Transmission Flush
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
Mike Marlow wrote:
> Well yeah - if you run the tranny low, but it's not at all difficult to keep
> it topped off while you're flushing it. You'd have to be asleep under the
> hood to drain it down low enough to pump air. You do exchange the TC fluid
> this way - it's a closed loop system. Perhaps one could argue that there is
> some very, very small percentage of the old fluid that mixes with the new,
> but that is such a small number that it is inconsequential.
How do you keep it full? How do you even check the oil when you have
the dipstick out to pour the oil in?
I'll take your word for it on the Hyundai TC as I don't have a shop
manual for one yet. Many of the older TCs didn't really exchange oil
much until they were spinning at a pretty high RPM. At idle, not much
oil was exchanged between the TC internals and the rest of the transmission.
>>In any event, it is completely unnecessary. Transmissions don't
>>contaminate the oil anywhere near what engines do with their combustion
>>byproducts. Changing half of the fluid at the recommended intervals is
>>plenty good enough maintenance.
>>
>
>
> Correct - there is not combustion in a tranny so the fluids don't
> contaminate like engine oil does. But - why bother changing tranny fluid at
> all then? It's so easy to flush the tranny, and it's done so infrequently,
> that it's hardly worth *not* doing it.
The main reason generally is to change the filter. I think you or
someone else said that Hyundai has no filter, but that seems like a
major oversight if true. Changing the filter and half of the fluid
probably removed 90% of the wear particles and also gave you a fairly
large dose of new additives for the seals, friction modifiers, etc.
I've never seen a car maker require transmissions flushes so I think
they are largely a waste of money and fluid.
You'd have to run probably 2-3 times the capacity of the transmission
through it to have any hope of anything approaching a 100% exchange of
fluid, and even then I'll bet you don't get it all.
> As an aside - have you ever run flush/cleaner through tranny lines before
> installing a rebuilt, or a new tranny? Did you see the amount of ugly black
> crap that comes out of those lines? Trannies are constantly wearing and
> degrading. Clutch residue, etc. has to go somewhere and it does not all
> accumulate in the pan. Flushing the lines, though not the same as a real
> cleaning, does a lot to clean out the whole system. It's the only way
> you're going to clean the residue out of the intercooler and the lines
> themselves.
Nope, I've never had to replace a transmission in 30 years of car
ownership. My last vehicle before the Sonata was a 96 Plymouth Grand
Voyager with the supposedly fragile electronic 4-speed. It went to
178,000 miles before a drunk ran into me an totaled it right before
Christmas. The transmission was original and working great. Regular
maintenance and sane driving practices and you shouldn't have to replace
a transmission, unless you get the occasional lemon.
I'm not saying there aren't conditions where a flush makes sense, and it
sounds like a rebuilt tranny is one of them, however, to me this
indicates a really lousy rebuild. A good rebuilding of either engines
or transmissions should ensure that things are squeaky clean before
being assembled.
I'm saying that there is no need to flush an automatic as part of
routine maintenance.
Matt
> Well yeah - if you run the tranny low, but it's not at all difficult to keep
> it topped off while you're flushing it. You'd have to be asleep under the
> hood to drain it down low enough to pump air. You do exchange the TC fluid
> this way - it's a closed loop system. Perhaps one could argue that there is
> some very, very small percentage of the old fluid that mixes with the new,
> but that is such a small number that it is inconsequential.
How do you keep it full? How do you even check the oil when you have
the dipstick out to pour the oil in?
I'll take your word for it on the Hyundai TC as I don't have a shop
manual for one yet. Many of the older TCs didn't really exchange oil
much until they were spinning at a pretty high RPM. At idle, not much
oil was exchanged between the TC internals and the rest of the transmission.
>>In any event, it is completely unnecessary. Transmissions don't
>>contaminate the oil anywhere near what engines do with their combustion
>>byproducts. Changing half of the fluid at the recommended intervals is
>>plenty good enough maintenance.
>>
>
>
> Correct - there is not combustion in a tranny so the fluids don't
> contaminate like engine oil does. But - why bother changing tranny fluid at
> all then? It's so easy to flush the tranny, and it's done so infrequently,
> that it's hardly worth *not* doing it.
The main reason generally is to change the filter. I think you or
someone else said that Hyundai has no filter, but that seems like a
major oversight if true. Changing the filter and half of the fluid
probably removed 90% of the wear particles and also gave you a fairly
large dose of new additives for the seals, friction modifiers, etc.
I've never seen a car maker require transmissions flushes so I think
they are largely a waste of money and fluid.
You'd have to run probably 2-3 times the capacity of the transmission
through it to have any hope of anything approaching a 100% exchange of
fluid, and even then I'll bet you don't get it all.
> As an aside - have you ever run flush/cleaner through tranny lines before
> installing a rebuilt, or a new tranny? Did you see the amount of ugly black
> crap that comes out of those lines? Trannies are constantly wearing and
> degrading. Clutch residue, etc. has to go somewhere and it does not all
> accumulate in the pan. Flushing the lines, though not the same as a real
> cleaning, does a lot to clean out the whole system. It's the only way
> you're going to clean the residue out of the intercooler and the lines
> themselves.
Nope, I've never had to replace a transmission in 30 years of car
ownership. My last vehicle before the Sonata was a 96 Plymouth Grand
Voyager with the supposedly fragile electronic 4-speed. It went to
178,000 miles before a drunk ran into me an totaled it right before
Christmas. The transmission was original and working great. Regular
maintenance and sane driving practices and you shouldn't have to replace
a transmission, unless you get the occasional lemon.
I'm not saying there aren't conditions where a flush makes sense, and it
sounds like a rebuilt tranny is one of them, however, to me this
indicates a really lousy rebuild. A good rebuilding of either engines
or transmissions should ensure that things are squeaky clean before
being assembled.
I'm saying that there is no need to flush an automatic as part of
routine maintenance.
Matt
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
"Matt Whiting" <whiting@epix.net> wrote in message
news:5PyBf.5496$lb.478215@news1.epix.net...
> Mike Marlow wrote:
>
> > Well yeah - if you run the tranny low, but it's not at all difficult to
keep
> > it topped off while you're flushing it. You'd have to be asleep under
the
> > hood to drain it down low enough to pump air. You do exchange the TC
fluid
> > this way - it's a closed loop system. Perhaps one could argue that
there is
> > some very, very small percentage of the old fluid that mixes with the
new,
> > but that is such a small number that it is inconsequential.
>
> How do you keep it full? How do you even check the oil when you have
> the dipstick out to pour the oil in?
You watch the oil pouring into the catch pan. It's not at all hard to guage
how much to put it. You really have to pump out a lot of ATF before you get
into any trouble, and it's quite simple to stay ahead of that point.
>
> I'll take your word for it on the Hyundai TC as I don't have a shop
> manual for one yet. Many of the older TCs didn't really exchange oil
> much until they were spinning at a pretty high RPM. At idle, not much
> oil was exchanged between the TC internals and the rest of the
transmission.
Not so high an RPM. Most cars are well at stall by 2,000 RMP or so. The
torque converter pumps quite well at an idle or just above. But - don't
confuse stall (which occurrs at higher RPM's) with pumping which occurs even
at idle. The torque converter is pumping all the while it is turning.
>
>
> >>In any event, it is completely unnecessary. Transmissions don't
> >>contaminate the oil anywhere near what engines do with their combustion
> >>byproducts. Changing half of the fluid at the recommended intervals is
> >>plenty good enough maintenance.
> >>
> >
> >
> > Correct - there is not combustion in a tranny so the fluids don't
> > contaminate like engine oil does. But - why bother changing tranny
fluid at
> > all then? It's so easy to flush the tranny, and it's done so
infrequently,
> > that it's hardly worth *not* doing it.
>
> The main reason generally is to change the filter. I think you or
> someone else said that Hyundai has no filter, but that seems like a
> major oversight if true. Changing the filter and half of the fluid
> probably removed 90% of the wear particles and also gave you a fairly
> large dose of new additives for the seals, friction modifiers, etc.
> I've never seen a car maker require transmissions flushes so I think
> they are largely a waste of money and fluid.
Well, trannies have been serviced by a lot of people by simply changing the
filter and draining the tranny itself, and refilling, but shops have been
pumping the whole system for decades. It's not a novel practice. Any
decent tranny shop will do so as part of a routine tranny service.
What I said about the Hyundai filter was that I thought someone here said
there is no changeable filter in the Hyundai. I believe it was said that
there is a wire mesh filter that is internal to the tranny and is not even a
dealer serviceable item, short of a full tranny teardown.
As far as Hyundai's recommendation, the tech service manual specifically
calls for disconnecting the line to the intercooler while the engine is
idling, for up to one minute or until it stops pumping ATF out.
>
> You'd have to run probably 2-3 times the capacity of the transmission
> through it to have any hope of anything approaching a 100% exchange of
> fluid, and even then I'll bet you don't get it all.
Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never even
seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two quarts
before you are pumping bright new fluid.
>
>
> > As an aside - have you ever run flush/cleaner through tranny lines
before
> > installing a rebuilt, or a new tranny? Did you see the amount of ugly
black
> > crap that comes out of those lines? Trannies are constantly wearing and
> > degrading. Clutch residue, etc. has to go somewhere and it does not all
> > accumulate in the pan. Flushing the lines, though not the same as a
real
> > cleaning, does a lot to clean out the whole system. It's the only way
> > you're going to clean the residue out of the intercooler and the lines
> > themselves.
>
> Nope, I've never had to replace a transmission in 30 years of car
> ownership. My last vehicle before the Sonata was a 96 Plymouth Grand
> Voyager with the supposedly fragile electronic 4-speed. It went to
> 178,000 miles before a drunk ran into me an totaled it right before
> Christmas. The transmission was original and working great. Regular
> maintenance and sane driving practices and you shouldn't have to replace
> a transmission, unless you get the occasional lemon.
But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck is
serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing snow
truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a trouble
free tranny.
>
> I'm not saying there aren't conditions where a flush makes sense, and it
> sounds like a rebuilt tranny is one of them, however, to me this
> indicates a really lousy rebuild. A good rebuilding of either engines
> or transmissions should ensure that things are squeaky clean before
> being assembled.
Read my post again Matt. The flush was to clean out the intercooler and the
tranny lines. Those don't get removed when you pull a tranny to take it to
the shop. They are what held all of the contaminate.
>
> I'm saying that there is no need to flush an automatic as part of
> routine maintenance.
>
Fine, I won't argue with it, but I'll insist it's not a waste of money. I
know what comes out of the lines when a flush is done and I have every
reason to spend the extra 15 minutes and two quarts of ATF to get the system
fully cleaned when I service my tranny.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel.net
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
"Matt Whiting" <whiting@epix.net> wrote in message
news:5PyBf.5496$lb.478215@news1.epix.net...
> Mike Marlow wrote:
>
> > Well yeah - if you run the tranny low, but it's not at all difficult to
keep
> > it topped off while you're flushing it. You'd have to be asleep under
the
> > hood to drain it down low enough to pump air. You do exchange the TC
fluid
> > this way - it's a closed loop system. Perhaps one could argue that
there is
> > some very, very small percentage of the old fluid that mixes with the
new,
> > but that is such a small number that it is inconsequential.
>
> How do you keep it full? How do you even check the oil when you have
> the dipstick out to pour the oil in?
You watch the oil pouring into the catch pan. It's not at all hard to guage
how much to put it. You really have to pump out a lot of ATF before you get
into any trouble, and it's quite simple to stay ahead of that point.
>
> I'll take your word for it on the Hyundai TC as I don't have a shop
> manual for one yet. Many of the older TCs didn't really exchange oil
> much until they were spinning at a pretty high RPM. At idle, not much
> oil was exchanged between the TC internals and the rest of the
transmission.
Not so high an RPM. Most cars are well at stall by 2,000 RMP or so. The
torque converter pumps quite well at an idle or just above. But - don't
confuse stall (which occurrs at higher RPM's) with pumping which occurs even
at idle. The torque converter is pumping all the while it is turning.
>
>
> >>In any event, it is completely unnecessary. Transmissions don't
> >>contaminate the oil anywhere near what engines do with their combustion
> >>byproducts. Changing half of the fluid at the recommended intervals is
> >>plenty good enough maintenance.
> >>
> >
> >
> > Correct - there is not combustion in a tranny so the fluids don't
> > contaminate like engine oil does. But - why bother changing tranny
fluid at
> > all then? It's so easy to flush the tranny, and it's done so
infrequently,
> > that it's hardly worth *not* doing it.
>
> The main reason generally is to change the filter. I think you or
> someone else said that Hyundai has no filter, but that seems like a
> major oversight if true. Changing the filter and half of the fluid
> probably removed 90% of the wear particles and also gave you a fairly
> large dose of new additives for the seals, friction modifiers, etc.
> I've never seen a car maker require transmissions flushes so I think
> they are largely a waste of money and fluid.
Well, trannies have been serviced by a lot of people by simply changing the
filter and draining the tranny itself, and refilling, but shops have been
pumping the whole system for decades. It's not a novel practice. Any
decent tranny shop will do so as part of a routine tranny service.
What I said about the Hyundai filter was that I thought someone here said
there is no changeable filter in the Hyundai. I believe it was said that
there is a wire mesh filter that is internal to the tranny and is not even a
dealer serviceable item, short of a full tranny teardown.
As far as Hyundai's recommendation, the tech service manual specifically
calls for disconnecting the line to the intercooler while the engine is
idling, for up to one minute or until it stops pumping ATF out.
>
> You'd have to run probably 2-3 times the capacity of the transmission
> through it to have any hope of anything approaching a 100% exchange of
> fluid, and even then I'll bet you don't get it all.
Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never even
seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two quarts
before you are pumping bright new fluid.
>
>
> > As an aside - have you ever run flush/cleaner through tranny lines
before
> > installing a rebuilt, or a new tranny? Did you see the amount of ugly
black
> > crap that comes out of those lines? Trannies are constantly wearing and
> > degrading. Clutch residue, etc. has to go somewhere and it does not all
> > accumulate in the pan. Flushing the lines, though not the same as a
real
> > cleaning, does a lot to clean out the whole system. It's the only way
> > you're going to clean the residue out of the intercooler and the lines
> > themselves.
>
> Nope, I've never had to replace a transmission in 30 years of car
> ownership. My last vehicle before the Sonata was a 96 Plymouth Grand
> Voyager with the supposedly fragile electronic 4-speed. It went to
> 178,000 miles before a drunk ran into me an totaled it right before
> Christmas. The transmission was original and working great. Regular
> maintenance and sane driving practices and you shouldn't have to replace
> a transmission, unless you get the occasional lemon.
But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck is
serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing snow
truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a trouble
free tranny.
>
> I'm not saying there aren't conditions where a flush makes sense, and it
> sounds like a rebuilt tranny is one of them, however, to me this
> indicates a really lousy rebuild. A good rebuilding of either engines
> or transmissions should ensure that things are squeaky clean before
> being assembled.
Read my post again Matt. The flush was to clean out the intercooler and the
tranny lines. Those don't get removed when you pull a tranny to take it to
the shop. They are what held all of the contaminate.
>
> I'm saying that there is no need to flush an automatic as part of
> routine maintenance.
>
Fine, I won't argue with it, but I'll insist it's not a waste of money. I
know what comes out of the lines when a flush is done and I have every
reason to spend the extra 15 minutes and two quarts of ATF to get the system
fully cleaned when I service my tranny.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel.net
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
"Matt Whiting" <whiting@epix.net> wrote in message
news:5PyBf.5496$lb.478215@news1.epix.net...
> Mike Marlow wrote:
>
> > Well yeah - if you run the tranny low, but it's not at all difficult to
keep
> > it topped off while you're flushing it. You'd have to be asleep under
the
> > hood to drain it down low enough to pump air. You do exchange the TC
fluid
> > this way - it's a closed loop system. Perhaps one could argue that
there is
> > some very, very small percentage of the old fluid that mixes with the
new,
> > but that is such a small number that it is inconsequential.
>
> How do you keep it full? How do you even check the oil when you have
> the dipstick out to pour the oil in?
You watch the oil pouring into the catch pan. It's not at all hard to guage
how much to put it. You really have to pump out a lot of ATF before you get
into any trouble, and it's quite simple to stay ahead of that point.
>
> I'll take your word for it on the Hyundai TC as I don't have a shop
> manual for one yet. Many of the older TCs didn't really exchange oil
> much until they were spinning at a pretty high RPM. At idle, not much
> oil was exchanged between the TC internals and the rest of the
transmission.
Not so high an RPM. Most cars are well at stall by 2,000 RMP or so. The
torque converter pumps quite well at an idle or just above. But - don't
confuse stall (which occurrs at higher RPM's) with pumping which occurs even
at idle. The torque converter is pumping all the while it is turning.
>
>
> >>In any event, it is completely unnecessary. Transmissions don't
> >>contaminate the oil anywhere near what engines do with their combustion
> >>byproducts. Changing half of the fluid at the recommended intervals is
> >>plenty good enough maintenance.
> >>
> >
> >
> > Correct - there is not combustion in a tranny so the fluids don't
> > contaminate like engine oil does. But - why bother changing tranny
fluid at
> > all then? It's so easy to flush the tranny, and it's done so
infrequently,
> > that it's hardly worth *not* doing it.
>
> The main reason generally is to change the filter. I think you or
> someone else said that Hyundai has no filter, but that seems like a
> major oversight if true. Changing the filter and half of the fluid
> probably removed 90% of the wear particles and also gave you a fairly
> large dose of new additives for the seals, friction modifiers, etc.
> I've never seen a car maker require transmissions flushes so I think
> they are largely a waste of money and fluid.
Well, trannies have been serviced by a lot of people by simply changing the
filter and draining the tranny itself, and refilling, but shops have been
pumping the whole system for decades. It's not a novel practice. Any
decent tranny shop will do so as part of a routine tranny service.
What I said about the Hyundai filter was that I thought someone here said
there is no changeable filter in the Hyundai. I believe it was said that
there is a wire mesh filter that is internal to the tranny and is not even a
dealer serviceable item, short of a full tranny teardown.
As far as Hyundai's recommendation, the tech service manual specifically
calls for disconnecting the line to the intercooler while the engine is
idling, for up to one minute or until it stops pumping ATF out.
>
> You'd have to run probably 2-3 times the capacity of the transmission
> through it to have any hope of anything approaching a 100% exchange of
> fluid, and even then I'll bet you don't get it all.
Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never even
seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two quarts
before you are pumping bright new fluid.
>
>
> > As an aside - have you ever run flush/cleaner through tranny lines
before
> > installing a rebuilt, or a new tranny? Did you see the amount of ugly
black
> > crap that comes out of those lines? Trannies are constantly wearing and
> > degrading. Clutch residue, etc. has to go somewhere and it does not all
> > accumulate in the pan. Flushing the lines, though not the same as a
real
> > cleaning, does a lot to clean out the whole system. It's the only way
> > you're going to clean the residue out of the intercooler and the lines
> > themselves.
>
> Nope, I've never had to replace a transmission in 30 years of car
> ownership. My last vehicle before the Sonata was a 96 Plymouth Grand
> Voyager with the supposedly fragile electronic 4-speed. It went to
> 178,000 miles before a drunk ran into me an totaled it right before
> Christmas. The transmission was original and working great. Regular
> maintenance and sane driving practices and you shouldn't have to replace
> a transmission, unless you get the occasional lemon.
But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck is
serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing snow
truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a trouble
free tranny.
>
> I'm not saying there aren't conditions where a flush makes sense, and it
> sounds like a rebuilt tranny is one of them, however, to me this
> indicates a really lousy rebuild. A good rebuilding of either engines
> or transmissions should ensure that things are squeaky clean before
> being assembled.
Read my post again Matt. The flush was to clean out the intercooler and the
tranny lines. Those don't get removed when you pull a tranny to take it to
the shop. They are what held all of the contaminate.
>
> I'm saying that there is no need to flush an automatic as part of
> routine maintenance.
>
Fine, I won't argue with it, but I'll insist it's not a waste of money. I
know what comes out of the lines when a flush is done and I have every
reason to spend the extra 15 minutes and two quarts of ATF to get the system
fully cleaned when I service my tranny.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel.net
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
Mike Marlow wrote:
> Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never even
> seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two quarts
> before you are pumping bright new fluid.
What is the capacity of the Hyundai automatic?
> But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
> ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
> reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
> snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck is
> serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
> Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing snow
> truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
> that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a trouble
> free tranny.
My truck has 90,000 miles and plows snow regularly. Then again, I got a
standard transmission just so I wouldn't have to worry about
transmission failures from plowing snow and towing! :-)
Matt
> Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never even
> seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two quarts
> before you are pumping bright new fluid.
What is the capacity of the Hyundai automatic?
> But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
> ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
> reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
> snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck is
> serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
> Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing snow
> truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
> that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a trouble
> free tranny.
My truck has 90,000 miles and plows snow regularly. Then again, I got a
standard transmission just so I wouldn't have to worry about
transmission failures from plowing snow and towing! :-)
Matt
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
Mike Marlow wrote:
> Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never even
> seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two quarts
> before you are pumping bright new fluid.
What is the capacity of the Hyundai automatic?
> But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
> ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
> reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
> snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck is
> serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
> Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing snow
> truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
> that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a trouble
> free tranny.
My truck has 90,000 miles and plows snow regularly. Then again, I got a
standard transmission just so I wouldn't have to worry about
transmission failures from plowing snow and towing! :-)
Matt
> Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never even
> seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two quarts
> before you are pumping bright new fluid.
What is the capacity of the Hyundai automatic?
> But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
> ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
> reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
> snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck is
> serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
> Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing snow
> truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
> that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a trouble
> free tranny.
My truck has 90,000 miles and plows snow regularly. Then again, I got a
standard transmission just so I wouldn't have to worry about
transmission failures from plowing snow and towing! :-)
Matt
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
Mike Marlow wrote:
> Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never even
> seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two quarts
> before you are pumping bright new fluid.
What is the capacity of the Hyundai automatic?
> But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
> ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
> reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
> snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck is
> serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
> Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing snow
> truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
> that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a trouble
> free tranny.
My truck has 90,000 miles and plows snow regularly. Then again, I got a
standard transmission just so I wouldn't have to worry about
transmission failures from plowing snow and towing! :-)
Matt
> Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never even
> seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two quarts
> before you are pumping bright new fluid.
What is the capacity of the Hyundai automatic?
> But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
> ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
> reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
> snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck is
> serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
> Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing snow
> truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
> that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a trouble
> free tranny.
My truck has 90,000 miles and plows snow regularly. Then again, I got a
standard transmission just so I wouldn't have to worry about
transmission failures from plowing snow and towing! :-)
Matt
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
"Matt Whiting" <whiting@epix.net> wrote in message
news:gQABf.5513$lb.478705@news1.epix.net...
> Mike Marlow wrote:
>
> > Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never
even
> > seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two
quarts
> > before you are pumping bright new fluid.
>
> What is the capacity of the Hyundai automatic?
7-ish quarts I believe.
>
>
> > But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
> > ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
> > reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
> > snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck
is
> > serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
> > Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing
snow
> > truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
> > that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a
trouble
> > free tranny.
>
> My truck has 90,000 miles and plows snow regularly. Then again, I got a
> standard transmission just so I wouldn't have to worry about
> transmission failures from plowing snow and towing! :-)
>
Oh sit on it! (God hates those who gloat). My plow truck before this one
was a standard and I had 0 problems with it plowing for 176,000 miles. It
was a little less forgiving of an end over end flip which landed it on the
cab, though. So - I bought this truck used in '96 and except for toasting
the tranny in the middle of plow season last year, it really has been pretty
much trouble free. It's a '94 Silverado with the 4L60E in it and though
it's really not a bad tranny, it's not really beefy enough for plowing. We
get a lot of snow around here - I think I've mentioned in the group that we
get in the neighborhood of 300 inches per year, and that's a lot of plowing.
The truck had 32,000 on it when I bought it and it had never plowed snow,
but it did pull a hard body camper and I can't speak to the previous owner's
towing experiences. I'd have gladly bought another standard, but this truck
came along and it's so nice in so many other respects, that I just bought
it. The tranny only cost me $500 for a complete rebuild - and I mean a
complete rebuild, through a buddy who is a tranny mechanic. I had to pull
it and put it back in, but it was worth the effort for that price.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel.net
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
"Matt Whiting" <whiting@epix.net> wrote in message
news:gQABf.5513$lb.478705@news1.epix.net...
> Mike Marlow wrote:
>
> > Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never
even
> > seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two
quarts
> > before you are pumping bright new fluid.
>
> What is the capacity of the Hyundai automatic?
7-ish quarts I believe.
>
>
> > But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
> > ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
> > reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
> > snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck
is
> > serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
> > Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing
snow
> > truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
> > that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a
trouble
> > free tranny.
>
> My truck has 90,000 miles and plows snow regularly. Then again, I got a
> standard transmission just so I wouldn't have to worry about
> transmission failures from plowing snow and towing! :-)
>
Oh sit on it! (God hates those who gloat). My plow truck before this one
was a standard and I had 0 problems with it plowing for 176,000 miles. It
was a little less forgiving of an end over end flip which landed it on the
cab, though. So - I bought this truck used in '96 and except for toasting
the tranny in the middle of plow season last year, it really has been pretty
much trouble free. It's a '94 Silverado with the 4L60E in it and though
it's really not a bad tranny, it's not really beefy enough for plowing. We
get a lot of snow around here - I think I've mentioned in the group that we
get in the neighborhood of 300 inches per year, and that's a lot of plowing.
The truck had 32,000 on it when I bought it and it had never plowed snow,
but it did pull a hard body camper and I can't speak to the previous owner's
towing experiences. I'd have gladly bought another standard, but this truck
came along and it's so nice in so many other respects, that I just bought
it. The tranny only cost me $500 for a complete rebuild - and I mean a
complete rebuild, through a buddy who is a tranny mechanic. I had to pull
it and put it back in, but it was worth the effort for that price.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel.net
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
"Matt Whiting" <whiting@epix.net> wrote in message
news:gQABf.5513$lb.478705@news1.epix.net...
> Mike Marlow wrote:
>
> > Not at all. You can't say this when by your own admission you've never
even
> > seen the process done. Typically you don't go through more than two
quarts
> > before you are pumping bright new fluid.
>
> What is the capacity of the Hyundai automatic?
7-ish quarts I believe.
>
>
> > But then again there are those of us who use our vechicles in different
> > ways. I had to rebuild my tranny in my pickup last winter after it lost
> > reverse. In part due to normal wear and in part because the truck plows
> > snow and at a little over 100,000 the tranny bit the bullet. The truck
is
> > serviced on a regular basis, and is well cared for and not driven hard.
> > Even plowing snow it is driven easy, though one can never call plowing
snow
> > truly easy. There are lots of reasons that trannies die - one can't say
> > that regualar maintenance and sane driving practices will ensure a
trouble
> > free tranny.
>
> My truck has 90,000 miles and plows snow regularly. Then again, I got a
> standard transmission just so I wouldn't have to worry about
> transmission failures from plowing snow and towing! :-)
>
Oh sit on it! (God hates those who gloat). My plow truck before this one
was a standard and I had 0 problems with it plowing for 176,000 miles. It
was a little less forgiving of an end over end flip which landed it on the
cab, though. So - I bought this truck used in '96 and except for toasting
the tranny in the middle of plow season last year, it really has been pretty
much trouble free. It's a '94 Silverado with the 4L60E in it and though
it's really not a bad tranny, it's not really beefy enough for plowing. We
get a lot of snow around here - I think I've mentioned in the group that we
get in the neighborhood of 300 inches per year, and that's a lot of plowing.
The truck had 32,000 on it when I bought it and it had never plowed snow,
but it did pull a hard body camper and I can't speak to the previous owner's
towing experiences. I'd have gladly bought another standard, but this truck
came along and it's so nice in so many other respects, that I just bought
it. The tranny only cost me $500 for a complete rebuild - and I mean a
complete rebuild, through a buddy who is a tranny mechanic. I had to pull
it and put it back in, but it was worth the effort for that price.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel.net
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
Mike Marlow wrote:
> Oh sit on it! (God hates those who gloat).
I'd rather sit in my truck than on it... :-)
> My plow truck before this one
> was a standard and I had 0 problems with it plowing for 176,000 miles. It
> was a little less forgiving of an end over end flip which landed it on the
> cab, though. So - I bought this truck used in '96 and except for toasting
> the tranny in the middle of plow season last year, it really has been pretty
> much trouble free. It's a '94 Silverado with the 4L60E in it and though
> it's really not a bad tranny, it's not really beefy enough for plowing. We
> get a lot of snow around here - I think I've mentioned in the group that we
> get in the neighborhood of 300 inches per year, and that's a lot of plowing.
> The truck had 32,000 on it when I bought it and it had never plowed snow,
> but it did pull a hard body camper and I can't speak to the previous owner's
> towing experiences. I'd have gladly bought another standard, but this truck
> came along and it's so nice in so many other respects, that I just bought
> it. The tranny only cost me $500 for a complete rebuild - and I mean a
> complete rebuild, through a buddy who is a tranny mechanic. I had to pull
> it and put it back in, but it was worth the effort for that price.
I don't get nearly the snow you do, but my driveway is 3/8 mile long, so
even 6" of snow means a fair bit of plowing. Even though people freak
out when they hear me say I plow with a standard shift truck, I still
think that properly driven a standard shift is a much better plow
vehicle. Not quite as fast for things like parking lots, so I
understand why the commercial plow guys use an automatic. Then again,
plowing fast with an auto means shifting gears while you are still
moving at the end of each run, and that is part of what kills the
automatics so quickly.
Matt
> Oh sit on it! (God hates those who gloat).
I'd rather sit in my truck than on it... :-)
> My plow truck before this one
> was a standard and I had 0 problems with it plowing for 176,000 miles. It
> was a little less forgiving of an end over end flip which landed it on the
> cab, though. So - I bought this truck used in '96 and except for toasting
> the tranny in the middle of plow season last year, it really has been pretty
> much trouble free. It's a '94 Silverado with the 4L60E in it and though
> it's really not a bad tranny, it's not really beefy enough for plowing. We
> get a lot of snow around here - I think I've mentioned in the group that we
> get in the neighborhood of 300 inches per year, and that's a lot of plowing.
> The truck had 32,000 on it when I bought it and it had never plowed snow,
> but it did pull a hard body camper and I can't speak to the previous owner's
> towing experiences. I'd have gladly bought another standard, but this truck
> came along and it's so nice in so many other respects, that I just bought
> it. The tranny only cost me $500 for a complete rebuild - and I mean a
> complete rebuild, through a buddy who is a tranny mechanic. I had to pull
> it and put it back in, but it was worth the effort for that price.
I don't get nearly the snow you do, but my driveway is 3/8 mile long, so
even 6" of snow means a fair bit of plowing. Even though people freak
out when they hear me say I plow with a standard shift truck, I still
think that properly driven a standard shift is a much better plow
vehicle. Not quite as fast for things like parking lots, so I
understand why the commercial plow guys use an automatic. Then again,
plowing fast with an auto means shifting gears while you are still
moving at the end of each run, and that is part of what kills the
automatics so quickly.
Matt
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
Mike Marlow wrote:
> Oh sit on it! (God hates those who gloat).
I'd rather sit in my truck than on it... :-)
> My plow truck before this one
> was a standard and I had 0 problems with it plowing for 176,000 miles. It
> was a little less forgiving of an end over end flip which landed it on the
> cab, though. So - I bought this truck used in '96 and except for toasting
> the tranny in the middle of plow season last year, it really has been pretty
> much trouble free. It's a '94 Silverado with the 4L60E in it and though
> it's really not a bad tranny, it's not really beefy enough for plowing. We
> get a lot of snow around here - I think I've mentioned in the group that we
> get in the neighborhood of 300 inches per year, and that's a lot of plowing.
> The truck had 32,000 on it when I bought it and it had never plowed snow,
> but it did pull a hard body camper and I can't speak to the previous owner's
> towing experiences. I'd have gladly bought another standard, but this truck
> came along and it's so nice in so many other respects, that I just bought
> it. The tranny only cost me $500 for a complete rebuild - and I mean a
> complete rebuild, through a buddy who is a tranny mechanic. I had to pull
> it and put it back in, but it was worth the effort for that price.
I don't get nearly the snow you do, but my driveway is 3/8 mile long, so
even 6" of snow means a fair bit of plowing. Even though people freak
out when they hear me say I plow with a standard shift truck, I still
think that properly driven a standard shift is a much better plow
vehicle. Not quite as fast for things like parking lots, so I
understand why the commercial plow guys use an automatic. Then again,
plowing fast with an auto means shifting gears while you are still
moving at the end of each run, and that is part of what kills the
automatics so quickly.
Matt
> Oh sit on it! (God hates those who gloat).
I'd rather sit in my truck than on it... :-)
> My plow truck before this one
> was a standard and I had 0 problems with it plowing for 176,000 miles. It
> was a little less forgiving of an end over end flip which landed it on the
> cab, though. So - I bought this truck used in '96 and except for toasting
> the tranny in the middle of plow season last year, it really has been pretty
> much trouble free. It's a '94 Silverado with the 4L60E in it and though
> it's really not a bad tranny, it's not really beefy enough for plowing. We
> get a lot of snow around here - I think I've mentioned in the group that we
> get in the neighborhood of 300 inches per year, and that's a lot of plowing.
> The truck had 32,000 on it when I bought it and it had never plowed snow,
> but it did pull a hard body camper and I can't speak to the previous owner's
> towing experiences. I'd have gladly bought another standard, but this truck
> came along and it's so nice in so many other respects, that I just bought
> it. The tranny only cost me $500 for a complete rebuild - and I mean a
> complete rebuild, through a buddy who is a tranny mechanic. I had to pull
> it and put it back in, but it was worth the effort for that price.
I don't get nearly the snow you do, but my driveway is 3/8 mile long, so
even 6" of snow means a fair bit of plowing. Even though people freak
out when they hear me say I plow with a standard shift truck, I still
think that properly driven a standard shift is a much better plow
vehicle. Not quite as fast for things like parking lots, so I
understand why the commercial plow guys use an automatic. Then again,
plowing fast with an auto means shifting gears while you are still
moving at the end of each run, and that is part of what kills the
automatics so quickly.
Matt
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
Mike Marlow wrote:
> Oh sit on it! (God hates those who gloat).
I'd rather sit in my truck than on it... :-)
> My plow truck before this one
> was a standard and I had 0 problems with it plowing for 176,000 miles. It
> was a little less forgiving of an end over end flip which landed it on the
> cab, though. So - I bought this truck used in '96 and except for toasting
> the tranny in the middle of plow season last year, it really has been pretty
> much trouble free. It's a '94 Silverado with the 4L60E in it and though
> it's really not a bad tranny, it's not really beefy enough for plowing. We
> get a lot of snow around here - I think I've mentioned in the group that we
> get in the neighborhood of 300 inches per year, and that's a lot of plowing.
> The truck had 32,000 on it when I bought it and it had never plowed snow,
> but it did pull a hard body camper and I can't speak to the previous owner's
> towing experiences. I'd have gladly bought another standard, but this truck
> came along and it's so nice in so many other respects, that I just bought
> it. The tranny only cost me $500 for a complete rebuild - and I mean a
> complete rebuild, through a buddy who is a tranny mechanic. I had to pull
> it and put it back in, but it was worth the effort for that price.
I don't get nearly the snow you do, but my driveway is 3/8 mile long, so
even 6" of snow means a fair bit of plowing. Even though people freak
out when they hear me say I plow with a standard shift truck, I still
think that properly driven a standard shift is a much better plow
vehicle. Not quite as fast for things like parking lots, so I
understand why the commercial plow guys use an automatic. Then again,
plowing fast with an auto means shifting gears while you are still
moving at the end of each run, and that is part of what kills the
automatics so quickly.
Matt
> Oh sit on it! (God hates those who gloat).
I'd rather sit in my truck than on it... :-)
> My plow truck before this one
> was a standard and I had 0 problems with it plowing for 176,000 miles. It
> was a little less forgiving of an end over end flip which landed it on the
> cab, though. So - I bought this truck used in '96 and except for toasting
> the tranny in the middle of plow season last year, it really has been pretty
> much trouble free. It's a '94 Silverado with the 4L60E in it and though
> it's really not a bad tranny, it's not really beefy enough for plowing. We
> get a lot of snow around here - I think I've mentioned in the group that we
> get in the neighborhood of 300 inches per year, and that's a lot of plowing.
> The truck had 32,000 on it when I bought it and it had never plowed snow,
> but it did pull a hard body camper and I can't speak to the previous owner's
> towing experiences. I'd have gladly bought another standard, but this truck
> came along and it's so nice in so many other respects, that I just bought
> it. The tranny only cost me $500 for a complete rebuild - and I mean a
> complete rebuild, through a buddy who is a tranny mechanic. I had to pull
> it and put it back in, but it was worth the effort for that price.
I don't get nearly the snow you do, but my driveway is 3/8 mile long, so
even 6" of snow means a fair bit of plowing. Even though people freak
out when they hear me say I plow with a standard shift truck, I still
think that properly driven a standard shift is a much better plow
vehicle. Not quite as fast for things like parking lots, so I
understand why the commercial plow guys use an automatic. Then again,
plowing fast with an auto means shifting gears while you are still
moving at the end of each run, and that is part of what kills the
automatics so quickly.
Matt
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
"Matt Whiting" <whiting@epix.net> wrote in message
news:bCIBf.5518$lb.479249@news1.epix.net...
>
> I don't get nearly the snow you do, but my driveway is 3/8 mile long, so
> even 6" of snow means a fair bit of plowing.
Yes it does - 3/8 mi is a long push. My driveway is 350 ft long and then I
continue to push another 150 or so feet, in order to get my banks back into
the woods so I have room for snow all winter long. I also have a large
parking/turn-around area at the house end of the driveway that will easily
park 5 cars side by side (and allow for opening doors), and almost enough
space to make two rows, without one of the cars sticking out into the
driveway proper.
> Even though people freak
> out when they hear me say I plow with a standard shift truck, I still
> think that properly driven a standard shift is a much better plow
> vehicle.
Much better. I don't plow commercially so I too prefer a standard for
plowing. My truck is always in 4L for plowing and it almost never sees a
shift. I don't see the need for ground speed while plowing - but then
again, since I'm not doing it commercially, I don't have a schedule to hit.
I do plow a few other people (friends, old folks - older than me, some
shut-ins) that either can't afford to pay for a plow, or the likes. I
easily get my banks to 8-10 feet and never ram a bank. It's a rare
occassion when you get jolted in the cab of my truck.
> Not quite as fast for things like parking lots, so I
> understand why the commercial plow guys use an automatic. Then again,
> plowing fast with an auto means shifting gears while you are still
> moving at the end of each run, and that is part of what kills the
> automatics so quickly.
>
I can't say I see a lot of plow trucks go down for tranny failures. The
failures that seem most common are either from operators who really beat the
trucks (and nothing is going to fix that issue), or problems like I
experienced, where an otherwise good road tranny is really not meant for the
rigors of plowing beyond around 100,000 without a rebuild. At that -
100,000 miles out of a plow truck and then a tranny rebuild is really not a
bad performance history.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel.net
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Transmission Flush
"Matt Whiting" <whiting@epix.net> wrote in message
news:bCIBf.5518$lb.479249@news1.epix.net...
>
> I don't get nearly the snow you do, but my driveway is 3/8 mile long, so
> even 6" of snow means a fair bit of plowing.
Yes it does - 3/8 mi is a long push. My driveway is 350 ft long and then I
continue to push another 150 or so feet, in order to get my banks back into
the woods so I have room for snow all winter long. I also have a large
parking/turn-around area at the house end of the driveway that will easily
park 5 cars side by side (and allow for opening doors), and almost enough
space to make two rows, without one of the cars sticking out into the
driveway proper.
> Even though people freak
> out when they hear me say I plow with a standard shift truck, I still
> think that properly driven a standard shift is a much better plow
> vehicle.
Much better. I don't plow commercially so I too prefer a standard for
plowing. My truck is always in 4L for plowing and it almost never sees a
shift. I don't see the need for ground speed while plowing - but then
again, since I'm not doing it commercially, I don't have a schedule to hit.
I do plow a few other people (friends, old folks - older than me, some
shut-ins) that either can't afford to pay for a plow, or the likes. I
easily get my banks to 8-10 feet and never ram a bank. It's a rare
occassion when you get jolted in the cab of my truck.
> Not quite as fast for things like parking lots, so I
> understand why the commercial plow guys use an automatic. Then again,
> plowing fast with an auto means shifting gears while you are still
> moving at the end of each run, and that is part of what kills the
> automatics so quickly.
>
I can't say I see a lot of plow trucks go down for tranny failures. The
failures that seem most common are either from operators who really beat the
trucks (and nothing is going to fix that issue), or problems like I
experienced, where an otherwise good road tranny is really not meant for the
rigors of plowing beyond around 100,000 without a rebuild. At that -
100,000 miles out of a plow truck and then a tranny rebuild is really not a
bad performance history.
--
-Mike-
mmarlowREMOVE@alltel.net
