Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

Elmo P. Shagnasty wrote:
> Cars aren't like modern buildings. ALL cars bring in some fresh air,
> even on recirculate.

Hmmm, if you say so. Certainly my '94 Civic does. ;-)

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/22/04 7:44 PM, in article GM6dnWmr1uPQgc_cRVn-gA@comcast.com, "MAT"
<marcoatRM_SPAM@DEL_SPAmsnotmail.com> wrote:

>
> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote in message
> news:BD776302.9E55C%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org...
>>
>> From another resident of a hot climate - you will get better (read faster)
>> results if you let it go into recirc and crack the windows several inches
>> for the first couple of minutes. The AC will cool faster and convection
>> (warm air rises) plus whatever breeze there might be will draw the
>> superheated air out the windows.
>>
>
> Bah, this is still unclear to me with no concensus on the best method. It
> is agreed that opening/cracking the windows when first driving will evacuate
> the heated air, but afterwards there are 2 camps.
>
> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>
> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>
>

I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
stop watch and try it both ways.

I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
years or more.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/22/04 7:44 PM, in article GM6dnWmr1uPQgc_cRVn-gA@comcast.com, "MAT"
<marcoatRM_SPAM@DEL_SPAmsnotmail.com> wrote:

>
> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote in message
> news:BD776302.9E55C%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org...
>>
>> From another resident of a hot climate - you will get better (read faster)
>> results if you let it go into recirc and crack the windows several inches
>> for the first couple of minutes. The AC will cool faster and convection
>> (warm air rises) plus whatever breeze there might be will draw the
>> superheated air out the windows.
>>
>
> Bah, this is still unclear to me with no concensus on the best method. It
> is agreed that opening/cracking the windows when first driving will evacuate
> the heated air, but afterwards there are 2 camps.
>
> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>
> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>
>

I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
stop watch and try it both ways.

I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
years or more.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <BD784BA3.9E7B9%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
"E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:

> > 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
> > 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
> >
> > I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
> >
> >
>
> I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
> stop watch and try it both ways.
>
> I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
> recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
> years or more.

It is not the recommended procedure in any owner's manual I've seen in
the last 15 years, and I will take your bet.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <BD784BA3.9E7B9%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
"E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:

> > 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
> > 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
> >
> > I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
> >
> >
>
> I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
> stop watch and try it both ways.
>
> I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
> recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
> years or more.

It is not the recommended procedure in any owner's manual I've seen in
the last 15 years, and I will take your bet.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <jeff-EC6298.00511822092004@news.east.cox.net>, Jeff
<jeff@invalid.net> wrote:

> Just wondering--whenever I use the AC, my Accord keeps defaulting to
> outside air (as do most newer vehicles, I've noticed). I drive mostly
> in traffic and don't like to breathe exhaust fumes filling the car, so
> I'm continually resetting it to recirc. But I'm curious as to why
> outside air is the default setting. (?)
>
> 2000 Accord v6 sedan
>
> Jeff

I don't believe that it is suppose to work that way. It does NOT work that
way on my 1999 Honda Accord. You either have something wrong with your
system or you are not setting the controls correctly. It's my guess that
you don't bother turning on the air conditioner after starting your
vehicle. Try this experiment for a week:
After you start your Accord, turn the heat control to the max. setting.
Push the Recir button. It does not matter which vent button you press. I
almost forgot to tell you to press the AC button.
After you do this experiment for a week, repost and let us know the results.

I usually leave my air conditioner set this way all of the time during the
summer months.

--
NEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO
We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <jeff-EC6298.00511822092004@news.east.cox.net>, Jeff
<jeff@invalid.net> wrote:

> Just wondering--whenever I use the AC, my Accord keeps defaulting to
> outside air (as do most newer vehicles, I've noticed). I drive mostly
> in traffic and don't like to breathe exhaust fumes filling the car, so
> I'm continually resetting it to recirc. But I'm curious as to why
> outside air is the default setting. (?)
>
> 2000 Accord v6 sedan
>
> Jeff

I don't believe that it is suppose to work that way. It does NOT work that
way on my 1999 Honda Accord. You either have something wrong with your
system or you are not setting the controls correctly. It's my guess that
you don't bother turning on the air conditioner after starting your
vehicle. Try this experiment for a week:
After you start your Accord, turn the heat control to the max. setting.
Push the Recir button. It does not matter which vent button you press. I
almost forgot to tell you to press the AC button.
After you do this experiment for a week, repost and let us know the results.

I usually leave my air conditioner set this way all of the time during the
summer months.

--
NEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO
We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

MAT wrote:
>
> Bah, this is still unclear to me with no concensus on the best method. It
> is agreed that opening/cracking the windows when first driving will evacuate
> the heated air, but afterwards there are 2 camps.
>
> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>
> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!

Disregarding for a the moment the fact that the specific heat capacity
of air depends on humidity, I would say common sense tells us that for
most efficient cooling, you want the coolest possible air entering the
evaporator. So, if your car has been sitting in the sun, start with
"fresh" until the inside air is at the same temperature as the outside
air. Then switch to "recirc" until it gets comfortably cool inside. From
this point on, keeping it in "recirc" will give you the best fuel
economy, but unless it is hot enough that the A/C can't keep up, putting
it in "fresh" is an option after a large refried bean lunch.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

MAT wrote:
>
> Bah, this is still unclear to me with no concensus on the best method. It
> is agreed that opening/cracking the windows when first driving will evacuate
> the heated air, but afterwards there are 2 camps.
>
> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>
> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!

Disregarding for a the moment the fact that the specific heat capacity
of air depends on humidity, I would say common sense tells us that for
most efficient cooling, you want the coolest possible air entering the
evaporator. So, if your car has been sitting in the sun, start with
"fresh" until the inside air is at the same temperature as the outside
air. Then switch to "recirc" until it gets comfortably cool inside. From
this point on, keeping it in "recirc" will give you the best fuel
economy, but unless it is hot enough that the A/C can't keep up, putting
it in "fresh" is an option after a large refried bean lunch.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <jason-2309041251170001@pm4-broad-32.snlo.dialup.fix.net>,
jason@nospam.com says...
> In article <jeff-EC6298.00511822092004@news.east.cox.net>, Jeff
> <jeff@invalid.net> wrote:
>
> > Just wondering--whenever I use the AC, my Accord keeps defaulting to
> > outside air (as do most newer vehicles, I've noticed). I drive mostly
> > in traffic and don't like to breathe exhaust fumes filling the car, so
> > I'm continually resetting it to recirc. But I'm curious as to why
> > outside air is the default setting. (?)
> >
> > 2000 Accord v6 sedan
> >
> > Jeff
>
> I don't believe that it is suppose to work that way. It does NOT work that
> way on my 1999 Honda Accord. You either have something wrong with your
> system or you are not setting the controls correctly. It's my guess that
> you don't bother turning on the air conditioner after starting your
> vehicle. Try this experiment for a week:
> After you start your Accord, turn the heat control to the max. setting.
> Push the Recir button. It does not matter which vent button you press. I
> almost forgot to tell you to press the AC button.
> After you do this experiment for a week, repost and let us know the results.
>
> I usually leave my air conditioner set this way all of the time during the
> summer months.
>
>
It tells in my 2000 Accord Owners manual how to program it to work either
way.

Randy

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <jason-2309041251170001@pm4-broad-32.snlo.dialup.fix.net>,
jason@nospam.com says...
> In article <jeff-EC6298.00511822092004@news.east.cox.net>, Jeff
> <jeff@invalid.net> wrote:
>
> > Just wondering--whenever I use the AC, my Accord keeps defaulting to
> > outside air (as do most newer vehicles, I've noticed). I drive mostly
> > in traffic and don't like to breathe exhaust fumes filling the car, so
> > I'm continually resetting it to recirc. But I'm curious as to why
> > outside air is the default setting. (?)
> >
> > 2000 Accord v6 sedan
> >
> > Jeff
>
> I don't believe that it is suppose to work that way. It does NOT work that
> way on my 1999 Honda Accord. You either have something wrong with your
> system or you are not setting the controls correctly. It's my guess that
> you don't bother turning on the air conditioner after starting your
> vehicle. Try this experiment for a week:
> After you start your Accord, turn the heat control to the max. setting.
> Push the Recir button. It does not matter which vent button you press. I
> almost forgot to tell you to press the AC button.
> After you do this experiment for a week, repost and let us know the results.
>
> I usually leave my air conditioner set this way all of the time during the
> summer months.
>
>
It tells in my 2000 Accord Owners manual how to program it to work either
way.

Randy

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/23/2004 10:52 AM Elmo P. Shagnasty spake these words of knowledge:

> In article <BD784BA3.9E7B9%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:
>
>> > 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
>> > 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>> >
>> > I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>> >
>> >
>>
>> I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
>> stop watch and try it both ways.
>>
>> I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
>> recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
>> years or more.
>
> It is not the recommended procedure in any owner's manual I've seen in
> the last 15 years, and I will take your bet.

You don't read much, apparently. Or you have misread what was said
above. Look again.


RFT!!!
Dave Kelsen
--
I just got slapped with my seventh sexual harassment suit this year.
Man, I tell ya, the broads in my office -- great racks, no sense of humor.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/23/2004 10:52 AM Elmo P. Shagnasty spake these words of knowledge:

> In article <BD784BA3.9E7B9%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:
>
>> > 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
>> > 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>> >
>> > I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>> >
>> >
>>
>> I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
>> stop watch and try it both ways.
>>
>> I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
>> recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
>> years or more.
>
> It is not the recommended procedure in any owner's manual I've seen in
> the last 15 years, and I will take your bet.

You don't read much, apparently. Or you have misread what was said
above. Look again.


RFT!!!
Dave Kelsen
--
I just got slapped with my seventh sexual harassment suit this year.
Man, I tell ya, the broads in my office -- great racks, no sense of humor.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/24/04 12:12 AM, in article 4153AD23.1833E5FF@junkmail.com, "Randolph"
<trash@junkmail.com> wrote:

>
> MAT wrote:
>>
>> Bah, this is still unclear to me with no concensus on the best method. It
>> is agreed that opening/cracking the windows when first driving will evacuate
>> the heated air, but afterwards there are 2 camps.
>>
>> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
>> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>>
>> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>
> Disregarding for a the moment the fact that the specific heat capacity
> of air depends on humidity, I would say common sense tells us that for
> most efficient cooling, you want the coolest possible air entering the
> evaporator.

.... and it takes about 15 seconds to completely replace the hot air near the
recirc inlet (which by convection is already the coolest air in the car)
with chilled air from the AC outlets being sucked down to it.

> So, if your car has been sitting in the sun, start with
> "fresh" until the inside air is at the same temperature as the outside
> air. Then switch to "recirc" until it gets comfortably cool inside. From
> this point on, keeping it in "recirc" will give you the best fuel
> economy,

Say what? It takes less gas to have the AC in recirc mode vs. fresh air
mode? I'd like to see the data that supports this assertion.

> but unless it is hot enough that the A/C can't keep up, putting
> it in "fresh" is an option after a large refried bean lunch.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/24/04 12:12 AM, in article 4153AD23.1833E5FF@junkmail.com, "Randolph"
<trash@junkmail.com> wrote:

>
> MAT wrote:
>>
>> Bah, this is still unclear to me with no concensus on the best method. It
>> is agreed that opening/cracking the windows when first driving will evacuate
>> the heated air, but afterwards there are 2 camps.
>>
>> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
>> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>>
>> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>
> Disregarding for a the moment the fact that the specific heat capacity
> of air depends on humidity, I would say common sense tells us that for
> most efficient cooling, you want the coolest possible air entering the
> evaporator.

.... and it takes about 15 seconds to completely replace the hot air near the
recirc inlet (which by convection is already the coolest air in the car)
with chilled air from the AC outlets being sucked down to it.

> So, if your car has been sitting in the sun, start with
> "fresh" until the inside air is at the same temperature as the outside
> air. Then switch to "recirc" until it gets comfortably cool inside. From
> this point on, keeping it in "recirc" will give you the best fuel
> economy,

Say what? It takes less gas to have the AC in recirc mode vs. fresh air
mode? I'd like to see the data that supports this assertion.

> but unless it is hot enough that the A/C can't keep up, putting
> it in "fresh" is an option after a large refried bean lunch.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/24/04 6:57 AM, in article
zYT4d.54592$uN5.18482@tornado.tampabay.rr.com, "Dave Kelsen"
<invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> On 9/23/2004 10:52 AM Elmo P. Shagnasty spake these words of knowledge:
>
>> In article <BD784BA3.9E7B9%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
>> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:
>>
>>>> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
>>>> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>>>>
>>>> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
>>> stop watch and try it both ways.
>>>
>>> I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
>>> recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
>>> years or more.
>>
>> It is not the recommended procedure in any owner's manual I've seen in
>> the last 15 years, and I will take your bet.
>
> You don't read much, apparently. Or you have misread what was said
> above. Look again.
>
>
> RFT!!!
> Dave Kelsen


What does "RFT!!!" mean?

Well, I double checked the manuals for the 15 years of cars my immediate
family currently uses. The '91 240SX, '96 I30, '96 Odyssey, '97 I30t, '98
Maxima, and '02 Pathfinder all say what I said they say.

The '00 TL manual doesn't address it. That book says "The system
automatically selects the proper mix of conditioned and/or heated air that
will, as quickly as possible, raise or lower the interior temperature from
its current level to the set temperature." In practice, that car always
turns on recirc mode when it first engages on a hot day.

So, pal - which books are you reading? I don't doubt that there will be
differences from one car's manual to another, but I didn't misread anything.

Another interesting side-light - the mid-'90s Nissans with automatic systems
(the two I30s) ignore the recirc button when they are in automatic mode and
you select a temperature at least 10-15 degrees below ambient (which is most
of the time here in Texas). They go into recirc and you can't switch it
off. The light goes on and off when you push the button, but nothing
changes.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/24/04 6:57 AM, in article
zYT4d.54592$uN5.18482@tornado.tampabay.rr.com, "Dave Kelsen"
<invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> On 9/23/2004 10:52 AM Elmo P. Shagnasty spake these words of knowledge:
>
>> In article <BD784BA3.9E7B9%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
>> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:
>>
>>>> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
>>>> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>>>>
>>>> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
>>> stop watch and try it both ways.
>>>
>>> I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
>>> recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
>>> years or more.
>>
>> It is not the recommended procedure in any owner's manual I've seen in
>> the last 15 years, and I will take your bet.
>
> You don't read much, apparently. Or you have misread what was said
> above. Look again.
>
>
> RFT!!!
> Dave Kelsen


What does "RFT!!!" mean?

Well, I double checked the manuals for the 15 years of cars my immediate
family currently uses. The '91 240SX, '96 I30, '96 Odyssey, '97 I30t, '98
Maxima, and '02 Pathfinder all say what I said they say.

The '00 TL manual doesn't address it. That book says "The system
automatically selects the proper mix of conditioned and/or heated air that
will, as quickly as possible, raise or lower the interior temperature from
its current level to the set temperature." In practice, that car always
turns on recirc mode when it first engages on a hot day.

So, pal - which books are you reading? I don't doubt that there will be
differences from one car's manual to another, but I didn't misread anything.

Another interesting side-light - the mid-'90s Nissans with automatic systems
(the two I30s) ignore the recirc button when they are in automatic mode and
you select a temperature at least 10-15 degrees below ambient (which is most
of the time here in Texas). They go into recirc and you can't switch it
off. The light goes on and off when you push the button, but nothing
changes.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/24/2004 9:26 AM E. Meyer spake these words of knowledge:

> On 9/24/04 6:57 AM, in article
> zYT4d.54592$uN5.18482@tornado.tampabay.rr.com, "Dave Kelsen"
> <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On 9/23/2004 10:52 AM Elmo P. Shagnasty spake these words of knowledge:
>>
>>> In article <BD784BA3.9E7B9%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
>>> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
>>>>> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
>>>> stop watch and try it both ways.
>>>>
>>>> I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
>>>> recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
>>>> years or more.
>>>
>>> It is not the recommended procedure in any owner's manual I've seen in
>>> the last 15 years, and I will take your bet.
>>
>> You don't read much, apparently. Or you have misread what was said
>> above. Look again.
>>
>>
>> RFT!!!
>> Dave Kelsen
>
>
> What does "RFT!!!" mean?

It means "Roll Tide" (the teams of the athletic department of the
University of Alabama).


> Well, I double checked the manuals for the 15 years of cars my immediate
> family currently uses. The '91 240SX, '96 I30, '96 Odyssey, '97 I30t, '98
> Maxima, and '02 Pathfinder all say what I said they say.

Yes. Well, if you look at the message I typed, I was responding to
Elmo. He has some unusual ideas at times, but he's not an idiot, so I
figured that perhaps he had misread your message and thought that you
were saying the opposite of what you were actually saying. Sorta like
you just thought about my message.

I agree with you, and so do the manuals of my automobiles.

RFT!!!
Dave Kelsen
--
"Do nothing secretly; for Time sees and hears all things, and discloses
all." -- Sophocles

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/24/2004 9:26 AM E. Meyer spake these words of knowledge:

> On 9/24/04 6:57 AM, in article
> zYT4d.54592$uN5.18482@tornado.tampabay.rr.com, "Dave Kelsen"
> <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>
>> On 9/23/2004 10:52 AM Elmo P. Shagnasty spake these words of knowledge:
>>
>>> In article <BD784BA3.9E7B9%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
>>> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>>> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
>>>>> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>>>>>
>>>>> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
>>>> stop watch and try it both ways.
>>>>
>>>> I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
>>>> recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
>>>> years or more.
>>>
>>> It is not the recommended procedure in any owner's manual I've seen in
>>> the last 15 years, and I will take your bet.
>>
>> You don't read much, apparently. Or you have misread what was said
>> above. Look again.
>>
>>
>> RFT!!!
>> Dave Kelsen
>
>
> What does "RFT!!!" mean?

It means "Roll Tide" (the teams of the athletic department of the
University of Alabama).


> Well, I double checked the manuals for the 15 years of cars my immediate
> family currently uses. The '91 240SX, '96 I30, '96 Odyssey, '97 I30t, '98
> Maxima, and '02 Pathfinder all say what I said they say.

Yes. Well, if you look at the message I typed, I was responding to
Elmo. He has some unusual ideas at times, but he's not an idiot, so I
figured that perhaps he had misread your message and thought that you
were saying the opposite of what you were actually saying. Sorta like
you just thought about my message.

I agree with you, and so do the manuals of my automobiles.

RFT!!!
Dave Kelsen
--
"Do nothing secretly; for Time sees and hears all things, and discloses
all." -- Sophocles

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <qdb5d.31202$Si.29776@tornado.tampabay.rr.com>,
Dave Kelsen <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> Yes. Well, if you look at the message I typed, I was responding to
> Elmo. He has some unusual ideas at times, but he's not an idiot, so I
> figured that perhaps he had misread your message and thought that you
> were saying the opposite of what you were actually saying.

Upon re-reading the original post, I do believe that was the case, yes.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <qdb5d.31202$Si.29776@tornado.tampabay.rr.com>,
Dave Kelsen <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> Yes. Well, if you look at the message I typed, I was responding to
> Elmo. He has some unusual ideas at times, but he's not an idiot, so I
> figured that perhaps he had misread your message and thought that you
> were saying the opposite of what you were actually saying.

Upon re-reading the original post, I do believe that was the case, yes.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 12:59:09 GMT, "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>
wrote:

>> So, if your car has been sitting in the sun, start with
>> "fresh" until the inside air is at the same temperature as the outside
>> air. Then switch to "recirc" until it gets comfortably cool inside. From
>> this point on, keeping it in "recirc" will give you the best fuel
>> economy,
>
>Say what? It takes less gas to have the AC in recirc mode vs. fresh air
>mode? I'd like to see the data that supports this assertion.

You get better fuel economy on recirculate. On a long highway journey
with the cruise on and nothing else to do, I timed the time the
compressor was ON/OFF while on recirculate and while on fresh. It was
ON for about 30 seconds on Recirc but more than a minute on Fresh (the
car's interior had already cooled down completely). Also, OFF times
were higher for recirc but don't remember them.

If it's extremely humid outside I would expect the compressor to stay
ON all the time on fresh. Air "quality" (temperature? humidity?) is
always better on fresh instead of hours on recirculate.

Bye,
Leon

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 12:59:09 GMT, "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>
wrote:

>> So, if your car has been sitting in the sun, start with
>> "fresh" until the inside air is at the same temperature as the outside
>> air. Then switch to "recirc" until it gets comfortably cool inside. From
>> this point on, keeping it in "recirc" will give you the best fuel
>> economy,
>
>Say what? It takes less gas to have the AC in recirc mode vs. fresh air
>mode? I'd like to see the data that supports this assertion.

You get better fuel economy on recirculate. On a long highway journey
with the cruise on and nothing else to do, I timed the time the
compressor was ON/OFF while on recirculate and while on fresh. It was
ON for about 30 seconds on Recirc but more than a minute on Fresh (the
car's interior had already cooled down completely). Also, OFF times
were higher for recirc but don't remember them.

If it's extremely humid outside I would expect the compressor to stay
ON all the time on fresh. Air "quality" (temperature? humidity?) is
always better on fresh instead of hours on recirculate.

Bye,
Leon

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/25/04 4:52 AM, in article qdb5d.31202$Si.29776@tornado.tampabay.rr.com,
"Dave Kelsen" <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> On 9/24/2004 9:26 AM E. Meyer spake these words of knowledge:
>
>> On 9/24/04 6:57 AM, in article
>> zYT4d.54592$uN5.18482@tornado.tampabay.rr.com, "Dave Kelsen"
>> <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> On 9/23/2004 10:52 AM Elmo P. Shagnasty spake these words of knowledge:
>>>
>>>> In article <BD784BA3.9E7B9%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
>>>> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
>>>>>> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
>>>>> stop watch and try it both ways.
>>>>>
>>>>> I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
>>>>> recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
>>>>> years or more.
>>>>
>>>> It is not the recommended procedure in any owner's manual I've seen in
>>>> the last 15 years, and I will take your bet.
>>>
>>> You don't read much, apparently. Or you have misread what was said
>>> above. Look again.
>>>
>>>
>>> RFT!!!
>>> Dave Kelsen
>>
>>
>> What does "RFT!!!" mean?
>
> It means "Roll Tide" (the teams of the athletic department of the
> University of Alabama).
>
>
>> Well, I double checked the manuals for the 15 years of cars my immediate
>> family currently uses. The '91 240SX, '96 I30, '96 Odyssey, '97 I30t, '98
>> Maxima, and '02 Pathfinder all say what I said they say.
>
> Yes. Well, if you look at the message I typed, I was responding to
> Elmo. He has some unusual ideas at times, but he's not an idiot, so I
> figured that perhaps he had misread your message and thought that you
> were saying the opposite of what you were actually saying. Sorta like
> you just thought about my message.
>
> I agree with you, and so do the manuals of my automobiles.
>
> RFT!!!
> Dave Kelsen

Sorry. I missed Elmo completely - he went into my kill file a year ago when
he was advocating feeding false and possibly dangerous answers to anyone who
had the audacity to ask how to turn off the maintenance light. Apparently
my news reader is doing a good job of filtering him out.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/25/04 4:52 AM, in article qdb5d.31202$Si.29776@tornado.tampabay.rr.com,
"Dave Kelsen" <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:

> On 9/24/2004 9:26 AM E. Meyer spake these words of knowledge:
>
>> On 9/24/04 6:57 AM, in article
>> zYT4d.54592$uN5.18482@tornado.tampabay.rr.com, "Dave Kelsen"
>> <invalid@invalid.invalid> wrote:
>>
>>> On 9/23/2004 10:52 AM Elmo P. Shagnasty spake these words of knowledge:
>>>
>>>> In article <BD784BA3.9E7B9%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
>>>> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>> 1. Start in recirc and then switch to fresh after temp stabilization.
>>>>>> 2. Start in fresh and then switch to recirc.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think 2 is more intuitive and that's what I do!
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I don't see why there should be a "camp". Get out your thermometer and a
>>>>> stop watch and try it both ways.
>>>>>
>>>>> I would be willing to bet that number one will win, and is, in fact, the
>>>>> recommended procedure in every owner's manual I have seen in the past 15
>>>>> years or more.
>>>>
>>>> It is not the recommended procedure in any owner's manual I've seen in
>>>> the last 15 years, and I will take your bet.
>>>
>>> You don't read much, apparently. Or you have misread what was said
>>> above. Look again.
>>>
>>>
>>> RFT!!!
>>> Dave Kelsen
>>
>>
>> What does "RFT!!!" mean?
>
> It means "Roll Tide" (the teams of the athletic department of the
> University of Alabama).
>
>
>> Well, I double checked the manuals for the 15 years of cars my immediate
>> family currently uses. The '91 240SX, '96 I30, '96 Odyssey, '97 I30t, '98
>> Maxima, and '02 Pathfinder all say what I said they say.
>
> Yes. Well, if you look at the message I typed, I was responding to
> Elmo. He has some unusual ideas at times, but he's not an idiot, so I
> figured that perhaps he had misread your message and thought that you
> were saying the opposite of what you were actually saying. Sorta like
> you just thought about my message.
>
> I agree with you, and so do the manuals of my automobiles.
>
> RFT!!!
> Dave Kelsen

Sorry. I missed Elmo completely - he went into my kill file a year ago when
he was advocating feeding false and possibly dangerous answers to anyone who
had the audacity to ask how to turn off the maintenance light. Apparently
my news reader is doing a good job of filtering him out.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/25/04 2:03 PM, in article 1n8bl0h7gm5tq45kkgalo2q4dnsrl1i8qv@4ax.com,
"Leon" <Curb_Weight_69@hotmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 12:59:09 GMT, "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>
> wrote:
>
>>> So, if your car has been sitting in the sun, start with
>>> "fresh" until the inside air is at the same temperature as the outside
>>> air. Then switch to "recirc" until it gets comfortably cool inside. From
>>> this point on, keeping it in "recirc" will give you the best fuel
>>> economy,
>>
>> Say what? It takes less gas to have the AC in recirc mode vs. fresh air
>> mode? I'd like to see the data that supports this assertion.
>
> You get better fuel economy on recirculate. On a long highway journey
> with the cruise on and nothing else to do, I timed the time the
> compressor was ON/OFF while on recirculate and while on fresh. It was
> ON for about 30 seconds on Recirc but more than a minute on Fresh (the
> car's interior had already cooled down completely). Also, OFF times
> were higher for recirc but don't remember them.
>
> If it's extremely humid outside I would expect the compressor to stay
> ON all the time on fresh. Air "quality" (temperature? humidity?) is
> always better on fresh instead of hours on recirculate.
>
> Bye,
> Leon

This sounds like an experiment I need to try on the trip to Houston next
week.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

On 9/25/04 2:03 PM, in article 1n8bl0h7gm5tq45kkgalo2q4dnsrl1i8qv@4ax.com,
"Leon" <Curb_Weight_69@hotmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, 24 Sep 2004 12:59:09 GMT, "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>
> wrote:
>
>>> So, if your car has been sitting in the sun, start with
>>> "fresh" until the inside air is at the same temperature as the outside
>>> air. Then switch to "recirc" until it gets comfortably cool inside. From
>>> this point on, keeping it in "recirc" will give you the best fuel
>>> economy,
>>
>> Say what? It takes less gas to have the AC in recirc mode vs. fresh air
>> mode? I'd like to see the data that supports this assertion.
>
> You get better fuel economy on recirculate. On a long highway journey
> with the cruise on and nothing else to do, I timed the time the
> compressor was ON/OFF while on recirculate and while on fresh. It was
> ON for about 30 seconds on Recirc but more than a minute on Fresh (the
> car's interior had already cooled down completely). Also, OFF times
> were higher for recirc but don't remember them.
>
> If it's extremely humid outside I would expect the compressor to stay
> ON all the time on fresh. Air "quality" (temperature? humidity?) is
> always better on fresh instead of hours on recirculate.
>
> Bye,
> Leon

This sounds like an experiment I need to try on the trip to Houston next
week.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <BD7B6693.9EE39%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
"E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:

> Sorry. I missed Elmo completely - he went into my kill file a year ago when
> he was advocating feeding false and possibly dangerous answers to anyone who
> had the audacity to ask how to turn off the maintenance light. Apparently
> my news reader is doing a good job of filtering him out.

Ooooooo. <snort>

Obviously, you have no sense of reality.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <BD7B6693.9EE39%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
"E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:

> Sorry. I missed Elmo completely - he went into my kill file a year ago when
> he was advocating feeding false and possibly dangerous answers to anyone who
> had the audacity to ask how to turn off the maintenance light. Apparently
> my news reader is doing a good job of filtering him out.

Ooooooo. <snort>

Obviously, you have no sense of reality.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

"Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message
news:elmop-80CB5B.22150925092004@text.usenetserver.com...
> In article <BD7B6693.9EE39%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:
>
>> Sorry. I missed Elmo completely - he went into my kill file a year ago
>> when
>> he was advocating feeding false and possibly dangerous answers to anyone
>> who
>> had the audacity to ask how to turn off the maintenance light.
>> Apparently
>> my news reader is doing a good job of filtering him out.
>
> Ooooooo. <snort>
>
> Obviously, you have no sense of reality.

Says you.
*You're* replying to someone you know has you killfiled!

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

"Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message
news:elmop-80CB5B.22150925092004@text.usenetserver.com...
> In article <BD7B6693.9EE39%e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org>,
> "E. Meyer" <e52.meyer0SPAM@ieee.org> wrote:
>
>> Sorry. I missed Elmo completely - he went into my kill file a year ago
>> when
>> he was advocating feeding false and possibly dangerous answers to anyone
>> who
>> had the audacity to ask how to turn off the maintenance light.
>> Apparently
>> my news reader is doing a good job of filtering him out.
>
> Ooooooo. <snort>
>
> Obviously, you have no sense of reality.

Says you.
*You're* replying to someone you know has you killfiled!

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <vcidncUxm6wTp8vcRVn-gg@rogers.com>,
"Steve Bigelow" <stevebigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote:

> *You're* replying to someone you know has you killfiled!

no, I'm replying to someone who SAYS he has me killfiled.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

In article <vcidncUxm6wTp8vcRVn-gg@rogers.com>,
"Steve Bigelow" <stevebigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote:

> *You're* replying to someone you know has you killfiled!

no, I'm replying to someone who SAYS he has me killfiled.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

"Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message
news:elmop-2F95AE.07395326092004@text.usenetserver.com...
> In article <vcidncUxm6wTp8vcRVn-gg@rogers.com>,
> "Steve Bigelow" <stevebigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote:
>
>> *You're* replying to someone you know has you killfiled!
>
> no, I'm replying to someone who SAYS he has me killfiled.

Touche.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

"Elmo P. Shagnasty" <elmop@nastydesigns.com> wrote in message
news:elmop-2F95AE.07395326092004@text.usenetserver.com...
> In article <vcidncUxm6wTp8vcRVn-gg@rogers.com>,
> "Steve Bigelow" <stevebigelowXXX@rogers.com> wrote:
>
>> *You're* replying to someone you know has you killfiled!
>
> no, I'm replying to someone who SAYS he has me killfiled.

Touche.

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

Can you post the instructions or email them to me? Maybe it will work on my
Pilot. The A/C on my Town and Country would allow you to program the
recirc. button either way.

Kerby

"Randy Hunt" <rhunt960@tco.net> wrote in message
news:MPG.1bbd5ad4768241d9896d0@news.tco.net...
> In article <jason-2309041251170001@pm4-broad-32.snlo.dialup.fix.net>,
> jason@nospam.com says...
> > In article <jeff-EC6298.00511822092004@news.east.cox.net>, Jeff
> > <jeff@invalid.net> wrote:
> >
> > > Just wondering--whenever I use the AC, my Accord keeps defaulting to
> > > outside air (as do most newer vehicles, I've noticed). I drive mostly
> > > in traffic and don't like to breathe exhaust fumes filling the car, so
> > > I'm continually resetting it to recirc. But I'm curious as to why
> > > outside air is the default setting. (?)
> > >
> > > 2000 Accord v6 sedan
> > >
> > > Jeff
> >
> > I don't believe that it is suppose to work that way. It does NOT work
that
> > way on my 1999 Honda Accord. You either have something wrong with your
> > system or you are not setting the controls correctly. It's my guess that
> > you don't bother turning on the air conditioner after starting your
> > vehicle. Try this experiment for a week:
> > After you start your Accord, turn the heat control to the max. setting.
> > Push the Recir button. It does not matter which vent button you press. I
> > almost forgot to tell you to press the AC button.
> > After you do this experiment for a week, repost and let us know the
results.
> >
> > I usually leave my air conditioner set this way all of the time during
the
> > summer months.
> >
> >
> It tells in my 2000 Accord Owners manual how to program it to work either
> way.
>
> Randy

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

Can you post the instructions or email them to me? Maybe it will work on my
Pilot. The A/C on my Town and Country would allow you to program the
recirc. button either way.

Kerby

"Randy Hunt" <rhunt960@tco.net> wrote in message
news:MPG.1bbd5ad4768241d9896d0@news.tco.net...
> In article <jason-2309041251170001@pm4-broad-32.snlo.dialup.fix.net>,
> jason@nospam.com says...
> > In article <jeff-EC6298.00511822092004@news.east.cox.net>, Jeff
> > <jeff@invalid.net> wrote:
> >
> > > Just wondering--whenever I use the AC, my Accord keeps defaulting to
> > > outside air (as do most newer vehicles, I've noticed). I drive mostly
> > > in traffic and don't like to breathe exhaust fumes filling the car, so
> > > I'm continually resetting it to recirc. But I'm curious as to why
> > > outside air is the default setting. (?)
> > >
> > > 2000 Accord v6 sedan
> > >
> > > Jeff
> >
> > I don't believe that it is suppose to work that way. It does NOT work
that
> > way on my 1999 Honda Accord. You either have something wrong with your
> > system or you are not setting the controls correctly. It's my guess that
> > you don't bother turning on the air conditioner after starting your
> > vehicle. Try this experiment for a week:
> > After you start your Accord, turn the heat control to the max. setting.
> > Push the Recir button. It does not matter which vent button you press. I
> > almost forgot to tell you to press the AC button.
> > After you do this experiment for a week, repost and let us know the
results.
> >
> > I usually leave my air conditioner set this way all of the time during
the
> > summer months.
> >
> >
> It tells in my 2000 Accord Owners manual how to program it to work either
> way.
>
> Randy

Re: Why do vents default to outside air?
 

Can you post the instructions or email them to me? Maybe it will work on my
Pilot. The A/C on my Town and Country would allow you to program the
recirc. button either way.

Kerby

"Randy Hunt" <rhunt960@tco.net> wrote in message
news:MPG.1bbd5ad4768241d9896d0@news.tco.net...
> In article <jason-2309041251170001@pm4-broad-32.snlo.dialup.fix.net>,
> jason@nospam.com says...
> > In article <jeff-EC6298.00511822092004@news.east.cox.net>, Jeff
> > <jeff@invalid.net> wrote:
> >
> > > Just wondering--whenever I use the AC, my Accord keeps defaulting to
> > > outside air (as do most newer vehicles, I've noticed). I drive mostly
> > > in traffic and don't like to breathe exhaust fumes filling the car, so
> > > I'm continually resetting it to recirc. But I'm curious as to why
> > > outside air is the default setting. (?)
> > >
> > > 2000 Accord v6 sedan
> > >
> > > Jeff
> >
> > I don't believe that it is suppose to work that way. It does NOT work
that
> > way on my 1999 Honda Accord. You either have something wrong with your
> > system or you are not setting the controls correctly. It's my guess that
> > you don't bother turning on the air conditioner after starting your
> > vehicle. Try this experiment for a week:
> > After you start your Accord, turn the heat control to the max. setting.
> > Push the Recir button. It does not matter which vent button you press. I
> > almost forgot to tell you to press the AC button.
> > After you do this experiment for a week, repost and let us know the
results.
> >
> > I usually leave my air conditioner set this way all of the time during
the
> > summer months.
> >
> >
> It tells in my 2000 Accord Owners manual how to program it to work either
> way.
>
> Randy