Lanning

George, what could be the reason(s) my '02 "Si" has always wandered too
much?

I should say that an unusual thing about my car is that it came with three
of the tires having the cosmetic side toward the inside. I doubt Honda built
it like that.

Also, when I got the extended warranty contract, I saw that the end date was
about five months earlier than it should be. Calling the dealer and Honda, I
find that an incorrect "in-service date" was used. The car was built a full
year before I bought it, and it seems to have basically been on my dealer's
lot almost that long according to the shipping information. It had about 30
miles on it. Does this all make you think something is fishy, like something
happened to the car, or even that it could have been sold albeit briefly?

The dealer said they have fixed the extended warranty date, and that I'll be
getting a new warranty contract in the mail. As for the tires, they said to
bring the car in for reversing the three tires and balancing them. They
didn't even question me as to the possibility of my having done something to
create the tire situation.

There doesn't seem to be any TSB for wandering (most irritating on the
highway), but two other posters here who have the new model "Si" have noted
the same thing after I mentioned it here.

I talked to a tire shop mgr. who said new cars sometimes have their
alignment ruined by the downforce of being tied down during shipment, and
this car was made in England.

So, I hope this doesn't read too convoluted. Thanks for any help. Roy.


"George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in message
news:3f4dac50.71986248@news.tellurian.com...
| On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 02:14:58 GMT, "vinniemak" <vinniemak@netzero.net>
| wrote:
|
| >My wife has a 1991 Honda Civic hatchback with 121K miles. The car still
| >runs great. The resale is down low enough that for the last 3 years, I
| >said...if this car has any issues we'll get rid of it and get a new
| >one...BUT HONDA'S DON'T DIE EASY....this one still has 5 years left on it
at
| >least. No problems...excepting..
| >
| >The tire wear is somewhat uneven. I noticed the "inside" to be a little
| >more worn than the outside. I have seen camber kits for Honda Civic
| >hatchbacks being sold on Ebay.
|
| Is it only on the front and evenly worn on the inside on both sides? As
| the suspension "settles" on those cars, the front wheels tend to develop a
| slight toe-out, which can easily be corrected by cranking half a turn or
so
| on both tie rod ends. There isn't much to adjust otherwise but at that
age
| it might be worth checking on radius rod bushings and and other bushings &
| ball joints for wear.
|
| Rgds, George Macdonald
|
| "Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who,
me??

vinniemak

Hi, George:

To answer your question, the wear seems on the inside on the front tires.
The back ones are older, as I had bought a pair about 25,000 miles ago or
so, for the front. I am going to be changing them out (all 4) soon if I
still have the Civic in Nov (my wife is considering a new CRV, but she's not
sure yet...yawn !!).

Lanning....sorry to hear about your tire trouble on a brand new Si.

Vinnie
=========

"Lanning" <LanningREMOOVE@THIScox.net> wrote in message
news:hHt3b.75938$xf.62712@lakeread04...
> George, what could be the reason(s) my '02 "Si" has always wandered too
> much?
>
> I should say that an unusual thing about my car is that it came with three
> of the tires having the cosmetic side toward the inside. I doubt Honda
built
> it like that.
>
> Also, when I got the extended warranty contract, I saw that the end date
was
> about five months earlier than it should be. Calling the dealer and Honda,
I
> find that an incorrect "in-service date" was used. The car was built a
full
> year before I bought it, and it seems to have basically been on my
dealer's
> lot almost that long according to the shipping information. It had about
30
> miles on it. Does this all make you think something is fishy, like
something
> happened to the car, or even that it could have been sold albeit briefly?
>
> The dealer said they have fixed the extended warranty date, and that I'll
be
> getting a new warranty contract in the mail. As for the tires, they said
to
> bring the car in for reversing the three tires and balancing them. They
> didn't even question me as to the possibility of my having done something
to
> create the tire situation.
>
> There doesn't seem to be any TSB for wandering (most irritating on the
> highway), but two other posters here who have the new model "Si" have
noted
> the same thing after I mentioned it here.
>
> I talked to a tire shop mgr. who said new cars sometimes have their
> alignment ruined by the downforce of being tied down during shipment, and
> this car was made in England.
>
> So, I hope this doesn't read too convoluted. Thanks for any help. Roy.
>
>
> "George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in message
> news:3f4dac50.71986248@news.tellurian.com...
> | On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 02:14:58 GMT, "vinniemak" <vinniemak@netzero.net>
> | wrote:
> |
> | >My wife has a 1991 Honda Civic hatchback with 121K miles. The car
still
> | >runs great. The resale is down low enough that for the last 3 years, I
> | >said...if this car has any issues we'll get rid of it and get a new
> | >one...BUT HONDA'S DON'T DIE EASY....this one still has 5 years left on
it
> at
> | >least. No problems...excepting..
> | >
> | >The tire wear is somewhat uneven. I noticed the "inside" to be a
little
> | >more worn than the outside. I have seen camber kits for Honda Civic
> | >hatchbacks being sold on Ebay.
> |
> | Is it only on the front and evenly worn on the inside on both sides?
As
> | the suspension "settles" on those cars, the front wheels tend to develop
a
> | slight toe-out, which can easily be corrected by cranking half a turn or
> so
> | on both tie rod ends. There isn't much to adjust otherwise but at that
> age
> | it might be worth checking on radius rod bushings and and other bushings
&
> | ball joints for wear.
> |
> | Rgds, George Macdonald
> |
> | "Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who,
> me??
>
>

vinniemak

Hi, George:

To answer your question, the wear seems on the inside on the front tires.
The back ones are older, as I had bought a pair about 25,000 miles ago or
so, for the front. I am going to be changing them out (all 4) soon if I
still have the Civic in Nov (my wife is considering a new CRV, but she's not
sure yet...yawn !!).

Lanning....sorry to hear about your tire trouble on a brand new Si.

Vinnie
=========

"Lanning" <LanningREMOOVE@THIScox.net> wrote in message
news:hHt3b.75938$xf.62712@lakeread04...
> George, what could be the reason(s) my '02 "Si" has always wandered too
> much?
>
> I should say that an unusual thing about my car is that it came with three
> of the tires having the cosmetic side toward the inside. I doubt Honda
built
> it like that.
>
> Also, when I got the extended warranty contract, I saw that the end date
was
> about five months earlier than it should be. Calling the dealer and Honda,
I
> find that an incorrect "in-service date" was used. The car was built a
full
> year before I bought it, and it seems to have basically been on my
dealer's
> lot almost that long according to the shipping information. It had about
30
> miles on it. Does this all make you think something is fishy, like
something
> happened to the car, or even that it could have been sold albeit briefly?
>
> The dealer said they have fixed the extended warranty date, and that I'll
be
> getting a new warranty contract in the mail. As for the tires, they said
to
> bring the car in for reversing the three tires and balancing them. They
> didn't even question me as to the possibility of my having done something
to
> create the tire situation.
>
> There doesn't seem to be any TSB for wandering (most irritating on the
> highway), but two other posters here who have the new model "Si" have
noted
> the same thing after I mentioned it here.
>
> I talked to a tire shop mgr. who said new cars sometimes have their
> alignment ruined by the downforce of being tied down during shipment, and
> this car was made in England.
>
> So, I hope this doesn't read too convoluted. Thanks for any help. Roy.
>
>
> "George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in message
> news:3f4dac50.71986248@news.tellurian.com...
> | On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 02:14:58 GMT, "vinniemak" <vinniemak@netzero.net>
> | wrote:
> |
> | >My wife has a 1991 Honda Civic hatchback with 121K miles. The car
still
> | >runs great. The resale is down low enough that for the last 3 years, I
> | >said...if this car has any issues we'll get rid of it and get a new
> | >one...BUT HONDA'S DON'T DIE EASY....this one still has 5 years left on
it
> at
> | >least. No problems...excepting..
> | >
> | >The tire wear is somewhat uneven. I noticed the "inside" to be a
little
> | >more worn than the outside. I have seen camber kits for Honda Civic
> | >hatchbacks being sold on Ebay.
> |
> | Is it only on the front and evenly worn on the inside on both sides?
As
> | the suspension "settles" on those cars, the front wheels tend to develop
a
> | slight toe-out, which can easily be corrected by cranking half a turn or
> so
> | on both tie rod ends. There isn't much to adjust otherwise but at that
> age
> | it might be worth checking on radius rod bushings and and other bushings
&
> | ball joints for wear.
> |
> | Rgds, George Macdonald
> |
> | "Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who,
> me??
>
>

Lanning

Thanks, George, that's really good to hear your advice about doing a CarFax
check and favoring toe-in. I'll certainly do the web check, and probably
I'll never rest until I get a good shop to do an alignment. By cosmetic side
of the tire I mean that the sidewall of one side has a two or three inch
wide band of fine radial lines and the other side is rather blank.
Thanks, again, Roy.



"George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in message
news:3f4fb0e4.29821946@news.tellurian.com...
| On Thu, 28 Aug 2003 15:34:21 -0500, "Lanning" <LanningREMOOVE@THIScox.net>
| wrote:
|
| >George, what could be the reason(s) my '02 "Si" has always wandered too
| >much?
| >
| >I should say that an unusual thing about my car is that it came with
three
| >of the tires having the cosmetic side toward the inside. I doubt Honda
built
| >it like that.
|
| Hmm I don't know the car in detail so I'm not sure what cosmetic side
means
| on a tire, unless its a unidirectional tire and has some special
indication
| of such - worth checking.
|
| >Also, when I got the extended warranty contract, I saw that the end date
was
| >about five months earlier than it should be. Calling the dealer and
Honda, I
| >find that an incorrect "in-service date" was used. The car was built a
full
| >year before I bought it, and it seems to have basically been on my
dealer's
| >lot almost that long according to the shipping information. It had about
30
| >miles on it. Does this all make you think something is fishy, like
something
| >happened to the car, or even that it could have been sold albeit briefly?
|
| I'd think if it had been sold, there would be traceable records, CarFax,
| State docs, etc., by VIN. At worst, it was in a minor accident on a test
| drive or salesman's screw up in the parking lot. I've seen the idiots
| clearing the showroom at end of day lock-down and they drive them like
| they're stealing them... for a few hundred meters at most. Never buy a
| showroom car. OTOH it may have been just slightly out of adjustment from
| the factory.
|
| >The dealer said they have fixed the extended warranty date, and that I'll
be
| >getting a new warranty contract in the mail. As for the tires, they said
to
| >bring the car in for reversing the three tires and balancing them. They
| >didn't even question me as to the possibility of my having done something
to
| >create the tire situation.
| >
| >There doesn't seem to be any TSB for wandering (most irritating on the
| >highway), but two other posters here who have the new model "Si" have
noted
| >the same thing after I mentioned it here.
| >
| >I talked to a tire shop mgr. who said new cars sometimes have their
| >alignment ruined by the downforce of being tied down during shipment, and
| >this car was made in England.
|
| I think, in your situation, I'd get the best shop you can find to do an
| alignment check and ask for the front toe to favor the toe-in end of
| adjustment tolerance. IIRC most cases of wander in newish cars are due to
| even a small amount of toe-out.
|
| >
| >"George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in
message
| >news:3f4dac50.71986248@news.tellurian.com...
| >| On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 02:14:58 GMT, "vinniemak" <vinniemak@netzero.net>
| >| wrote:
| >|
| >| >My wife has a 1991 Honda Civic hatchback with 121K miles. The car
still
| >| >runs great. The resale is down low enough that for the last 3 years,
I
| >| >said...if this car has any issues we'll get rid of it and get a new
| >| >one...BUT HONDA'S DON'T DIE EASY....this one still has 5 years left on
it
| >at
| >| >least. No problems...excepting..
| >| >
| >| >The tire wear is somewhat uneven. I noticed the "inside" to be a
little
| >| >more worn than the outside. I have seen camber kits for Honda Civic
| >| >hatchbacks being sold on Ebay.
| >|
| >| Is it only on the front and evenly worn on the inside on both sides?
As
| >| the suspension "settles" on those cars, the front wheels tend to
develop a
| >| slight toe-out, which can easily be corrected by cranking half a turn
or
| >so
| >| on both tie rod ends. There isn't much to adjust otherwise but at that
| >age
| >| it might be worth checking on radius rod bushings and and other
bushings &
| >| ball joints for wear.
| >|
| >| Rgds, George Macdonald
| >|
| >| "Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" -
Who,
| >me??
| >
| >
|
| Rgds, George Macdonald
|
| "Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who,
me??

Lanning

Thanks, George, that's really good to hear your advice about doing a CarFax
check and favoring toe-in. I'll certainly do the web check, and probably
I'll never rest until I get a good shop to do an alignment. By cosmetic side
of the tire I mean that the sidewall of one side has a two or three inch
wide band of fine radial lines and the other side is rather blank.
Thanks, again, Roy.



"George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in message
news:3f4fb0e4.29821946@news.tellurian.com...
| On Thu, 28 Aug 2003 15:34:21 -0500, "Lanning" <LanningREMOOVE@THIScox.net>
| wrote:
|
| >George, what could be the reason(s) my '02 "Si" has always wandered too
| >much?
| >
| >I should say that an unusual thing about my car is that it came with
three
| >of the tires having the cosmetic side toward the inside. I doubt Honda
built
| >it like that.
|
| Hmm I don't know the car in detail so I'm not sure what cosmetic side
means
| on a tire, unless its a unidirectional tire and has some special
indication
| of such - worth checking.
|
| >Also, when I got the extended warranty contract, I saw that the end date
was
| >about five months earlier than it should be. Calling the dealer and
Honda, I
| >find that an incorrect "in-service date" was used. The car was built a
full
| >year before I bought it, and it seems to have basically been on my
dealer's
| >lot almost that long according to the shipping information. It had about
30
| >miles on it. Does this all make you think something is fishy, like
something
| >happened to the car, or even that it could have been sold albeit briefly?
|
| I'd think if it had been sold, there would be traceable records, CarFax,
| State docs, etc., by VIN. At worst, it was in a minor accident on a test
| drive or salesman's screw up in the parking lot. I've seen the idiots
| clearing the showroom at end of day lock-down and they drive them like
| they're stealing them... for a few hundred meters at most. Never buy a
| showroom car. OTOH it may have been just slightly out of adjustment from
| the factory.
|
| >The dealer said they have fixed the extended warranty date, and that I'll
be
| >getting a new warranty contract in the mail. As for the tires, they said
to
| >bring the car in for reversing the three tires and balancing them. They
| >didn't even question me as to the possibility of my having done something
to
| >create the tire situation.
| >
| >There doesn't seem to be any TSB for wandering (most irritating on the
| >highway), but two other posters here who have the new model "Si" have
noted
| >the same thing after I mentioned it here.
| >
| >I talked to a tire shop mgr. who said new cars sometimes have their
| >alignment ruined by the downforce of being tied down during shipment, and
| >this car was made in England.
|
| I think, in your situation, I'd get the best shop you can find to do an
| alignment check and ask for the front toe to favor the toe-in end of
| adjustment tolerance. IIRC most cases of wander in newish cars are due to
| even a small amount of toe-out.
|
| >
| >"George Macdonald" <fammacd=!SPAM^nothanks@tellurian.com> wrote in
message
| >news:3f4dac50.71986248@news.tellurian.com...
| >| On Wed, 27 Aug 2003 02:14:58 GMT, "vinniemak" <vinniemak@netzero.net>
| >| wrote:
| >|
| >| >My wife has a 1991 Honda Civic hatchback with 121K miles. The car
still
| >| >runs great. The resale is down low enough that for the last 3 years,
I
| >| >said...if this car has any issues we'll get rid of it and get a new
| >| >one...BUT HONDA'S DON'T DIE EASY....this one still has 5 years left on
it
| >at
| >| >least. No problems...excepting..
| >| >
| >| >The tire wear is somewhat uneven. I noticed the "inside" to be a
little
| >| >more worn than the outside. I have seen camber kits for Honda Civic
| >| >hatchbacks being sold on Ebay.
| >|
| >| Is it only on the front and evenly worn on the inside on both sides?
As
| >| the suspension "settles" on those cars, the front wheels tend to
develop a
| >| slight toe-out, which can easily be corrected by cranking half a turn
or
| >so
| >| on both tie rod ends. There isn't much to adjust otherwise but at that
| >age
| >| it might be worth checking on radius rod bushings and and other
bushings &
| >| ball joints for wear.
| >|
| >| Rgds, George Macdonald
| >|
| >| "Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" -
Who,
| >me??
| >
| >
|
| Rgds, George Macdonald
|
| "Just because they're paranoid doesn't mean you're not psychotic" - Who,
me??

Lanning

OK, Eric, thanks, I'll remember "computerized". BTW, I put in my VIN at
CarFax and it said there were *two* transactions, so I'm thinking, "Aha!",
but, to check, I put in the VIN for another car of mine I bought new and it
showed two transactions, also. So, it looks OK as to the car having been
sold before. I'll be asking the service mgr. what could explain the three
tires mounted wrong, though.

"Eric" <say.no@spam.now> wrote in message news:3F4FE315.4DB2153F@spam.now...
| Lanning wrote:
| >
| > Thanks, George, that's really good to hear your advice about doing a
CarFax
| > check and favoring toe-in. I'll certainly do the web check, and probably
| > I'll never rest until I get a good shop to do an alignment. By cosmetic
side
| > of the tire I mean that the sidewall of one side has a two or three inch
| > wide band of fine radial lines and the other side is rather blank.
| > Thanks, again, Roy.
| >
|
| A four wheel alignment will be your best bet. The rear toe is often out
on
| Hondas. Try to find a shop that has one of those computerized alignment
| checkers that you drive over.
|
| Eric

Lanning

OK, Eric, thanks, I'll remember "computerized". BTW, I put in my VIN at
CarFax and it said there were *two* transactions, so I'm thinking, "Aha!",
but, to check, I put in the VIN for another car of mine I bought new and it
showed two transactions, also. So, it looks OK as to the car having been
sold before. I'll be asking the service mgr. what could explain the three
tires mounted wrong, though.

"Eric" <say.no@spam.now> wrote in message news:3F4FE315.4DB2153F@spam.now...
| Lanning wrote:
| >
| > Thanks, George, that's really good to hear your advice about doing a
CarFax
| > check and favoring toe-in. I'll certainly do the web check, and probably
| > I'll never rest until I get a good shop to do an alignment. By cosmetic
side
| > of the tire I mean that the sidewall of one side has a two or three inch
| > wide band of fine radial lines and the other side is rather blank.
| > Thanks, again, Roy.
| >
|
| A four wheel alignment will be your best bet. The rear toe is often out
on
| Hondas. Try to find a shop that has one of those computerized alignment
| checkers that you drive over.
|
| Eric