03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
11-14-2005, 11:57 PM
#1
Guest
Posts: n/a
03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata. Called
dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is : 500.00 for timing
belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump replacement. Id it wise
to call Midas and ask what they charge? Dealer told me not to do that
because they don't use Hyundai product hence will void remainder of my
warranty. My sad story is I just graduated from graduate school having no
luck getting a job. Living off credit cards for the past 2 months. So money
right now is pretty tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is : 500.00 for timing
belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump replacement. Id it wise
to call Midas and ask what they charge? Dealer told me not to do that
because they don't use Hyundai product hence will void remainder of my
warranty. My sad story is I just graduated from graduate school having no
luck getting a job. Living off credit cards for the past 2 months. So money
right now is pretty tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
11-15-2005, 06:48 AM
#2
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
sonata32 wrote:
> How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata.
> Called dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is :
> 500.00 for timing belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump
> replacement. Id it wise to call Midas and ask what they charge?
> Dealer told me not to do that because they don't use Hyundai product
> hence will void remainder of my warranty. My sad story is I just
> graduated from graduate school having no luck getting a job. Living
> off credit cards for the past 2 months. So money right now is pretty
> tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
Well, changing the water pump at 60K is entirely optional. Odds are
you'll make it to 120K or will have traded the car before the water
pump gives you any trouble.
--
> How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata.
> Called dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is :
> 500.00 for timing belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump
> replacement. Id it wise to call Midas and ask what they charge?
> Dealer told me not to do that because they don't use Hyundai product
> hence will void remainder of my warranty. My sad story is I just
> graduated from graduate school having no luck getting a job. Living
> off credit cards for the past 2 months. So money right now is pretty
> tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
Well, changing the water pump at 60K is entirely optional. Odds are
you'll make it to 120K or will have traded the car before the water
pump gives you any trouble.
--
11-15-2005, 08:30 AM
#3
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
$625 for a tune up seems a more than a bit excessive. Are you sure some
other repairs aren't folded into that cost?
Jon
"Screwtape III" <gfy@bkbusa.com> wrote in message
news:xn0e9ri8b2suq1005@news.individual.net...
> sonata32 wrote:
>
> > How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata.
> > Called dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is :
> > 500.00 for timing belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump
> > replacement. Id it wise to call Midas and ask what they charge?
> > Dealer told me not to do that because they don't use Hyundai product
> > hence will void remainder of my warranty. My sad story is I just
> > graduated from graduate school having no luck getting a job. Living
> > off credit cards for the past 2 months. So money right now is pretty
> > tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
>
> Well, changing the water pump at 60K is entirely optional. Odds are
> you'll make it to 120K or will have traded the car before the water
> pump gives you any trouble.
>
> --
>
other repairs aren't folded into that cost?
Jon
"Screwtape III" <gfy@bkbusa.com> wrote in message
news:xn0e9ri8b2suq1005@news.individual.net...
> sonata32 wrote:
>
> > How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata.
> > Called dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is :
> > 500.00 for timing belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump
> > replacement. Id it wise to call Midas and ask what they charge?
> > Dealer told me not to do that because they don't use Hyundai product
> > hence will void remainder of my warranty. My sad story is I just
> > graduated from graduate school having no luck getting a job. Living
> > off credit cards for the past 2 months. So money right now is pretty
> > tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
>
> Well, changing the water pump at 60K is entirely optional. Odds are
> you'll make it to 120K or will have traded the car before the water
> pump gives you any trouble.
>
> --
>
11-15-2005, 12:27 PM
#4
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
Are you the original owner? If so, don't replace the water pump. It's
warranted for 10 years/100k miles.
If you're the original owner, you do have some incentive to install a
factory belt. Hyundai will continue to cover it for the 10 year/100k mile
period as long as you replace the belt with a Hyundai part. There's
nothing wrong with calling Midas (or anywhere else) and asking them if
they'd do the work using a factory belt (or all factory parts).
Understand they'll probably charge more due to their higher cost, but if
everything else is reasonable, it may be a good alternative. But also
consider whether they are competent to do the job. I wouldn't think the
guys at Midas do a lot of timing belts. This one isn't particularly
tricky, so someone who's competent and reasonably knowledgeable should be
able to do a good job. I would also have the timing belt tensioner
replaced with the timing belt. It's only covered by the 5/60 warranty and
its failure can cause the same consequences as a failed timing belt.
Replacing the spark plugs on your car will require removing the plenum.
Again, you'll want to make sure you have someone competent and
knowledgeable doing the work. You'll also want to make sure they use
quality parts, because you don't want to have to pay to have the plugs
replaced again in a relatively short period of time. You may also want to
consider having the plug wires replaced (with preferably OEM parts) while
the plenum is off.
warranted for 10 years/100k miles.
If you're the original owner, you do have some incentive to install a
factory belt. Hyundai will continue to cover it for the 10 year/100k mile
period as long as you replace the belt with a Hyundai part. There's
nothing wrong with calling Midas (or anywhere else) and asking them if
they'd do the work using a factory belt (or all factory parts).
Understand they'll probably charge more due to their higher cost, but if
everything else is reasonable, it may be a good alternative. But also
consider whether they are competent to do the job. I wouldn't think the
guys at Midas do a lot of timing belts. This one isn't particularly
tricky, so someone who's competent and reasonably knowledgeable should be
able to do a good job. I would also have the timing belt tensioner
replaced with the timing belt. It's only covered by the 5/60 warranty and
its failure can cause the same consequences as a failed timing belt.
Replacing the spark plugs on your car will require removing the plenum.
Again, you'll want to make sure you have someone competent and
knowledgeable doing the work. You'll also want to make sure they use
quality parts, because you don't want to have to pay to have the plugs
replaced again in a relatively short period of time. You may also want to
consider having the plug wires replaced (with preferably OEM parts) while
the plenum is off.
11-15-2005, 12:49 PM
#5
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
sonata32 wrote:
> How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata. Called
> dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is : 500.00 for timing
> belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump replacement. Id it wise
> to call Midas and ask what they charge? Dealer told me not to do that
> because they don't use Hyundai product hence will void remainder of my
> warranty. My sad story is I just graduated from graduate school having no
> luck getting a job. Living off credit cards for the past 2 months. So money
> right now is pretty tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
>
Do you own any basic tools? Even if you don't, you can do the tune up
work yourself (plugs, wires, oil change, air filter change, etc.) and
save more than the cost of buying a few tools. Once you own them, tools
are like money in the bank, as they'll save you more every time you use
them. As long as you document what you've done in the maintenance log
that came with the car, you're covered under warranty. The log also
tells you everything that needs to be done @ 60K miles. If money is
tight, you can put off the timing belt change for a little while if
necessary. It's unlikely to fail and as long as you get it done within a
few K's of 60K miles, Hyundai will be happy. I wouldn't bother with the
water pump unless there is an obvious problem with it.
For instructions, part numbers and other info about your car, go to:
http://www.hmaservice.com
You need to register first (it's free), then you can access Hyundai
service manuals and check parts prices online. You can even order parts
and accessories online though your local dealer. BTW, the site only
works with Internet Explorer.
I would hesitate to have the service done at any of the larger chains,
as the quality of the work you'll receive is anyone's guess. Those
places typically have high employee turnover and good mechanics don't
want to work at them. Better to check with friends to find a smaller,
reputable shop that's well established. Tell them you want them to use
Hyundai parts (a good shop will understand why) or buy the parts
yourself and drop them off with the car.
What your dealer told you about parts is not entirely true. Only the
timing belt and water pump (if you decide to do it) need to be Hyundai
parts to keep your warranty in effect. Plugs, wires, filters, etc. can
be aftermarket parts without have ANY effect on your warranty (that's
federal law). Just use good filters like Purolator and stay away from
junk like Fram. NGK plugs and wires are always a good bet.
Now sounds like an ideal time for you to learn some DIY skills. Best of
luck!
> How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata. Called
> dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is : 500.00 for timing
> belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump replacement. Id it wise
> to call Midas and ask what they charge? Dealer told me not to do that
> because they don't use Hyundai product hence will void remainder of my
> warranty. My sad story is I just graduated from graduate school having no
> luck getting a job. Living off credit cards for the past 2 months. So money
> right now is pretty tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
>
Do you own any basic tools? Even if you don't, you can do the tune up
work yourself (plugs, wires, oil change, air filter change, etc.) and
save more than the cost of buying a few tools. Once you own them, tools
are like money in the bank, as they'll save you more every time you use
them. As long as you document what you've done in the maintenance log
that came with the car, you're covered under warranty. The log also
tells you everything that needs to be done @ 60K miles. If money is
tight, you can put off the timing belt change for a little while if
necessary. It's unlikely to fail and as long as you get it done within a
few K's of 60K miles, Hyundai will be happy. I wouldn't bother with the
water pump unless there is an obvious problem with it.
For instructions, part numbers and other info about your car, go to:
http://www.hmaservice.com
You need to register first (it's free), then you can access Hyundai
service manuals and check parts prices online. You can even order parts
and accessories online though your local dealer. BTW, the site only
works with Internet Explorer.
I would hesitate to have the service done at any of the larger chains,
as the quality of the work you'll receive is anyone's guess. Those
places typically have high employee turnover and good mechanics don't
want to work at them. Better to check with friends to find a smaller,
reputable shop that's well established. Tell them you want them to use
Hyundai parts (a good shop will understand why) or buy the parts
yourself and drop them off with the car.
What your dealer told you about parts is not entirely true. Only the
timing belt and water pump (if you decide to do it) need to be Hyundai
parts to keep your warranty in effect. Plugs, wires, filters, etc. can
be aftermarket parts without have ANY effect on your warranty (that's
federal law). Just use good filters like Purolator and stay away from
junk like Fram. NGK plugs and wires are always a good bet.
Now sounds like an ideal time for you to learn some DIY skills. Best of
luck!
11-15-2005, 09:27 PM
#6
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
$625 for a tuneup??? I don't think the manual calls for more than spark
plugs, doesn't it? I doubt if it calls for a water pump replacement.
You're being majorly ripped off.
"sonata32" <sonata32@***.net> wrote in message
news:tVdef.9139$.2461@dukeread07...
> How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata. Called
> dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is : 500.00 for timing
> belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump replacement. Id it wise
> to call Midas and ask what they charge? Dealer told me not to do that
> because they don't use Hyundai product hence will void remainder of my
> warranty. My sad story is I just graduated from graduate school having no
> luck getting a job. Living off credit cards for the past 2 months. So
> money right now is pretty tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
>
plugs, doesn't it? I doubt if it calls for a water pump replacement.
You're being majorly ripped off.
"sonata32" <sonata32@***.net> wrote in message
news:tVdef.9139$.2461@dukeread07...
> How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata. Called
> dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is : 500.00 for timing
> belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump replacement. Id it wise
> to call Midas and ask what they charge? Dealer told me not to do that
> because they don't use Hyundai product hence will void remainder of my
> warranty. My sad story is I just graduated from graduate school having no
> luck getting a job. Living off credit cards for the past 2 months. So
> money right now is pretty tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
>
11-16-2005, 12:28 PM
#7
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
Thanks for all who replied to my post. I am the original owner of my sonata.
I commute 100 miles a day to school thats why my mileage is so high. I have
never missed an oil change and I replaced transmission oil. I guess I will
just do the belt for now. Last night when I went to start my car it would
not want to start. When I turned the key, the ignition was turning but it
would not catch. The battery is fine and the starter seems to be okay. I let
it sit for 2 minutes and turned the key it final grabbed and started after a
few turns. The car was making a "put" noise and wanted to stall but I gave
it gas and it stayed running. I noticed a odd smelling white smoke coming
out of the exhaust. This was the first time ever this had happened. The
weather here in Connecticut has been weird where the temps would go from
70's to 30's in a matter of 6 hours. Could it be condensation in the gas
line? Also, when are the tired needed to be changed. My car came with
Michelin tires which I noticed are really $$$ is there another good tire out
there someone can recommend.
Thanks,
Jeff
"Tom" <tjwitman@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:OLwef.6462$f_2.6403@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
> $625 for a tuneup??? I don't think the manual calls for more than spark
> plugs, doesn't it? I doubt if it calls for a water pump replacement.
> You're being majorly ripped off.
>
>
> "sonata32" <sonata32@***.net> wrote in message
> news:tVdef.9139$.2461@dukeread07...
>> How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata.
>> Called dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is : 500.00
>> for timing belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump
>> replacement. Id it wise to call Midas and ask what they charge? Dealer
>> told me not to do that because they don't use Hyundai product hence will
>> void remainder of my warranty. My sad story is I just graduated from
>> graduate school having no luck getting a job. Living off credit cards for
>> the past 2 months. So money right now is pretty tight. Any advice my dear
>> Hyundai buddies
>>
>
>
I commute 100 miles a day to school thats why my mileage is so high. I have
never missed an oil change and I replaced transmission oil. I guess I will
just do the belt for now. Last night when I went to start my car it would
not want to start. When I turned the key, the ignition was turning but it
would not catch. The battery is fine and the starter seems to be okay. I let
it sit for 2 minutes and turned the key it final grabbed and started after a
few turns. The car was making a "put" noise and wanted to stall but I gave
it gas and it stayed running. I noticed a odd smelling white smoke coming
out of the exhaust. This was the first time ever this had happened. The
weather here in Connecticut has been weird where the temps would go from
70's to 30's in a matter of 6 hours. Could it be condensation in the gas
line? Also, when are the tired needed to be changed. My car came with
Michelin tires which I noticed are really $$$ is there another good tire out
there someone can recommend.
Thanks,
Jeff
"Tom" <tjwitman@bellsouth.net> wrote in message
news:OLwef.6462$f_2.6403@bignews2.bellsouth.net...
> $625 for a tuneup??? I don't think the manual calls for more than spark
> plugs, doesn't it? I doubt if it calls for a water pump replacement.
> You're being majorly ripped off.
>
>
> "sonata32" <sonata32@***.net> wrote in message
> news:tVdef.9139$.2461@dukeread07...
>> How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata.
>> Called dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is : 500.00
>> for timing belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump
>> replacement. Id it wise to call Midas and ask what they charge? Dealer
>> told me not to do that because they don't use Hyundai product hence will
>> void remainder of my warranty. My sad story is I just graduated from
>> graduate school having no luck getting a job. Living off credit cards for
>> the past 2 months. So money right now is pretty tight. Any advice my dear
>> Hyundai buddies
>>
>
>
11-16-2005, 12:50 PM
#8
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
Regarding the problem with starting the car, could be anything, even a weak
battery.
As far as the tires, go to a reputable tire store near you and explain to
them you'd like some inexpensive tires of reasonable quality. Most tire
stores have house brand tires, that while not Michelins, compete well on
quality with major tire brands for a fraction of the price.
battery.
As far as the tires, go to a reputable tire store near you and explain to
them you'd like some inexpensive tires of reasonable quality. Most tire
stores have house brand tires, that while not Michelins, compete well on
quality with major tire brands for a fraction of the price.
11-16-2005, 02:09 PM
#9
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
When making a decision on the timing belt remember that the 60,000 mile
recomendation by Hyundai (that needs to be done to maintain the warrenty) is
a statistical thing. So few belts fail before 60,000 AND 5 years that
Hyundai deems it almost insignificant and will therefore pay to have
catastropic engine failure fixed. A key here (and in my case) is time. If
you put 60,000 miles on in 2 years, the timing belt is MUCH less likely to
fail than if you take 5 years to do it. 3 extra years of sitting outside in
weather have got to be significant in terms of belt wear, as do all the
extra starts and warm-ups. For me, with a 2002 XG350 with 67000 miles, I
have decided to go to 90,000 miles before doing the timing belt which should
put me in the 5-6 year time frame. Of coarse, I bought mine used so I have
no 10/100 warrenty to add in to the equation.
Dan
"sonata32" <sonata32@***.net> wrote in message
news:tVdef.9139$.2461@dukeread07...
> How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata. Called
> dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is : 500.00 for timing
> belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump replacement. Id it wise
> to call Midas and ask what they charge? Dealer told me not to do that
> because they don't use Hyundai product hence will void remainder of my
> warranty. My sad story is I just graduated from graduate school having no
> luck getting a job. Living off credit cards for the past 2 months. So
money
> right now is pretty tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
>
>
recomendation by Hyundai (that needs to be done to maintain the warrenty) is
a statistical thing. So few belts fail before 60,000 AND 5 years that
Hyundai deems it almost insignificant and will therefore pay to have
catastropic engine failure fixed. A key here (and in my case) is time. If
you put 60,000 miles on in 2 years, the timing belt is MUCH less likely to
fail than if you take 5 years to do it. 3 extra years of sitting outside in
weather have got to be significant in terms of belt wear, as do all the
extra starts and warm-ups. For me, with a 2002 XG350 with 67000 miles, I
have decided to go to 90,000 miles before doing the timing belt which should
put me in the 5-6 year time frame. Of coarse, I bought mine used so I have
no 10/100 warrenty to add in to the equation.
Dan
"sonata32" <sonata32@***.net> wrote in message
news:tVdef.9139$.2461@dukeread07...
> How much should I expect to be charged. I have a 2003 V6 GL Sonata. Called
> dealer they quoted me for the 60k maintenance which is : 500.00 for timing
> belt replacement-625.00 tune up- 550.00 water pump replacement. Id it wise
> to call Midas and ask what they charge? Dealer told me not to do that
> because they don't use Hyundai product hence will void remainder of my
> warranty. My sad story is I just graduated from graduate school having no
> luck getting a job. Living off credit cards for the past 2 months. So
money
> right now is pretty tight. Any advice my dear Hyundai buddies
>
>
11-16-2005, 06:51 PM
#10
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
Today, I was quoted $800 to replace the belt in Des Moines. I called
around and the going rate seems to be between $400 and $550 in other
midwest cities. I am taking it to Council Bluffs (near Omaha) to have
it done. I am not pleased with the Des Moines quote.
around and the going rate seems to be between $400 and $550 in other
midwest cities. I am taking it to Council Bluffs (near Omaha) to have
it done. I am not pleased with the Des Moines quote.
11-18-2005, 08:13 AM
#11
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
"hyundaitech" <notpublic@not.public.com> wrote in message
news:22ce78ef684bec6ba9ae6f34e6586533@localhost.ta lkaboutautos.com...
>
> As far as the tires, go to a reputable tire store near you and explain to
> them you'd like some inexpensive tires of reasonable quality. Most tire
> stores have house brand tires, that while not Michelins, compete well on
> quality with major tire brands for a fraction of the price.
>
Echo this. I have had really good luck with PepBoys Futura tires. They're
made by Cooper and they are a fraction of the price of the major brands.
I've always gotten at least the advertised mileage out of them and have been
very satisfied with the tire performance in rain and snow. I'm in upstate
NY and we get snow! A tire that will handle long winters, hard pack snow,
etc. is very important to me. They run quite and they hold up very well -
no history of broken cords, sidewall failures, etc. Half the price of
Michelin.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel.net
11-19-2005, 04:15 AM
#12
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
Mike Marlow wrote:
> I'm in upstate
> NY and we get snow! A tire that will handle long winters, hard pack snow,
> etc. is very important to me.
If that's the case, why don't you get snow tires for the winter? The
difference in performance in snow and ice vs. ANY "all season" tire is
dramatic.
> I'm in upstate
> NY and we get snow! A tire that will handle long winters, hard pack snow,
> etc. is very important to me.
If that's the case, why don't you get snow tires for the winter? The
difference in performance in snow and ice vs. ANY "all season" tire is
dramatic.
11-19-2005, 04:18 AM
#13
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
rayindesmoines@yahoo.com wrote:
> Today, I was quoted $800 to replace the belt in Des Moines. I called
> around and the going rate seems to be between $400 and $550 in other
> midwest cities. I am taking it to Council Bluffs (near Omaha) to have
> it done. I am not pleased with the Des Moines quote.
>
Rather than making a long drive, have you checked around to find a good
independent shop in your area? This work does not have to be done by a
Hyundai dealer, only with Hyundai parts.
> Today, I was quoted $800 to replace the belt in Des Moines. I called
> around and the going rate seems to be between $400 and $550 in other
> midwest cities. I am taking it to Council Bluffs (near Omaha) to have
> it done. I am not pleased with the Des Moines quote.
>
Rather than making a long drive, have you checked around to find a good
independent shop in your area? This work does not have to be done by a
Hyundai dealer, only with Hyundai parts.
11-20-2005, 12:08 AM
#14
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
"Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:P2Cff.97$Lw6.59@trndny02...
> Mike Marlow wrote:
> > I'm in upstate
> > NY and we get snow! A tire that will handle long winters, hard pack
snow,
> > etc. is very important to me.
>
> If that's the case, why don't you get snow tires for the winter? The
> difference in performance in snow and ice vs. ANY "all season" tire is
> dramatic.
>
>
Fair question. The reason is that I don't need them. Good radials do the
job just fine. I haven't had a snow tire on a car in over 30 years.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel.net
11-20-2005, 12:08 AM
#15
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 03 Sonata Timing Belt Replacement
"Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:P2Cff.97$Lw6.59@trndny02...
> Mike Marlow wrote:
> > I'm in upstate
> > NY and we get snow! A tire that will handle long winters, hard pack
snow,
> > etc. is very important to me.
>
> If that's the case, why don't you get snow tires for the winter? The
> difference in performance in snow and ice vs. ANY "all season" tire is
> dramatic.
>
>
Fair question. The reason is that I don't need them. Good radials do the
job just fine. I haven't had a snow tire on a car in over 30 years.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel.net