Grumpy AuContraire

Tegger wrote:
> Grumpy AuContraire <GrumpyOne@GrumpyvilleNOT.com> wrote in
> news:xPWdna6j1_8ocPTWnZ2dnUVZ_judnZ2d@giganews.com :
>
>
>> Simply put, a substantial number of people behind the wheel just don't
>> belong there...
>>
>
>
> Except that four of the reported five deaths involved a highly-trained
> policeman.


Yeah, but we all know that cops are not selected as the best and
brightest.

OTOH, if they got smacked by the Toyota, nothin's poifect!

JT

Mike Hunter

You expect us to believe you read the Journal?


"Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message
news:Xns9D15BC100395Etegger@208.90.168.18...
> "Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com> wrote in
> news:4b6b4732$0$31477$ce5e7886
> @news-radius.ptd.net:
>
>> Who told you that, your Toyota dealer
>
>
> The Wall Street Journal.
>
> Now answer the question, smiley.
>
>
> --
> Tegger
>

Mike Hunter

It's the fault of the Unions? I thought it was the fault of President
Bush

"Tegger" <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message
news:Xns9D15BE8602024tegger@208.90.168.18...
> "E. Meyer" <e.p.meyer@verizon.net> wrote in
> news:C7906C39.17000%e.p.meyer@verizon.net:
>
>> On 2/3/10 7:28 PM, in article
>> geWdnbQpzPojv_fWnZ2dnUVZ_rudnZ2d@giganews.com, "dbu''"
>> <nospam@nobama.com.invalid> wrote:
>>
>
>>>
>>> THIS has been wildly overblown. BUT....Toyota has been up to the
>>> challenge. They will have it fixed. The Toyota vehicles will be
>>> better than the space shuttle after all is said and done.
>>
>> I remember a month or two after the overturning Ford Explorer fiasco
>> hit the press there was suddenly an epidemic of SUVs of all makes and
>> models flipping over on their sides at every intersection. Before all
>> the publicity, I don't remember ever seeing an overturned SUV.
>> Strange things happen when people start thinking they can cash in.
>>
>>
>
>
> Let's look at some facts:
> - 2,300,000 vehicles operated daily without incident.
> - Two fatal incidents, five deaths (four of them in one incident).
> - Twelve actual documented cases of stuck gas pedals.
> - 0.00052% rate of incidence for stuck gas pedals.
> - The NHTSA has currently 40 "defect" investigations going on. Three
> involve Toyota. 37 involve other automakers.
> - Ford accounts for 28% of all SUA incidents, but not a peep is heard
> about
> that.
>
> I'm reading the paper this afternoon, and it appears there may be just a
> tad more to this SUA issue than actual malfunctions...
>
> As is well known by now, the Obama administration is very much beholden to
> trade unions. Obama even admitted in an interview during the election
> campaign that he owes a lot to the unions and would do whatever they
> wanted.
>
> Well, Toyota just closed a large and unionized plant in California. It
> seems the UAW is now exercised about that. Plus they're looking for sales
> for GM and Chrysler, which are now partly union-owned and are losing
> market
> share.
>
> What better way to get what they want than to nudge the Obamistas into
> slagging those successful little yellow (non-union) foreigners? You think
> LaHood is his own man here? Nope.
>
>
> --
> Tegger
>

jim beam

On 02/04/2010 07:51 AM, Mike Hunter wrote:
> According to todays Tribune Newspapers, the Chairman of the House Oversight
> Committee is stating Toyota will be asked about runaways problems with the
> Tacoma truck.
>
> The NHTSA has received over 100 complaints about sudden uncontrolled
> accelerations problem on the Tacoma, their truck that does NOT use the same
> pedal assembly as the other recalled Toyotas.
>
> The article also refers to Japans Transport Ministry releasing that their
> have been numerous complaints about "braking problems" with NEW generation
> Prius. Toyota admits they are addressing braking problems in previous
> Prius models but they are "unaware" of problems in the NEW generation Prius.
>
> The ever growing issue over sudden uncontrolled acceleration in most every
> type of Toyota vehicle is having a sensitizing effect on consumers around
> the world and Toyotas confusing responses are not helping the situation.
> Curious ah?

dude, at this stage it's mob hysteria. fact is, frod have defects that
have killed thousands of americans. but rather than spend money on
proper design and execution, they instead show up in d.c. with lobbyists
and spend hundreds of millions of dollars making "contributions" to
[which is MUCH cheaper b.t.w.] our representatives so they can stay off
the political/legal radar screen.

toyota, naively, just make great cars under the false impression that
they're selling into a meritocracy that plays fair. and they are so
wrong. but toyota, inadvertently, are shining the harsh light of
reality on the utter debasement of american values with this bullshit
from politicians that are prepared to take the dollar and turn a blind
eye to manslaughter rather than stand up for the lives and values of
citizens that elected them. it's an utter disgrace.



>
> "Tegger"<invalid@invalid.inv> wrote in message
> news:Xns9D148F020FD93tegger@208.90.168.18...
>> jim beam<me@privacy.net> wrote in
>> news:SYadnYVv5qcHDvTWnZ2dnUVZ_sWdnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t:
>>
>>> http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100203...tocompanyrecal
>>> ltoyota_20100203001517
>>>
>>> "US chides Toyota over recall"
>>>
>>> this is back-door protectionist political bullshit.
>>>
>>> fact: ford, bmw, and others have all had throttle sensor problems, and
>>> in much greater numbers than toyota.
>>>
>>> fact: the media has all but ignored it.
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> Currently Toyota accounts for 41% of all unintended acceleration
>> incidents.
>> Ford accounts for 28%. Both Toyota and Ford have about a 16% market share
>> apiece.
>>
>> GM and Chrysler have UA numbers smaller than their market shares. I don't
>> know the exact number.
>>
>>
>> --
>> Tegger
>>
>
>

jim beam

On 02/04/2010 03:43 PM, Tegger wrote:
> "E. Meyer"<e.p.meyer@verizon.net> wrote in
> news:C7906C39.17000%e.p.meyer@verizon.net:
>
>> On 2/3/10 7:28 PM, in article
>> geWdnbQpzPojv_fWnZ2dnUVZ_rudnZ2d@giganews.com, "dbu''"
>> <nospam@nobama.com.invalid> wrote:
>>
>
>>>
>>> THIS has been wildly overblown. BUT....Toyota has been up to the
>>> challenge. They will have it fixed. The Toyota vehicles will be
>>> better than the space shuttle after all is said and done.
>>
>> I remember a month or two after the overturning Ford Explorer fiasco
>> hit the press there was suddenly an epidemic of SUVs of all makes and
>> models flipping over on their sides at every intersection. Before all
>> the publicity, I don't remember ever seeing an overturned SUV.
>> Strange things happen when people start thinking they can cash in.
>>
>>
>
>
> Let's look at some facts:
> - 2,300,000 vehicles operated daily without incident.
> - Two fatal incidents, five deaths (four of them in one incident).
> - Twelve actual documented cases of stuck gas pedals.
> - 0.00052% rate of incidence for stuck gas pedals.
> - The NHTSA has currently 40 "defect" investigations going on. Three
> involve Toyota. 37 involve other automakers.
> - Ford accounts for 28% of all SUA incidents, but not a peep is heard about
> that.
>
> I'm reading the paper this afternoon, and it appears there may be just a
> tad more to this SUA issue than actual malfunctions...
>
> As is well known by now, the Obama administration is very much beholden to
> trade unions. Obama even admitted in an interview during the election
> campaign that he owes a lot to the unions and would do whatever they
> wanted.
>
> Well, Toyota just closed a large and unionized plant in California. It
> seems the UAW is now exercised about that. Plus they're looking for sales
> for GM and Chrysler, which are now partly union-owned and are losing market
> share.
>
> What better way to get what they want than to nudge the Obamistas into
> slagging those successful little yellow (non-union) foreigners? You think
> LaHood is his own man here? Nope.
>
>

well said.

Jim Yanik

"E. Meyer" <e.p.meyer@verizon.net> wrote in
news:C7906C39.17000%e.p.meyer@verizon.net:

> On 2/3/10 7:28 PM, in article
> geWdnbQpzPojv_fWnZ2dnUVZ_rudnZ2d@giganews.com, "dbu''"
> <nospam@nobama.com.invalid> wrote:
>
>> In article <Xns9D14C85F6C360tegger@208.90.168.18>,
>> Tegger <invalid@invalid.inv> wrote:
>>
>>> "tww1491" <twaugh5@***.net> wrote in
>>> news:Fooan.26826$fu3.6796@newsfe12.iad:
>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> "jim beam" <me@privacy.net> wrote in message
>>>> news:SYadnYVv5qcHDvTWnZ2dnUVZ_sWdnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> if toyota needs to learn a lesson from this fiasco, it's that they
>>>>> need to show up in washington and hand over their lobbying cash
>>>>> like detroit does, not be politically naive and simply rely on
>>>>> selling superior product.
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> In the local paper a couple days ago, a 79 year old women crashed
>>>> into a veterinarian's office claiming that the gas pedal on her new
>>>> Toyota stuck. The dealer found nothing wrong with the car. With
>>>> that story in the paper were reports of drivers complaining to the
>>>> local Toyota dealer that they received speeding tickets because of
>>>> "stuck" pedals. And so it has begun. And yet much more to come.
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> Keep in mind that there have been exactly twelve (12) confirmed
>>> incidents of actual stuck gas pedals on Toyotas since October.
>>> Worldwide. Over 2.3 million vehicles.
>>>
>>> That's 0.00052%, in case anybody's counting.
>>
>> That is well within any reasonable sample of defects for the NASA
>> space program parts!!!
>>
>> THIS has been wildly overblown. BUT....Toyota has been up to the
>> challenge. They will have it fixed. The Toyota vehicles will be
>> better than the space shuttle after all is said and done.
>
> I remember a month or two after the overturning Ford Explorer fiasco
> hit the press there was suddenly an epidemic of SUVs of all makes and
> models flipping over on their sides at every intersection. Before all
> the publicity, I don't remember ever seeing an overturned SUV.
> Strange things happen when people start thinking they can cash in.
>
>

OTOH,it might be just that the media began NOTICING the SUV rollovers,and
reporting nationally on every one that happened,instead of just local
reporting.

Kinda like reaching critical mass.... ;-)

Now,I've been reading that the Obama administration's -reaction- to the
Toyota recall may be due to union influence,considering Toyota is NON-union
and a "foreign" automaker. (although it's cars have more domestic content
than many "American" vehicles,that may be made in Canada or Mexico.

On the Prius brake/cruise control problem,considering that car is a hybrid
electric(with integral computer control of throttle/braking),I can see
software bugs cropping up. Sometimes it takes a while to encounter a SW
bug,particularly under unusual conditions. Like what happens if a ROM's
data is corrupted;lose a byte here or there,in the wrong place,and you have
a potentially hazardous condition waiting to be discovered.There's all
sorts of reasons memory data could get corrupted,AFTER the car is shipped
and sold.
At least aircraft have redundant systems.


that's why I'm not so hot on drive-by-wire autos;SW glitches.


--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
localnet
dot com

jr92

On Feb 3, 10:17 am, jim beam <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
> http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100203...autocompanyrec...
>
> "US chides Toyota over recall"
>
> this is back-door protectionist political bullshit.




You mean, like the Japanese version of protectionism that, in 2008,
exported over 2 million vechicles to the US, while at the same time,
only allowing 12 thousand American nameplates to be imported
there??????


Or the type of protectionism that Japan displayed when they had their
own "cash for clunkers" program, but excluded the handful of American
nameplates that WERE sold there from the program???????


Sounds fair to me, I guess, if I were from Japan.




>
> fact: ford, bmw, and others have all had throttle sensor problems, and
> in much greater numbers than toyota.
>
> fact: the media has all but ignored it.


>

Amazing statement.

For over three decades, the media has lamblasted American autos for
everything from interior light bulbs burning out, to weather stripping
dry-rotting after 10 years. They hammered away repeatedly at the "lack
of American reliability until many, who did not check things out on
their own, began to believe them.


Now, the worm is beginning to turn, and there are those who believed
what the media said for thirty years, are accusing them of the same
things they did against American nameplates.


Maybe turn-a-bout IS fair play!





> here we are, hot on the heels of political dismay at the unconsidered
> consequences of their ridiculous "cash for clunkers" program benefiting
> manufacturers of fuel efficient cars, not domestic gas guzzlers, being
> subjected to politically motivated hysterical xenophobia.
>




Kinda funny how it took about 20 MILLION Toyota recalls over the past
3 or 4 years before it became politically motivated, or a "hysterical
xeonphobia."


Hell , a good chunk of the MILLIONS of recalls happened well before it
became "chic' to knock Toyota.


The sludging engines, or rusting supensions were known well before the
US government began ownership in GM or Chysler, so there was nothing
to be gained by the US pressuring Toyota into making recalls. There
goes the 'conflict of interest" argument.


And BTW, if you believe Toyota has NOT been spending bundles of money
lobbying Washington, then YOU are more naive than you claim Toyota is.




> fact: toyota sells better, more fuel efficient, safer, more reliable
> vehicles using american parts and american labor than domestics
> assembling their carp from the chinese componentry they import.
>


Really, you didn't make a single factual statement at all in this
paragrah.


Matter of fact, just the opposite of what you stated is actually true.






> if toyota needs to learn a lesson from this fiasco, it's that they need
> to show up in washington and hand over their lobbying cash like detroit
> does, not be politically naive and simply rely on selling superior product.

jr92

On Feb 3, 7:19 pm, "tww1491" <twau...@***.net> wrote:
> "jim beam" <m...@privacy.net> wrote in message
>
> news:SYadnYVv5qcHDvTWnZ2dnUVZ_sWdnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>
>
>
>
>
> >http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100203...autocompanyrec...
>
> > "US chides Toyota over recall"
>
> > this is back-door protectionist political bullshit.
>
> > fact: ford, bmw, and others have all had throttle sensor problems, and in
> > much greater numbers than toyota.
>
> > fact: the media has all but ignored it.
>
> > here we are, hot on the heels of political dismay at the unconsidered
> > consequences of their ridiculous "cash for clunkers" program benefiting
> > manufacturers of fuel efficient cars, not domestic gas guzzlers, being
> > subjected to politically motivated hysterical xenophobia.
>
> > fact: toyota sells better, more fuel efficient, safer, more reliable
> > vehicles using american parts and american labor than domestics assembling
> > their carp from the chinese componentry they import.
>
> > if toyota needs to learn a lesson from this fiasco, it's that they needto
> > show up in washington and hand over their lobbying cash like detroit does,
> > not be politically naive and simply rely on selling superior product.
>
> In the local paper a couple days ago, a 79 year old women crashed into a
> veterinarian's office claiming that the gas pedal on her new Toyota stuck..
> The dealer found nothing wrong with the car. With that story in the paper
> were reports of drivers complaining to the local Toyota dealer that they
> received speeding tickets because of "stuck" pedals. And so it has begun.
> And yet much more to come.- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -



That does not mean that Toyota does not have problems with sticking
accelerators.


Fact#1

Toyota is selling products in which sometimes, the accelerator sticks
open, creating a safety hazard.


Fact:#2

There are some people who will try to take advantage of the situation
for monetary gain.


Fact# 3

Fact number 2 does not mean Fact number 1 does not exist.

jr92

On Feb 4, 3:18 am, "Dave D" <dtdod...@acsalaska.net> wrote:
> "Hachiroku ????" <Tru...@e86.GTS> wrote in message
>
> newsan.2010.02.04.00.38.36.169486@e86.GTS...
>
>
>
>
>
> > On Wed, 03 Feb 2010 07:17:45 -0800, jim beam wrote:
>
> >>http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100203...autocompanyrec....
>
> >> "US chides Toyota over recall"
>
> >> this is back-door protectionist political bullshit.
>
> >> fact: ford, bmw, and others have all had throttle sensor problems, andin
> >> much greater numbers than toyota.
>
> >> fact: the media has all but ignored it.
>
> >> here we are, hot on the heels of political dismay at the unconsidered
> >> consequences of their ridiculous "cash for clunkers" program benefiting
> >> manufacturers of fuel efficient cars, not domestic gas guzzlers, being
> >> subjected to politically motivated hysterical xenophobia.
>
> >> fact: toyota sells better, more fuel efficient, safer, more reliable
> >> vehicles using american parts and american labor than domestics
> >> assembling
> >> their carp from the chinese componentry they import.
>
> >> if toyota needs to learn a lesson from this fiasco, it's that they need
> >> to
> >> show up in washington and hand over their lobbying cash like detroit
> >> does,
> >> not be politically naive and simply rely on selling superior product.
>
> > WOW! I AGREE WITH JIM BEAM!!! <thud!>
>
> > Well said. Add to that the public likes to see the Big Dog take a stumble.
> > If you want some real heartburn, watch how Brian Williams on NBC is going
> > after Toyota...er...full throttle.
>
> Wasn't Brian Williams part of the "Exploding Chevy Trucks Fiasco"? Oh, nohe
> wasn't. I remember now, that was Stone(d) Phillips...Too bad....
>


Almost forgot about the 'staged' event that was made for the sole
purpose of hurting GM truck sales.

Just another example of the extremes the media would go to in order to
slam American nameplates.

However, sticking accelerators, sludging engines and rusting
suspension parts on Toyotas made over the past 6 or 7 years are very
REAL!



> DaveD
>
>
>
> - Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -- Hide quoted text -
>
> - Show quoted text -

jim beam

On 02/04/2010 08:29 PM, Jim Yanik wrote:
> "E. Meyer"<e.p.meyer@verizon.net> wrote in
> news:C7906C39.17000%e.p.meyer@verizon.net:
>
>> On 2/3/10 7:28 PM, in article
>> geWdnbQpzPojv_fWnZ2dnUVZ_rudnZ2d@giganews.com, "dbu''"
>> <nospam@nobama.com.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> In article<Xns9D14C85F6C360tegger@208.90.168.18>,
>>> Tegger<invalid@invalid.inv> wrote:
>>>
>>>> "tww1491"<twaugh5@***.net> wrote in
>>>> news:Fooan.26826$fu3.6796@newsfe12.iad:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> "jim beam"<me@privacy.net> wrote in message
>>>>> news:SYadnYVv5qcHDvTWnZ2dnUVZ_sWdnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> if toyota needs to learn a lesson from this fiasco, it's that they
>>>>>> need to show up in washington and hand over their lobbying cash
>>>>>> like detroit does, not be politically naive and simply rely on
>>>>>> selling superior product.
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> In the local paper a couple days ago, a 79 year old women crashed
>>>>> into a veterinarian's office claiming that the gas pedal on her new
>>>>> Toyota stuck. The dealer found nothing wrong with the car. With
>>>>> that story in the paper were reports of drivers complaining to the
>>>>> local Toyota dealer that they received speeding tickets because of
>>>>> "stuck" pedals. And so it has begun. And yet much more to come.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Keep in mind that there have been exactly twelve (12) confirmed
>>>> incidents of actual stuck gas pedals on Toyotas since October.
>>>> Worldwide. Over 2.3 million vehicles.
>>>>
>>>> That's 0.00052%, in case anybody's counting.
>>>
>>> That is well within any reasonable sample of defects for the NASA
>>> space program parts!!!
>>>
>>> THIS has been wildly overblown. BUT....Toyota has been up to the
>>> challenge. They will have it fixed. The Toyota vehicles will be
>>> better than the space shuttle after all is said and done.
>>
>> I remember a month or two after the overturning Ford Explorer fiasco
>> hit the press there was suddenly an epidemic of SUVs of all makes and
>> models flipping over on their sides at every intersection. Before all
>> the publicity, I don't remember ever seeing an overturned SUV.
>> Strange things happen when people start thinking they can cash in.
>>
>>
>
> OTOH,it might be just that the media began NOTICING the SUV rollovers,and
> reporting nationally on every one that happened,instead of just local
> reporting.
>
> Kinda like reaching critical mass.... ;-)
>
> Now,I've been reading that the Obama administration's -reaction- to the
> Toyota recall may be due to union influence,considering Toyota is NON-union
> and a "foreign" automaker. (although it's cars have more domestic content
> than many "American" vehicles,that may be made in Canada or Mexico.
>
> On the Prius brake/cruise control problem,considering that car is a hybrid
> electric(with integral computer control of throttle/braking),I can see
> software bugs cropping up. Sometimes it takes a while to encounter a SW
> bug,particularly under unusual conditions. Like what happens if a ROM's
> data is corrupted;lose a byte here or there,in the wrong place,and you have
> a potentially hazardous condition waiting to be discovered.There's all
> sorts of reasons memory data could get corrupted,AFTER the car is shipped
> and sold.
> At least aircraft have redundant systems.
>
>
> that's why I'm not so hot on drive-by-wire autos;SW glitches.
>

well, i drove a prius extensively this past summer, and found it to be a
smooth, finely engineered vehicle - no glitches, flaws, or mistakes in
performance anywhere. responsive too. wouldn't hesitate to recommend
one for driveability.

i also drove a chevy hhr, and if there is an example of "fly-by-wire"
done wrong, the hhr is it - what a piece of crap. whoever decided a
vehicle needs a 3-second delay on mid-throttle response needs a good
kicking in the gonads.

jim beam

On 02/04/2010 08:56 PM, jr92 wrote:
> On Feb 3, 7:19�pm, "tww1491"<twau...@***.net> wrote:
>> "jim beam"<m...@privacy.net> wrote in message
>>
>> news:SYadnYVv5qcHDvTWnZ2dnUVZ_sWdnZ2d@speakeasy.ne t...
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100203...autocompanyrec...
>>
>>> "US chides Toyota over recall"
>>
>>> this is back-door protectionist political bullshit.
>>
>>> fact: ford, bmw, and others have all had throttle sensor problems, and in
>>> much greater numbers than toyota.
>>
>>> fact: the media has all but ignored it.
>>
>>> here we are, hot on the heels of political dismay at the unconsidered
>>> consequences of their ridiculous "cash for clunkers" program benefiting
>>> manufacturers of fuel efficient cars, not domestic gas guzzlers, being
>>> subjected to politically motivated hysterical xenophobia.
>>
>>> fact: toyota sells better, more fuel efficient, safer, more reliable
>>> vehicles using american parts and american labor than domestics assembling
>>> their carp from the chinese componentry they import.
>>
>>> if toyota needs to learn a lesson from this fiasco, it's that they need to
>>> show up in washington and hand over their lobbying cash like detroit does,
>>> not be politically naive and simply rely on selling superior product.
>>
>> In the local paper a couple days ago, a 79 year old women crashed into a
>> veterinarian's office claiming that the gas pedal on her new Toyota stuck.
>> The dealer found nothing wrong with the car. With that story in the paper
>> were reports of drivers complaining to the local Toyota dealer that they
>> received speeding tickets because of "stuck" pedals. And so it has begun.
>> And yet much more to come.- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -
>
>
>
> That does not mean that Toyota does not have problems with sticking
> accelerators.
>
>
> Fact#1
>
> Toyota is selling products in which sometimes, the accelerator sticks
> open, creating a safety hazard.

all 12? and both [as in TWO] fatal crash vehicles were operated by
drivers apparently incapable of using brakes, ignition switch and
neutral transmission that would have prevented anything other than
inconvenience of having to pull over to the side of the road.

frod sell /more/ - MANY more vehicles with faulty throttles. wtf is the
outrage over that? same with bmw.


>
>
> Fact:#2
>
> There are some people who will try to take advantage of the situation
> for monetary gain.

yeah - our elected "representatives" that are accepting the detroit
[translation: foreign importer] dollar ahead of domestically [toyota]
produced vehicles.


>
>
> Fact# 3
>
> Fact number 2 does not mean Fact number 1 does not exist.

oh, #2 exists all right.

jim beam

On 02/04/2010 08:49 PM, jr92 wrote:
> On Feb 3, 10:17�am, jim beam<m...@privacy.net> wrote:
>> http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100203...autocompanyrec...
>>
>> "US chides Toyota over recall"
>>
>> this is back-door protectionist political bullshit.
>
>
>
>
> You mean, like the Japanese version of protectionism that, in 2008,
> exported over 2 million vechicles to the US, while at the same time,
> only allowing 12 thousand American nameplates to be imported
> there??????

no, i mean the us protectionism that hypocritically masquerades detroit
brands as "domestic" when all the brakes, steering gear, driveshafts,
instruments, seats, etc. are imported from china killing american companies.


>
>
> Or the type of protectionism that Japan displayed when they had their
> own "cash for clunkers" program, but excluded the handful of American
> nameplates that WERE sold there from the program???????

cash for clunkers was ridiculously ill-conceived idiocy. it would have
been cheaper and better for the american public to divide the money
among the few remaining detroit workers and close the money-sucking
dinosaurs for which they "work".


>
>
> Sounds fair to me, I guess, if I were from Japan.
>
>
>
>
>>
>> fact: ford, bmw, and others have all had throttle sensor problems, and
>> in much greater numbers than toyota.
>>
>> fact: the media has all but ignored it.
>
>
>>
>
> Amazing statement.
>
> For over three decades, the media has lamblasted American autos for
> everything from interior light bulbs burning out, to weather stripping
> dry-rotting after 10 years. They hammered away repeatedly at the "lack
> of American reliability until many, who did not check things out on
> their own, began to believe them.

go to a junk yard buddy. you'll see domestic vehicles by the thousand,
10 years and younger. you'll see japanese 15 years and older. the
domestics are worn out. the japanese are there simply because their
drivers got bored.

nothing speaks to reliability facts better than a junkyard.


>
>
> Now, the worm is beginning to turn, and there are those who believed
> what the media said for thirty years, are accusing them of the same
> things they did against American nameplates.

hey, i'm a patriot and i'll always buy domestic when it makes sense.
but detroit vehicles are unbelievable crap. and i don't like being
ripped off by mercenary a-holes that try to sell me vehicles they /know/
to be defective - frod and their exploder fiasco. and i don't like
having to pay through the nose to keep gas guzzling unreliable pieces of
s. on the road when i can buy japanese and actually get a reliable vehicle.


>
>
> Maybe turn-a-bout IS fair play!

telling the truth is fair play. detroit produces garbage and expects
the tax payer to bail out their inability to produce vehicles properly.


>
>
>
>
>
>> here we are, hot on the heels of political dismay at the unconsidered
>> consequences of their ridiculous "cash for clunkers" program benefiting
>> manufacturers of fuel efficient cars, not domestic gas guzzlers, being
>> subjected to politically motivated hysterical xenophobia.
>>
>
>
>
>
> Kinda funny how it took about 20 MILLION

ok dude, now you're just a bullshitter.


> Toyota recalls over the past
> 3 or 4 years before it became politically motivated, or a "hysterical
> xeonphobia."
>
>
> Hell , a good chunk of the MILLIONS of recalls happened well before it
> became "chic' to knock Toyota.
>
>
> The sludging engines, or rusting supensions were known well before the
> US government began ownership in GM or Chysler, so there was nothing
> to be gained by the US pressuring Toyota into making recalls. There
> goes the 'conflict of interest" argument.
>
>
> And BTW, if you believe Toyota has NOT been spending bundles of money
> lobbying Washington, then YOU are more naive than you claim Toyota is.
>
>
>
>
>> fact: toyota sells better, more fuel efficient, safer, more reliable
>> vehicles using american parts and american labor than domestics
>> assembling their carp from the chinese componentry they import.
>>
>
>
> Really, you didn't make a single factual statement at all in this
> paragrah.
>
>
> Matter of fact, just the opposite of what you stated is actually true.
>
>
>
>
>
>
>> if toyota needs to learn a lesson from this fiasco, it's that they need
>> to show up in washington and hand over their lobbying cash like detroit
>> does, not be politically naive and simply rely on selling superior product.
>

Tegger

"Mike Hunter" <Mikehunt2@lycos,com> wrote in
news:4b6b665b$0$20568$ce5e7886@news-radius.ptd.net:

> It's the fault of the Unions? I thought it was the fault of
> President Bush



Obama is a union stooge. He's even admitted it.


--
Tegger

Tegger

Jim Yanik <jyanik@abuse.gov> wrote in
news:Xns9D15EF00234FAjyaniklocalnetcom@216.168.3.4 4:


>
>
> OTOH,it might be just that the media began NOTICING the SUV
> rollovers,and reporting nationally on every one that happened,instead
> of just local reporting.
>
> Kinda like reaching critical mass.... ;-)



There's something to that, too. Now that this is in the news,
incidents will spike simply because now EVERYTHING will be blamed
on stuck pedals until proven otherwise.



>
> Now,I've been reading that the Obama administration's -reaction- to
> the Toyota recall may be due to union influence,considering Toyota is
> NON-union and a "foreign" automaker. (although it's cars have more
> domestic content than many "American" vehicles,that may be made in
> Canada or Mexico.



See here for more:
<http://network.nationalpost.com/np/blogs/fpcomment/archive/2010/02/03/terence-corcoran-the-war-on-toyota.aspx>




--
Tegger

Tegger

jr92 <coachrose13@hotmail.com> wrote in
news:28a1db53-7537-473d-8873-d2afacbd189a@k19g2000yqc.googlegroups.com:

> On Feb 3, 10:17 am, jim beam <m...@privacy.net> wrote:
>> http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20100203...autocompanyrec.
>> ..
>>
>> "US chides Toyota over recall"
>>
>> this is back-door protectionist political bullshit.
>
>
>
>
> You mean, like the Japanese version of protectionism that, in 2008,
> exported over 2 million vechicles to the US, while at the same time,
> only allowing 12 thousand American nameplates to be imported
> there??????



So what? Maybe the Japs simply don't like our cars. Ever thought of that?
If WE won't buy them, why would THEY?

There's a reason Toyota has the market share they do, in spite of all the
hatred directed against them from certain quarters.



--
Tegger