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(quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. It
is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of a busy intersection. The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free wheeling (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this particular model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? Jay C. |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
Thanks, I'm in denial about the timing belt...please don't let it be that,
please don't let it be that...:-) We just drove 500 highway miles yesterday without any problems. I guess we should be lucky that things didn't go haywire while we were 250 miles away from home. Does the 91 Civic have a piston/valve killer engine in the event that the timing belt broke? Are the clearances that close? Thanks again, Jay C. "Bill Kapaun" <bkapaun@coldmail.com> wrote in message news:bkapaun-2207031524130001@dialup-ras14-65.eug.or.uspops.net... > In article <nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03>, "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote: > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. It > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of a > > busy intersection. > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free wheeling > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this particular > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > Jay C. > > If you are SURE it sounds different, I'd pull the valve cover and see if > the timing belt broke. It's a pretty simple job to visually inspect. > > A COMMON problem with Hondas and the heat, is the Main Relay failing. This > usually results in the car failing to restart after driving, not just > quitting. It's a dinstinct possibility however if the TB is good. |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
In article <nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03>, "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote:
> I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. It > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of a > busy intersection. > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free wheeling > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this particular > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > Jay C. If you are SURE it sounds different, I'd pull the valve cover and see if the timing belt broke. It's a pretty simple job to visually inspect. A COMMON problem with Hondas and the heat, is the Main Relay failing. This usually results in the car failing to restart after driving, not just quitting. It's a dinstinct possibility however if the TB is good. |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
Jay C. wrote:
> > I pulled the valve cover off and visually inspected the belt. It appeared > to be laying in place around the cam pulley so I wiggled the part of the > belt that I could reach which was running toward the crank. It seemed to be > in place and not broken. Is there another simple but better way to test the > belt other than what I did? > > The engine doesn't really sound "free-wheeling" but more like spark or fuel > problems. Maybe when the temperature outside comes down from ludicrous to > insane, I'll go out to work on the car some more. In the mean time if you > have any other suggestions please pass them along. If you still have the valve cover off, have someone kick the starter briefly. If the belt doesn't turn, that's it. Alternatively, pull the distributor cap and do the same thing. If the rotor doesn't turn, timing belt. The civic has an interference engine, but at miminal speed it's unlikely there is any damage, valve springs will settle cam in clear position. Given the hot conditions, it could very well be the main relay, typical of this year honda. It may start once it cools down. When you turn the key to on position(not start), listen for the fuel pump to turn on for about 2-3 seconds, at which time the engine light should go off. If this doesn't happen, it's probably the relay. http://members.rogers.com/john-ings/MainRelay.HTM |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
Jay wrote:
> > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. It > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of a > busy intersection. > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free wheeling > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this particular > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > Jay C. ----------------------- Jay, Take off the distributor cap and turn the engine over. A broken belt won't turn the camshaft, so the rotor will remain stationary. High heat has probably caused your Main relay to fry the solder joints to death. http://members.rogers.com/john-ings/MainRelay.HTM Let us know what you find! 'Curly' -- To REPLY: You must remove two underscores from the return address to reply directly . . . . . . Regarding stage performances: When everyone else has finished playing, you should not play any notes you have left over. - |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
In article <HQjTa.110452$OZ2.21274@rwcrnsc54>, "Jay C."
<jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote: > I pulled the valve cover off and visually inspected the belt. It appeared > to be laying in place around the cam pulley so I wiggled the part of the > belt that I could reach which was running toward the crank. It seemed to be > in place and not broken. Is there another simple but better way to test the > belt other than what I did? It sounds like the belt is OK. Simply put, the belt turns the camshaft. If the cam turns when the engine is cranking, the belt is OK. Have someone crank the engine briefly while observing the cam. The distributor is driven by the end of the cam. One could remove the dist cap and observe the rotor (while cranking) just to ensure everything is OK there too. One thing we haven't discussed is spark! If you don't have it, it won't run! You could have a failed ignitor or ignition coil if you don't have spark. IIRC,Ignitor failure is not uncommon for this era Civic. In a nutshell, if no fuel, probably Main Relay. If no spark, probably Ignitor. -- To email, turn cold to hot. |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
Okay, I visually inspected the timing belt last evening and it appeared to
be okay. It was in place and I could not wiggle it loose. This morning I went out to listen for the fuel pump. Yep, I heard it too. I removed the distributor cap to see if things were turning. Nope, the rotor isn't moving when the engine is cranked. I suppose that the distributor is fried? I guess that is why the starting sounds a little different than normal; because it isn't "free-wheeling" but it doesn't sound normal either. Next step? Jay C. "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. It > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of a > busy intersection. > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free wheeling > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this particular > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > Jay C. > > |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
"Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:yBwTa.115347$sY2.52036@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... > Okay, I visually inspected the timing belt last evening and it appeared to > be okay. It was in place and I could not wiggle it loose. Good. > This morning I went out to listen for the fuel pump. Yep, I heard it too. I > removed the distributor cap to see if things were turning. Nope, the rotor > isn't moving when the engine is cranked. I suppose that the distributor is > fried? Bad. Are you SURE you inspected the *timing* belt? (Sorry, but I have no idea of your mechanical knowledge.) > I guess that is why the starting sounds a little different than normal; > because it isn't "free-wheeling" but it doesn't sound normal either. > > Next step? > > Jay C. > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. > It > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of a > > busy intersection. > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > wheeling > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > particular > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
I pulled the valve cover off and then pulled away the plastic belt cover so
I could tug on the belt. I even put a 12 mm socket on the cam pulley to see if it would turn and maybe show me the belt problem. That pulley wouldn't turn very easily at all, so I didn't force it. I concluded from that, that the belt was still in tact. Should I do something else to confirm the belt condition? Jay C. "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXLX@rogers.com> wrote in message news:0VwTa.19262$Ii1.3117@news02.bloor.is.net.cabl e.rogers.com... > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > news:yBwTa.115347$sY2.52036@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... > > Okay, I visually inspected the timing belt last evening and it appeared to > > be okay. It was in place and I could not wiggle it loose. > > Good. > > > This morning I went out to listen for the fuel pump. Yep, I heard it too. > I > > removed the distributor cap to see if things were turning. Nope, the > rotor > > isn't moving when the engine is cranked. I suppose that the distributor > is > > fried? > > Bad. > Are you SURE you inspected the *timing* belt? (Sorry, but I have no idea of > your mechanical knowledge.) > > > > I guess that is why the starting sounds a little different than normal; > > because it isn't "free-wheeling" but it doesn't sound normal either. > > > > Next step? > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. > > It > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of > a > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > > wheeling > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > particular > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
I pulled the valve cover off and then pulled away the plastic belt cover so
I could tug on the belt. I even put a 12 mm socket on the cam pulley to see if it would turn and maybe show me the belt problem. That pulley wouldn't turn very easily at all, so I didn't force it. I concluded from that, that the belt was still in tact. Should I do something else to confirm the belt condition? Jay C. "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXLX@rogers.com> wrote in message news:0VwTa.19262$Ii1.3117@news02.bloor.is.net.cabl e.rogers.com... > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > news:yBwTa.115347$sY2.52036@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... > > Okay, I visually inspected the timing belt last evening and it appeared to > > be okay. It was in place and I could not wiggle it loose. > > Good. > > > This morning I went out to listen for the fuel pump. Yep, I heard it too. > I > > removed the distributor cap to see if things were turning. Nope, the > rotor > > isn't moving when the engine is cranked. I suppose that the distributor > is > > fried? > > Bad. > Are you SURE you inspected the *timing* belt? (Sorry, but I have no idea of > your mechanical knowledge.) > > > > I guess that is why the starting sounds a little different than normal; > > because it isn't "free-wheeling" but it doesn't sound normal either. > > > > Next step? > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. > > It > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of > a > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > > wheeling > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > particular > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
I didn't try that last night but I just did. The cam DOESN'T turn. So,
that indicates that either the belt is broken and jammed down on the crank area so I can't see it or that the starter isn't engaging (doubtful) or... Hmmm. What else? Keep up the good work you guys and we'll get to the bottom of this yet. Jay C. "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXLX@rogers.com> wrote in message news:c8xTa.19424$Ii1.13594@news02.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > news:TZwTa.115390$sY2.51159@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... > > I pulled the valve cover off and then pulled away the plastic belt cover > so > > I could tug on the belt. I even put a 12 mm socket on the cam pulley to > see > > if it would turn and maybe show me the belt problem. That pulley wouldn't > > turn very easily at all, so I didn't force it. I concluded from that, > that > > the belt was still in tact. Should I do something else to confirm the > belt > > condition? > > Does the camshaft turn when you crank? > > > > "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXLX@rogers.com> wrote in message > > news:0VwTa.19262$Ii1.3117@news02.bloor.is.net.cabl e.rogers.com... > > > > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > news:yBwTa.115347$sY2.52036@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... > > > > Okay, I visually inspected the timing belt last evening and it > appeared > > to > > > > be okay. It was in place and I could not wiggle it loose. > > > > > > Good. > > > > > > > This morning I went out to listen for the fuel pump. Yep, I heard it > > too. > > > I > > > > removed the distributor cap to see if things were turning. Nope, the > > > rotor > > > > isn't moving when the engine is cranked. I suppose that the > distributor > > > is > > > > fried? > > > > > > Bad. > > > Are you SURE you inspected the *timing* belt? (Sorry, but I have no idea > > of > > > your mechanical knowledge.) > > > > > > > > > > I guess that is why the starting sounds a little different than > normal; > > > > because it isn't "free-wheeling" but it doesn't sound normal either. > > > > > > > > Next step? > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > > house. > > > > It > > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the > middle > > of > > > a > > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a > little > > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > > > > wheeling > > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that > could > > be > > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > > > particular > > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
I didn't try that last night but I just did. The cam DOESN'T turn. So,
that indicates that either the belt is broken and jammed down on the crank area so I can't see it or that the starter isn't engaging (doubtful) or... Hmmm. What else? Keep up the good work you guys and we'll get to the bottom of this yet. Jay C. "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXLX@rogers.com> wrote in message news:c8xTa.19424$Ii1.13594@news02.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > news:TZwTa.115390$sY2.51159@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... > > I pulled the valve cover off and then pulled away the plastic belt cover > so > > I could tug on the belt. I even put a 12 mm socket on the cam pulley to > see > > if it would turn and maybe show me the belt problem. That pulley wouldn't > > turn very easily at all, so I didn't force it. I concluded from that, > that > > the belt was still in tact. Should I do something else to confirm the > belt > > condition? > > Does the camshaft turn when you crank? > > > > "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXLX@rogers.com> wrote in message > > news:0VwTa.19262$Ii1.3117@news02.bloor.is.net.cabl e.rogers.com... > > > > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > news:yBwTa.115347$sY2.52036@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... > > > > Okay, I visually inspected the timing belt last evening and it > appeared > > to > > > > be okay. It was in place and I could not wiggle it loose. > > > > > > Good. > > > > > > > This morning I went out to listen for the fuel pump. Yep, I heard it > > too. > > > I > > > > removed the distributor cap to see if things were turning. Nope, the > > > rotor > > > > isn't moving when the engine is cranked. I suppose that the > distributor > > > is > > > > fried? > > > > > > Bad. > > > Are you SURE you inspected the *timing* belt? (Sorry, but I have no idea > > of > > > your mechanical knowledge.) > > > > > > > > > > I guess that is why the starting sounds a little different than > normal; > > > > because it isn't "free-wheeling" but it doesn't sound normal either. > > > > > > > > Next step? > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > > house. > > > > It > > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the > middle > > of > > > a > > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a > little > > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > > > > wheeling > > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that > could > > be > > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > > > particular > > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
"Jay C." wrote:
> I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a cooler > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth in one > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a traffic > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she couldn't > restart it. > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any damage). > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to restart it. > The timing sounded like it was off. > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for possible > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > Jay C. > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. > It > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of a > > busy intersection. > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > wheeling > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > particular > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > Jay C. > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the compression on all cyclinders. |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
"Jay C." wrote:
> I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a cooler > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth in one > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a traffic > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she couldn't > restart it. > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any damage). > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to restart it. > The timing sounded like it was off. > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for possible > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > Jay C. > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. > It > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of a > > busy intersection. > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > wheeling > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > particular > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > Jay C. > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the compression on all cyclinders. |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
Thanks,
I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do a valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has nearly 1/4 million miles on it. Jay "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > "Jay C." wrote: > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a cooler > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth in one > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a traffic > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she couldn't > > restart it. > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any damage). > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to restart it. > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for possible > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > Jay C. > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. > > It > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of a > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > > wheeling > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > particular > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the compression on > all cyclinders. > |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
Thanks,
I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do a valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has nearly 1/4 million miles on it. Jay "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > "Jay C." wrote: > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a cooler > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth in one > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a traffic > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she couldn't > > restart it. > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any damage). > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to restart it. > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for possible > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > Jay C. > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the house. > > It > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle of a > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > > wheeling > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could be > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > particular > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the compression on > all cyclinders. > |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
"Jay C." wrote:
> Thanks, > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do a > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has nearly > 1/4 million miles on it. > > Jay > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a > cooler > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth in > one > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a > traffic > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she couldn't > > > restart it. > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any > damage). > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to restart > it. > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for possible > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > house. > > > It > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle > of a > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > > > wheeling > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could > be > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > > particular > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the compression > on > > all cyclinders. > > you may find if you rebuild the head, the lower end of the engine may get stressed more with the additional compression and quickly fail. Ive seen this happen on several vehichles with many miles on the odo, with a new /fresh cyclinder head. should you decide to do the head work, its not much more work to slap new piston rings and rod bearings in the thing. all assuming your capable of the task. |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
"Jay C." wrote:
> Thanks, > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do a > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has nearly > 1/4 million miles on it. > > Jay > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a > cooler > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth in > one > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a > traffic > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she couldn't > > > restart it. > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any > damage). > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to restart > it. > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for possible > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > house. > > > It > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle > of a > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > > > wheeling > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could > be > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > > particular > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the compression > on > > all cyclinders. > > you may find if you rebuild the head, the lower end of the engine may get stressed more with the additional compression and quickly fail. Ive seen this happen on several vehichles with many miles on the odo, with a new /fresh cyclinder head. should you decide to do the head work, its not much more work to slap new piston rings and rod bearings in the thing. all assuming your capable of the task. |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
"Jay C." wrote:
> Yeah, you're right. I will probably leave things alone if it is possible. > > The biggest problem I am having right now is trying to get the drive belt > pulley-crank bolt loose. I can't take the bottom timing belt cover off to > finish the R & R of the timing belt until I do. > > Hopefully I can round up an impact driver. :-( > > Jay C. > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > message news:3F1EE3A2.758C7D28@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do > a > > > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has > nearly > > > 1/4 million miles on it. > > > > > > Jay > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote > in > > > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a > > > cooler > > > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth > in > > > one > > > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a > > > traffic > > > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she > couldn't > > > > > restart it. > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any > > > damage). > > > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to > restart > > > it. > > > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for > possible > > > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > > > house. > > > > > It > > > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the > middle > > > of a > > > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a > little > > > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is > free > > > > > wheeling > > > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that > could > > > be > > > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > > > > particular > > > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the > compression > > > on > > > > all cyclinders. > > > > > > > > you may find if you rebuild the head, the lower end of the engine may get > > stressed more with the additional compression and quickly fail. Ive seen > this > > happen on several vehichles with many miles on the odo, with a new /fresh > > cyclinder head. > > > > should you decide to do the head work, its not much more work to slap new > > piston rings and rod bearings in the thing. > > all assuming your capable of the task. > > I had incredible difficulty removing mine as well as others, The impact wrench with a short 15ft of hose and 160 psi finally broke the darn thing loose after snapping 4 sockets, and 1 extension. try to use no extensions and a good impact socket, it makes all the difference. you will most likely have to anchor the flywheel or flexplate to the transmission using some metal strapping to keep the engine from turing over. someone on the web has a picture of the "flywheel anchor" on the web. good luck |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
"Jay C." wrote:
> Yeah, you're right. I will probably leave things alone if it is possible. > > The biggest problem I am having right now is trying to get the drive belt > pulley-crank bolt loose. I can't take the bottom timing belt cover off to > finish the R & R of the timing belt until I do. > > Hopefully I can round up an impact driver. :-( > > Jay C. > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > message news:3F1EE3A2.758C7D28@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do > a > > > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has > nearly > > > 1/4 million miles on it. > > > > > > Jay > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote > in > > > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a > > > cooler > > > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth > in > > > one > > > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a > > > traffic > > > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she > couldn't > > > > > restart it. > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any > > > damage). > > > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to > restart > > > it. > > > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for > possible > > > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > > > house. > > > > > It > > > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the > middle > > > of a > > > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a > little > > > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is > free > > > > > wheeling > > > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that > could > > > be > > > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > > > > particular > > > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the > compression > > > on > > > > all cyclinders. > > > > > > > > you may find if you rebuild the head, the lower end of the engine may get > > stressed more with the additional compression and quickly fail. Ive seen > this > > happen on several vehichles with many miles on the odo, with a new /fresh > > cyclinder head. > > > > should you decide to do the head work, its not much more work to slap new > > piston rings and rod bearings in the thing. > > all assuming your capable of the task. > > I had incredible difficulty removing mine as well as others, The impact wrench with a short 15ft of hose and 160 psi finally broke the darn thing loose after snapping 4 sockets, and 1 extension. try to use no extensions and a good impact socket, it makes all the difference. you will most likely have to anchor the flywheel or flexplate to the transmission using some metal strapping to keep the engine from turing over. someone on the web has a picture of the "flywheel anchor" on the web. good luck |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
Well, as you said, since you went that far already...
If you're going to keep the car and you can afford it all now, may was well do it all NOW rather than later. John D. "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:<llATa.114868$wk6.30051@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att .net>... > Thanks, > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do a > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has nearly > 1/4 million miles on it. > > Jay > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a > cooler > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth in > one > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a > traffic > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she couldn't > > > restart it. > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any > damage). > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to restart > it. > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for possible > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > house. > It > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle > of a > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > wheeling > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could > be > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > particular > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the compression > on > > all cyclinders. > > |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
Well, as you said, since you went that far already...
If you're going to keep the car and you can afford it all now, may was well do it all NOW rather than later. John D. "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:<llATa.114868$wk6.30051@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att .net>... > Thanks, > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do a > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has nearly > 1/4 million miles on it. > > Jay > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a > cooler > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth in > one > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a > traffic > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she couldn't > > > restart it. > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any > damage). > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to restart > it. > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for possible > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > house. > It > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle > of a > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > wheeling > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could > be > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > particular > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the compression > on > > all cyclinders. > > |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
PostScript.
I forgot to add that 250,000 miles is a lot...do what you can now on the head with that many miles on the car...at least you won't have to worry about head problems for a long while...it'll probably be something else! John D. "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:<llATa.114868$wk6.30051@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att .net>... > Thanks, > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do a > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has nearly > 1/4 million miles on it. > > Jay > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a > cooler > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth in > one > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a > traffic > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she couldn't > > > restart it. > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any > damage). > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to restart > it. > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for possible > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > house. > It > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle > of a > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > wheeling > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could > be > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > particular > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the compression > on > > all cyclinders. > > |
Re: (quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
PostScript.
I forgot to add that 250,000 miles is a lot...do what you can now on the head with that many miles on the car...at least you won't have to worry about head problems for a long while...it'll probably be something else! John D. "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:<llATa.114868$wk6.30051@rwcrnsc52.ops.asp.att .net>... > Thanks, > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do a > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has nearly > 1/4 million miles on it. > > Jay > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a > cooler > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth in > one > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a > traffic > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she couldn't > > > restart it. > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any > damage). > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to restart > it. > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for possible > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > house. > It > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the middle > of a > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a little > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is free > wheeling > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that could > be > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > particular > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the compression > on > > all cyclinders. > > |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
Umm. Is the pulley-to-crankshaft bolt a left or right handed? It is so
friggin tight that I might have go to Pep Boys and buy one of there specialty PowerBuilt tools to help remove it. I borrowed an industrial strength electric impact driver but have been assuming the the bolt is right handed. Some of the other suggestions on the Net were to use the starter in short bursts to help break loose the bolt. I don't like the idea but their setup suggests that the bolt is a left handed one. The crank rotates ccw so if a breaker bar were anchored in any location, the starter action would tend to tighten the bolt if it were a right hand thead. Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or lefty-loosey? Thanks, Jay C. "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in message news:3F1EF58E.4CC3810A@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > "Jay C." wrote: > > > Yeah, you're right. I will probably leave things alone if it is possible. > > > > The biggest problem I am having right now is trying to get the drive belt > > pulley-crank bolt loose. I can't take the bottom timing belt cover off to > > finish the R & R of the timing belt until I do. > > > > Hopefully I can round up an impact driver. :-( > > > > Jay C. > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > > message news:3F1EE3A2.758C7D28@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do > > a > > > > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has > > nearly > > > > 1/4 million miles on it. > > > > > > > > Jay > > > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote > > in > > > > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > > > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a > > > > cooler > > > > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth > > in > > > > one > > > > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a > > > > traffic > > > > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she > > couldn't > > > > > > restart it. > > > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any > > > > damage). > > > > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to > > restart > > > > it. > > > > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for > > possible > > > > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > > > > house. > > > > > > It > > > > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the > > middle > > > > of a > > > > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a > > little > > > > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is > > free > > > > > > wheeling > > > > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that > > could > > > > be > > > > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > > > > > particular > > > > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the > > compression > > > > on > > > > > all cyclinders. > > > > > > > > > > > you may find if you rebuild the head, the lower end of the engine may get > > > stressed more with the additional compression and quickly fail. Ive seen > > this > > > happen on several vehichles with many miles on the odo, with a new /fresh > > > cyclinder head. > > > > > > should you decide to do the head work, its not much more work to slap new > > > piston rings and rod bearings in the thing. > > > all assuming your capable of the task. > > > > > I had incredible difficulty removing mine as well as others, The impact wrench > with a short 15ft of hose and 160 psi finally broke the darn thing loose after > snapping 4 sockets, and 1 extension. try to use no extensions and a good > impact socket, it makes all the difference. > > you will most likely have to anchor the flywheel or flexplate to the > transmission using some metal strapping to keep the engine from turing over. > someone on the web has a picture of the "flywheel anchor" on the web. > good luck > |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
Umm. Is the pulley-to-crankshaft bolt a left or right handed? It is so
friggin tight that I might have go to Pep Boys and buy one of there specialty PowerBuilt tools to help remove it. I borrowed an industrial strength electric impact driver but have been assuming the the bolt is right handed. Some of the other suggestions on the Net were to use the starter in short bursts to help break loose the bolt. I don't like the idea but their setup suggests that the bolt is a left handed one. The crank rotates ccw so if a breaker bar were anchored in any location, the starter action would tend to tighten the bolt if it were a right hand thead. Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or lefty-loosey? Thanks, Jay C. "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in message news:3F1EF58E.4CC3810A@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > "Jay C." wrote: > > > Yeah, you're right. I will probably leave things alone if it is possible. > > > > The biggest problem I am having right now is trying to get the drive belt > > pulley-crank bolt loose. I can't take the bottom timing belt cover off to > > finish the R & R of the timing belt until I do. > > > > Hopefully I can round up an impact driver. :-( > > > > Jay C. > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > > message news:3F1EE3A2.758C7D28@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want to do > > a > > > > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has > > nearly > > > > 1/4 million miles on it. > > > > > > > > Jay > > > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote > > in > > > > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > > > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car (in a > > > > cooler > > > > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several teeth > > in > > > > one > > > > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at a > > > > traffic > > > > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she > > couldn't > > > > > > restart it. > > > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do any > > > > damage). > > > > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to > > restart > > > > it. > > > > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for > > possible > > > > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to the > > > > house. > > > > > > It > > > > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the > > middle > > > > of a > > > > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a > > little > > > > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is > > free > > > > > > wheeling > > > > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess that > > could > > > > be > > > > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on this > > > > > > particular > > > > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check first? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the > > compression > > > > on > > > > > all cyclinders. > > > > > > > > > > > you may find if you rebuild the head, the lower end of the engine may get > > > stressed more with the additional compression and quickly fail. Ive seen > > this > > > happen on several vehichles with many miles on the odo, with a new /fresh > > > cyclinder head. > > > > > > should you decide to do the head work, its not much more work to slap new > > > piston rings and rod bearings in the thing. > > > all assuming your capable of the task. > > > > > I had incredible difficulty removing mine as well as others, The impact wrench > with a short 15ft of hose and 160 psi finally broke the darn thing loose after > snapping 4 sockets, and 1 extension. try to use no extensions and a good > impact socket, it makes all the difference. > > you will most likely have to anchor the flywheel or flexplate to the > transmission using some metal strapping to keep the engine from turing over. > someone on the web has a picture of the "flywheel anchor" on the web. > good luck > |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
"Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... .. > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or lefty-loosey? Yes. |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
"Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... .. > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or lefty-loosey? Yes. |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
Okay, it looks like I will have to make a special tool out of an old bed
rail or some other angle iron which spans the drive belt pulley face and has a couple of holes for bolts to go through the pulley (gently tightened). Four feet long should do it. I'll need to allow another hole for the socket/short breaker bar which will be anchored on the floor or engine compartment. Easy does it, so I don't bend the pulley when I use the four foot angle iron for my new lever/wrench. The alternative of pulling off the starter and wedging a large screw driver into the flywheel seems like too much work. ....pray for me ;-) Jay "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote in message news:x6VTa.67453$zwL.13660@news04.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... > > . > > > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or lefty-loosey? > > Yes. > > |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
Okay, it looks like I will have to make a special tool out of an old bed
rail or some other angle iron which spans the drive belt pulley face and has a couple of holes for bolts to go through the pulley (gently tightened). Four feet long should do it. I'll need to allow another hole for the socket/short breaker bar which will be anchored on the floor or engine compartment. Easy does it, so I don't bend the pulley when I use the four foot angle iron for my new lever/wrench. The alternative of pulling off the starter and wedging a large screw driver into the flywheel seems like too much work. ....pray for me ;-) Jay "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote in message news:x6VTa.67453$zwL.13660@news04.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... > > . > > > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or lefty-loosey? > > Yes. > > |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
"Jay C." wrote:
> Okay, it looks like I will have to make a special tool out of an old bed > rail or some other angle iron which spans the drive belt pulley face and has > a couple of holes for bolts to go through the pulley (gently tightened). > Four feet long should do it. I'll need to allow another hole for the > socket/short breaker bar which will be anchored on the floor or engine > compartment. Easy does it, so I don't bend the pulley when I use the four > foot angle iron for my new lever/wrench. > > The alternative of pulling off the starter and wedging a large screw driver > into the flywheel seems like too much work. > > ...pray for me ;-) > > Jay > > "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote in message > news:x6VTa.67453$zwL.13660@news04.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... > > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... > > > > . > > > > > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or > lefty-loosey? > > > > Yes. > > > > I used a piece of angle steel with 2 holes in it, securing the flywheel to the transmission housing. that kept the crank from turning but still that darn bolt is tight, a long piece of pipe over a 36 in breaker bar just managed to snap my extensions, all of them, and all my sockets. eventually the bolt did come out as noted before. impact wrench, impact socket, 160psi, and as short of hose as possible (15ft) to the impact wrench. its standard thread. lefty loosey. |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
"Jay C." wrote:
> Okay, it looks like I will have to make a special tool out of an old bed > rail or some other angle iron which spans the drive belt pulley face and has > a couple of holes for bolts to go through the pulley (gently tightened). > Four feet long should do it. I'll need to allow another hole for the > socket/short breaker bar which will be anchored on the floor or engine > compartment. Easy does it, so I don't bend the pulley when I use the four > foot angle iron for my new lever/wrench. > > The alternative of pulling off the starter and wedging a large screw driver > into the flywheel seems like too much work. > > ...pray for me ;-) > > Jay > > "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote in message > news:x6VTa.67453$zwL.13660@news04.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... > > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... > > > > . > > > > > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or > lefty-loosey? > > > > Yes. > > > > I used a piece of angle steel with 2 holes in it, securing the flywheel to the transmission housing. that kept the crank from turning but still that darn bolt is tight, a long piece of pipe over a 36 in breaker bar just managed to snap my extensions, all of them, and all my sockets. eventually the bolt did come out as noted before. impact wrench, impact socket, 160psi, and as short of hose as possible (15ft) to the impact wrench. its standard thread. lefty loosey. |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
A word to the wise; get the crank bolt broken loose before you start on the
timing belt replacement project. Fortunately my son works at a body and paint shop so we are going to load the car onto the flatbed tow truck on Monday to go use his air impact driver. I do have a few choice words for Honda. :-) Jay C. "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:hpZTa.123519$sY2.56015@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... > Thanks, > > I'm resting today to build up for the big day tomorrow. ;-) If I break two > sockets, I'll tow the car somewhere to have someone else break their socket > with an air impact driver. > > Jay C. > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <guest@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:3F205835.6872B5A5@hotmail.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > Okay, it looks like I will have to make a special tool out of an old bed > > > rail or some other angle iron which spans the drive belt pulley face and > has > > > a couple of holes for bolts to go through the pulley (gently > tightened). > > > Four feet long should do it. I'll need to allow another hole for the > > > socket/short breaker bar which will be anchored on the floor or engine > > > compartment. Easy does it, so I don't bend the pulley when I use the > four > > > foot angle iron for my new lever/wrench. > > > > > > The alternative of pulling off the starter and wedging a large screw > driver > > > into the flywheel seems like too much work. > > > > > > ...pray for me ;-) > > > > > > Jay > > > > > > "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote in message > > > news:x6VTa.67453$zwL.13660@news04.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... > > > > > > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > > news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... > > > > > > > > . > > > > > > > > > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or > > > lefty-loosey? > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > I used a piece of angle steel with 2 holes in it, securing the flywheel to > the > > transmission housing. that kept the crank from turning but still that > darn > > bolt is tight, a long piece of pipe over a 36 in breaker bar just managed > to > > snap my extensions, all of them, and all my sockets. eventually the > bolt > > did come out as noted before. impact wrench, impact socket, 160psi, and > as > > short of hose as possible (15ft) to the impact wrench. > > > > its standard thread. lefty loosey. > > > > |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
A word to the wise; get the crank bolt broken loose before you start on the
timing belt replacement project. Fortunately my son works at a body and paint shop so we are going to load the car onto the flatbed tow truck on Monday to go use his air impact driver. I do have a few choice words for Honda. :-) Jay C. "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:hpZTa.123519$sY2.56015@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... > Thanks, > > I'm resting today to build up for the big day tomorrow. ;-) If I break two > sockets, I'll tow the car somewhere to have someone else break their socket > with an air impact driver. > > Jay C. > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <guest@hotmail.com> wrote in message > news:3F205835.6872B5A5@hotmail.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > Okay, it looks like I will have to make a special tool out of an old bed > > > rail or some other angle iron which spans the drive belt pulley face and > has > > > a couple of holes for bolts to go through the pulley (gently > tightened). > > > Four feet long should do it. I'll need to allow another hole for the > > > socket/short breaker bar which will be anchored on the floor or engine > > > compartment. Easy does it, so I don't bend the pulley when I use the > four > > > foot angle iron for my new lever/wrench. > > > > > > The alternative of pulling off the starter and wedging a large screw > driver > > > into the flywheel seems like too much work. > > > > > > ...pray for me ;-) > > > > > > Jay > > > > > > "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote in message > > > news:x6VTa.67453$zwL.13660@news04.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... > > > > > > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > > news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... > > > > > > > > . > > > > > > > > > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or > > > lefty-loosey? > > > > > > > > Yes. > > > > > > > > > > > > I used a piece of angle steel with 2 holes in it, securing the flywheel to > the > > transmission housing. that kept the crank from turning but still that > darn > > bolt is tight, a long piece of pipe over a 36 in breaker bar just managed > to > > snap my extensions, all of them, and all my sockets. eventually the > bolt > > did come out as noted before. impact wrench, impact socket, 160psi, and > as > > short of hose as possible (15ft) to the impact wrench. > > > > its standard thread. lefty loosey. > > > > |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
Your '95 200sx has a timing chain. The only reason you will ever have to
deal with the bolt will be if the front oil seal ever leaks. On 7/25/03 8:47 PM, in article e821bab6.0307251747.53ef6019@posting.google.com, "John D." <jcdech@hotmail.com> wrote: > Jay, > > Don't get angry with Honda...ALL crankshaft bolts are like that! > > My tiny 1973 Datsun 1200 engine for example...couldn't get the bolt > loose no matter what technique I tried. Had to get help. I do not look > forward to the day I have to get my 1995 Nissan 200SX SE's bolt loose > but at only 24000 miles on it, it probably won't be any time soon. > > In short, expect it to be hard to get off no matter what brand of car. > > You're right, if you can't get it off you can't get the rest of the > job done...you're stopped right up front. > > John D. > > > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > news:<idhUa.145497$ye4.100256@sccrnsc01>... >> A word to the wise; get the crank bolt broken loose before you start on the >> timing belt replacement project. >> >> Fortunately my son works at a body and paint shop so we are going to load >> the car onto the flatbed tow truck on Monday to go use his air impact >> driver. >> >> I do have a few choice words for Honda. :-) >> >> Jay C. >> >> >> >> "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message >> news:hpZTa.123519$sY2.56015@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... >>> Thanks, >>> >>> I'm resting today to build up for the big day tomorrow. ;-) If I break two >>> sockets, I'll tow the car somewhere to have someone else break their >> socket >>> with an air impact driver. >>> >>> Jay C. >>> >>> >>> "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <guest@hotmail.com> wrote in message >>> news:3F205835.6872B5A5@hotmail.com... >>>> "Jay C." wrote: >>>> >>>>> Okay, it looks like I will have to make a special tool out of an old >> bed >>>>> rail or some other angle iron which spans the drive belt pulley face >> and >> has >>>>> a couple of holes for bolts to go through the pulley (gently >> tightened). >>>>> Four feet long should do it. I'll need to allow another hole for the >>>>> socket/short breaker bar which will be anchored on the floor or engine >>>>> compartment. Easy does it, so I don't bend the pulley when I use the >> four >>>>> foot angle iron for my new lever/wrench. >>>>> >>>>> The alternative of pulling off the starter and wedging a large screw >> driver >>>>> into the flywheel seems like too much work. >>>>> >>>>> ...pray for me ;-) >>>>> >>>>> Jay >>>>> >>>>> "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote in message >>>>> news:x6VTa.67453$zwL.13660@news04.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... >>>>>> >>>>>> "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message >>>>>> news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... >>>>>> >>>>>> . >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or >> lefty-loosey? >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>> I used a piece of angle steel with 2 holes in it, securing the flywheel >> to >> the >>>> transmission housing. that kept the crank from turning but still that >> darn >>>> bolt is tight, a long piece of pipe over a 36 in breaker bar just >> managed >> to >>>> snap my extensions, all of them, and all my sockets. eventually the >> bolt >>>> did come out as noted before. impact wrench, impact socket, 160psi, >> and >> as >>>> short of hose as possible (15ft) to the impact wrench. >>>> >>>> its standard thread. lefty loosey. >>>> >>> >>> |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
Your '95 200sx has a timing chain. The only reason you will ever have to
deal with the bolt will be if the front oil seal ever leaks. On 7/25/03 8:47 PM, in article e821bab6.0307251747.53ef6019@posting.google.com, "John D." <jcdech@hotmail.com> wrote: > Jay, > > Don't get angry with Honda...ALL crankshaft bolts are like that! > > My tiny 1973 Datsun 1200 engine for example...couldn't get the bolt > loose no matter what technique I tried. Had to get help. I do not look > forward to the day I have to get my 1995 Nissan 200SX SE's bolt loose > but at only 24000 miles on it, it probably won't be any time soon. > > In short, expect it to be hard to get off no matter what brand of car. > > You're right, if you can't get it off you can't get the rest of the > job done...you're stopped right up front. > > John D. > > > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > news:<idhUa.145497$ye4.100256@sccrnsc01>... >> A word to the wise; get the crank bolt broken loose before you start on the >> timing belt replacement project. >> >> Fortunately my son works at a body and paint shop so we are going to load >> the car onto the flatbed tow truck on Monday to go use his air impact >> driver. >> >> I do have a few choice words for Honda. :-) >> >> Jay C. >> >> >> >> "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message >> news:hpZTa.123519$sY2.56015@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... >>> Thanks, >>> >>> I'm resting today to build up for the big day tomorrow. ;-) If I break two >>> sockets, I'll tow the car somewhere to have someone else break their >> socket >>> with an air impact driver. >>> >>> Jay C. >>> >>> >>> "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <guest@hotmail.com> wrote in message >>> news:3F205835.6872B5A5@hotmail.com... >>>> "Jay C." wrote: >>>> >>>>> Okay, it looks like I will have to make a special tool out of an old >> bed >>>>> rail or some other angle iron which spans the drive belt pulley face >> and >> has >>>>> a couple of holes for bolts to go through the pulley (gently >> tightened). >>>>> Four feet long should do it. I'll need to allow another hole for the >>>>> socket/short breaker bar which will be anchored on the floor or engine >>>>> compartment. Easy does it, so I don't bend the pulley when I use the >> four >>>>> foot angle iron for my new lever/wrench. >>>>> >>>>> The alternative of pulling off the starter and wedging a large screw >> driver >>>>> into the flywheel seems like too much work. >>>>> >>>>> ...pray for me ;-) >>>>> >>>>> Jay >>>>> >>>>> "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote in message >>>>> news:x6VTa.67453$zwL.13660@news04.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... >>>>>> >>>>>> "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message >>>>>> news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... >>>>>> >>>>>> . >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or >> lefty-loosey? >>>>>> >>>>>> Yes. >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>> >>>> I used a piece of angle steel with 2 holes in it, securing the flywheel >> to >> the >>>> transmission housing. that kept the crank from turning but still that >> darn >>>> bolt is tight, a long piece of pipe over a 36 in breaker bar just >> managed >> to >>>> snap my extensions, all of them, and all my sockets. eventually the >> bolt >>>> did come out as noted before. impact wrench, impact socket, 160psi, >> and >> as >>>> short of hose as possible (15ft) to the impact wrench. >>>> >>>> its standard thread. lefty loosey. >>>> >>> >>> |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
Yes, I knew about the Nissan having a chain, but you see I had to
remove my '73 Datsun 1200's crankshaft bolt to replace the timing chain (when the car was about 24 years old at that time, it's still running) and I expect to keep the Nissan "indefinitely" also. BTW, the Datsun's ONE chain is a whole lot easier than the VTC DOHC Nissan engine's TWO chains are going to be...and its associated gears, etc. But as you said, that shouldn't happen for a LONG time...if ever. I hardly put any miles on the car, presently only about 3000-4000 a year. At that rate, 100K will take me almost 19 years...I may not even live long enough to worry about it! ;-) John D. "E. Meyer" <e.meyer@ieee.org> wrote in message news:<BB47F767.68DA%e.meyer@ieee.org>... > Your '95 200sx has a timing chain. The only reason you will ever have to > deal with the bolt will be if the front oil seal ever leaks. > > On 7/25/03 8:47 PM, in article > e821bab6.0307251747.53ef6019@posting.google.com, "John D." > <jcdech@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > Jay, > > > > Don't get angry with Honda...ALL crankshaft bolts are like that! > > > > My tiny 1973 Datsun 1200 engine for example...couldn't get the bolt > > loose no matter what technique I tried. Had to get help. I do not look > > forward to the day I have to get my 1995 Nissan 200SX SE's bolt loose > > but at only 24000 miles on it, it probably won't be any time soon. > > > > In short, expect it to be hard to get off no matter what brand of car. > > > > You're right, if you can't get it off you can't get the rest of the > > job done...you're stopped right up front. > > > > John D. > > > > > > > > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > news:<idhUa.145497$ye4.100256@sccrnsc01>... > >> A word to the wise; get the crank bolt broken loose before you start on the > >> timing belt replacement project. > >> > >> Fortunately my son works at a body and paint shop so we are going to load > >> the car onto the flatbed tow truck on Monday to go use his air impact > >> driver. > >> > >> I do have a few choice words for Honda. :-) > >> > >> Jay C. > >> > >> > >> > >> "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > >> news:hpZTa.123519$sY2.56015@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... > >>> Thanks, > >>> > >>> I'm resting today to build up for the big day tomorrow. ;-) If I break two > >>> sockets, I'll tow the car somewhere to have someone else break their > socket > >>> with an air impact driver. > >>> > >>> Jay C. > >>> > >>> > >>> "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <guest@hotmail.com> wrote in message > >>> news:3F205835.6872B5A5@hotmail.com... > >>>> "Jay C." wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> Okay, it looks like I will have to make a special tool out of an old > bed > >>>>> rail or some other angle iron which spans the drive belt pulley face > >> and > >> has > >>>>> a couple of holes for bolts to go through the pulley (gently > tightened). > >>>>> Four feet long should do it. I'll need to allow another hole for the > >>>>> socket/short breaker bar which will be anchored on the floor or engine > >>>>> compartment. Easy does it, so I don't bend the pulley when I use the > four > >>>>> foot angle iron for my new lever/wrench. > >>>>> > >>>>> The alternative of pulling off the starter and wedging a large screw > driver > >>>>> into the flywheel seems like too much work. > >>>>> > >>>>> ...pray for me ;-) > >>>>> > >>>>> Jay > >>>>> > >>>>> "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote in message > >>>>> news:x6VTa.67453$zwL.13660@news04.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... > >>>>>> > >>>>>> "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > >>>>>> news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... > >>>>>> > >>>>>> . > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or > lefty-loosey? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Yes. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>> > >>>> I used a piece of angle steel with 2 holes in it, securing the flywheel > >> to > >> the > >>>> transmission housing. that kept the crank from turning but still that > darn > >>>> bolt is tight, a long piece of pipe over a 36 in breaker bar just > >> managed > >> to > >>>> snap my extensions, all of them, and all my sockets. eventually the > bolt > >>>> did come out as noted before. impact wrench, impact socket, 160psi, > >> and > >> as > >>>> short of hose as possible (15ft) to the impact wrench. > >>>> > >>>> its standard thread. lefty loosey. > >>>> > >>> > >>> |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
Yes, I knew about the Nissan having a chain, but you see I had to
remove my '73 Datsun 1200's crankshaft bolt to replace the timing chain (when the car was about 24 years old at that time, it's still running) and I expect to keep the Nissan "indefinitely" also. BTW, the Datsun's ONE chain is a whole lot easier than the VTC DOHC Nissan engine's TWO chains are going to be...and its associated gears, etc. But as you said, that shouldn't happen for a LONG time...if ever. I hardly put any miles on the car, presently only about 3000-4000 a year. At that rate, 100K will take me almost 19 years...I may not even live long enough to worry about it! ;-) John D. "E. Meyer" <e.meyer@ieee.org> wrote in message news:<BB47F767.68DA%e.meyer@ieee.org>... > Your '95 200sx has a timing chain. The only reason you will ever have to > deal with the bolt will be if the front oil seal ever leaks. > > On 7/25/03 8:47 PM, in article > e821bab6.0307251747.53ef6019@posting.google.com, "John D." > <jcdech@hotmail.com> wrote: > > > Jay, > > > > Don't get angry with Honda...ALL crankshaft bolts are like that! > > > > My tiny 1973 Datsun 1200 engine for example...couldn't get the bolt > > loose no matter what technique I tried. Had to get help. I do not look > > forward to the day I have to get my 1995 Nissan 200SX SE's bolt loose > > but at only 24000 miles on it, it probably won't be any time soon. > > > > In short, expect it to be hard to get off no matter what brand of car. > > > > You're right, if you can't get it off you can't get the rest of the > > job done...you're stopped right up front. > > > > John D. > > > > > > > > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > news:<idhUa.145497$ye4.100256@sccrnsc01>... > >> A word to the wise; get the crank bolt broken loose before you start on the > >> timing belt replacement project. > >> > >> Fortunately my son works at a body and paint shop so we are going to load > >> the car onto the flatbed tow truck on Monday to go use his air impact > >> driver. > >> > >> I do have a few choice words for Honda. :-) > >> > >> Jay C. > >> > >> > >> > >> "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > >> news:hpZTa.123519$sY2.56015@rwcrnsc51.ops.asp.att. net... > >>> Thanks, > >>> > >>> I'm resting today to build up for the big day tomorrow. ;-) If I break two > >>> sockets, I'll tow the car somewhere to have someone else break their > socket > >>> with an air impact driver. > >>> > >>> Jay C. > >>> > >>> > >>> "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <guest@hotmail.com> wrote in message > >>> news:3F205835.6872B5A5@hotmail.com... > >>>> "Jay C." wrote: > >>>> > >>>>> Okay, it looks like I will have to make a special tool out of an old > bed > >>>>> rail or some other angle iron which spans the drive belt pulley face > >> and > >> has > >>>>> a couple of holes for bolts to go through the pulley (gently > tightened). > >>>>> Four feet long should do it. I'll need to allow another hole for the > >>>>> socket/short breaker bar which will be anchored on the floor or engine > >>>>> compartment. Easy does it, so I don't bend the pulley when I use the > four > >>>>> foot angle iron for my new lever/wrench. > >>>>> > >>>>> The alternative of pulling off the starter and wedging a large screw > driver > >>>>> into the flywheel seems like too much work. > >>>>> > >>>>> ...pray for me ;-) > >>>>> > >>>>> Jay > >>>>> > >>>>> "Stephen Bigelow" <sbigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote in message > >>>>> news:x6VTa.67453$zwL.13660@news04.bloor.is.net.cab le.rogers.com... > >>>>>> > >>>>>> "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > >>>>>> news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... > >>>>>> > >>>>>> . > >>>>>>> > >>>>>>> Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or > lefty-loosey? > >>>>>> > >>>>>> Yes. > >>>>>> > >>>>>> > >>>> > >>>> I used a piece of angle steel with 2 holes in it, securing the flywheel > >> to > >> the > >>>> transmission housing. that kept the crank from turning but still that > darn > >>>> bolt is tight, a long piece of pipe over a 36 in breaker bar just > >> managed > >> to > >>>> snap my extensions, all of them, and all my sockets. eventually the > bolt > >>>> did come out as noted before. impact wrench, impact socket, 160psi, > >> and > >> as > >>>> short of hose as possible (15ft) to the impact wrench. > >>>> > >>>> its standard thread. lefty loosey. > >>>> > >>> > >>> |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
For my Acura's I bought a special tool that holds the crank pulley in place
while torque is applied to the crank bolt. The tool fits the hex inside the pulley and has an opening for the socket on the bolt to fit through. It worked great but cost about $40. The same tool fits most Honda's as well. I think the manufacturer is Scheley Products and the part number is SP 60100. I bought the tool on-line at thetoolwarehouse.net. -Acura Legend Guy "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... > Umm. Is the pulley-to-crankshaft bolt a left or right handed? It is so > friggin tight that I might have go to Pep Boys and buy one of there > specialty PowerBuilt tools to help remove it. I borrowed an industrial > strength electric impact driver but have been assuming the the bolt is right > handed. > > Some of the other suggestions on the Net were to use the starter in short > bursts to help break loose the bolt. I don't like the idea but their setup > suggests that the bolt is a left handed one. The crank rotates ccw so if a > breaker bar were anchored in any location, the starter action would tend to > tighten the bolt if it were a right hand thead. > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or lefty-loosey? > > Thanks, > > Jay C. > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > message news:3F1EF58E.4CC3810A@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > Yeah, you're right. I will probably leave things alone if it is > possible. > > > > > > The biggest problem I am having right now is trying to get the drive > belt > > > pulley-crank bolt loose. I can't take the bottom timing belt cover off > to > > > finish the R & R of the timing belt until I do. > > > > > > Hopefully I can round up an impact driver. :-( > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote > in > > > message news:3F1EE3A2.758C7D28@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want > to do > > > a > > > > > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has > > > nearly > > > > > 1/4 million miles on it. > > > > > > > > > > Jay > > > > > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> > wrote > > > in > > > > > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > > > > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car > (in a > > > > > cooler > > > > > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several > teeth > > > in > > > > > one > > > > > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at > a > > > > > traffic > > > > > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she > > > couldn't > > > > > > > restart it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do > any > > > > > damage). > > > > > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to > > > restart > > > > > it. > > > > > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for > > > possible > > > > > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > > > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to > the > > > > > house. > > > > > > > It > > > > > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the > > > middle > > > > > of a > > > > > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a > > > little > > > > > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is > > > free > > > > > > > wheeling > > > > > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess > that > > > could > > > > > be > > > > > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on > this > > > > > > > particular > > > > > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check > first? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the > > > compression > > > > > on > > > > > > all cyclinders. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you may find if you rebuild the head, the lower end of the engine may > get > > > > stressed more with the additional compression and quickly fail. Ive > seen > > > this > > > > happen on several vehichles with many miles on the odo, with a new > /fresh > > > > cyclinder head. > > > > > > > > should you decide to do the head work, its not much more work to slap > new > > > > piston rings and rod bearings in the thing. > > > > all assuming your capable of the task. > > > > > > > > I had incredible difficulty removing mine as well as others, The impact > wrench > > with a short 15ft of hose and 160 psi finally broke the darn thing loose > after > > snapping 4 sockets, and 1 extension. try to use no extensions and a good > > impact socket, it makes all the difference. > > > > you will most likely have to anchor the flywheel or flexplate to the > > transmission using some metal strapping to keep the engine from turing > over. > > someone on the web has a picture of the "flywheel anchor" on the web. > > good luck > > > > |
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
For my Acura's I bought a special tool that holds the crank pulley in place
while torque is applied to the crank bolt. The tool fits the hex inside the pulley and has an opening for the socket on the bolt to fit through. It worked great but cost about $40. The same tool fits most Honda's as well. I think the manufacturer is Scheley Products and the part number is SP 60100. I bought the tool on-line at thetoolwarehouse.net. -Acura Legend Guy "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53... > Umm. Is the pulley-to-crankshaft bolt a left or right handed? It is so > friggin tight that I might have go to Pep Boys and buy one of there > specialty PowerBuilt tools to help remove it. I borrowed an industrial > strength electric impact driver but have been assuming the the bolt is right > handed. > > Some of the other suggestions on the Net were to use the starter in short > bursts to help break loose the bolt. I don't like the idea but their setup > suggests that the bolt is a left handed one. The crank rotates ccw so if a > breaker bar were anchored in any location, the starter action would tend to > tighten the bolt if it were a right hand thead. > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or lefty-loosey? > > Thanks, > > Jay C. > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote in > message news:3F1EF58E.4CC3810A@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > Yeah, you're right. I will probably leave things alone if it is > possible. > > > > > > The biggest problem I am having right now is trying to get the drive > belt > > > pulley-crank bolt loose. I can't take the bottom timing belt cover off > to > > > finish the R & R of the timing belt until I do. > > > > > > Hopefully I can round up an impact driver. :-( > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> wrote > in > > > message news:3F1EE3A2.758C7D28@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > > > > > Thanks, > > > > > > > > > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if I want > to do > > > a > > > > > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The car has > > > nearly > > > > > 1/4 million miles on it. > > > > > > > > > > Jay > > > > > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com> > wrote > > > in > > > > > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com... > > > > > > "Jay C." wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating the car > (in a > > > > > cooler > > > > > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing several > teeth > > > in > > > > > one > > > > > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow stop at > a > > > > > traffic > > > > > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled and she > > > couldn't > > > > > > > restart it. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough to do > any > > > > > damage). > > > > > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I tried to > > > restart > > > > > it. > > > > > > > The timing sounded like it was off. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I look for > > > possible > > > > > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message > > > > > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03... > > > > > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX back to > the > > > > > house. > > > > > > > It > > > > > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car quit in the > > > middle > > > > > of a > > > > > > > > busy intersection. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does sound a > > > little > > > > > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more like it is > > > free > > > > > > > wheeling > > > > > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I guess > that > > > could > > > > > be > > > > > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an expert on > this > > > > > > > particular > > > > > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to check > first? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check the > > > compression > > > > > on > > > > > > all cyclinders. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > you may find if you rebuild the head, the lower end of the engine may > get > > > > stressed more with the additional compression and quickly fail. Ive > seen > > > this > > > > happen on several vehichles with many miles on the odo, with a new > /fresh > > > > cyclinder head. > > > > > > > > should you decide to do the head work, its not much more work to slap > new > > > > piston rings and rod bearings in the thing. > > > > all assuming your capable of the task. > > > > > > > > I had incredible difficulty removing mine as well as others, The impact > wrench > > with a short 15ft of hose and 160 psi finally broke the darn thing loose > after > > snapping 4 sockets, and 1 extension. try to use no extensions and a good > > impact socket, it makes all the difference. > > > > you will most likely have to anchor the flywheel or flexplate to the > > transmission using some metal strapping to keep the engine from turing > over. > > someone on the web has a picture of the "flywheel anchor" on the web. > > good luck > > > > |
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