Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:

> OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point.

No, I didn't miss the point. I was only pointing out that there is a market
for those small cars in other places around the world.


> Americans
> in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
> is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
> watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
> driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.

Yes, people are still buying big SUV's here, but not in the large numbers
of, say, 10 years ago.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

Jason wrote:
>
> In article <7Z-dnez3XtdJHaTZnZ2dnUVZ_v2dnZ2d@sedona.net>, "Michael Pardee"
> <michaeltnull@cybertrails.com> wrote:
>
> > "Jason" <jason@nospam.com> wrote in message
> > news:jason-0904061353340001@66-52-22-17.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net...
> > >
> > > I have a copy of the May 2006 issue of Car and Driver (magazine). The
> > > magazine has an excellent article beginning on page 58 related 6 foreign
> > > made cars that cost about $15,000 per car. They are really small cars (aka
> > > economobiles).
> > > These are the companies that make the economobiles:
> > > Honda Fit Sport
> > > Hyundai Accent GLS
> > > Kia Rio5 SX
> > > Nissan Versa 1.8L
> > > Suzuki Reno
> > > Toyota Yaris S
> > >
> > > The car that came in first place in the comparison test was the Honda Fit
> > > Sport. It actully "sailed through the lane change test 6 mph faster than a
> > > Corvette Z06." The Honda Fit is now sold in 70 countries and is known in
> > > Europe as the Jazz.
> > >
> > > One of the reasons that Americans buy GM cars and Ford cars is because of
> > > their low prices compared to cars made by Honda and Toyota. Now that Honda
> > > and Toyota will be selling the Honda Fit and the Toyota Yaris at a cost of
> > > about $15,000 per car, it means those people that plan to buy a low priced
> > > new car in 2006 or 2007 will probably be buying a Honda Fit or Toyota
> > > Yaris instead of a low priced Ford or Chevy. Do you agree? Do you agree
> > > that this could be the final nail in the coffin for GM and perhaps Ford?
> > > Jason
> > >
> > >
> > I think Car and Driver wants to sell magazines.
> >
> > I don't know the shape of things to come in the consumer automotive market,
> > but I doubt anything will cause a huge shift of buyers from any major brand
> > to another. It seems to me most people have already made up their minds
> > which brands of car they would buy and which they will not.
> >
> > I do recall that in the mid-70's one of the magazines (Road and Track, IIRC)
> > track tested various cars and the Ford Pinto beat the Porsche 911's time
> > through the slalom! Outraged readers wanted to know how the obvious error
> > got through, so the editors explained: understeering cars have an edge over
> > oversteering cars in the slalom, allowing the Pinto (shudder!) to beat the
> > Porsche. I just don't think that is why more Pintos were sold than were 911s
> > each year.
> >
> > Mike
>
> MIke,
> You must be much younger than me. I remember the 1970's when there were
> lines of cars at every gasoline station. They even had to ration gasoline.
> It was the main reason the Jimmy Carter lost the election for a second
> term. The best selling cars (in the !970's) became the really small cars
> such as the Honda Civic and the Volkswagen Bug. If the cost of gasoline
> rises to $4.00 per gallon, it will cause a shift to cars such as the Honda
> Fit and the Toyota Yaris. I doubt that GM and Ford will sell very many
> monster sized SUVs and Pickups if the gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon.
> Jason
>
>


I can come up with several reasons Carter lost the election, all of
which are based on his total incompetence.

1. Foreign Policy blunder #1: Returning the Panama Canal to Panama

2. Foreign Policy blunder #2: Inability to deal with the Iranian
hostage crisis

3. Foreign Policy blunder #3: Failure to deal with the Lebanese civil war

4. Gutting the military (as evidence by the failure of the Iranian
hostage rescue attempt)

5. Presiding over double digit inflation

6. The pardoning of Vietnam War deserters

Worse, his incompetence carried forth in later years such as being the
main architect of the North Korean nuclear issue (along with Richardson
of New Mexico).

Jimmy Carter, the Millard Fillmore of the 20th century...

JT

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

Jason wrote:
>
> In article <7Z-dnez3XtdJHaTZnZ2dnUVZ_v2dnZ2d@sedona.net>, "Michael Pardee"
> <michaeltnull@cybertrails.com> wrote:
>
> > "Jason" <jason@nospam.com> wrote in message
> > news:jason-0904061353340001@66-52-22-17.lsan.pw-dia.impulse.net...
> > >
> > > I have a copy of the May 2006 issue of Car and Driver (magazine). The
> > > magazine has an excellent article beginning on page 58 related 6 foreign
> > > made cars that cost about $15,000 per car. They are really small cars (aka
> > > economobiles).
> > > These are the companies that make the economobiles:
> > > Honda Fit Sport
> > > Hyundai Accent GLS
> > > Kia Rio5 SX
> > > Nissan Versa 1.8L
> > > Suzuki Reno
> > > Toyota Yaris S
> > >
> > > The car that came in first place in the comparison test was the Honda Fit
> > > Sport. It actully "sailed through the lane change test 6 mph faster than a
> > > Corvette Z06." The Honda Fit is now sold in 70 countries and is known in
> > > Europe as the Jazz.
> > >
> > > One of the reasons that Americans buy GM cars and Ford cars is because of
> > > their low prices compared to cars made by Honda and Toyota. Now that Honda
> > > and Toyota will be selling the Honda Fit and the Toyota Yaris at a cost of
> > > about $15,000 per car, it means those people that plan to buy a low priced
> > > new car in 2006 or 2007 will probably be buying a Honda Fit or Toyota
> > > Yaris instead of a low priced Ford or Chevy. Do you agree? Do you agree
> > > that this could be the final nail in the coffin for GM and perhaps Ford?
> > > Jason
> > >
> > >
> > I think Car and Driver wants to sell magazines.
> >
> > I don't know the shape of things to come in the consumer automotive market,
> > but I doubt anything will cause a huge shift of buyers from any major brand
> > to another. It seems to me most people have already made up their minds
> > which brands of car they would buy and which they will not.
> >
> > I do recall that in the mid-70's one of the magazines (Road and Track, IIRC)
> > track tested various cars and the Ford Pinto beat the Porsche 911's time
> > through the slalom! Outraged readers wanted to know how the obvious error
> > got through, so the editors explained: understeering cars have an edge over
> > oversteering cars in the slalom, allowing the Pinto (shudder!) to beat the
> > Porsche. I just don't think that is why more Pintos were sold than were 911s
> > each year.
> >
> > Mike
>
> MIke,
> You must be much younger than me. I remember the 1970's when there were
> lines of cars at every gasoline station. They even had to ration gasoline.
> It was the main reason the Jimmy Carter lost the election for a second
> term. The best selling cars (in the !970's) became the really small cars
> such as the Honda Civic and the Volkswagen Bug. If the cost of gasoline
> rises to $4.00 per gallon, it will cause a shift to cars such as the Honda
> Fit and the Toyota Yaris. I doubt that GM and Ford will sell very many
> monster sized SUVs and Pickups if the gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon.
> Jason
>
>


I can come up with several reasons Carter lost the election, all of
which are based on his total incompetence.

1. Foreign Policy blunder #1: Returning the Panama Canal to Panama

2. Foreign Policy blunder #2: Inability to deal with the Iranian
hostage crisis

3. Foreign Policy blunder #3: Failure to deal with the Lebanese civil war

4. Gutting the military (as evidence by the failure of the Iranian
hostage rescue attempt)

5. Presiding over double digit inflation

6. The pardoning of Vietnam War deserters

Worse, his incompetence carried forth in later years such as being the
main architect of the North Korean nuclear issue (along with Richardson
of New Mexico).

Jimmy Carter, the Millard Fillmore of the 20th century...

JT

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

Art wrote:
>
> The only thing that can help GM is a 6 year bumper to bumper warranty. That
> would get them a lot of sales. And probably bankrupt them paying for
> repairs.



You bet! I really chuckled over that one...

JT

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

Art wrote:
>
> The only thing that can help GM is a 6 year bumper to bumper warranty. That
> would get them a lot of sales. And probably bankrupt them paying for
> repairs.



You bet! I really chuckled over that one...

JT

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <1144713943.298484.81270@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups. com>,
twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:

> OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point. Americans
> in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
> is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
> watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
> driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.
>
>
>
> Air-
>
>

Hello,
If the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon, the Honda Fit Sport,
Toyota Yaris S. and the Suzuki Reno will become the best selling vehicles
in America.
Of course, lots of people that can afford it will continue to buy full
sized pickups and SUVs. There are lots of people in America that can't
afford to spend $50.00 or more per week for gasoline. I know several
people that drive over 50 miles per day to and from work.
Jason

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Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <1144713943.298484.81270@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups. com>,
twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:

> OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point. Americans
> in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
> is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
> watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
> driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.
>
>
>
> Air-
>
>

Hello,
If the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon, the Honda Fit Sport,
Toyota Yaris S. and the Suzuki Reno will become the best selling vehicles
in America.
Of course, lots of people that can afford it will continue to buy full
sized pickups and SUVs. There are lots of people in America that can't
afford to spend $50.00 or more per week for gasoline. I know several
people that drive over 50 miles per day to and from work.
Jason

--
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We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

If Gas rises to $4 a gallon the best selling cars in america would be
the Prius and the Civic Hybrid. Including the cars that run off of
compressed natural gas. Motorcycles would start picking up in sales in
a way that the states would have never seen before.

Sure the Fit and Nissan version would be top sellers too but the Prius
would be one of the most desirable. Honda Insights would start selling
for a lot of money used.


O3-


Jason wrote:
> In article <1144713943.298484.81270@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups. com>,
> twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point. Americans
> > in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
> > is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
> > watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
> > driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.
> >
> >
> >
> > Air-
> >
> >
>
> Hello,
> If the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon, the Honda Fit Sport,
> Toyota Yaris S. and the Suzuki Reno will become the best selling vehicles
> in America.
> Of course, lots of people that can afford it will continue to buy full
> sized pickups and SUVs. There are lots of people in America that can't
> afford to spend $50.00 or more per week for gasoline. I know several
> people that drive over 50 miles per day to and from work.
> Jason
>
> --
> NEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO
> We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
> We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

If Gas rises to $4 a gallon the best selling cars in america would be
the Prius and the Civic Hybrid. Including the cars that run off of
compressed natural gas. Motorcycles would start picking up in sales in
a way that the states would have never seen before.

Sure the Fit and Nissan version would be top sellers too but the Prius
would be one of the most desirable. Honda Insights would start selling
for a lot of money used.


O3-


Jason wrote:
> In article <1144713943.298484.81270@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups. com>,
> twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:
>
> > OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point. Americans
> > in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
> > is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
> > watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
> > driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.
> >
> >
> >
> > Air-
> >
> >
>
> Hello,
> If the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon, the Honda Fit Sport,
> Toyota Yaris S. and the Suzuki Reno will become the best selling vehicles
> in America.
> Of course, lots of people that can afford it will continue to buy full
> sized pickups and SUVs. There are lots of people in America that can't
> afford to spend $50.00 or more per week for gasoline. I know several
> people that drive over 50 miles per day to and from work.
> Jason
>
> --
> NEWSGROUP SUBSCRIBERS MOTTO
> We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
> We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <1144793278.351250.170360@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups .com>,
twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:

> If Gas rises to $4 a gallon the best selling cars in america would be
> the Prius and the Civic Hybrid. Including the cars that run off of
> compressed natural gas. Motorcycles would start picking up in sales in
> a way that the states would have never seen before.
>
> Sure the Fit and Nissan version would be top sellers too but the Prius
> would be one of the most desirable. Honda Insights would start selling
> for a lot of money used.
>
>
> O3-
>
>
> Jason wrote:
> > In article <1144713943.298484.81270@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups. com>,
> > twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:
> >
> > > OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point. Americans
> > > in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
> > > is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
> > > watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
> > > driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Air-
> > >
> > >
> >


Air-
You are probably correct. Only time will tell.
The smallest cars and hybrids made by all of the car companies will become
their best selling cars if the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon.
I would keep my Accord since I rarely drive it long distances.
jason

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Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <1144793278.351250.170360@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups .com>,
twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:

> If Gas rises to $4 a gallon the best selling cars in america would be
> the Prius and the Civic Hybrid. Including the cars that run off of
> compressed natural gas. Motorcycles would start picking up in sales in
> a way that the states would have never seen before.
>
> Sure the Fit and Nissan version would be top sellers too but the Prius
> would be one of the most desirable. Honda Insights would start selling
> for a lot of money used.
>
>
> O3-
>
>
> Jason wrote:
> > In article <1144713943.298484.81270@i39g2000cwa.googlegroups. com>,
> > twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:
> >
> > > OK so the Fit is a little less. You still missed the point. Americans
> > > in general do not gravitate towards mini-compact cars. The situation
> > > is different in Canada. Yet In Canada people still buy big SUVs. Ever
> > > watched the TV show "Help you sell" based in Quebec Canada? They are
> > > driving an Explorer or a Jeep Grand Cherokee.
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Air-
> > >
> > >
> >


Air-
You are probably correct. Only time will tell.
The smallest cars and hybrids made by all of the car companies will become
their best selling cars if the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per gallon.
I would keep my Accord since I rarely drive it long distances.
jason

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Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

<<<<Air-
You are probably correct. Only time will tell.
The smallest cars and hybrids made by all of the car companies will
become
their best selling cars if the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per
gallon.
I would keep my Accord since I rarely drive it long distances.
jason >>>>


And don't forget the Turbo Diesels offered by Volkwagen.

50mpg Highway is not bad at all for a diesel VW Jetta or Golf. The new
Jeep Liberty Diesel is selling so fast that none of the dealerships can
keep one on the show floor.

I wouldn't be surprised if the 5 states that banned the new turbo
diesels would lift the emmisions requirments in order to make the
diesel alternative available to the public in California, New York,
Massachusets, Vermont, and Maine.

The advantage to the diesels is that they get better MPG on the Highway
while the gas/electric hybrids get their best MPG in the stop and go.
Now market a car that is a diesel/electric hybrid and now your talking!
It's been on the drawing boards for years, just never actually done.

Or who knows, like you said only time will tell. I've got a feeling
those nuclear batteries are going to save us.



O3-

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

<<<<Air-
You are probably correct. Only time will tell.
The smallest cars and hybrids made by all of the car companies will
become
their best selling cars if the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per
gallon.
I would keep my Accord since I rarely drive it long distances.
jason >>>>


And don't forget the Turbo Diesels offered by Volkwagen.

50mpg Highway is not bad at all for a diesel VW Jetta or Golf. The new
Jeep Liberty Diesel is selling so fast that none of the dealerships can
keep one on the show floor.

I wouldn't be surprised if the 5 states that banned the new turbo
diesels would lift the emmisions requirments in order to make the
diesel alternative available to the public in California, New York,
Massachusets, Vermont, and Maine.

The advantage to the diesels is that they get better MPG on the Highway
while the gas/electric hybrids get their best MPG in the stop and go.
Now market a car that is a diesel/electric hybrid and now your talking!
It's been on the drawing boards for years, just never actually done.

Or who knows, like you said only time will tell. I've got a feeling
those nuclear batteries are going to save us.



O3-

Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <1144811405.905538.170840@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups .com>,
twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:

> <<<<Air-
> You are probably correct. Only time will tell.
> The smallest cars and hybrids made by all of the car companies will
> become
> their best selling cars if the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per
> gallon.
> I would keep my Accord since I rarely drive it long distances.
> jason >>>>
>
>
> And don't forget the Turbo Diesels offered by Volkwagen.
>
> 50mpg Highway is not bad at all for a diesel VW Jetta or Golf. The new
> Jeep Liberty Diesel is selling so fast that none of the dealerships can
> keep one on the show floor.
>
> I wouldn't be surprised if the 5 states that banned the new turbo
> diesels would lift the emmisions requirments in order to make the
> diesel alternative available to the public in California, New York,
> Massachusets, Vermont, and Maine.
>
> The advantage to the diesels is that they get better MPG on the Highway
> while the gas/electric hybrids get their best MPG in the stop and go.
> Now market a car that is a diesel/electric hybrid and now your talking!
> It's been on the drawing boards for years, just never actually done.
>
> Or who knows, like you said only time will tell. I've got a feeling
> those nuclear batteries are going to save us.
>
>
>
> O3-

I have not read yet read about those nuclear batteries but will do so if
an article appears about them in Car and Driver magazine or Popular
Mechanics magazine--I subscribe to both of them. I have read a lot about
the hydrogen fuel cells and it's obvious that it's a stupid idea. They are
not cost effective. It takes huge amounts of energy to produce a fuel
cell. I'm sure that someone will disagree with me.
Jason

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We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
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Re: Kiss of death for GM and perhaps Ford
 

In article <1144811405.905538.170840@g10g2000cwb.googlegroups .com>,
twothousandtwoto2007@yahoo.com wrote:

> <<<<Air-
> You are probably correct. Only time will tell.
> The smallest cars and hybrids made by all of the car companies will
> become
> their best selling cars if the cost of gasoline rises to $4.00 per
> gallon.
> I would keep my Accord since I rarely drive it long distances.
> jason >>>>
>
>
> And don't forget the Turbo Diesels offered by Volkwagen.
>
> 50mpg Highway is not bad at all for a diesel VW Jetta or Golf. The new
> Jeep Liberty Diesel is selling so fast that none of the dealerships can
> keep one on the show floor.
>
> I wouldn't be surprised if the 5 states that banned the new turbo
> diesels would lift the emmisions requirments in order to make the
> diesel alternative available to the public in California, New York,
> Massachusets, Vermont, and Maine.
>
> The advantage to the diesels is that they get better MPG on the Highway
> while the gas/electric hybrids get their best MPG in the stop and go.
> Now market a car that is a diesel/electric hybrid and now your talking!
> It's been on the drawing boards for years, just never actually done.
>
> Or who knows, like you said only time will tell. I've got a feeling
> those nuclear batteries are going to save us.
>
>
>
> O3-

I have not read yet read about those nuclear batteries but will do so if
an article appears about them in Car and Driver magazine or Popular
Mechanics magazine--I subscribe to both of them. I have read a lot about
the hydrogen fuel cells and it's obvious that it's a stupid idea. They are
not cost effective. It takes huge amounts of energy to produce a fuel
cell. I'm sure that someone will disagree with me.
Jason

--
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We respect those subscribers that ask for advice or provide advice.
We do NOT respect the subscribers that enjoy criticizing people.