm. Were you thinking this was some sort of either/or proposition?
>>>>> I'd bet that the lawyers will take in more than Honda will render in
>>>>> added warranty service. Now, if they extended the 36 months time
>>>>> frame by 1.8 months, I'm sure that would have helped much more <sic>.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> RFT!!!
>>>>>> Dave Kelsen
>>>> Other winners: Lease holders who had to pay for excess mileage when
>>>> they turned in their cars. Also everyone who buys a new Honda (or
>>>> other brand as they are all taking note) who will get a car with an
>>>> accurate odometer and won't have to sue to get the full warranty/lease
>>>> term for which they paid. Is that worth maybe $10 per car on the
>>>> average? That would be about $1.6 Billion for consumers over the next
>>>> ten years. The lawyer's share comes to 0.6%, paid for by Honda.
>>>> You're welcome.
>>> I'd be willing to bet that 9MM in revenue for the law firm will be much
>>> higher to the corporate percentage than the $10 is to any one consumer.
>>
>> And that would be relevant... how?
>>
>> This is the point of class action lawsuits. A company can make
>> significant money ripping off thousands or millions of consumers for a
>> few bucks each.
> <snip remaining drivel>
>
> "rip off"??? dude, are you out of your freakin' mind? you're talking
> about the difference between a 5% and 10% inaccuracy, which is within
> the limits of those requited by the d.o.t. and certainly less than that
> of other manufacturers. tire pressure alone can account for more of a
> problem. and the economic impact is what exactly? and since there's no
> technical grounds for your position, do you instead have evidence of
> fraud instead? were honda subpoenaed for corporate memos directing
> their engineers to deliberately fudge instrumentation? no?
>
> if you want to shill for domestic manufacturers, declare that. don't
> pose as "an outraged member of the public".
All he did was post the rationale behind class-action lawsuits, and the
justification for the law firms making money off of them.
He did not say that Honda ripped anyone off, nor was Honda found guilty of
such.
In lawsuits, perception is reality. This was a cheap price to pay, for
Honda, from a PR point of view.
> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 14:43:51 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 03 Mar 2007 15:49:22 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Dave Kelsen wrote:
>>>>>> On 3/3/2007 7:09 AM L Alpert spake these words of knowledge:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:00:33 -0800, jim beam
>>>>>>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> rick++ wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Radio says Honda settled, but I didnt see the exact terms.
>>>>>>>>>> I received a letter in Dec saying that I was a member of this
>>>>>>>>>> suit. The proposed settlement was that Honda would pay for
>>>>>>>>>> repairs inccurred up to 38K miles instead of 36K due to
>>>>>>>>>> inaccuracies
>>>>>>>>>> in odometers. Plus leasees would have 2K mileage overchanges
>>>>>>>>>> refunded.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I do not know if 5% odometer inaccuracies are consider
>>>>>>>>>> engineering norm or rather sloppy by current standards.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> domestics only have to be 90% accurate. that's /twice/ as sloppy
>>>>>>>>> as you're alleging there's a problem with. a lawsuit for 5%
>>>>>>>>> between miles 36k & 38k??? that's utter bull.
>>>>>>>> I don't know - not all together bad. There has long been a
>>>>>>>> practice to target the odo to be 5% on the high side.
>>>>>>>> Manufacturers are now put on notice that they will be accountable
>>>>>>>> for the full mileage as promised.
>>>>>>> While we all get an extra 5% (that's1800 miles on a 36K warranty),
>>>>>>> the law firm that took on this class action got about (from what I
>>>>>>> read) 9 million bucks. Who's best interests were served?
>>>>>> Is this a trick question? Given your numbers the easy answer is
>>>>>> Honda owners with less than 37800 miles on the clock, and the law
>>>>>> firm. Were you thinking this was some sort of either/or proposition?
>>>>> I'd bet that the lawyers will take in more than Honda will render in
>>>>> added warranty service. Now, if they extended the 36 months time
>>>>> frame by 1.8 months, I'm sure that would have helped much more <sic>.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> RFT!!!
>>>>>> Dave Kelsen
>>>> Other winners: Lease holders who had to pay for excess mileage when
>>>> they turned in their cars. Also everyone who buys a new Honda (or
>>>> other brand as they are all taking note) who will get a car with an
>>>> accurate odometer and won't have to sue to get the full warranty/lease
>>>> term for which they paid. Is that worth maybe $10 per car on the
>>>> average? That would be about $1.6 Billion for consumers over the next
>>>> ten years. The lawyer's share comes to 0.6%, paid for by Honda.
>>>> You're welcome.
>>> I'd be willing to bet that 9MM in revenue for the law firm will be much
>>> higher to the corporate percentage than the $10 is to any one consumer.
>>
>> And that would be relevant... how?
>>
>> This is the point of class action lawsuits. A company can make
>> significant money ripping off thousands or millions of consumers for a
>> few bucks each.
> <snip remaining drivel>
>
> "rip off"??? dude, are you out of your freakin' mind? you're talking
> about the difference between a 5% and 10% inaccuracy, which is within
> the limits of those requited by the d.o.t. and certainly less than that
> of other manufacturers. tire pressure alone can account for more of a
> problem. and the economic impact is what exactly? and since there's no
> technical grounds for your position, do you instead have evidence of
> fraud instead? were honda subpoenaed for corporate memos directing
> their engineers to deliberately fudge instrumentation? no?
>
> if you want to shill for domestic manufacturers, declare that. don't
> pose as "an outraged member of the public".
All he did was post the rationale behind class-action lawsuits, and the
justification for the law firms making money off of them.
He did not say that Honda ripped anyone off, nor was Honda found guilty of
such.
In lawsuits, perception is reality. This was a cheap price to pay, for
Honda, from a PR point of view.
#19
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: odometer class action suit
On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 09:20:50 -0800, jim beam
<spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 14:43:51 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 03 Mar 2007 15:49:22 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Dave Kelsen wrote:
>>>>>> On 3/3/2007 7:09 AM L Alpert spake these words of knowledge:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:00:33 -0800, jim beam
>>>>>>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> rick++ wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Radio says Honda settled, but I didnt see the exact terms.
>>>>>>>>>> I received a letter in Dec saying that I was a member of this
>>>>>>>>>> suit. The proposed settlement was that Honda would pay for
>>>>>>>>>> repairs inccurred up to 38K miles instead of 36K due to
>>>>>>>>>> inaccuracies
>>>>>>>>>> in odometers. Plus leasees would have 2K mileage overchanges
>>>>>>>>>> refunded.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I do not know if 5% odometer inaccuracies are consider
>>>>>>>>>> engineering norm or rather sloppy by current standards.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> domestics only have to be 90% accurate. that's /twice/ as sloppy
>>>>>>>>> as you're alleging there's a problem with. a lawsuit for 5%
>>>>>>>>> between miles 36k & 38k??? that's utter bull.
>>>>>>>> I don't know - not all together bad. There has long been a
>>>>>>>> practice to target the odo to be 5% on the high side.
>>>>>>>> Manufacturers are now put on notice that they will be accountable
>>>>>>>> for the full mileage as promised.
>>>>>>> While we all get an extra 5% (that's1800 miles on a 36K warranty),
>>>>>>> the law firm that took on this class action got about (from what I
>>>>>>> read) 9 million bucks. Who's best interests were served?
>>>>>> Is this a trick question? Given your numbers the easy answer is
>>>>>> Honda owners with less than 37800 miles on the clock, and the law
>>>>>> firm. Were you thinking this was some sort of either/or proposition?
>>>>> I'd bet that the lawyers will take in more than Honda will render in
>>>>> added warranty service. Now, if they extended the 36 months time
>>>>> frame by 1.8 months, I'm sure that would have helped much more <sic>.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> RFT!!!
>>>>>> Dave Kelsen
>>>> Other winners: Lease holders who had to pay for excess mileage when
>>>> they turned in their cars. Also everyone who buys a new Honda (or
>>>> other brand as they are all taking note) who will get a car with an
>>>> accurate odometer and won't have to sue to get the full warranty/lease
>>>> term for which they paid. Is that worth maybe $10 per car on the
>>>> average? That would be about $1.6 Billion for consumers over the next
>>>> ten years. The lawyer's share comes to 0.6%, paid for by Honda.
>>>> You're welcome.
>>> I'd be willing to bet that 9MM in revenue for the law firm will be much
>>> higher to the corporate percentage than the $10 is to any one consumer.
>>
>> And that would be relevant... how?
>>
>> This is the point of class action lawsuits. A company can make
>> significant money ripping off thousands or millions of consumers for a
>> few bucks each.
><snip remaining drivel>
>
>"rip off"??? dude, are you out of your freakin' mind? you're talking
>about the difference between a 5% and 10% inaccuracy, which is within
>the limits of those requited by the d.o.t. and certainly less than that
>of other manufacturers. tire pressure alone can account for more of a
>problem. and the economic impact is what exactly? and since there's no
>technical grounds for your position, do you instead have evidence of
>fraud instead? were honda subpoenaed for corporate memos directing
>their engineers to deliberately fudge instrumentation? no?
>
>if you want to shill for domestic manufacturers, declare that. don't
>pose as "an outraged member of the public".
Don't want to shill for anybody, just want an accurate odometer. Yes,
there are external factors, like tires, that can affect accuracy but
that is separate from the fact that odometers almost universally
overstate mileage. I assume that is the case here or there wouldn't
be a case.
I have no ideas which manufacturers might be better or worse in this
regard.
<spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>Gordon McGrew wrote:
>> On Sun, 04 Mar 2007 14:43:51 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>> On Sat, 03 Mar 2007 15:49:22 GMT, "L Alpert" <alpertl@xxgmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Dave Kelsen wrote:
>>>>>> On 3/3/2007 7:09 AM L Alpert spake these words of knowledge:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Gordon McGrew wrote:
>>>>>>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2007 08:00:33 -0800, jim beam
>>>>>>>> <spamvortex@bad.example.net> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> rick++ wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> Radio says Honda settled, but I didnt see the exact terms.
>>>>>>>>>> I received a letter in Dec saying that I was a member of this
>>>>>>>>>> suit. The proposed settlement was that Honda would pay for
>>>>>>>>>> repairs inccurred up to 38K miles instead of 36K due to
>>>>>>>>>> inaccuracies
>>>>>>>>>> in odometers. Plus leasees would have 2K mileage overchanges
>>>>>>>>>> refunded.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I do not know if 5% odometer inaccuracies are consider
>>>>>>>>>> engineering norm or rather sloppy by current standards.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> domestics only have to be 90% accurate. that's /twice/ as sloppy
>>>>>>>>> as you're alleging there's a problem with. a lawsuit for 5%
>>>>>>>>> between miles 36k & 38k??? that's utter bull.
>>>>>>>> I don't know - not all together bad. There has long been a
>>>>>>>> practice to target the odo to be 5% on the high side.
>>>>>>>> Manufacturers are now put on notice that they will be accountable
>>>>>>>> for the full mileage as promised.
>>>>>>> While we all get an extra 5% (that's1800 miles on a 36K warranty),
>>>>>>> the law firm that took on this class action got about (from what I
>>>>>>> read) 9 million bucks. Who's best interests were served?
>>>>>> Is this a trick question? Given your numbers the easy answer is
>>>>>> Honda owners with less than 37800 miles on the clock, and the law
>>>>>> firm. Were you thinking this was some sort of either/or proposition?
>>>>> I'd bet that the lawyers will take in more than Honda will render in
>>>>> added warranty service. Now, if they extended the 36 months time
>>>>> frame by 1.8 months, I'm sure that would have helped much more <sic>.
>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> RFT!!!
>>>>>> Dave Kelsen
>>>> Other winners: Lease holders who had to pay for excess mileage when
>>>> they turned in their cars. Also everyone who buys a new Honda (or
>>>> other brand as they are all taking note) who will get a car with an
>>>> accurate odometer and won't have to sue to get the full warranty/lease
>>>> term for which they paid. Is that worth maybe $10 per car on the
>>>> average? That would be about $1.6 Billion for consumers over the next
>>>> ten years. The lawyer's share comes to 0.6%, paid for by Honda.
>>>> You're welcome.
>>> I'd be willing to bet that 9MM in revenue for the law firm will be much
>>> higher to the corporate percentage than the $10 is to any one consumer.
>>
>> And that would be relevant... how?
>>
>> This is the point of class action lawsuits. A company can make
>> significant money ripping off thousands or millions of consumers for a
>> few bucks each.
><snip remaining drivel>
>
>"rip off"??? dude, are you out of your freakin' mind? you're talking
>about the difference between a 5% and 10% inaccuracy, which is within
>the limits of those requited by the d.o.t. and certainly less than that
>of other manufacturers. tire pressure alone can account for more of a
>problem. and the economic impact is what exactly? and since there's no
>technical grounds for your position, do you instead have evidence of
>fraud instead? were honda subpoenaed for corporate memos directing
>their engineers to deliberately fudge instrumentation? no?
>
>if you want to shill for domestic manufacturers, declare that. don't
>pose as "an outraged member of the public".
Don't want to shill for anybody, just want an accurate odometer. Yes,
there are external factors, like tires, that can affect accuracy but
that is separate from the fact that odometers almost universally
overstate mileage. I assume that is the case here or there wouldn't
be a case.
I have no ideas which manufacturers might be better or worse in this
regard.
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01-19-2007 12:45 AM
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