(quit in the heat) 91 Honda Civic
07-29-2003, 03:07 PM
#46
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: crank bolt ARRRGGG! 91 Honda Civic
Very nice, Dave, but how about the guy making only $400-$600/month?
Retired or otherwise. He has plenty to worry about. Count your
blessings.
All through life, retired or not, either you pay someone else to do
the work -- have the big bucks/income available and HOPE it's done
right even at that -- or, you don't have the $$ and are forced to DIY.
In the latter case, no one else is going to do it if YOU don't. So I
do a lot of "quality reading" on occasion: auto
service/repair/troubleshooting/parts manuals -- and here in the
Honda/Toyota and Nissan newsgroups -- and hope at least regular
maintenance with quality fliuds/filters forestalls/prevents any
trouble down the road. And I drive my cars gently, don't abuse
them...that helps A LOT.
But I DO take it in to the shop when I have tried everything I can
think of to solve the problem but still can't find it, or, it's
something out of my area of expertise. For example, I will NOT get out
my cordless drill, put in a huge bit, hold the block between my feet
and rebore the cylinders! I used to do that -- just eyeball the bore
measurements in fact, and tried to hold the drill completely vertical
-- but that didn't work to well! Just kidding. ;-)
In those cases (very rare fortunately), it goes in to the shop. But
it's still tough coming up with the money sometimes.
John D.
"Dave" <dave1027@comcast.net> wrote in message news:<YQ2dnYXS8uZri7uiXTWJjA@comcast.com>...
> No, I'm not rich, not yet any way. I'm kind of middle class. If I was rich
> would I be driving Honda Civics? I'm just a guy that has been there and
> done that. I found out long ago that life is too short to be spending it
> worrying about how I'm going to get the crank bolt off. $300 is not a bad
> trade for peace of mind.
>
> Dave
>
>
> "John D." <jcdech@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:e821bab6.0307281411.7bcd708@posting.google.co m...
> > Dave,
> >
> > Possibly because SOME people here just may be on a very small fixed
> > income (like SS...or a SMALL VA disability as in my case) and if it
> > saves LABOR costs, it's of great interest...$300 is HALF of some
> > people's monthly income.
> >
> > As for parts, some of us need to shop around for the lowest prices for
> > them, too.
> >
> > We all don't make big money like you might -- really can't afford to
> > take it in even just for a diagnostics every time something happens --
> > or if you don't make big bucks, we probably care more about how/where
> > it's spent than you do. It has nothing to do with being cheap or a
> > tightwad.
> >
> > Finally, as for saving on labor costs, lots of DIYers do BETTER work
> > than the shops anyway! I know I do. I HATE to take it in for that
> > reason alone...you can't always watch the monkeys these every second
> > you know.
> >
> > John D.
> >
> >
> >
> > "Dave" <dave1027@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:<u4ednV3IAfQTxbiiU-KYgw@comcast.com>...
> > > I don't know why you people go to such hassle to try to save a few
> bucks. I
> > > had two Civics and on both I had the dealer do the job. They charge
> less
> > > than $300 and use only genuine Honda parts. The also changed all belts
> and
> > > the water pump too. Oh, they also washed the cars after they were done.
> > > Dave
> > >
> > > "think2nd" <think2nd@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > news:3f230daf_3@newsfeed...
> > > > For my Acura's I bought a special tool that holds the crank pulley in
> place
> > > > while torque is applied to the crank bolt. The tool fits the hex
> inside
> the
> > > > pulley and has an opening for the socket on the bolt to fit through.
> It
> > > > worked great but cost about $40. The same tool fits most Honda's as
> well.
> > > > I think the manufacturer is Scheley Products and the part number is SP
> > > > 60100. I bought the tool on-line at thetoolwarehouse.net.
> > > > -Acura Legend Guy
> > > >
> > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message
> > > > news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53...
> > > > > Umm. Is the pulley-to-crankshaft bolt a left or right handed? It
> is so
> > > > > friggin tight that I might have go to Pep Boys and buy one of there
> > > > > specialty PowerBuilt tools to help remove it. I borrowed an
> industrial
> > > > > strength electric impact driver but have been assuming the the bolt
> is
> right
> > > > > handed.
> > > > >
> > > > > Some of the other suggestions on the Net were to use the starter in
> short
> > > > > bursts to help break loose the bolt. I don't like the idea but
> their
> setup
> > > > > suggests that the bolt is a left handed one. The crank rotates ccw
> so
> > > if
> > > a
> > > > > breaker bar were anchored in any location, the starter action would
> tend
> to
> > > > > tighten the bolt if it were a right hand thead.
> > > > >
> > > > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or
> lefty-loosey?
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks,
> > > > >
> > > > > Jay C.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com>
> wrote
> in
> > > > > message news:3F1EF58E.4CC3810A@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com...
> > > > > > "Jay C." wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Yeah, you're right. I will probably leave things alone if it is
> possible.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The biggest problem I am having right now is trying to get the
> drive
> belt
> > > > > > > pulley-crank bolt loose. I can't take the bottom timing belt
> cover
> > > off
> > > to
> > > > > > > finish the R & R of the timing belt until I do.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hopefully I can round up an impact driver. :-(
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Jay C.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com>
> > > wrote
> > > in
> > > > > > > message news:3F1EE3A2.758C7D28@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com...
> > > > > > > > "Jay C." wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if
> I
> > > want
> > > to do
> > > a
> > > > > > > > > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The
> car
> > > has
> > > nearly
> > > > > > > > > 1/4 million miles on it.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Jay
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185"
> <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com>
> > > wrote
> > > in
> > > > > > > > > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com...
> > > > > > > > > > "Jay C." wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating
> the
> > > car
> > > (in a
> > > cooler
> > > > > > > > > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing
> > > several
> > > teeth
> > > in
> > > one
> > > > > > > > > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow
> > > stop
> > > at
> > > a
> > > traffic
> > > > > > > > > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled
> and
> > > she
> > > couldn't
> > > > > > > > > > > restart it.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough
> to
> > > do
> > > any
> > > damage).
> > > > > > > > > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I
> > > tried
> > > to
> > > restart
> > > it.
> > > > > > > > > > > The timing sounded like it was off.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I
> look
> > > for
> > > possible
> > > > > > > > > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Jay C.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03...
> > > > > > > > > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX
> back
> > > to
> > > the
> > > house.
> > > It
> > > > > > > > > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car
> quit in
> > > the
> > > middle
> > > of a
> > > > > > > > > > > > busy intersection.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does
> > > sound
> > > a
> > > little
> > > > > > > > > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more
> like
> > > it
> > > is
> > > free
> > > wheeling
> > > > > > > > > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I
> guess
> > > that
> > > could
> > > be
> > > > > > > > > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an
> expert
> > > on
> > > this
> > > particular
> > > > > > > > > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to
> check
> first?
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check
> the
> > > compression
> > > on
> > > > > > > > > > all cyclinders.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > you may find if you rebuild the head, the lower end of the
> engine
> > > may
> > > get
> > > > > > > > stressed more with the additional compression and quickly
> fail.
> > > Ive
> > > seen
> > > this
> > > > > > > > happen on several vehichles with many miles on the odo, with a
> new
> /fresh
> > > > > > > > cyclinder head.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > should you decide to do the head work, its not much more work
> to
> > > slap
> > > new
> > > > > > > > piston rings and rod bearings in the thing.
> > > > > > > > all assuming your capable of the task.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I had incredible difficulty removing mine as well as others, The
> > > impact
> > > wrench
> > > > > > with a short 15ft of hose and 160 psi finally broke the darn thing
> > > loose
> > > after
> > > > > > snapping 4 sockets, and 1 extension. try to use no extensions and
> a
> good
> > > > > > impact socket, it makes all the difference.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > you will most likely have to anchor the flywheel or flexplate to
> the
> > > > > > transmission using some metal strapping to keep the engine from
> turing
> over.
> > > > > > someone on the web has a picture of the "flywheel anchor" on the
> web.
> > > > > > good luck
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
Retired or otherwise. He has plenty to worry about. Count your
blessings.
All through life, retired or not, either you pay someone else to do
the work -- have the big bucks/income available and HOPE it's done
right even at that -- or, you don't have the $$ and are forced to DIY.
In the latter case, no one else is going to do it if YOU don't. So I
do a lot of "quality reading" on occasion: auto
service/repair/troubleshooting/parts manuals -- and here in the
Honda/Toyota and Nissan newsgroups -- and hope at least regular
maintenance with quality fliuds/filters forestalls/prevents any
trouble down the road. And I drive my cars gently, don't abuse
them...that helps A LOT.
But I DO take it in to the shop when I have tried everything I can
think of to solve the problem but still can't find it, or, it's
something out of my area of expertise. For example, I will NOT get out
my cordless drill, put in a huge bit, hold the block between my feet
and rebore the cylinders! I used to do that -- just eyeball the bore
measurements in fact, and tried to hold the drill completely vertical
-- but that didn't work to well! Just kidding. ;-)
In those cases (very rare fortunately), it goes in to the shop. But
it's still tough coming up with the money sometimes.
John D.
"Dave" <dave1027@comcast.net> wrote in message news:<YQ2dnYXS8uZri7uiXTWJjA@comcast.com>...
> No, I'm not rich, not yet any way. I'm kind of middle class. If I was rich
> would I be driving Honda Civics? I'm just a guy that has been there and
> done that. I found out long ago that life is too short to be spending it
> worrying about how I'm going to get the crank bolt off. $300 is not a bad
> trade for peace of mind.
>
> Dave
>
>
> "John D." <jcdech@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:e821bab6.0307281411.7bcd708@posting.google.co m...
> > Dave,
> >
> > Possibly because SOME people here just may be on a very small fixed
> > income (like SS...or a SMALL VA disability as in my case) and if it
> > saves LABOR costs, it's of great interest...$300 is HALF of some
> > people's monthly income.
> >
> > As for parts, some of us need to shop around for the lowest prices for
> > them, too.
> >
> > We all don't make big money like you might -- really can't afford to
> > take it in even just for a diagnostics every time something happens --
> > or if you don't make big bucks, we probably care more about how/where
> > it's spent than you do. It has nothing to do with being cheap or a
> > tightwad.
> >
> > Finally, as for saving on labor costs, lots of DIYers do BETTER work
> > than the shops anyway! I know I do. I HATE to take it in for that
> > reason alone...you can't always watch the monkeys these every second
> > you know.
> >
> > John D.
> >
> >
> >
> > "Dave" <dave1027@comcast.net> wrote in message
> news:<u4ednV3IAfQTxbiiU-KYgw@comcast.com>...
> > > I don't know why you people go to such hassle to try to save a few
> bucks. I
> > > had two Civics and on both I had the dealer do the job. They charge
> less
> > > than $300 and use only genuine Honda parts. The also changed all belts
> and
> > > the water pump too. Oh, they also washed the cars after they were done.
> > > Dave
> > >
> > > "think2nd" <think2nd@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> > > news:3f230daf_3@newsfeed...
> > > > For my Acura's I bought a special tool that holds the crank pulley in
> place
> > > > while torque is applied to the crank bolt. The tool fits the hex
> inside
> the
> > > > pulley and has an opening for the socket on the bolt to fit through.
> It
> > > > worked great but cost about $40. The same tool fits most Honda's as
> well.
> > > > I think the manufacturer is Scheley Products and the part number is SP
> > > > 60100. I bought the tool on-line at thetoolwarehouse.net.
> > > > -Acura Legend Guy
> > > >
> > > > "Jay C." <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message
> > > > news:dsUTa.120627$GL4.32487@rwcrnsc53...
> > > > > Umm. Is the pulley-to-crankshaft bolt a left or right handed? It
> is so
> > > > > friggin tight that I might have go to Pep Boys and buy one of there
> > > > > specialty PowerBuilt tools to help remove it. I borrowed an
> industrial
> > > > > strength electric impact driver but have been assuming the the bolt
> is
> right
> > > > > handed.
> > > > >
> > > > > Some of the other suggestions on the Net were to use the starter in
> short
> > > > > bursts to help break loose the bolt. I don't like the idea but
> their
> setup
> > > > > suggests that the bolt is a left handed one. The crank rotates ccw
> so
> > > if
> > > a
> > > > > breaker bar were anchored in any location, the starter action would
> tend
> to
> > > > > tighten the bolt if it were a right hand thead.
> > > > >
> > > > > Could someone make this clear for me? Is it righty-tighty or
> lefty-loosey?
> > > > >
> > > > > Thanks,
> > > > >
> > > > > Jay C.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com>
> wrote
> in
> > > > > message news:3F1EF58E.4CC3810A@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com...
> > > > > > "Jay C." wrote:
> > > > > >
> > > > > > > Yeah, you're right. I will probably leave things alone if it is
> possible.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > The biggest problem I am having right now is trying to get the
> drive
> belt
> > > > > > > pulley-crank bolt loose. I can't take the bottom timing belt
> cover
> > > off
> > > to
> > > > > > > finish the R & R of the timing belt until I do.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Hopefully I can round up an impact driver. :-(
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > Jay C.
> > > > > > >
> > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185" <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com>
> > > wrote
> > > in
> > > > > > > message news:3F1EE3A2.758C7D28@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com...
> > > > > > > > "Jay C." wrote:
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Thanks,
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > I am in the process of doing the deal. I have to decide if
> I
> > > want
> > > to do
> > > a
> > > > > > > > > valve and head cleaning job while I am this far along. The
> car
> > > has
> > > nearly
> > > > > > > > > 1/4 million miles on it.
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > Jay
> > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > "Mitchell A. Bogh; bems=137185"
> <mab2728@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com>
> > > wrote
> > > in
> > > > > > > > > message news:3F1ECADD.88D6EE12@eeppf001.ca.boeing.com...
> > > > > > > > > > "Jay C." wrote:
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I spent a little more time this morning investigating
> the
> > > car
> > > (in a
> > > cooler
> > > > > > > > > > > garage). I can now see that the timing belt is missing
> > > several
> > > teeth
> > > in
> > > one
> > > > > > > > > > > place as it loops over the top of the cam pulley.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Yesterday my daughter said that she was coming to a slow
> > > stop
> > > at
> > > a
> > > traffic
> > > > > > > > > > > light and the next thing she knew, the car had stalled
> and
> > > she
> > > couldn't
> > > > > > > > > > > restart it.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Perhaps the belt skipped position (hopefully not enough
> to
> > > do
> > > any
> > > damage).
> > > > > > > > > > > Now I think I can explain how the engine sounded when I
> > > tried
> > > to
> > > restart
> > > it.
> > > > > > > > > > > The timing sounded like it was off.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > I will be changing the belt starting today. How do I
> look
> > > for
> > > possible
> > > > > > > > > > > damage to valves and pistons without pulling the head?
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > Jay C.
> > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > "Jay" <jay@jaycatmull.com> wrote in message
> > > > > > > > > > > news:nriTa.119388$N7.16718@sccrnsc03...
> > > > > > > > > > > > I just got back from towing my daughter's 91 Civic DX
> back
> > > to
> > > the
> > > house.
> > > It
> > > > > > > > > > > > is 103 degrees in Salt Lake City today and the car
> quit in
> > > the
> > > middle
> > > of a
> > > > > > > > > > > > busy intersection.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > The engine turns over and cranks just fine but it does
> > > sound
> > > a
> > > little
> > > > > > > > > > > > different while cranking. It sounds a little more
> like
> > > it
> > > is
> > > free
> > > wheeling
> > > > > > > > > > > > (possibly) rather than turning under compression. I
> guess
> > > that
> > > could
> > > be
> > > > > > > > > > > > because of a couple of things....but not being an
> expert
> > > on
> > > this
> > > particular
> > > > > > > > > > > > model I could sure use some advice. Help! What to
> check
> first?
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > > Jay C.
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > > > install the new belt and necessary components then check
> the
> > > compression
> > > on
> > > > > > > > > > all cyclinders.
> > > > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > you may find if you rebuild the head, the lower end of the
> engine
> > > may
> > > get
> > > > > > > > stressed more with the additional compression and quickly
> fail.
> > > Ive
> > > seen
> > > this
> > > > > > > > happen on several vehichles with many miles on the odo, with a
> new
> /fresh
> > > > > > > > cyclinder head.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > > > > should you decide to do the head work, its not much more work
> to
> > > slap
> > > new
> > > > > > > > piston rings and rod bearings in the thing.
> > > > > > > > all assuming your capable of the task.
> > > > > > > >
> > > > > >
> > > > > > I had incredible difficulty removing mine as well as others, The
> > > impact
> > > wrench
> > > > > > with a short 15ft of hose and 160 psi finally broke the darn thing
> > > loose
> > > after
> > > > > > snapping 4 sockets, and 1 extension. try to use no extensions and
> a
> good
> > > > > > impact socket, it makes all the difference.
> > > > > >
> > > > > > you will most likely have to anchor the flywheel or flexplate to
> the
> > > > > > transmission using some metal strapping to keep the engine from
> turing
> over.
> > > > > > someone on the web has a picture of the "flywheel anchor" on the
> web.
> > > > > > good luck
> > > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > >
> > > >
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