Tim Brown

Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully locking
when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the way
back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward it
seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia in
stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone else
noticing this?

'Curly Q. Links'

Tim Brown wrote:


P R I V A T E L Y

What year, model, and mileage are we talking about ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
--

Reply to group..........

'Curly'

'Curly Q. Links'

Tim Brown wrote:


P R I V A T E L Y

What year, model, and mileage are we talking about ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
--

Reply to group..........

'Curly'

'Curly Q. Links'

Tim Brown wrote:


P R I V A T E L Y

What year, model, and mileage are we talking about ? ? ? ? ? ? ?
--

Reply to group..........

'Curly'

Dungheap

The driver's seat in my 03 EX V6 Coupe with 10k miles on it has done this
under heavy braking since day one, it shifts forward a good 1-2" and is
quite bothersome. The service department at my Honda dealer said its not a
safety issue and I should just "live with it" They have also said that
about the clear plastic faceplate on the stock radio that warps and pops off
in the Texas heat...

I hate this car and the lack of service I am getting from the dealers in my
area.

> "Tim Brown" <tweb@islc.net> wrote in message
news:blquvf0v6s@enews2.newsguy.com...
> Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully locking
> when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the way
> back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward it
> seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia in
> stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone
else
> noticing this?
>
>

Dungheap

The driver's seat in my 03 EX V6 Coupe with 10k miles on it has done this
under heavy braking since day one, it shifts forward a good 1-2" and is
quite bothersome. The service department at my Honda dealer said its not a
safety issue and I should just "live with it" They have also said that
about the clear plastic faceplate on the stock radio that warps and pops off
in the Texas heat...

I hate this car and the lack of service I am getting from the dealers in my
area.

> "Tim Brown" <tweb@islc.net> wrote in message
news:blquvf0v6s@enews2.newsguy.com...
> Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully locking
> when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the way
> back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward it
> seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia in
> stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone
else
> noticing this?
>
>

Dungheap

The driver's seat in my 03 EX V6 Coupe with 10k miles on it has done this
under heavy braking since day one, it shifts forward a good 1-2" and is
quite bothersome. The service department at my Honda dealer said its not a
safety issue and I should just "live with it" They have also said that
about the clear plastic faceplate on the stock radio that warps and pops off
in the Texas heat...

I hate this car and the lack of service I am getting from the dealers in my
area.

> "Tim Brown" <tweb@islc.net> wrote in message
news:blquvf0v6s@enews2.newsguy.com...
> Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully locking
> when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the way
> back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward it
> seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia in
> stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone
else
> noticing this?
>
>

TL

Both are clearly issues that need to be addressed by the dealer (or
another with a complaint to Honda). The moving seat is in fact a very
real safety issue as it affects both seatbelt tension and the distance
from the airbag. Seats should not move when they are properly adjusted
to a notch in the track. If that is really happening on multiple cars,
I can't believe we aren't seeing / won't see a recall.

Re the radio, that's pretty bizarre. I'm assuming it is like mine (4
cyl EX-L) unless you've got the Nav as well. But it certainly should
not do that.


On Tue, 07 Oct 2003 05:51:55 GMT, "Dungheap" <dungheap@3dretreat.com>
wrote:

>The driver's seat in my 03 EX V6 Coupe with 10k miles on it has done this
>under heavy braking since day one, it shifts forward a good 1-2" and is
>quite bothersome. The service department at my Honda dealer said its not a
>safety issue and I should just "live with it" They have also said that
>about the clear plastic faceplate on the stock radio that warps and pops off
>in the Texas heat...
>
>I hate this car and the lack of service I am getting from the dealers in my
>area.
>
>> "Tim Brown" <tweb@islc.net> wrote in message
>news:blquvf0v6s@enews2.newsguy.com...
>> Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully locking
>> when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the way
>> back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward it
>> seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia in
>> stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone
>else
>> noticing this?
>>
>>
>

TL

Both are clearly issues that need to be addressed by the dealer (or
another with a complaint to Honda). The moving seat is in fact a very
real safety issue as it affects both seatbelt tension and the distance
from the airbag. Seats should not move when they are properly adjusted
to a notch in the track. If that is really happening on multiple cars,
I can't believe we aren't seeing / won't see a recall.

Re the radio, that's pretty bizarre. I'm assuming it is like mine (4
cyl EX-L) unless you've got the Nav as well. But it certainly should
not do that.


On Tue, 07 Oct 2003 05:51:55 GMT, "Dungheap" <dungheap@3dretreat.com>
wrote:

>The driver's seat in my 03 EX V6 Coupe with 10k miles on it has done this
>under heavy braking since day one, it shifts forward a good 1-2" and is
>quite bothersome. The service department at my Honda dealer said its not a
>safety issue and I should just "live with it" They have also said that
>about the clear plastic faceplate on the stock radio that warps and pops off
>in the Texas heat...
>
>I hate this car and the lack of service I am getting from the dealers in my
>area.
>
>> "Tim Brown" <tweb@islc.net> wrote in message
>news:blquvf0v6s@enews2.newsguy.com...
>> Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully locking
>> when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the way
>> back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward it
>> seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia in
>> stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone
>else
>> noticing this?
>>
>>
>

TL

Both are clearly issues that need to be addressed by the dealer (or
another with a complaint to Honda). The moving seat is in fact a very
real safety issue as it affects both seatbelt tension and the distance
from the airbag. Seats should not move when they are properly adjusted
to a notch in the track. If that is really happening on multiple cars,
I can't believe we aren't seeing / won't see a recall.

Re the radio, that's pretty bizarre. I'm assuming it is like mine (4
cyl EX-L) unless you've got the Nav as well. But it certainly should
not do that.


On Tue, 07 Oct 2003 05:51:55 GMT, "Dungheap" <dungheap@3dretreat.com>
wrote:

>The driver's seat in my 03 EX V6 Coupe with 10k miles on it has done this
>under heavy braking since day one, it shifts forward a good 1-2" and is
>quite bothersome. The service department at my Honda dealer said its not a
>safety issue and I should just "live with it" They have also said that
>about the clear plastic faceplate on the stock radio that warps and pops off
>in the Texas heat...
>
>I hate this car and the lack of service I am getting from the dealers in my
>area.
>
>> "Tim Brown" <tweb@islc.net> wrote in message
>news:blquvf0v6s@enews2.newsguy.com...
>> Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully locking
>> when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the way
>> back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward it
>> seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia in
>> stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone
>else
>> noticing this?
>>
>>
>

Dungheap

Preaching to the choir my friend I know the seat is a safety hazard,
though I didn't think about it from the airbag and seatbelt perspective,
only from the having to "brace" to keep from losing control while the seat
moves.

Curious about the "notch" in the track that you mention. This is the power
8 way adjustable so it doesn't really have a notch that it should be in
afaik.

I know the radio face plate shouldn't do it. The dealer says "when we
replace it the new piece warps out too so its pointless to fix it, live with
it" Its the 6 disk in dash changer radio... don't know if that matters or
not *shrug*

While I'm on the topic of annoyances...
The trim along the bottom edge of the driver's and passenger windows, a big
flat shiny piece of tape on top of plastic basically, bubbles and peels.
Mines been replaced and the replaced ones do it too. Once again "live with
it"

One is a squeak located in the passenger side c pillar somewhere. I have
taken it back to the dealership numerous times, the service writer has heard
the squeak twice and subsequently claimed they fixed it each time. Every
time they 'disassemble' the interior to try to fix a noise the noise gets
worse and worse. It seems exactly like the TSB someone mentioned a few weeks
back except my VIN isn't in the affected class.

The second noise is located in the passenger door, its a buffeting noise
that sounds like canvas blowing in the wind, it usually starts around 65-80
mph. The service department has messed around in the door numerous times
but never fixed anything.

-Dung

"TL" <tlehman@visi.com> wrote in message
news:aa66ovkbigeum6j26uegcu9ggq4og1gcl7@4ax.com...
> Both are clearly issues that need to be addressed by the dealer (or
> another with a complaint to Honda). The moving seat is in fact a very
> real safety issue as it affects both seatbelt tension and the distance
> from the airbag. Seats should not move when they are properly adjusted
> to a notch in the track. If that is really happening on multiple cars,
> I can't believe we aren't seeing / won't see a recall.
>
> Re the radio, that's pretty bizarre. I'm assuming it is like mine (4
> cyl EX-L) unless you've got the Nav as well. But it certainly should
> not do that.
>
>
> On Tue, 07 Oct 2003 05:51:55 GMT, "Dungheap" <dungheap@3dretreat.com>
> wrote:
>
> >The driver's seat in my 03 EX V6 Coupe with 10k miles on it has done this
> >under heavy braking since day one, it shifts forward a good 1-2" and is
> >quite bothersome. The service department at my Honda dealer said its not
a
> >safety issue and I should just "live with it" They have also said that
> >about the clear plastic faceplate on the stock radio that warps and pops
off
> >in the Texas heat...
> >
> >I hate this car and the lack of service I am getting from the dealers in
my
> >area.
> >
> >> "Tim Brown" <tweb@islc.net> wrote in message
> >news:blquvf0v6s@enews2.newsguy.com...
> >> Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully
locking
> >> when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the
way
> >> back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward
it
> >> seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia
in
> >> stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone
> >else
> >> noticing this?
> >>
> >>
> >
>

Dungheap

Preaching to the choir my friend I know the seat is a safety hazard,
though I didn't think about it from the airbag and seatbelt perspective,
only from the having to "brace" to keep from losing control while the seat
moves.

Curious about the "notch" in the track that you mention. This is the power
8 way adjustable so it doesn't really have a notch that it should be in
afaik.

I know the radio face plate shouldn't do it. The dealer says "when we
replace it the new piece warps out too so its pointless to fix it, live with
it" Its the 6 disk in dash changer radio... don't know if that matters or
not *shrug*

While I'm on the topic of annoyances...
The trim along the bottom edge of the driver's and passenger windows, a big
flat shiny piece of tape on top of plastic basically, bubbles and peels.
Mines been replaced and the replaced ones do it too. Once again "live with
it"

One is a squeak located in the passenger side c pillar somewhere. I have
taken it back to the dealership numerous times, the service writer has heard
the squeak twice and subsequently claimed they fixed it each time. Every
time they 'disassemble' the interior to try to fix a noise the noise gets
worse and worse. It seems exactly like the TSB someone mentioned a few weeks
back except my VIN isn't in the affected class.

The second noise is located in the passenger door, its a buffeting noise
that sounds like canvas blowing in the wind, it usually starts around 65-80
mph. The service department has messed around in the door numerous times
but never fixed anything.

-Dung

"TL" <tlehman@visi.com> wrote in message
news:aa66ovkbigeum6j26uegcu9ggq4og1gcl7@4ax.com...
> Both are clearly issues that need to be addressed by the dealer (or
> another with a complaint to Honda). The moving seat is in fact a very
> real safety issue as it affects both seatbelt tension and the distance
> from the airbag. Seats should not move when they are properly adjusted
> to a notch in the track. If that is really happening on multiple cars,
> I can't believe we aren't seeing / won't see a recall.
>
> Re the radio, that's pretty bizarre. I'm assuming it is like mine (4
> cyl EX-L) unless you've got the Nav as well. But it certainly should
> not do that.
>
>
> On Tue, 07 Oct 2003 05:51:55 GMT, "Dungheap" <dungheap@3dretreat.com>
> wrote:
>
> >The driver's seat in my 03 EX V6 Coupe with 10k miles on it has done this
> >under heavy braking since day one, it shifts forward a good 1-2" and is
> >quite bothersome. The service department at my Honda dealer said its not
a
> >safety issue and I should just "live with it" They have also said that
> >about the clear plastic faceplate on the stock radio that warps and pops
off
> >in the Texas heat...
> >
> >I hate this car and the lack of service I am getting from the dealers in
my
> >area.
> >
> >> "Tim Brown" <tweb@islc.net> wrote in message
> >news:blquvf0v6s@enews2.newsguy.com...
> >> Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully
locking
> >> when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the
way
> >> back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward
it
> >> seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia
in
> >> stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone
> >else
> >> noticing this?
> >>
> >>
> >
>

Dungheap

Preaching to the choir my friend I know the seat is a safety hazard,
though I didn't think about it from the airbag and seatbelt perspective,
only from the having to "brace" to keep from losing control while the seat
moves.

Curious about the "notch" in the track that you mention. This is the power
8 way adjustable so it doesn't really have a notch that it should be in
afaik.

I know the radio face plate shouldn't do it. The dealer says "when we
replace it the new piece warps out too so its pointless to fix it, live with
it" Its the 6 disk in dash changer radio... don't know if that matters or
not *shrug*

While I'm on the topic of annoyances...
The trim along the bottom edge of the driver's and passenger windows, a big
flat shiny piece of tape on top of plastic basically, bubbles and peels.
Mines been replaced and the replaced ones do it too. Once again "live with
it"

One is a squeak located in the passenger side c pillar somewhere. I have
taken it back to the dealership numerous times, the service writer has heard
the squeak twice and subsequently claimed they fixed it each time. Every
time they 'disassemble' the interior to try to fix a noise the noise gets
worse and worse. It seems exactly like the TSB someone mentioned a few weeks
back except my VIN isn't in the affected class.

The second noise is located in the passenger door, its a buffeting noise
that sounds like canvas blowing in the wind, it usually starts around 65-80
mph. The service department has messed around in the door numerous times
but never fixed anything.

-Dung

"TL" <tlehman@visi.com> wrote in message
news:aa66ovkbigeum6j26uegcu9ggq4og1gcl7@4ax.com...
> Both are clearly issues that need to be addressed by the dealer (or
> another with a complaint to Honda). The moving seat is in fact a very
> real safety issue as it affects both seatbelt tension and the distance
> from the airbag. Seats should not move when they are properly adjusted
> to a notch in the track. If that is really happening on multiple cars,
> I can't believe we aren't seeing / won't see a recall.
>
> Re the radio, that's pretty bizarre. I'm assuming it is like mine (4
> cyl EX-L) unless you've got the Nav as well. But it certainly should
> not do that.
>
>
> On Tue, 07 Oct 2003 05:51:55 GMT, "Dungheap" <dungheap@3dretreat.com>
> wrote:
>
> >The driver's seat in my 03 EX V6 Coupe with 10k miles on it has done this
> >under heavy braking since day one, it shifts forward a good 1-2" and is
> >quite bothersome. The service department at my Honda dealer said its not
a
> >safety issue and I should just "live with it" They have also said that
> >about the clear plastic faceplate on the stock radio that warps and pops
off
> >in the Texas heat...
> >
> >I hate this car and the lack of service I am getting from the dealers in
my
> >area.
> >
> >> "Tim Brown" <tweb@islc.net> wrote in message
> >news:blquvf0v6s@enews2.newsguy.com...
> >> Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully
locking
> >> when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the
way
> >> back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward
it
> >> seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia
in
> >> stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone
> >else
> >> noticing this?
> >>
> >>
> >
>

TL

On Wed, 08 Oct 2003 01:18:12 GMT, "Dungheap" <dungheap@3dretreat.com>
wrote:

>Preaching to the choir my friend I know the seat is a safety hazard,
>though I didn't think about it from the airbag and seatbelt perspective,
>only from the having to "brace" to keep from losing control while the seat
>moves.
>
>Curious about the "notch" in the track that you mention. This is the power
>8 way adjustable so it doesn't really have a notch that it should be in
>afaik.

I wasn't thinking. Of course you have a power seat, as do I! I was
thinking about the notches on a manual seat. I know that seat movement
has been a major safety issue since the days when seats used to pull
out of the floor in a major collision. I never thought about it with
power seats, but there must be some kind of locking mechanism or
perhaps its on a threaded rod (though it would hard to understand how
that could slip).

>I know the radio face plate shouldn't do it. The dealer says "when we
>replace it the new piece warps out too so its pointless to fix it, live with
>it" Its the 6 disk in dash changer radio... don't know if that matters or
>not *shrug*

I love when someone responds to a problem by saying, yeah it's a real
problem, we can reproduce it, it's an engineering problem, therefore
we're not responsible to fix it. By that logic, any problem that is
systemic doesn't have to be fixed. That's nuts IMHO. If it is that
wide in hot climates, Honda needs to find a solution.

>While I'm on the topic of annoyances...
>The trim along the bottom edge of the driver's and passenger windows, a big
>flat shiny piece of tape on top of plastic basically, bubbles and peels.
>Mines been replaced and the replaced ones do it too. Once again "live with
>it"
>
>One is a squeak located in the passenger side c pillar somewhere. I have
>taken it back to the dealership numerous times, the service writer has heard
>the squeak twice and subsequently claimed they fixed it each time. Every
>time they 'disassemble' the interior to try to fix a noise the noise gets
>worse and worse. It seems exactly like the TSB someone mentioned a few weeks
>back except my VIN isn't in the affected class.
>
>The second noise is located in the passenger door, its a buffeting noise
>that sounds like canvas blowing in the wind, it usually starts around 65-80
>mph. The service department has messed around in the door numerous times
>but never fixed anything.
>
>-Dung
>
>"TL" <tlehman@visi.com> wrote in message
>news:aa66ovkbigeum6j26uegcu9ggq4og1gcl7@4ax.com.. .
>> Both are clearly issues that need to be addressed by the dealer (or
>> another with a complaint to Honda). The moving seat is in fact a very
>> real safety issue as it affects both seatbelt tension and the distance
>> from the airbag. Seats should not move when they are properly adjusted
>> to a notch in the track. If that is really happening on multiple cars,
>> I can't believe we aren't seeing / won't see a recall.
>>
>> Re the radio, that's pretty bizarre. I'm assuming it is like mine (4
>> cyl EX-L) unless you've got the Nav as well. But it certainly should
>> not do that.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 07 Oct 2003 05:51:55 GMT, "Dungheap" <dungheap@3dretreat.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >The driver's seat in my 03 EX V6 Coupe with 10k miles on it has done this
>> >under heavy braking since day one, it shifts forward a good 1-2" and is
>> >quite bothersome. The service department at my Honda dealer said its not
>a
>> >safety issue and I should just "live with it" They have also said that
>> >about the clear plastic faceplate on the stock radio that warps and pops
>off
>> >in the Texas heat...
>> >
>> >I hate this car and the lack of service I am getting from the dealers in
>my
>> >area.
>> >
>> >> "Tim Brown" <tweb@islc.net> wrote in message
>> >news:blquvf0v6s@enews2.newsguy.com...
>> >> Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully
>locking
>> >> when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the
>way
>> >> back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward
>it
>> >> seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia
>in
>> >> stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone
>> >else
>> >> noticing this?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>

TL

On Wed, 08 Oct 2003 01:18:12 GMT, "Dungheap" <dungheap@3dretreat.com>
wrote:

>Preaching to the choir my friend I know the seat is a safety hazard,
>though I didn't think about it from the airbag and seatbelt perspective,
>only from the having to "brace" to keep from losing control while the seat
>moves.
>
>Curious about the "notch" in the track that you mention. This is the power
>8 way adjustable so it doesn't really have a notch that it should be in
>afaik.

I wasn't thinking. Of course you have a power seat, as do I! I was
thinking about the notches on a manual seat. I know that seat movement
has been a major safety issue since the days when seats used to pull
out of the floor in a major collision. I never thought about it with
power seats, but there must be some kind of locking mechanism or
perhaps its on a threaded rod (though it would hard to understand how
that could slip).

>I know the radio face plate shouldn't do it. The dealer says "when we
>replace it the new piece warps out too so its pointless to fix it, live with
>it" Its the 6 disk in dash changer radio... don't know if that matters or
>not *shrug*

I love when someone responds to a problem by saying, yeah it's a real
problem, we can reproduce it, it's an engineering problem, therefore
we're not responsible to fix it. By that logic, any problem that is
systemic doesn't have to be fixed. That's nuts IMHO. If it is that
wide in hot climates, Honda needs to find a solution.

>While I'm on the topic of annoyances...
>The trim along the bottom edge of the driver's and passenger windows, a big
>flat shiny piece of tape on top of plastic basically, bubbles and peels.
>Mines been replaced and the replaced ones do it too. Once again "live with
>it"
>
>One is a squeak located in the passenger side c pillar somewhere. I have
>taken it back to the dealership numerous times, the service writer has heard
>the squeak twice and subsequently claimed they fixed it each time. Every
>time they 'disassemble' the interior to try to fix a noise the noise gets
>worse and worse. It seems exactly like the TSB someone mentioned a few weeks
>back except my VIN isn't in the affected class.
>
>The second noise is located in the passenger door, its a buffeting noise
>that sounds like canvas blowing in the wind, it usually starts around 65-80
>mph. The service department has messed around in the door numerous times
>but never fixed anything.
>
>-Dung
>
>"TL" <tlehman@visi.com> wrote in message
>news:aa66ovkbigeum6j26uegcu9ggq4og1gcl7@4ax.com.. .
>> Both are clearly issues that need to be addressed by the dealer (or
>> another with a complaint to Honda). The moving seat is in fact a very
>> real safety issue as it affects both seatbelt tension and the distance
>> from the airbag. Seats should not move when they are properly adjusted
>> to a notch in the track. If that is really happening on multiple cars,
>> I can't believe we aren't seeing / won't see a recall.
>>
>> Re the radio, that's pretty bizarre. I'm assuming it is like mine (4
>> cyl EX-L) unless you've got the Nav as well. But it certainly should
>> not do that.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, 07 Oct 2003 05:51:55 GMT, "Dungheap" <dungheap@3dretreat.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> >The driver's seat in my 03 EX V6 Coupe with 10k miles on it has done this
>> >under heavy braking since day one, it shifts forward a good 1-2" and is
>> >quite bothersome. The service department at my Honda dealer said its not
>a
>> >safety issue and I should just "live with it" They have also said that
>> >about the clear plastic faceplate on the stock radio that warps and pops
>off
>> >in the Texas heat...
>> >
>> >I hate this car and the lack of service I am getting from the dealers in
>my
>> >area.
>> >
>> >> "Tim Brown" <tweb@islc.net> wrote in message
>> >news:blquvf0v6s@enews2.newsguy.com...
>> >> Has anyone experienced problems with the driver's seat not fully
>locking
>> >> when not in the full backward position. I drive with the seat all the
>way
>> >> back and don't face this daily, but when I test the seat more forward
>it
>> >> seems to "give" just a tad too much for my comfort along with inertia
>in
>> >> stopping. The Honda people think I am am delusional, I believe. Anyone
>> >else
>> >> noticing this?
>> >>
>> >>
>> >
>>
>