Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

I would buy a GM or Ford car if they had any kind of reliability, I don't
mind spending the extra on the domestic brands, what I do mind is sticking a
bunch of money in it, just after the warranty expires.I think the bidy
styles are better looking than the foreign cars.

Tom


"Jason" <jason@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:jason-0904061353340001@66-52-22-17.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net...
>
> I have a copy of the May 2006 issue of Car and Driver (magazine). The
> magazine has an excellent article beginning on page 58 related 6 foreign
> made cars that cost about $15,000 per car. They are really small cars (aka
> economobiles).
> These are the companies that make the economobiles:
> Honda Fit Sport
> Hyundai Accent GLS
> Kia Rio5 SX
> Nissan Versa 1.8L
> Suzuki Reno
> Toyota Yaris S
>
> The car that came in first place in the comparison test was the Honda Fit
> Sport. It actully "sailed through the lane change test 6 mph faster than a
> Corvette Z06." The Honda Fit is now sold in 70 countries and is known in
> Europe as the Jazz.
>
> One of the reasons that Americans buy GM cars and Ford cars is because of
> their low prices compared to cars made by Honda and Toyota. Now that Honda
> and Toyota will be selling the Honda Fit and the Toyota Yaris at a cost of
> about $15,000 per car, it means those people that plan to buy a low priced
> new car in 2006 or 2007 will probably be buying a Honda Fit or Toyota
> Yaris instead of a low priced Ford or Chevy. Do you agree? Do you agree
> that this could be the final nail in the coffin for GM and perhaps Ford?
> Jason
>
> --
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> We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
> We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.
>
>
>

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

I would buy a GM or Ford car if they had any kind of reliability, I don't
mind spending the extra on the domestic brands, what I do mind is sticking a
bunch of money in it, just after the warranty expires.I think the bidy
styles are better looking than the foreign cars.

Tom


"Jason" <jason@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:jason-0904061353340001@66-52-22-17.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net...
>
> I have a copy of the May 2006 issue of Car and Driver (magazine). The
> magazine has an excellent article beginning on page 58 related 6 foreign
> made cars that cost about $15,000 per car. They are really small cars (aka
> economobiles).
> These are the companies that make the economobiles:
> Honda Fit Sport
> Hyundai Accent GLS
> Kia Rio5 SX
> Nissan Versa 1.8L
> Suzuki Reno
> Toyota Yaris S
>
> The car that came in first place in the comparison test was the Honda Fit
> Sport. It actully "sailed through the lane change test 6 mph faster than a
> Corvette Z06." The Honda Fit is now sold in 70 countries and is known in
> Europe as the Jazz.
>
> One of the reasons that Americans buy GM cars and Ford cars is because of
> their low prices compared to cars made by Honda and Toyota. Now that Honda
> and Toyota will be selling the Honda Fit and the Toyota Yaris at a cost of
> about $15,000 per car, it means those people that plan to buy a low priced
> new car in 2006 or 2007 will probably be buying a Honda Fit or Toyota
> Yaris instead of a low priced Ford or Chevy. Do you agree? Do you agree
> that this could be the final nail in the coffin for GM and perhaps Ford?
> Jason
>
> --
> NEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO
> We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
> We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.
>
>
>

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:

> I don't see much of a market for the Honda Fit. Most people would buy
> the civic instead which offers so much more for less money. Same thing
> with the Suzuki Reno vs the Suzuki Forenza. The Forenza is the better
> choice.
>
> America isn't built like prehistoric Europe where there is barely
> enough room for foot traffic. People will buy the larger car for the
> same price or for a slightly higher price than the smaller version.
>
> It would appear that for every Toyota Echo that was sold there were 10
> more Corollas that were sold. Can you see the pattern?
> Air-

Sorry, but the Fit costs less than a comparably equipped Civic. I don't
know about the U.S., but there is definitely a market for the Fit here in
Canada, where gas costs much more than in the U.S. even after you do the
necessary conversions (metric to U.S., currency). The Toyota Echo actually
sold quite well here, and the Yaris looks like it will be equally
successful. So I have no doubt that the Fit will also do well here.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:

> I don't see much of a market for the Honda Fit. Most people would buy
> the civic instead which offers so much more for less money. Same thing
> with the Suzuki Reno vs the Suzuki Forenza. The Forenza is the better
> choice.
>
> America isn't built like prehistoric Europe where there is barely
> enough room for foot traffic. People will buy the larger car for the
> same price or for a slightly higher price than the smaller version.
>
> It would appear that for every Toyota Echo that was sold there were 10
> more Corollas that were sold. Can you see the pattern?
> Air-

Sorry, but the Fit costs less than a comparably equipped Civic. I don't
know about the U.S., but there is definitely a market for the Fit here in
Canada, where gas costs much more than in the U.S. even after you do the
necessary conversions (metric to U.S., currency). The Toyota Echo actually
sold quite well here, and the Yaris looks like it will be equally
successful. So I have no doubt that the Fit will also do well here.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <168kmuvqow63m.dlg@hightech.misfit>, High Tech Misfit
<me@privacy.net> wrote:

> twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > I don't see much of a market for the Honda Fit. Most people would buy
> > the civic instead which offers so much more for less money. Same thing
> > with the Suzuki Reno vs the Suzuki Forenza. The Forenza is the better
> > choice.
> >
> > America isn't built like prehistoric Europe where there is barely
> > enough room for foot traffic. People will buy the larger car for the
> > same price or for a slightly higher price than the smaller version.
> >
> > It would appear that for every Toyota Echo that was sold there were 10
> > more Corollas that were sold. Can you see the pattern?
> > Air-
>
> Sorry, but the Fit costs less than a comparably equipped Civic. I don't
> know about the U.S., but there is definitely a market for the Fit here in
> Canada, where gas costs much more than in the U.S. even after you do the
> necessary conversions (metric to U.S., currency). The Toyota Echo actually
> sold quite well here, and the Yaris looks like it will be equally
> successful. So I have no doubt that the Fit will also do well here.

If the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon, it's my guess that the
Honda Fit Sport, Toyota Yaris S and Suzuki Reno will be very successful.
That's the main reason those types of cars are so popular in Europe--since
gas prices are much higher in Europe than in America.

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We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <168kmuvqow63m.dlg@hightech.misfit>, High Tech Misfit
<me@privacy.net> wrote:

> twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > I don't see much of a market for the Honda Fit. Most people would buy
> > the civic instead which offers so much more for less money. Same thing
> > with the Suzuki Reno vs the Suzuki Forenza. The Forenza is the better
> > choice.
> >
> > America isn't built like prehistoric Europe where there is barely
> > enough room for foot traffic. People will buy the larger car for the
> > same price or for a slightly higher price than the smaller version.
> >
> > It would appear that for every Toyota Echo that was sold there were 10
> > more Corollas that were sold. Can you see the pattern?
> > Air-
>
> Sorry, but the Fit costs less than a comparably equipped Civic. I don't
> know about the U.S., but there is definitely a market for the Fit here in
> Canada, where gas costs much more than in the U.S. even after you do the
> necessary conversions (metric to U.S., currency). The Toyota Echo actually
> sold quite well here, and the Yaris looks like it will be equally
> successful. So I have no doubt that the Fit will also do well here.

If the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon, it's my guess that the
Honda Fit Sport, Toyota Yaris S and Suzuki Reno will be very successful.
That's the main reason those types of cars are so popular in Europe--since
gas prices are much higher in Europe than in America.

--
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We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <t38j329l1dsg609nfmps6ut15112qqqqit@4ax.com>, Gordon McGrew
<RgEmMcOgVrEew@mindspring.com> wrote:

> On Sun, 09 Apr 2006 13:53:33 -0700, jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
>
> >The car that came in first place in the comparison test was the Honda Fit
> >Sport. It actully "sailed through the lane change test 6 mph faster than a
> >Corvette Z06."
>
> Actually it was 6 mph faster than the next fastest car in the
> comparison and faster than the Corvette but we don't know by how much.
> Still a very impressive showing.
>
> As for being the kiss of death for GM and Ford, Gm and Ford never made
> any money off economy cars anyway. The kiss of death for GM and Ford
> is $3 gas which is killing their monster SUV sales.

You are correct. I just re-read the sentence that you mentioned and it's
clear that I left out some of the words from that sentence in my
post--sorry.
You made a great point related to gas prices in regard to monster SUV
sales. It's my guess that GM and Ford will have a hard time selling the
monster sized pickup trucks if the gas prices keep going higher.
Jason

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We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
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Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <t38j329l1dsg609nfmps6ut15112qqqqit@4ax.com>, Gordon McGrew
<RgEmMcOgVrEew@mindspring.com> wrote:

> On Sun, 09 Apr 2006 13:53:33 -0700, jason@nospam.com (Jason) wrote:
>
> >The car that came in first place in the comparison test was the Honda Fit
> >Sport. It actully "sailed through the lane change test 6 mph faster than a
> >Corvette Z06."
>
> Actually it was 6 mph faster than the next fastest car in the
> comparison and faster than the Corvette but we don't know by how much.
> Still a very impressive showing.
>
> As for being the kiss of death for GM and Ford, Gm and Ford never made
> any money off economy cars anyway. The kiss of death for GM and Ford
> is $3 gas which is killing their monster SUV sales.

You are correct. I just re-read the sentence that you mentioned and it's
clear that I left out some of the words from that sentence in my
post--sorry.
You made a great point related to gas prices in regard to monster SUV
sales. It's my guess that GM and Ford will have a hard time selling the
monster sized pickup trucks if the gas prices keep going higher.
Jason

--
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We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <7Z-dnez3XtdJHaTZnZ2dnUVZ_v2dnZ2d@sedona.net>, "Michael Pardee"
<michaeltnull@cybertrails.com> wrote:

> "Jason" <jason@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:jason-0904061353340001@66-52-22-17.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net...
> >
> > I have a copy of the May 2006 issue of Car and Driver (magazine). The
> > magazine has an excellent article beginning on page 58 related 6 foreign
> > made cars that cost about $15,000 per car. They are really small cars (aka
> > economobiles).
> > These are the companies that make the economobiles:
> > Honda Fit Sport
> > Hyundai Accent GLS
> > Kia Rio5 SX
> > Nissan Versa 1.8L
> > Suzuki Reno
> > Toyota Yaris S
> >
> > The car that came in first place in the comparison test was the Honda Fit
> > Sport. It actully "sailed through the lane change test 6 mph faster than a
> > Corvette Z06." The Honda Fit is now sold in 70 countries and is known in
> > Europe as the Jazz.
> >
> > One of the reasons that Americans buy GM cars and Ford cars is because of
> > their low prices compared to cars made by Honda and Toyota. Now that Honda
> > and Toyota will be selling the Honda Fit and the Toyota Yaris at a cost of
> > about $15,000 per car, it means those people that plan to buy a low priced
> > new car in 2006 or 2007 will probably be buying a Honda Fit or Toyota
> > Yaris instead of a low priced Ford or Chevy. Do you agree? Do you agree
> > that this could be the final nail in the coffin for GM and perhaps Ford?
> > Jason
> >
> >
> I think Car and Driver wants to sell magazines.
>
> I don't know the shape of things to come in the consumer automotive market,
> but I doubt anything will cause a huge shift of buyers from any major brand
> to another. It seems to me most people have already made up their minds
> which brands of car they would buy and which they will not.
>
> I do recall that in the mid-70's one of the magazines (Road and Track, IIRC)
> track tested various cars and the Ford Pinto beat the Porsche 911's time
> through the slalom! Outraged readers wanted to know how the obvious error
> got through, so the editors explained: understeering cars have an edge over
> oversteering cars in the slalom, allowing the Pinto (shudder!) to beat the
> Porsche. I just don't think that is why more Pintos were sold than were 911s
> each year.
>
> Mike

MIke,
You must be much younger than me. I remember the 1970's when there were
lines of cars at every gasoline station. They even had to ration gasoline.
It was the main reason the Jimmy Carter lost the election for a second
term. The best selling cars (in the !970's) became the really small cars
such as the Honda Civic and the Volkswagen Bug. If the cost of gasoline
rises to $4.00 per gallon, it will cause a shift to cars such as the Honda
Fit and the Toyota Yaris. I doubt that GM and Ford will sell very many
monster sized SUVs and Pickups if the gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon.
Jason

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We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <7Z-dnez3XtdJHaTZnZ2dnUVZ_v2dnZ2d@sedona.net>, "Michael Pardee"
<michaeltnull@cybertrails.com> wrote:

> "Jason" <jason@nospam.com> wrote in message
> news:jason-0904061353340001@66-52-22-17.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net...
> >
> > I have a copy of the May 2006 issue of Car and Driver (magazine). The
> > magazine has an excellent article beginning on page 58 related 6 foreign
> > made cars that cost about $15,000 per car. They are really small cars (aka
> > economobiles).
> > These are the companies that make the economobiles:
> > Honda Fit Sport
> > Hyundai Accent GLS
> > Kia Rio5 SX
> > Nissan Versa 1.8L
> > Suzuki Reno
> > Toyota Yaris S
> >
> > The car that came in first place in the comparison test was the Honda Fit
> > Sport. It actully "sailed through the lane change test 6 mph faster than a
> > Corvette Z06." The Honda Fit is now sold in 70 countries and is known in
> > Europe as the Jazz.
> >
> > One of the reasons that Americans buy GM cars and Ford cars is because of
> > their low prices compared to cars made by Honda and Toyota. Now that Honda
> > and Toyota will be selling the Honda Fit and the Toyota Yaris at a cost of
> > about $15,000 per car, it means those people that plan to buy a low priced
> > new car in 2006 or 2007 will probably be buying a Honda Fit or Toyota
> > Yaris instead of a low priced Ford or Chevy. Do you agree? Do you agree
> > that this could be the final nail in the coffin for GM and perhaps Ford?
> > Jason
> >
> >
> I think Car and Driver wants to sell magazines.
>
> I don't know the shape of things to come in the consumer automotive market,
> but I doubt anything will cause a huge shift of buyers from any major brand
> to another. It seems to me most people have already made up their minds
> which brands of car they would buy and which they will not.
>
> I do recall that in the mid-70's one of the magazines (Road and Track, IIRC)
> track tested various cars and the Ford Pinto beat the Porsche 911's time
> through the slalom! Outraged readers wanted to know how the obvious error
> got through, so the editors explained: understeering cars have an edge over
> oversteering cars in the slalom, allowing the Pinto (shudder!) to beat the
> Porsche. I just don't think that is why more Pintos were sold than were 911s
> each year.
>
> Mike

MIke,
You must be much younger than me. I remember the 1970's when there were
lines of cars at every gasoline station. They even had to ration gasoline.
It was the main reason the Jimmy Carter lost the election for a second
term. The best selling cars (in the !970's) became the really small cars
such as the Honda Civic and the Volkswagen Bug. If the cost of gasoline
rises to $4.00 per gallon, it will cause a shift to cars such as the Honda
Fit and the Toyota Yaris. I doubt that GM and Ford will sell very many
monster sized SUVs and Pickups if the gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon.
Jason

--
NEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO
We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point. Americans
in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.



Air-




High Tech Misfit wrote:
> twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > I don't see much of a market for the Honda Fit. Most people would buy
> > the civic instead which offers so much more for less money. Same thing
> > with the Suzuki Reno vs the Suzuki Forenza. The Forenza is the better
> > choice.
> >
> > America isn't built like prehistoric Europe where there is barely
> > enough room for foot traffic. People will buy the larger car for the
> > same price or for a slightly higher price than the smaller version.
> >
> > It would appear that for every Toyota Echo that was sold there were 10
> > more Corollas that were sold. Can you see the pattern?
> > Air-
>
> Sorry, but the Fit costs less than a comparably equipped Civic. I don't
> know about the U.S., but there is definitely a market for the Fit here in
> Canada, where gas costs much more than in the U.S. even after you do the
> necessary conversions (metric to U.S., currency). The Toyota Echo actually
> sold quite well here, and the Yaris looks like it will be equally
> successful. So I have no doubt that the Fit will also do well here.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point. Americans
in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.



Air-




High Tech Misfit wrote:
> twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > I don't see much of a market for the Honda Fit. Most people would buy
> > the civic instead which offers so much more for less money. Same thing
> > with the Suzuki Reno vs the Suzuki Forenza. The Forenza is the better
> > choice.
> >
> > America isn't built like prehistoric Europe where there is barely
> > enough room for foot traffic. People will buy the larger car for the
> > same price or for a slightly higher price than the smaller version.
> >
> > It would appear that for every Toyota Echo that was sold there were 10
> > more Corollas that were sold. Can you see the pattern?
> > Air-
>
> Sorry, but the Fit costs less than a comparably equipped Civic. I don't
> know about the U.S., but there is definitely a market for the Fit here in
> Canada, where gas costs much more than in the U.S. even after you do the
> necessary conversions (metric to U.S., currency). The Toyota Echo actually
> sold quite well here, and the Yaris looks like it will be equally
> successful. So I have no doubt that the Fit will also do well here.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point. Americans
in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.



Air-




High Tech Misfit wrote:
> twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > I don't see much of a market for the Honda Fit. Most people would buy
> > the civic instead which offers so much more for less money. Same thing
> > with the Suzuki Reno vs the Suzuki Forenza. The Forenza is the better
> > choice.
> >
> > America isn't built like prehistoric Europe where there is barely
> > enough room for foot traffic. People will buy the larger car for the
> > same price or for a slightly higher price than the smaller version.
> >
> > It would appear that for every Toyota Echo that was sold there were 10
> > more Corollas that were sold. Can you see the pattern?
> > Air-
>
> Sorry, but the Fit costs less than a comparably equipped Civic. I don't
> know about the U.S., but there is definitely a market for the Fit here in
> Canada, where gas costs much more than in the U.S. even after you do the
> necessary conversions (metric to U.S., currency). The Toyota Echo actually
> sold quite well here, and the Yaris looks like it will be equally
> successful. So I have no doubt that the Fit will also do well here.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point. Americans
in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.



Air-




High Tech Misfit wrote:
> twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > I don't see much of a market for the Honda Fit. Most people would buy
> > the civic instead which offers so much more for less money. Same thing
> > with the Suzuki Reno vs the Suzuki Forenza. The Forenza is the better
> > choice.
> >
> > America isn't built like prehistoric Europe where there is barely
> > enough room for foot traffic. People will buy the larger car for the
> > same price or for a slightly higher price than the smaller version.
> >
> > It would appear that for every Toyota Echo that was sold there were 10
> > more Corollas that were sold. Can you see the pattern?
> > Air-
>
> Sorry, but the Fit costs less than a comparably equipped Civic. I don't
> know about the U.S., but there is definitely a market for the Fit here in
> Canada, where gas costs much more than in the U.S. even after you do the
> necessary conversions (metric to U.S., currency). The Toyota Echo actually
> sold quite well here, and the Yaris looks like it will be equally
> successful. So I have no doubt that the Fit will also do well here.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:

> OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point.

No, I didn't miss the point. I was only pointing out that there is a market
for those small cars in other places around the world.


> Americans
> in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
> is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
> watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
> driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.

Yes, people are still buying big SUV's here, but not in the large numbers
of, say, 10 years ago.