2004 Sonata alignment problem
11-07-2008, 07:57 PM
#1
Guest
Posts: n/a
2004 Sonata alignment problem
We have a 2004 Sonata with about 30,000 miles on it. Recently we had to
get the front right tire replaced (it had been losing air, turned out it had
several nails in it). We had it done at a local Goodyear shop that we've
been using for several years and have been happy with.
After the replacement, we noticed it pulling to the right so we took it back
and asked them to check the alignment. Later that day they called and said
that the alignment was so far out of spec that they would have to replace
the control arms with new ones with adjustable ball joints, and that the
right rear spindle was bent. Their estimate was about $1,400. They said
that the car had to have been in a serious accident to cause this. We are
the original owner, and it has never been wrecked and neither my wife or I
ever recall hitting a curb or pothole that hard. We asked why we didn't
notice it before and they said that the tires may have worn in such a way to
offset most of the effect and that when we put a new tire on the right front
it made it more noticeable.
They said it was safe to drive, it would mainly be affecting the tire wear,
so we're going to take it to the dealer Monday and see what they say. The
Goodyear shop gave us the alignment report and suggested that we show it to
the Hyundai service tech, so I don't think they were trying to pull
something.
The values flagged on the report were:
Front camber Left: -.6, right +.7, (spec -.5 to +.5)
Front toe Left -.25, right -.34 (spec -.08 to +.08)
Front Cross Camber -1.3 (spec -.5 to +.5)
Front Total Toe -.59 (spec -.16 to +.16)
Rear camber Left -1, right +.4 (spec -1 to 0)
Rear toe Left -.06, right -.41 (spec 0 to +.16)
Rear cross camber -1.4 (spec -.5 to +.5)
Rear toe -.47 (spec 0 to +.31)
I guess I'm just trying to get some information on this problem. Does a
problem like this seem to be possible without a major accident? Overall
we've been satisfied with the Hyundai quality, but could something like this
be a manufacturing defect, or something at least partially covered by
Hyundai? We just got our third Hyundai from the same dealer a few months
ago, so I'm hoping they might be able to work out something better than
$1,400..
Any suggestions would be appreciated
Mike O.
get the front right tire replaced (it had been losing air, turned out it had
several nails in it). We had it done at a local Goodyear shop that we've
been using for several years and have been happy with.
After the replacement, we noticed it pulling to the right so we took it back
and asked them to check the alignment. Later that day they called and said
that the alignment was so far out of spec that they would have to replace
the control arms with new ones with adjustable ball joints, and that the
right rear spindle was bent. Their estimate was about $1,400. They said
that the car had to have been in a serious accident to cause this. We are
the original owner, and it has never been wrecked and neither my wife or I
ever recall hitting a curb or pothole that hard. We asked why we didn't
notice it before and they said that the tires may have worn in such a way to
offset most of the effect and that when we put a new tire on the right front
it made it more noticeable.
They said it was safe to drive, it would mainly be affecting the tire wear,
so we're going to take it to the dealer Monday and see what they say. The
Goodyear shop gave us the alignment report and suggested that we show it to
the Hyundai service tech, so I don't think they were trying to pull
something.
The values flagged on the report were:
Front camber Left: -.6, right +.7, (spec -.5 to +.5)
Front toe Left -.25, right -.34 (spec -.08 to +.08)
Front Cross Camber -1.3 (spec -.5 to +.5)
Front Total Toe -.59 (spec -.16 to +.16)
Rear camber Left -1, right +.4 (spec -1 to 0)
Rear toe Left -.06, right -.41 (spec 0 to +.16)
Rear cross camber -1.4 (spec -.5 to +.5)
Rear toe -.47 (spec 0 to +.31)
I guess I'm just trying to get some information on this problem. Does a
problem like this seem to be possible without a major accident? Overall
we've been satisfied with the Hyundai quality, but could something like this
be a manufacturing defect, or something at least partially covered by
Hyundai? We just got our third Hyundai from the same dealer a few months
ago, so I'm hoping they might be able to work out something better than
$1,400..
Any suggestions would be appreciated
Mike O.
11-10-2008, 04:11 PM
#2
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 2004 Sonata alignment problem
Everything in that report is either adjustable or close enough to spec. to
not cause a major issue.
I also see that on both the front and rear, the right camber values are
(nearly) excessively positive while the left camber values are excessively
negative. This makes me wonder if the alignment rack was properly
leveled.
Also check your tire wear on your original tires. Are any of them worn on
one edge but not the other? If not, that adds to my doubt that the
alignment readings are correct. Both the front and rear toe are listed as
being significantly out of spec. If that is actually the case, and if it
has been the case for quite some time, the posted readings suggest you
should have severe wear on the inside edges of all four tires. Maybe have
the dealer check it on their alignment rack to compare readings.
The most likely reason you'd have a pulling after tire replacement that
wasn't there prior to the tire replacement is what's called radial tire
pull. Tires can have different rolling resistance, which can cause the
vehicle to pull toward the side which has the front tire of greatest
rolling resistance. This is most frequently noticeable when the two front
tires are not identical.
Also, many people use the word "pull" incorrectly as it relates to
automobile steering. "Pulling" means that if you let go of the steering
wheel while driving straight ahead on smooth, level pavement, the vehicle
will turn one direction or another. No vehicle is perfect in this
regard-- a minor drift over a tenth of a mile is not abnomal. On the
other hand, significant pressure to keep the wheel straight, or a
significantly turning wheel when released does suggest a problem exists.
Many people use the word "pull" to describe a wheel-centering issue. If
you must turn the steering wheel away from center to keep the vehicle
traveling straight ahead, you are experiencing a wheel centering issue,
not a pulling issue. It is possible, too, to have a pulling issue severe
enough to cause a wheel centering issue.
Has anyone swapped the front tires or rotated the tires to see if the
issue changes or goes away? That should be the first step, considering
that the problem seemed to arise immediately after the tire replacement.
--
Message posted using http://www.talkaboutautos.com/group/alt.autos.hyundai/
More information at http://www.talkaboutautos.com/faq.html
not cause a major issue.
I also see that on both the front and rear, the right camber values are
(nearly) excessively positive while the left camber values are excessively
negative. This makes me wonder if the alignment rack was properly
leveled.
Also check your tire wear on your original tires. Are any of them worn on
one edge but not the other? If not, that adds to my doubt that the
alignment readings are correct. Both the front and rear toe are listed as
being significantly out of spec. If that is actually the case, and if it
has been the case for quite some time, the posted readings suggest you
should have severe wear on the inside edges of all four tires. Maybe have
the dealer check it on their alignment rack to compare readings.
The most likely reason you'd have a pulling after tire replacement that
wasn't there prior to the tire replacement is what's called radial tire
pull. Tires can have different rolling resistance, which can cause the
vehicle to pull toward the side which has the front tire of greatest
rolling resistance. This is most frequently noticeable when the two front
tires are not identical.
Also, many people use the word "pull" incorrectly as it relates to
automobile steering. "Pulling" means that if you let go of the steering
wheel while driving straight ahead on smooth, level pavement, the vehicle
will turn one direction or another. No vehicle is perfect in this
regard-- a minor drift over a tenth of a mile is not abnomal. On the
other hand, significant pressure to keep the wheel straight, or a
significantly turning wheel when released does suggest a problem exists.
Many people use the word "pull" to describe a wheel-centering issue. If
you must turn the steering wheel away from center to keep the vehicle
traveling straight ahead, you are experiencing a wheel centering issue,
not a pulling issue. It is possible, too, to have a pulling issue severe
enough to cause a wheel centering issue.
Has anyone swapped the front tires or rotated the tires to see if the
issue changes or goes away? That should be the first step, considering
that the problem seemed to arise immediately after the tire replacement.
--
Message posted using http://www.talkaboutautos.com/group/alt.autos.hyundai/
More information at http://www.talkaboutautos.com/faq.html
11-10-2008, 11:04 PM
#3
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 2004 Sonata alignment problem
Thanks for the response.
From what I gathered, the excessive camber was their concern since it wasn't
adjustable without changing the ball joints and control arms.
However, it's all a moot point now. Last night we dropped it off at the
Hyundai dealership. The dealer tech called me this morning before he did
any work to get some more info on exactly what we were bringing it in for.
I described the problem and he was a little surprised about the amount of
work needed. He wanted to hook it up to their alignment rack and asked for
my OK (which I gave, since that was pretty much the point of bringing it to
the dealer..)
To make a long story short, it looks like the original shop didn't have the
machine set up right (just like you described). The Hyundai dealer showed a
camber of about -.2 for the left, and +.2 for the right. The rear camber
was -.6 on left and 0 on the right. The other readings pretty much matched
the original tech. The only item out of spec was the toe, which the dealer
adjusted The dealer tech also mentioned the same thing you said about the
about the mix of tires contributing to the pulling problem and suggested
putting the two newer tires on the front, instead of the current arrangement
that had both newer tires on the same side. He wasn't impressed that the
original place didn't suggest that...
Bottom line was the total cost was about $90. A whole lot better than
$1,400! It also pretty much ends any future dealing with the original
shop.. I don't think it was anything deliberate on their part, but I think
they were a little too quick to accept their test results, especially with
the good condition of the car and after we assured them that it hadn't been
in any kind of serious accident. Especially given that they acted surprised
that it was that far out of spec without any apparent cause.
Mike O.
"hyundaitech" <notpublic@not.public.com> wrote in message
news:5929d518c12d1cdbbe1baf6ab4c54052@localhost.ta lkaboutautos.com...
> Everything in that report is either adjustable or close enough to spec. to
> not cause a major issue.
>
> I also see that on both the front and rear, the right camber values are
> (nearly) excessively positive while the left camber values are excessively
> negative. This makes me wonder if the alignment rack was properly
> leveled.
>
> Also check your tire wear on your original tires. Are any of them worn on
> one edge but not the other? If not, that adds to my doubt that the
> alignment readings are correct. Both the front and rear toe are listed as
> being significantly out of spec. If that is actually the case, and if it
> has been the case for quite some time, the posted readings suggest you
> should have severe wear on the inside edges of all four tires. Maybe have
> the dealer check it on their alignment rack to compare readings.
>
> The most likely reason you'd have a pulling after tire replacement that
> wasn't there prior to the tire replacement is what's called radial tire
> pull. Tires can have different rolling resistance, which can cause the
> vehicle to pull toward the side which has the front tire of greatest
> rolling resistance. This is most frequently noticeable when the two front
> tires are not identical.
>
> Also, many people use the word "pull" incorrectly as it relates to
> automobile steering. "Pulling" means that if you let go of the steering
> wheel while driving straight ahead on smooth, level pavement, the vehicle
> will turn one direction or another. No vehicle is perfect in this
> regard-- a minor drift over a tenth of a mile is not abnomal. On the
> other hand, significant pressure to keep the wheel straight, or a
> significantly turning wheel when released does suggest a problem exists.
>
> Many people use the word "pull" to describe a wheel-centering issue. If
> you must turn the steering wheel away from center to keep the vehicle
> traveling straight ahead, you are experiencing a wheel centering issue,
> not a pulling issue. It is possible, too, to have a pulling issue severe
> enough to cause a wheel centering issue.
>
> Has anyone swapped the front tires or rotated the tires to see if the
> issue changes or goes away? That should be the first step, considering
> that the problem seemed to arise immediately after the tire replacement.
>
>
>
> --
> Message posted using
> http://www.talkaboutautos.com/group/alt.autos.hyundai/
> More information at http://www.talkaboutautos.com/faq.html
>
From what I gathered, the excessive camber was their concern since it wasn't
adjustable without changing the ball joints and control arms.
However, it's all a moot point now. Last night we dropped it off at the
Hyundai dealership. The dealer tech called me this morning before he did
any work to get some more info on exactly what we were bringing it in for.
I described the problem and he was a little surprised about the amount of
work needed. He wanted to hook it up to their alignment rack and asked for
my OK (which I gave, since that was pretty much the point of bringing it to
the dealer..)
To make a long story short, it looks like the original shop didn't have the
machine set up right (just like you described). The Hyundai dealer showed a
camber of about -.2 for the left, and +.2 for the right. The rear camber
was -.6 on left and 0 on the right. The other readings pretty much matched
the original tech. The only item out of spec was the toe, which the dealer
adjusted The dealer tech also mentioned the same thing you said about the
about the mix of tires contributing to the pulling problem and suggested
putting the two newer tires on the front, instead of the current arrangement
that had both newer tires on the same side. He wasn't impressed that the
original place didn't suggest that...
Bottom line was the total cost was about $90. A whole lot better than
$1,400! It also pretty much ends any future dealing with the original
shop.. I don't think it was anything deliberate on their part, but I think
they were a little too quick to accept their test results, especially with
the good condition of the car and after we assured them that it hadn't been
in any kind of serious accident. Especially given that they acted surprised
that it was that far out of spec without any apparent cause.
Mike O.
"hyundaitech" <notpublic@not.public.com> wrote in message
news:5929d518c12d1cdbbe1baf6ab4c54052@localhost.ta lkaboutautos.com...
> Everything in that report is either adjustable or close enough to spec. to
> not cause a major issue.
>
> I also see that on both the front and rear, the right camber values are
> (nearly) excessively positive while the left camber values are excessively
> negative. This makes me wonder if the alignment rack was properly
> leveled.
>
> Also check your tire wear on your original tires. Are any of them worn on
> one edge but not the other? If not, that adds to my doubt that the
> alignment readings are correct. Both the front and rear toe are listed as
> being significantly out of spec. If that is actually the case, and if it
> has been the case for quite some time, the posted readings suggest you
> should have severe wear on the inside edges of all four tires. Maybe have
> the dealer check it on their alignment rack to compare readings.
>
> The most likely reason you'd have a pulling after tire replacement that
> wasn't there prior to the tire replacement is what's called radial tire
> pull. Tires can have different rolling resistance, which can cause the
> vehicle to pull toward the side which has the front tire of greatest
> rolling resistance. This is most frequently noticeable when the two front
> tires are not identical.
>
> Also, many people use the word "pull" incorrectly as it relates to
> automobile steering. "Pulling" means that if you let go of the steering
> wheel while driving straight ahead on smooth, level pavement, the vehicle
> will turn one direction or another. No vehicle is perfect in this
> regard-- a minor drift over a tenth of a mile is not abnomal. On the
> other hand, significant pressure to keep the wheel straight, or a
> significantly turning wheel when released does suggest a problem exists.
>
> Many people use the word "pull" to describe a wheel-centering issue. If
> you must turn the steering wheel away from center to keep the vehicle
> traveling straight ahead, you are experiencing a wheel centering issue,
> not a pulling issue. It is possible, too, to have a pulling issue severe
> enough to cause a wheel centering issue.
>
> Has anyone swapped the front tires or rotated the tires to see if the
> issue changes or goes away? That should be the first step, considering
> that the problem seemed to arise immediately after the tire replacement.
>
>
>
> --
> Message posted using
> http://www.talkaboutautos.com/group/alt.autos.hyundai/
> More information at http://www.talkaboutautos.com/faq.html
>
11-11-2008, 07:15 AM
#4
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: 2004 Sonata alignment problem
I forgot to add: We got the car back from the dealer after having them
rearrange the tires and adjust the alignment, and it drives perfectly.
"Mike O." <putthespam@thecan.com> wrote in message
news:av7Sk.113$jZ1.26@flpi144.ffdc.sbc.com...
> Thanks for the response.
>
> From what I gathered, the excessive camber was their concern since it
> wasn't adjustable without changing the ball joints and control arms.
>
> However, it's all a moot point now. Last night we dropped it off at the
> Hyundai dealership. The dealer tech called me this morning before he did
> any work to get some more info on exactly what we were bringing it in for.
> I described the problem and he was a little surprised about the amount of
> work needed. He wanted to hook it up to their alignment rack and asked for
> my OK (which I gave, since that was pretty much the point of bringing it
> to the dealer..)
>
> To make a long story short, it looks like the original shop didn't have
> the machine set up right (just like you described). The Hyundai dealer
> showed a camber of about -.2 for the left, and +.2 for the right. The rear
> camber was -.6 on left and 0 on the right. The other readings pretty much
> matched the original tech. The only item out of spec was the toe, which
> the dealer adjusted The dealer tech also mentioned the same thing you
> said about the about the mix of tires contributing to the pulling problem
> and suggested putting the two newer tires on the front, instead of the
> current arrangement that had both newer tires on the same side. He wasn't
> impressed that the original place didn't suggest that...
>
> Bottom line was the total cost was about $90. A whole lot better than
> $1,400! It also pretty much ends any future dealing with the original
> shop.. I don't think it was anything deliberate on their part, but I
> think they were a little too quick to accept their test results,
> especially with the good condition of the car and after we assured them
> that it hadn't been in any kind of serious accident. Especially given
> that they acted surprised that it was that far out of spec without any
> apparent cause.
>
> Mike O.
>
>
>
> "hyundaitech" <notpublic@not.public.com> wrote in message
> news:5929d518c12d1cdbbe1baf6ab4c54052@localhost.ta lkaboutautos.com...
>> Everything in that report is either adjustable or close enough to spec.
>> to
>> not cause a major issue.
>>
>> I also see that on both the front and rear, the right camber values are
>> (nearly) excessively positive while the left camber values are
>> excessively
>> negative. This makes me wonder if the alignment rack was properly
>> leveled.
>>
>> Also check your tire wear on your original tires. Are any of them worn
>> on
>> one edge but not the other? If not, that adds to my doubt that the
>> alignment readings are correct. Both the front and rear toe are listed
>> as
>> being significantly out of spec. If that is actually the case, and if it
>> has been the case for quite some time, the posted readings suggest you
>> should have severe wear on the inside edges of all four tires. Maybe
>> have
>> the dealer check it on their alignment rack to compare readings.
>>
>> The most likely reason you'd have a pulling after tire replacement that
>> wasn't there prior to the tire replacement is what's called radial tire
>> pull. Tires can have different rolling resistance, which can cause the
>> vehicle to pull toward the side which has the front tire of greatest
>> rolling resistance. This is most frequently noticeable when the two
>> front
>> tires are not identical.
>>
>> Also, many people use the word "pull" incorrectly as it relates to
>> automobile steering. "Pulling" means that if you let go of the steering
>> wheel while driving straight ahead on smooth, level pavement, the vehicle
>> will turn one direction or another. No vehicle is perfect in this
>> regard-- a minor drift over a tenth of a mile is not abnomal. On the
>> other hand, significant pressure to keep the wheel straight, or a
>> significantly turning wheel when released does suggest a problem exists.
>>
>> Many people use the word "pull" to describe a wheel-centering issue. If
>> you must turn the steering wheel away from center to keep the vehicle
>> traveling straight ahead, you are experiencing a wheel centering issue,
>> not a pulling issue. It is possible, too, to have a pulling issue severe
>> enough to cause a wheel centering issue.
>>
>> Has anyone swapped the front tires or rotated the tires to see if the
>> issue changes or goes away? That should be the first step, considering
>> that the problem seemed to arise immediately after the tire replacement.
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Message posted using
>> http://www.talkaboutautos.com/group/alt.autos.hyundai/
>> More information at http://www.talkaboutautos.com/faq.html
>>
>
rearrange the tires and adjust the alignment, and it drives perfectly.
"Mike O." <putthespam@thecan.com> wrote in message
news:av7Sk.113$jZ1.26@flpi144.ffdc.sbc.com...
> Thanks for the response.
>
> From what I gathered, the excessive camber was their concern since it
> wasn't adjustable without changing the ball joints and control arms.
>
> However, it's all a moot point now. Last night we dropped it off at the
> Hyundai dealership. The dealer tech called me this morning before he did
> any work to get some more info on exactly what we were bringing it in for.
> I described the problem and he was a little surprised about the amount of
> work needed. He wanted to hook it up to their alignment rack and asked for
> my OK (which I gave, since that was pretty much the point of bringing it
> to the dealer..)
>
> To make a long story short, it looks like the original shop didn't have
> the machine set up right (just like you described). The Hyundai dealer
> showed a camber of about -.2 for the left, and +.2 for the right. The rear
> camber was -.6 on left and 0 on the right. The other readings pretty much
> matched the original tech. The only item out of spec was the toe, which
> the dealer adjusted The dealer tech also mentioned the same thing you
> said about the about the mix of tires contributing to the pulling problem
> and suggested putting the two newer tires on the front, instead of the
> current arrangement that had both newer tires on the same side. He wasn't
> impressed that the original place didn't suggest that...
>
> Bottom line was the total cost was about $90. A whole lot better than
> $1,400! It also pretty much ends any future dealing with the original
> shop.. I don't think it was anything deliberate on their part, but I
> think they were a little too quick to accept their test results,
> especially with the good condition of the car and after we assured them
> that it hadn't been in any kind of serious accident. Especially given
> that they acted surprised that it was that far out of spec without any
> apparent cause.
>
> Mike O.
>
>
>
> "hyundaitech" <notpublic@not.public.com> wrote in message
> news:5929d518c12d1cdbbe1baf6ab4c54052@localhost.ta lkaboutautos.com...
>> Everything in that report is either adjustable or close enough to spec.
>> to
>> not cause a major issue.
>>
>> I also see that on both the front and rear, the right camber values are
>> (nearly) excessively positive while the left camber values are
>> excessively
>> negative. This makes me wonder if the alignment rack was properly
>> leveled.
>>
>> Also check your tire wear on your original tires. Are any of them worn
>> on
>> one edge but not the other? If not, that adds to my doubt that the
>> alignment readings are correct. Both the front and rear toe are listed
>> as
>> being significantly out of spec. If that is actually the case, and if it
>> has been the case for quite some time, the posted readings suggest you
>> should have severe wear on the inside edges of all four tires. Maybe
>> have
>> the dealer check it on their alignment rack to compare readings.
>>
>> The most likely reason you'd have a pulling after tire replacement that
>> wasn't there prior to the tire replacement is what's called radial tire
>> pull. Tires can have different rolling resistance, which can cause the
>> vehicle to pull toward the side which has the front tire of greatest
>> rolling resistance. This is most frequently noticeable when the two
>> front
>> tires are not identical.
>>
>> Also, many people use the word "pull" incorrectly as it relates to
>> automobile steering. "Pulling" means that if you let go of the steering
>> wheel while driving straight ahead on smooth, level pavement, the vehicle
>> will turn one direction or another. No vehicle is perfect in this
>> regard-- a minor drift over a tenth of a mile is not abnomal. On the
>> other hand, significant pressure to keep the wheel straight, or a
>> significantly turning wheel when released does suggest a problem exists.
>>
>> Many people use the word "pull" to describe a wheel-centering issue. If
>> you must turn the steering wheel away from center to keep the vehicle
>> traveling straight ahead, you are experiencing a wheel centering issue,
>> not a pulling issue. It is possible, too, to have a pulling issue severe
>> enough to cause a wheel centering issue.
>>
>> Has anyone swapped the front tires or rotated the tires to see if the
>> issue changes or goes away? That should be the first step, considering
>> that the problem seemed to arise immediately after the tire replacement.
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> Message posted using
>> http://www.talkaboutautos.com/group/alt.autos.hyundai/
>> More information at http://www.talkaboutautos.com/faq.html
>>
>
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