Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
In article <H3XOg.6$s85.5@newsfe08.lga>,
"Seth" <seth_lermanNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote: > Now we have computers that take ALL the factors affecting oil life into > consideration and thus the 3000 OCI of old has morphed into "change the oil > when the computer says to" with a stage of "here are some different > intervals based on use" in between. I would be happier if the computer gave me even a few simple options for explaining whether I was a conservative worrywart who wanted a very conservative interval, or whatever. |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
"Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message
news:elmop-711FE8.14411116092006@nntp2.usenetserver.com... > In article <H3XOg.6$s85.5@newsfe08.lga>, > "Seth" <seth_lermanNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote: > >> Now we have computers that take ALL the factors affecting oil life into >> consideration and thus the 3000 OCI of old has morphed into "change the >> oil >> when the computer says to" with a stage of "here are some different >> intervals based on use" in between. > > I would be happier if the computer gave me even a few simple options for > explaining whether I was a conservative worrywart who wanted a very > conservative interval, or whatever. Maybe next version? My wife's mini-van rather than a simple light, gives it in a percentage. Worriers can do it and reset it at say, 20%??? |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
"Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message
news:elmop-711FE8.14411116092006@nntp2.usenetserver.com... > In article <H3XOg.6$s85.5@newsfe08.lga>, > "Seth" <seth_lermanNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote: > >> Now we have computers that take ALL the factors affecting oil life into >> consideration and thus the 3000 OCI of old has morphed into "change the >> oil >> when the computer says to" with a stage of "here are some different >> intervals based on use" in between. > > I would be happier if the computer gave me even a few simple options for > explaining whether I was a conservative worrywart who wanted a very > conservative interval, or whatever. Maybe next version? My wife's mini-van rather than a simple light, gives it in a percentage. Worriers can do it and reset it at say, 20%??? |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
"Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message
news:elmop-711FE8.14411116092006@nntp2.usenetserver.com... > In article <H3XOg.6$s85.5@newsfe08.lga>, > "Seth" <seth_lermanNOSPAM@hotmail.com> wrote: > >> Now we have computers that take ALL the factors affecting oil life into >> consideration and thus the 3000 OCI of old has morphed into "change the >> oil >> when the computer says to" with a stage of "here are some different >> intervals based on use" in between. > > I would be happier if the computer gave me even a few simple options for > explaining whether I was a conservative worrywart who wanted a very > conservative interval, or whatever. Maybe next version? My wife's mini-van rather than a simple light, gives it in a percentage. Worriers can do it and reset it at say, 20%??? |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
> Now we have computers that take ALL the factors affecting oil life
into > consideration and thus the 3000 OCI of old has morphed into "change the oil > when the computer says to" with a stage of "here are some different > intervals based on use" in between. >My wife's mini-van rather than a simple light, gives it in a percentage. >Worriers can do it and reset it at say, 20%??? This is part of my argument: the Oil Life Meter should NOT be considered the end-all be-all indicator. Like I said, they are very liberal on oil life because of the "cost of ownership" concerns. Honda wins that category in many car magazines (especially the Civic and CR-V), so they are very conscious of the issue. Also, I thought we were talking about Honda's Oil Life Meter the entire time. It measures oil life in percentages; they recommend oil to be changed at 15%. Another reason I don't trust it is because my car sees the rev limiter very frequently (8,200 rpm) and I have been at 6200mi when the OLM reads 20%. I often drive fifteen minutes or less (small town), so one would assume the large number of cold starts would wear out the oil faster. That was the first red flag that made me think twice about the meter. |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
> Now we have computers that take ALL the factors affecting oil life
into > consideration and thus the 3000 OCI of old has morphed into "change the oil > when the computer says to" with a stage of "here are some different > intervals based on use" in between. >My wife's mini-van rather than a simple light, gives it in a percentage. >Worriers can do it and reset it at say, 20%??? This is part of my argument: the Oil Life Meter should NOT be considered the end-all be-all indicator. Like I said, they are very liberal on oil life because of the "cost of ownership" concerns. Honda wins that category in many car magazines (especially the Civic and CR-V), so they are very conscious of the issue. Also, I thought we were talking about Honda's Oil Life Meter the entire time. It measures oil life in percentages; they recommend oil to be changed at 15%. Another reason I don't trust it is because my car sees the rev limiter very frequently (8,200 rpm) and I have been at 6200mi when the OLM reads 20%. I often drive fifteen minutes or less (small town), so one would assume the large number of cold starts would wear out the oil faster. That was the first red flag that made me think twice about the meter. |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
> Now we have computers that take ALL the factors affecting oil life
into > consideration and thus the 3000 OCI of old has morphed into "change the oil > when the computer says to" with a stage of "here are some different > intervals based on use" in between. >My wife's mini-van rather than a simple light, gives it in a percentage. >Worriers can do it and reset it at say, 20%??? This is part of my argument: the Oil Life Meter should NOT be considered the end-all be-all indicator. Like I said, they are very liberal on oil life because of the "cost of ownership" concerns. Honda wins that category in many car magazines (especially the Civic and CR-V), so they are very conscious of the issue. Also, I thought we were talking about Honda's Oil Life Meter the entire time. It measures oil life in percentages; they recommend oil to be changed at 15%. Another reason I don't trust it is because my car sees the rev limiter very frequently (8,200 rpm) and I have been at 6200mi when the OLM reads 20%. I often drive fifteen minutes or less (small town), so one would assume the large number of cold starts would wear out the oil faster. That was the first red flag that made me think twice about the meter. |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
"televascular" <televascular@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1158466524.923136.97010@i42g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com... > > Now we have computers that take ALL the factors affecting oil life > into >> consideration and thus the 3000 OCI of old has morphed into "change the >> oil >> when the computer says to" with a stage of "here are some different >> intervals based on use" in between. > >>My wife's mini-van rather than a simple light, gives it in a percentage. >>Worriers can do it and reset it at say, 20%??? > > This is part of my argument: the Oil Life Meter should NOT be > considered the end-all be-all indicator. Like I said, they are very > liberal on oil life because of the "cost of ownership" concerns. Honda > wins that category in many car magazines (especially the Civic and > CR-V), so they are very conscious of the issue. Repairs due to maintenence are part of the "cost of ownership" equation. Part of why they wil in that category is by not breaking down as much thus requiring costly repairs. > Also, I thought we were talking about Honda's Oil Life Meter the entire > time. It measures oil life in percentages; they recommend oil to be > changed at 15%. Another reason I don't trust it is because my car sees > the rev limiter very frequently (8,200 rpm) and I have been at 6200mi > when the OLM reads 20%. I often drive fifteen minutes or less (small > town), so one would assume the large number of cold starts would wear > out the oil faster. That was the first red flag that made me think > twice about the meter. What does it matter who's oil life meter we're talking about? They all may be a little different from each other, but they will all take more factors other than just mileage into account. If you weren't hitting the rev limiter, the meter might have shows 30% at 6200 instead of just 20%. That means it's working as it should looking at all the factors. You want to change your oil earlier than recommended, go ahead. My entire point in this thread has been that blanket advice without using all the factors is bunk. And when people give advice that differs from others they will be challenged on it. You could go ahead and change your oil at 1500 and I won't care. When you recommend others do the same despite changes in modern engineering (i.e. engines are better, oil is better and we have better ways of predicting it's condition), someone will challenge that advice. |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
"televascular" <televascular@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1158466524.923136.97010@i42g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com... > > Now we have computers that take ALL the factors affecting oil life > into >> consideration and thus the 3000 OCI of old has morphed into "change the >> oil >> when the computer says to" with a stage of "here are some different >> intervals based on use" in between. > >>My wife's mini-van rather than a simple light, gives it in a percentage. >>Worriers can do it and reset it at say, 20%??? > > This is part of my argument: the Oil Life Meter should NOT be > considered the end-all be-all indicator. Like I said, they are very > liberal on oil life because of the "cost of ownership" concerns. Honda > wins that category in many car magazines (especially the Civic and > CR-V), so they are very conscious of the issue. Repairs due to maintenence are part of the "cost of ownership" equation. Part of why they wil in that category is by not breaking down as much thus requiring costly repairs. > Also, I thought we were talking about Honda's Oil Life Meter the entire > time. It measures oil life in percentages; they recommend oil to be > changed at 15%. Another reason I don't trust it is because my car sees > the rev limiter very frequently (8,200 rpm) and I have been at 6200mi > when the OLM reads 20%. I often drive fifteen minutes or less (small > town), so one would assume the large number of cold starts would wear > out the oil faster. That was the first red flag that made me think > twice about the meter. What does it matter who's oil life meter we're talking about? They all may be a little different from each other, but they will all take more factors other than just mileage into account. If you weren't hitting the rev limiter, the meter might have shows 30% at 6200 instead of just 20%. That means it's working as it should looking at all the factors. You want to change your oil earlier than recommended, go ahead. My entire point in this thread has been that blanket advice without using all the factors is bunk. And when people give advice that differs from others they will be challenged on it. You could go ahead and change your oil at 1500 and I won't care. When you recommend others do the same despite changes in modern engineering (i.e. engines are better, oil is better and we have better ways of predicting it's condition), someone will challenge that advice. |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
"televascular" <televascular@yahoo.com> wrote in message
news:1158466524.923136.97010@i42g2000cwa.googlegro ups.com... > > Now we have computers that take ALL the factors affecting oil life > into >> consideration and thus the 3000 OCI of old has morphed into "change the >> oil >> when the computer says to" with a stage of "here are some different >> intervals based on use" in between. > >>My wife's mini-van rather than a simple light, gives it in a percentage. >>Worriers can do it and reset it at say, 20%??? > > This is part of my argument: the Oil Life Meter should NOT be > considered the end-all be-all indicator. Like I said, they are very > liberal on oil life because of the "cost of ownership" concerns. Honda > wins that category in many car magazines (especially the Civic and > CR-V), so they are very conscious of the issue. Repairs due to maintenence are part of the "cost of ownership" equation. Part of why they wil in that category is by not breaking down as much thus requiring costly repairs. > Also, I thought we were talking about Honda's Oil Life Meter the entire > time. It measures oil life in percentages; they recommend oil to be > changed at 15%. Another reason I don't trust it is because my car sees > the rev limiter very frequently (8,200 rpm) and I have been at 6200mi > when the OLM reads 20%. I often drive fifteen minutes or less (small > town), so one would assume the large number of cold starts would wear > out the oil faster. That was the first red flag that made me think > twice about the meter. What does it matter who's oil life meter we're talking about? They all may be a little different from each other, but they will all take more factors other than just mileage into account. If you weren't hitting the rev limiter, the meter might have shows 30% at 6200 instead of just 20%. That means it's working as it should looking at all the factors. You want to change your oil earlier than recommended, go ahead. My entire point in this thread has been that blanket advice without using all the factors is bunk. And when people give advice that differs from others they will be challenged on it. You could go ahead and change your oil at 1500 and I won't care. When you recommend others do the same despite changes in modern engineering (i.e. engines are better, oil is better and we have better ways of predicting it's condition), someone will challenge that advice. |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
Seth wrote: > You want to change your oil earlier than recommended, go ahead. My entire > point in this thread has been that blanket advice without using all the > factors is bunk. And when people give advice that differs from others they > will be challenged on it. You could go ahead and change your oil at 1500 > and I won't care. When you recommend others do the same despite changes in > modern engineering (i.e. engines are better, oil is better and we have > better ways of predicting it's condition), someone will challenge that > advice. Not much of what I said has stuck with you. No way would I ever recommend changing oil regularly at 1,500 miles; that is an inexcusable waste of oil and money. Maybe it's worth it if you drive your car once a year, or twenty hours per day. Granted, a car with it's oil changed every 500 miles will last much, much longer than a car with oil changed every 7,500. It's an issue of ethics; hopefully, no one is that desperate to become an enemy of the environment. I welcome opposing opinions, it gets a good discussion going. So here: Engines are "better", yes; advances in technology allow tighter tolerances, hotter temperatures, and more complex moving parts without risk of failure. This puts even more strain on engine oil, and car manufacturers can do this because they know that the easily available motor oils on the market have improved and can handle this. But the only major improvement in engine oil is the quality/price of synthetic oil since its first appearance in the seventies; traditional oil companies have changed their additive packages (sometimes up to three times a year), but their base stock hasn't improved. In fact, most oil companies don't create their own stock, but buy it from other well established companies in bulk. Pennzoil buys stock from Mobil 1, for instance. Group IV and V stock is superior to anything on the market, but the *endurance* of the oil has still not been proven to last longer than dino oil. Thus, engines have become tougher on oil, and while non-synthetic oil has improved greatly in the area of extreme pressure/anti-wear additives, the advances in oil longevity are negligent! This is why most car companies have been suggesting the 3,750/5,000mi service interval since the eighties, and still do, regardless of using dino or synthetic. |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
Seth wrote: > You want to change your oil earlier than recommended, go ahead. My entire > point in this thread has been that blanket advice without using all the > factors is bunk. And when people give advice that differs from others they > will be challenged on it. You could go ahead and change your oil at 1500 > and I won't care. When you recommend others do the same despite changes in > modern engineering (i.e. engines are better, oil is better and we have > better ways of predicting it's condition), someone will challenge that > advice. Not much of what I said has stuck with you. No way would I ever recommend changing oil regularly at 1,500 miles; that is an inexcusable waste of oil and money. Maybe it's worth it if you drive your car once a year, or twenty hours per day. Granted, a car with it's oil changed every 500 miles will last much, much longer than a car with oil changed every 7,500. It's an issue of ethics; hopefully, no one is that desperate to become an enemy of the environment. I welcome opposing opinions, it gets a good discussion going. So here: Engines are "better", yes; advances in technology allow tighter tolerances, hotter temperatures, and more complex moving parts without risk of failure. This puts even more strain on engine oil, and car manufacturers can do this because they know that the easily available motor oils on the market have improved and can handle this. But the only major improvement in engine oil is the quality/price of synthetic oil since its first appearance in the seventies; traditional oil companies have changed their additive packages (sometimes up to three times a year), but their base stock hasn't improved. In fact, most oil companies don't create their own stock, but buy it from other well established companies in bulk. Pennzoil buys stock from Mobil 1, for instance. Group IV and V stock is superior to anything on the market, but the *endurance* of the oil has still not been proven to last longer than dino oil. Thus, engines have become tougher on oil, and while non-synthetic oil has improved greatly in the area of extreme pressure/anti-wear additives, the advances in oil longevity are negligent! This is why most car companies have been suggesting the 3,750/5,000mi service interval since the eighties, and still do, regardless of using dino or synthetic. |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
Seth wrote: > You want to change your oil earlier than recommended, go ahead. My entire > point in this thread has been that blanket advice without using all the > factors is bunk. And when people give advice that differs from others they > will be challenged on it. You could go ahead and change your oil at 1500 > and I won't care. When you recommend others do the same despite changes in > modern engineering (i.e. engines are better, oil is better and we have > better ways of predicting it's condition), someone will challenge that > advice. Not much of what I said has stuck with you. No way would I ever recommend changing oil regularly at 1,500 miles; that is an inexcusable waste of oil and money. Maybe it's worth it if you drive your car once a year, or twenty hours per day. Granted, a car with it's oil changed every 500 miles will last much, much longer than a car with oil changed every 7,500. It's an issue of ethics; hopefully, no one is that desperate to become an enemy of the environment. I welcome opposing opinions, it gets a good discussion going. So here: Engines are "better", yes; advances in technology allow tighter tolerances, hotter temperatures, and more complex moving parts without risk of failure. This puts even more strain on engine oil, and car manufacturers can do this because they know that the easily available motor oils on the market have improved and can handle this. But the only major improvement in engine oil is the quality/price of synthetic oil since its first appearance in the seventies; traditional oil companies have changed their additive packages (sometimes up to three times a year), but their base stock hasn't improved. In fact, most oil companies don't create their own stock, but buy it from other well established companies in bulk. Pennzoil buys stock from Mobil 1, for instance. Group IV and V stock is superior to anything on the market, but the *endurance* of the oil has still not been proven to last longer than dino oil. Thus, engines have become tougher on oil, and while non-synthetic oil has improved greatly in the area of extreme pressure/anti-wear additives, the advances in oil longevity are negligent! This is why most car companies have been suggesting the 3,750/5,000mi service interval since the eighties, and still do, regardless of using dino or synthetic. |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
"televascular" <televascular@yahoo.com> wrote
> Granted, a car with it's oil changed > every 500 miles will last much, much longer than a car > with oil changed > every 7,500. At some point, more frequent changes add no further life to the engine. That point may very well be around 3000 miles per oil change (with a commensurate time limit). I think there is no basis (data, common sense, or otherwise) for saying an engine will last "much, much longer" the more often one changes the oil. |
Re: What factors go into the oil life indicator: 2006 Civic
"televascular" <televascular@yahoo.com> wrote
> Granted, a car with it's oil changed > every 500 miles will last much, much longer than a car > with oil changed > every 7,500. At some point, more frequent changes add no further life to the engine. That point may very well be around 3000 miles per oil change (with a commensurate time limit). I think there is no basis (data, common sense, or otherwise) for saying an engine will last "much, much longer" the more often one changes the oil. |
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