Re: Questions about new Accord
 

rev_otis_mcnatt@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Oct 19, 12:00�pm, Brian Smith <Hali...@NovaScotia.Canada> wrote:
>> Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
>>
>>> Absolutely. �Because you know EVERYTHING about how your engine is
>>> designed and manufactured--more so than even the engineers who designed
>>> it.
>> � � � � What part of "I know what works for my application" did you not
>> understand? I change my engine oil and all the fluids in my vehicles
>> when I choose to, it is a practice that hasn't caused me any breakdowns
>> or headaches in close to four decades of motor vehicle ownership. If
>> that is wrong in your eyes, that is too bad, because practice has proven
>> it to be correct.
>
> Yep, I'm a little younger than you, but I've kept a couple of cars
> many
> years (currently have one nearly 20 years old, always maintained by
> yours truly and still runs great). The yo-yo you responded to who
> gives the great reverence and weight to the stuff put out by
> automakers
> has evidently been in a fog most of his life. It has LONG been the
> practice
> of automakers to lengthen the stated service intervals on various
> items,
> obviously to make their cars appear more maintenance free, and
> therefore more attractive for purchase. Old stuff. After all,
> they're the ones who will sell you new wheels when the old car
> starts barking.:) One recent example is a big issue with a large
> number of VW owners who were following their owners manuals
> and not bothering to change their timing belts till the 100k mark
> stated in their manuals. Guess what, these belts actually started
> failing em masse at anywhere from 65-80k miles, as would be
> expected for a timing belt. But purchasers who were uninformed
> about timing belts believed the manual, and most paid around
> 4k for extensive engine work because of the failed belts.
>
> But hey, people like shagnasty are needed in society. After
> all, the people who sell times shares, rent-to-own services,
> and bad mortgage deals have to make a living too!:)
>

ad hominem doesn't make you factually correct, it makes you look like a
loser. where is your oil analysis?

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

rev_otis_mcnatt@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> Yep, I'm a little younger than you, but I've kept a couple of cars
> many
> years (currently have one nearly 20 years old, always maintained by
> yours truly and still runs great).

That is my point if a program works, there is no need to upgrade. That
has become a common misconception put in place by Microsoft. :^)

> The yo-yo you responded to who
> gives the great reverence and weight to the stuff put out by
> automakers
> has evidently been in a fog most of his life. It has LONG been the
> practice
> of automakers to lengthen the stated service intervals on various
> items,
> obviously to make their cars appear more maintenance free, and
> therefore more attractive for purchase. Old stuff. After all,
> they're the ones who will sell you new wheels when the old car
> starts barking.:)

That's their plan, which is fine because they are in business to turn a
profit.

> One recent example is a big issue with a large
> number of VW owners who were following their owners manuals
> and not bothering to change their timing belts till the 100k mark
> stated in their manuals. Guess what, these belts actually started
> failing em masse at anywhere from 65-80k miles, as would be
> expected for a timing belt. But purchasers who were uninformed
> about timing belts believed the manual, and most paid around
> 4k for extensive engine work because of the failed belts.

Some people never learn.

> But hey, people like shagnasty are needed in society. After
> all, the people who sell times shares, rent-to-own services,
> and bad mortgage deals have to make a living too!:)

LOL!

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

In article <gdfpho$7mm$1@news.datemas.de>,
Brian Smith <Halifax@NovaScotia.Canada> wrote:

> Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
> >
> > What you have is called being an old fart.
>
> Well, this old fart is going to continue on with the program that
> works. If you don't like it, that's your decision. But it has proven
> itself over a number of decades and what works, is nothing to get rid of
> just because of technology.

Sure it works, just like 2000 mile oil change intervals will work. Just
like renting a crane to lift your car off the ground so you can rotate
the tires works.

All sorts of stupid and expensive processes can produce positive end
results. That doesn't make the processes any less stupid or expensive.

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
>
> Sure it works, just like 2000 mile oil change intervals will work. Just
> like renting a crane to lift your car off the ground so you can rotate
> the tires works.
>
> All sorts of stupid and expensive processes can produce positive end
> results. That doesn't make the processes any less stupid or expensive.

You are truly dense. I said it was cost effective for my application.
I'll translate that for you as you seem to have comprehension issues,
that means quite simply that it saves me money to perform the
maintenance to my vehicles using the method that I have used for decades.

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

Thus spake Brian Smith <Halifax@NovaScotia.Canada> :

>Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
>>
>> Sure it works, just like 2000 mile oil change intervals will work. Just
>> like renting a crane to lift your car off the ground so you can rotate
>> the tires works.
>>
>> All sorts of stupid and expensive processes can produce positive end
>> results. That doesn't make the processes any less stupid or expensive.
>
> You are truly dense. I said it was cost effective for my application.
>I'll translate that for you as you seem to have comprehension issues,
>that means quite simply that it saves me money to perform the
>maintenance to my vehicles using the method that I have used for decades.

Let's see
You: Drive the car on to the ramps, pull the drain plug, pull the
filter, replace filter gasket, replace filter, replace drain plug
gasket, pour in oil. repeat every 3000 miles

Me: Drive the car on to the ramps, pull the drain plug, pull the
filter, replace filter gasket, replace filter, replace drain plug
gasket, pour in oil. repeat every 7000 miles.

One of us is spending less money.

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

Thus spake rev_otis_mcnatt@yahoo.com :

>On Oct 18, 9:24 pm, Dillon Pyron <invaliddmpy...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> Actually the MM on my 2007 accord not only tracks oil life (pretty much
>> >> 7.5K/change) but also indicates other services by code (A1, B2, etc.)
>>
>> >But these messages only show up when the MM says "Oil Life" at
>> >15%-- or lower-- on your car, right? They never show up independently
>> >w/o
>> >the MM saying it's time for an oil change.
>>
>> Yes, because, if you do it according to Honda's recommendations, the
>> service intervals for the other items fall in line with the
>> recommended change times for oil.
>
>From previous post of mine, which addresses this--read slowly:
>
> "I think it's pretty clear to me now that this silly MM is just
> an oil change interval-based thingy that also keeps track
> of the overall mileage on the car (or maybe even the number
> of times the thing has been reset, to deal with the other
> items than need changing later--such as plugs and filters). "

THEN YOU DON'T KNOW HOW IT WORKS.

It's "pretty clear" to you because you don't understand it and make
things up on the fly.

>
>Assumes of course the owners waits till 15% on subsequent
>oil changes...
>
>> If you short shift on an oil change, eventually you'll get a reminder
>> to change your air filter. But it will be part of a "package", that
>> will include an oil change
>
>Read the following that I wrote above, very carefully:
>
> "For a person who does not wish to wait for the Oil Life to
> get down to 15% on the MM before changing his oil, he will
> never see reminders for changing out the other items, rotating
> tires, etc. Let us say there are flaws in the system. "
>
>IOW, a customer/car owner who, say, drops in at the Jiffy Lube
>"every 3 thousand miles or three months" will never see any
>of these service messages. My own Honda dealership actually
>has me scheduled for the first oil change at 4800 miles, which
>they have determined to be on January 19, '09. Then there
>is also the case of the owner who doesn't put enough miles
>on his car in a year to get down to 15% and the messages...
>The manual tells them to do an oil change at least once a year
>even if very low miles, like most automakers. This person will
>also never get the other service item messages.

Um, see above. You have no knowledge or expertise (otherwise, why
would you be asking the question in the first place), yet you are able
to come to conclusions based on your own opinion and conjecture.

>
>
>
>
>
>>
>> From the 2008 Fit:
>>
>> A: Replace engine oil
>> B: Replace engine oil
>> Inspect front and rear brake wear
>> Check parking brake adjustment
>> Inspect the following items:
>> - Fluid levels and conditions
>> - Brake hoses and lines
>> - Driveshaft boots
>> - Exhaust system
>> - Fuel lines and connections
>> - Suspension components
>> - Tie rod ends, steering gear box and boots
>>
>> 1: Rotate tires
>> 2: Replace air cleaner element. Replace dust and pollen filter.
>> Inspect drive belt.
>> 3: Replace transmission fluid
>> 4: Replace spark plugs. Inspect vavle clearance.
>> 5: Replace engine coolant
>>
>> Also: Replace brake fluid every 3 years, inspect idle speed every 160K
>> miles- Hide quoted text -
>>
>> - Show quoted text -

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

In article <gdgb63$obb$1@news.datemas.de>,
Brian Smith <Halifax@NovaScotia.Canada> wrote:

> > All sorts of stupid and expensive processes can produce positive end
> > results. That doesn't make the processes any less stupid or expensive.
>
> You are truly dense. I said it was cost effective for my application.

I'm not dense.

You aren't measuring anything; all you know is "I've done it this way
for 40 years and so far nothing's broken." That doesn't mean anything
more than "nothing's broken".

If that's all you care about, fine. OTOH, maybe you'd like to know
if/how you could TWEAK your process, FINE TUNE it--save a few dollars,
save some time on unnecessary oil changes, whatever.

At least have the actual INFORMATION in hand, so that you can make an
INFORMED decision.

But no, it seems like you and otis want NOT to have the actual
information in hand. It seems like you and otis want NOT to know
anything. You know all you need.

That sounds like a crack dealer on the corner. Keepin' it real, are
you? "I don't need to know that !"

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

In article <i0gnf4t5sg35i9aram8v8q8ed0aa1ttt2h@4ax.com>,
Dillon Pyron <invaliddmpyron@austin.rr.com> wrote:

> >> All sorts of stupid and expensive processes can produce positive end
> >> results. That doesn't make the processes any less stupid or expensive.
> >
> > You are truly dense. I said it was cost effective for my application.
> >I'll translate that for you as you seem to have comprehension issues,
> >that means quite simply that it saves me money to perform the
> >maintenance to my vehicles using the method that I have used for decades.
>
> Let's see
> You: Drive the car on to the ramps, pull the drain plug, pull the
> filter, replace filter gasket, replace filter, replace drain plug
> gasket, pour in oil. repeat every 3000 miles
>
> Me: Drive the car on to the ramps, pull the drain plug, pull the
> filter, replace filter gasket, replace filter, replace drain plug
> gasket, pour in oil. repeat every 7000 miles.
>
> One of us is spending less money.

And less time.

Brian doesn't want to *know* anything beyond "my process hasn't broken
my car yet".

I wonder what Brian would say to someone who changes his synthetic oil
religiously every 2000 miles. I bet Brian would have ALL SORTS of snide
remarks for THAT guy. Never mind that it's the same "my process hasn't
broken my car yet" mindset...

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

On Oct 19, 7:23 pm, Dillon Pyron <invaliddmpy...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
> Thus spake rev_otis_mcn...@yahoo.com :
>
>
>
>
>
> >On Oct 18, 9:24 pm, Dillon Pyron <invaliddmpy...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
>
> >> >> Actually the MM on my 2007 accord not only tracks oil life (pretty much
> >> >> 7.5K/change) but also indicates other services by code (A1, B2, etc..)
>
> >> >But these messages only show up when the MM says "Oil Life" at
> >> >15%-- or lower-- on your car, right? They never show up independently
> >> >w/o
> >> >the MM saying it's time for an oil change.
>
> >> Yes, because, if you do it according to Honda's recommendations, the
> >> service intervals for the other items fall in line with the
> >> recommended change times for oil.
>
> >From previous post of mine, which addresses this--read slowly:
>
> > "I think it's pretty clear to me now that this silly MM is just
> > an oil change interval-based thingy that also keeps track
> > of the overall mileage on the car (or maybe even the number
> > of times the thing has been reset, to deal with the other
> > items than need changing later--such as plugs and filters). "
>
> THEN YOU DON'T KNOW HOW IT WORKS.
>
> It's "pretty clear" to you because you don't understand it and make
> things up on the fly.

Another genius amuses me with his dendrite shortage. Explain
if you can what about "none of the other maintenance items show
up until the Oil Life reading reaches 15%" can you not comprehend?

> >Assumes of course the owners waits till 15% on subsequent
> >oil changes...
>
> >> If you short shift on an oil change, eventually you'll get a reminder
> >> to change your air filter. But it will be part of a "package", that
> >> will include an oil change
>
> >Read the following that I wrote above, very carefully:
>
> > "For a person who does not wish to wait for the Oil Life to
> > get down to 15% on the MM before changing his oil, he will
> > never see reminders for changing out the other items, rotating
> > tires, etc. Let us say there are flaws in the system. "
>
> >IOW, a customer/car owner who, say, drops in at the Jiffy Lube
> >"every 3 thousand miles or three months" will never see any
> >of these service messages. My own Honda dealership actually
> >has me scheduled for the first oil change at 4800 miles, which
> >they have determined to be on January 19, '09. Then there
> >is also the case of the owner who doesn't put enough miles
> >on his car in a year to get down to 15% and the messages...
> >The manual tells them to do an oil change at least once a year
> >even if very low miles, like most automakers. This person will
> >also never get the other service item messages.
>
> Um, see above. You have no knowledge or expertise (otherwise, why
> would you be asking the question in the first place), yet you are able
> to come to conclusions based on your own opinion and conjecture.

I asked the question about this silly Honda MM 5 days ago. Since then
I have learned quite clearly how it works. How many years
will it take for you to figure it out? Ever heard "tis better to be
silent and thought a fool than speak and remove all doubt"?

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

rev_otis_mcnatt@yahoo.com wrote:
> On Oct 19, 7:23�pm, Dillon Pyron <invaliddmpy...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
>> Thus spake rev_otis_mcn...@yahoo.com :
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>> On Oct 18, 9:24�pm, Dillon Pyron <invaliddmpy...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
>>>>>> Actually the MM on my 2007 accord not only tracks oil life (pretty much
>>>>>> 7.5K/change) but also indicates other services by code (A1, B2, etc.)
>>>>> But these messages only show up when the MM says "Oil Life" at
>>>>> 15%-- or lower-- on your car, right? �They never show up independently
>>>>> w/o
>>>>> the MM saying it's time for an oil change.
>>>> Yes, because, if you do it according to Honda's recommendations, the
>>>> service intervals for the other items fall in line with the
>>>> recommended change times for oil.
>> >From previous post of mine, which addresses this--read slowly:
>>
>>> "I think it's pretty clear to me now that this silly MM is just
>>> an oil change interval-based thingy that also keeps track
>>> of the overall mileage on the car (or maybe even the number
>>> of times the thing has been reset, to deal with the other
>>> items than need changing later--such as plugs and filters). "
>> THEN YOU DON'T KNOW HOW IT WORKS.
>>
>> It's "pretty clear" to you because you don't understand it and make
>> things up on the fly.
>
> Another genius amuses me with his dendrite shortage.

to a materials person, you know, what cars are made of, dendrites are
these things:

http://math.nist.gov/mcsd/savg/vis/dendrite/index.html

life would be much more pleasant if you dropped the preoccupation with
personal issues and concentrated on car stuff.


> Explain
> if you can what about "none of the other maintenance items show
> up until the Oil Life reading reaches 15%" can you not comprehend?

why don't you explain your simple oil usage algorithm when a modern
vehicle can track every cold start, every warmup cycle, every minute of
idle, every minute [blah...] ?




>
>>> Assumes of course the owners waits till 15% on subsequent
>>> oil changes...
>>>> If you short shift on an oil change, eventually you'll get a reminder
>>>> to change your air filter. �But it will be part of a "package", that
>>>> will include an oil change
>>> Read the following �that I wrote above, very carefully:
>>> "For a person who does not wish to wait for the Oil Life to
>>> get down to 15% on the MM before changing his oil, he will
>>> never see reminders for changing out the other items, rotating
>>> tires, etc. �Let us say there are flaws in the system. "
>>> IOW, a customer/car owner who, say, drops in at the Jiffy Lube
>>> "every 3 thousand miles or three months" will never see any
>>> of these service messages. �My own Honda dealership actually
>>> has me scheduled for the first oil change at 4800 miles, which
>>> they have determined to be on January 19, '09. � Then there
>>> is also the case of the owner who doesn't put enough miles
>>> on his car in a year to get down to 15% and the messages...
>>> The manual tells them to do an oil change at least once a year
>>> even if very low miles, like most automakers. �This person will
>>> also never get the other service item messages.
>> Um, see above. �You have no knowledge or expertise (otherwise, why
>> would you be asking the question in the first place), yet you are able
>> to come to conclusions based on your own opinion and conjecture.
>
> I asked the question about this silly Honda MM 5 days ago. Since then
> I have learned quite clearly how it works. How many years
> will it take for you to figure it out? Ever heard "tis better to be
> silent and thought a fool than speak and remove all doubt"?

eh? you came here demanding free expert advice, against which you
fought, you complained, you insulted, and then you flung your teddy in a
corner announcing your departure, yet here you still are and now you're
lecturing others on the benefits of silence??? buddy, you need to take
your own advice if you don't understand why you're getting a negative
reaction. coughing up your secret data on your oil analysis would help too.

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

jim beam wrote:

> ad hominem doesn't make you factually correct, it makes you look like a
> loser. where is your oil analysis?

This, coming from the King of Snotty Remarks?!

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

On Mon, 20 Oct 2008 08:50:13 -0700, Greg Campbell <nospam@null.net> wrote:
>jim beam wrote:

>> ad hominem doesn't make you factually correct, it makes you look like a
>> loser. where is your oil analysis?

>This, coming from the King of Snotty Remarks?!

You really look stupid bordering on insanity when you continue to post
ad hominem's when your logical falacy has been pointed out to you in
terms that hit you in the face.

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

Greg Campbell wrote:
> jim beam wrote:
>
>> ad hominem doesn't make you factually correct, it makes you look like
>> a loser. where is your oil analysis?
>
> This, coming from the King of Snotty Remarks?!
>

actually, i'm the king of "don't pollute the knowledge pool with b.s.".

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

Thus spake rev_otis_mcnatt@yahoo.com :

>On Oct 19, 7:23 pm, Dillon Pyron <invaliddmpy...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
>> Thus spake rev_otis_mcn...@yahoo.com :
>>
>>
>>
>>
>>
>> >On Oct 18, 9:24 pm, Dillon Pyron <invaliddmpy...@austin.rr.com> wrote:
>>
>> >> >> Actually the MM on my 2007 accord not only tracks oil life (pretty much
>> >> >> 7.5K/change) but also indicates other services by code (A1, B2, etc.)
>>
>> >> >But these messages only show up when the MM says "Oil Life" at
>> >> >15%-- or lower-- on your car, right? They never show up independently
>> >> >w/o
>> >> >the MM saying it's time for an oil change.
>>
>> >> Yes, because, if you do it according to Honda's recommendations, the
>> >> service intervals for the other items fall in line with the
>> >> recommended change times for oil.
>>
>> >From previous post of mine, which addresses this--read slowly:
>>
>> > "I think it's pretty clear to me now that this silly MM is just
>> > an oil change interval-based thingy that also keeps track
>> > of the overall mileage on the car (or maybe even the number
>> > of times the thing has been reset, to deal with the other
>> > items than need changing later--such as plugs and filters). "
>>
>> THEN YOU DON'T KNOW HOW IT WORKS.
>>
>> It's "pretty clear" to you because you don't understand it and make
>> things up on the fly.
>
>Another genius amuses me with his dendrite shortage. Explain
>if you can what about "none of the other maintenance items show
>up until the Oil Life reading reaches 15%" can you not comprehend?

Cites?

Re: Questions about new Accord
 

In article <QL1Lk.3565$Zd.648@newsfe10.iad>,
Greg Campbell <nospam@null.net> wrote:

> jim beam wrote:
>
> > ad hominem doesn't make you factually correct, it makes you look like a
> > loser. where is your oil analysis?
>
> This, coming from the King of Snotty Remarks?!

Where is his oil analysis?

Never mind the tone in which the question was asked. You are merely
attempting to redirect attention away from the very valid question:
where is his oil analysis?

No oil analysis = no facts.