sludge
#166
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
Dave in Lake Villa wrote:
> 'Dave, you've said you are a Christian. So am I'
> Glad to hear that Matt. So, if you were to die very
> unexpectedly tonight and stand before God immediatly, how would you
> answer the question of him asking you :" Matt, why should i let you into
> Heaven for eternity ?" .
>
> That is a topic for a different newsgroup.
>
> REPLY: Then feel free to email me with the answer you would give.
It isn't relevant to engine flushing.
> 'And you have the manufacturer's manual for your Hyundai also. It is
> called the owner's manual. Does it specify engine flushing using the
> Bilstein machine? If not, then why do you think it is necessary?'
>
> REPLY: I dont believe i ever said 'it is necessary' (??) However i do
> think it is advantageous . Does the Hyundai Manual recommend using
> synthetic fluids in the drivetrain ... even though synthetic fluids have
> a distinct advantage over the non types ?
No, and I would never say that anyone should use them unless they want
the very well documented benefits. I use synthetics purely for the cold
starting advantage. They are overkill in pretty much every other way as
I don't run extended drain intervals and I don't race, etc. However,
for me the cold start benefit alone is worth the incremental cost. The
"data" at the Bilstein site was feeble even if true, with claimed
performance that isn't even above the measurement noise floor. This
isn't true with synthetic lubricants. There is tons of data from many
sources as to the benefit, so much so that some car makers (Chevrolet
with the Vette and Porsche) actually specify it.
Comparing engine flushing with synthetic oil is as specious as your
comparision to electronic ignition.
> 'I have investigated what I saw published about the Bilstein machine. It
> is simply an unnecessary gimmick, just like so many others designed to
> separate people from their money. Things such as transmission flushing
> machines, oil additives, etc.
> Matt '
>
> REPLY: Good...then youve taken the first step. If you have a Pep Boys
> or other place that uses the exact machine, then stop by and ask them if
> you can watch it being used as you have the desire to fully evaluate it.
I wouldn't let a Pep Boys employee within 10 feet of my car. I stopped
at an Autozone once to get the free scan tool read on my Plymouth van as
the MIL was lit. They gave me a code that made no sense at all as it
was a part that had been just recently replaced. I went to a Chrysler
dealer and they gave me the correct problem code. Places like that
can't even use a scan tool correctly. You think I'd let them access the
internals of my engine? Not going to happen.
Well, it is obvious that you are one of the folks that P.T. Barnum
talked about. Reason won't work with you so I'm done with this thread.
Matt
> 'Dave, you've said you are a Christian. So am I'
> Glad to hear that Matt. So, if you were to die very
> unexpectedly tonight and stand before God immediatly, how would you
> answer the question of him asking you :" Matt, why should i let you into
> Heaven for eternity ?" .
>
> That is a topic for a different newsgroup.
>
> REPLY: Then feel free to email me with the answer you would give.
It isn't relevant to engine flushing.
> 'And you have the manufacturer's manual for your Hyundai also. It is
> called the owner's manual. Does it specify engine flushing using the
> Bilstein machine? If not, then why do you think it is necessary?'
>
> REPLY: I dont believe i ever said 'it is necessary' (??) However i do
> think it is advantageous . Does the Hyundai Manual recommend using
> synthetic fluids in the drivetrain ... even though synthetic fluids have
> a distinct advantage over the non types ?
No, and I would never say that anyone should use them unless they want
the very well documented benefits. I use synthetics purely for the cold
starting advantage. They are overkill in pretty much every other way as
I don't run extended drain intervals and I don't race, etc. However,
for me the cold start benefit alone is worth the incremental cost. The
"data" at the Bilstein site was feeble even if true, with claimed
performance that isn't even above the measurement noise floor. This
isn't true with synthetic lubricants. There is tons of data from many
sources as to the benefit, so much so that some car makers (Chevrolet
with the Vette and Porsche) actually specify it.
Comparing engine flushing with synthetic oil is as specious as your
comparision to electronic ignition.
> 'I have investigated what I saw published about the Bilstein machine. It
> is simply an unnecessary gimmick, just like so many others designed to
> separate people from their money. Things such as transmission flushing
> machines, oil additives, etc.
> Matt '
>
> REPLY: Good...then youve taken the first step. If you have a Pep Boys
> or other place that uses the exact machine, then stop by and ask them if
> you can watch it being used as you have the desire to fully evaluate it.
I wouldn't let a Pep Boys employee within 10 feet of my car. I stopped
at an Autozone once to get the free scan tool read on my Plymouth van as
the MIL was lit. They gave me a code that made no sense at all as it
was a part that had been just recently replaced. I went to a Chrysler
dealer and they gave me the correct problem code. Places like that
can't even use a scan tool correctly. You think I'd let them access the
internals of my engine? Not going to happen.
Well, it is obvious that you are one of the folks that P.T. Barnum
talked about. Reason won't work with you so I'm done with this thread.
Matt
#167
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
Dave in Lake Villa wrote:
> 'CDI provided demonstrable advantages. That is why car makers switched
> to using them. Engine flushes don't have demonstrable advantages, that
> is why no car make recommends them.
> Matt '
>
> REPLY: Synthetic fluids have demonstrable advantages, yet not all Car
> Mfg's recommend them in their owners manual. Same with K and N intake
> air filters and a host of other things.
Because the advantages aren't needed in most cases. Chevrolet and
Porsche do specify synthetics. My K1500 requires a specific Castrol
synthetic gear lube in the manual transmission.
K&N filters are a great way to ruin your engine as they pass a lot more
dirt than do conventional paper filters. Sure, you get a little more
performance, but you give up engine life. If you are a racer, this is a
worthwhile trade. It is a fool's choice for a street vehicle.
Matt
> 'CDI provided demonstrable advantages. That is why car makers switched
> to using them. Engine flushes don't have demonstrable advantages, that
> is why no car make recommends them.
> Matt '
>
> REPLY: Synthetic fluids have demonstrable advantages, yet not all Car
> Mfg's recommend them in their owners manual. Same with K and N intake
> air filters and a host of other things.
Because the advantages aren't needed in most cases. Chevrolet and
Porsche do specify synthetics. My K1500 requires a specific Castrol
synthetic gear lube in the manual transmission.
K&N filters are a great way to ruin your engine as they pass a lot more
dirt than do conventional paper filters. Sure, you get a little more
performance, but you give up engine life. If you are a racer, this is a
worthwhile trade. It is a fool's choice for a street vehicle.
Matt
#168
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
Dave in Lake Villa wrote:
> 'CDI provided demonstrable advantages. That is why car makers switched
> to using them. Engine flushes don't have demonstrable advantages, that
> is why no car make recommends them.
> Matt '
>
> REPLY: Synthetic fluids have demonstrable advantages, yet not all Car
> Mfg's recommend them in their owners manual. Same with K and N intake
> air filters and a host of other things.
Because the advantages aren't needed in most cases. Chevrolet and
Porsche do specify synthetics. My K1500 requires a specific Castrol
synthetic gear lube in the manual transmission.
K&N filters are a great way to ruin your engine as they pass a lot more
dirt than do conventional paper filters. Sure, you get a little more
performance, but you give up engine life. If you are a racer, this is a
worthwhile trade. It is a fool's choice for a street vehicle.
Matt
> 'CDI provided demonstrable advantages. That is why car makers switched
> to using them. Engine flushes don't have demonstrable advantages, that
> is why no car make recommends them.
> Matt '
>
> REPLY: Synthetic fluids have demonstrable advantages, yet not all Car
> Mfg's recommend them in their owners manual. Same with K and N intake
> air filters and a host of other things.
Because the advantages aren't needed in most cases. Chevrolet and
Porsche do specify synthetics. My K1500 requires a specific Castrol
synthetic gear lube in the manual transmission.
K&N filters are a great way to ruin your engine as they pass a lot more
dirt than do conventional paper filters. Sure, you get a little more
performance, but you give up engine life. If you are a racer, this is a
worthwhile trade. It is a fool's choice for a street vehicle.
Matt
#169
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
Dave in Lake Villa wrote:
> 'CDI provided demonstrable advantages. That is why car makers switched
> to using them. Engine flushes don't have demonstrable advantages, that
> is why no car make recommends them.
> Matt '
>
> REPLY: Synthetic fluids have demonstrable advantages, yet not all Car
> Mfg's recommend them in their owners manual. Same with K and N intake
> air filters and a host of other things.
Because the advantages aren't needed in most cases. Chevrolet and
Porsche do specify synthetics. My K1500 requires a specific Castrol
synthetic gear lube in the manual transmission.
K&N filters are a great way to ruin your engine as they pass a lot more
dirt than do conventional paper filters. Sure, you get a little more
performance, but you give up engine life. If you are a racer, this is a
worthwhile trade. It is a fool's choice for a street vehicle.
Matt
> 'CDI provided demonstrable advantages. That is why car makers switched
> to using them. Engine flushes don't have demonstrable advantages, that
> is why no car make recommends them.
> Matt '
>
> REPLY: Synthetic fluids have demonstrable advantages, yet not all Car
> Mfg's recommend them in their owners manual. Same with K and N intake
> air filters and a host of other things.
Because the advantages aren't needed in most cases. Chevrolet and
Porsche do specify synthetics. My K1500 requires a specific Castrol
synthetic gear lube in the manual transmission.
K&N filters are a great way to ruin your engine as they pass a lot more
dirt than do conventional paper filters. Sure, you get a little more
performance, but you give up engine life. If you are a racer, this is a
worthwhile trade. It is a fool's choice for a street vehicle.
Matt
#173
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
hyundaitech wrote:
> I'll interject here that Dave's experience is one of the few actual
> benefits of an engine flush. If you do happen to get something lodged in
> a small passage, the flusher could possibly push it out.
>
> If I had a customer with a valve tap, I'd recommend trying an engine flush
> prior to engaging in extensive and costly engine repairs. What's to lose?
What's to lose is your engine if you dislodge a large piece of gunk and
clog up the passage to a main bearing in the process of opening up the
passage to the lifter. Personally, I'd try running a synthetic oil for
a change or two first. Jumping right to an engine flush is like driving
a finishing nail with a 5 lb maul. Sure, it'll drive the nail, but
it'll also leave a large dent in the finished wood!
Matt
> I'll interject here that Dave's experience is one of the few actual
> benefits of an engine flush. If you do happen to get something lodged in
> a small passage, the flusher could possibly push it out.
>
> If I had a customer with a valve tap, I'd recommend trying an engine flush
> prior to engaging in extensive and costly engine repairs. What's to lose?
What's to lose is your engine if you dislodge a large piece of gunk and
clog up the passage to a main bearing in the process of opening up the
passage to the lifter. Personally, I'd try running a synthetic oil for
a change or two first. Jumping right to an engine flush is like driving
a finishing nail with a 5 lb maul. Sure, it'll drive the nail, but
it'll also leave a large dent in the finished wood!
Matt
#174
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
hyundaitech wrote:
> I'll interject here that Dave's experience is one of the few actual
> benefits of an engine flush. If you do happen to get something lodged in
> a small passage, the flusher could possibly push it out.
>
> If I had a customer with a valve tap, I'd recommend trying an engine flush
> prior to engaging in extensive and costly engine repairs. What's to lose?
What's to lose is your engine if you dislodge a large piece of gunk and
clog up the passage to a main bearing in the process of opening up the
passage to the lifter. Personally, I'd try running a synthetic oil for
a change or two first. Jumping right to an engine flush is like driving
a finishing nail with a 5 lb maul. Sure, it'll drive the nail, but
it'll also leave a large dent in the finished wood!
Matt
> I'll interject here that Dave's experience is one of the few actual
> benefits of an engine flush. If you do happen to get something lodged in
> a small passage, the flusher could possibly push it out.
>
> If I had a customer with a valve tap, I'd recommend trying an engine flush
> prior to engaging in extensive and costly engine repairs. What's to lose?
What's to lose is your engine if you dislodge a large piece of gunk and
clog up the passage to a main bearing in the process of opening up the
passage to the lifter. Personally, I'd try running a synthetic oil for
a change or two first. Jumping right to an engine flush is like driving
a finishing nail with a 5 lb maul. Sure, it'll drive the nail, but
it'll also leave a large dent in the finished wood!
Matt
#175
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
hyundaitech wrote:
> I'll interject here that Dave's experience is one of the few actual
> benefits of an engine flush. If you do happen to get something lodged in
> a small passage, the flusher could possibly push it out.
>
> If I had a customer with a valve tap, I'd recommend trying an engine flush
> prior to engaging in extensive and costly engine repairs. What's to lose?
What's to lose is your engine if you dislodge a large piece of gunk and
clog up the passage to a main bearing in the process of opening up the
passage to the lifter. Personally, I'd try running a synthetic oil for
a change or two first. Jumping right to an engine flush is like driving
a finishing nail with a 5 lb maul. Sure, it'll drive the nail, but
it'll also leave a large dent in the finished wood!
Matt
> I'll interject here that Dave's experience is one of the few actual
> benefits of an engine flush. If you do happen to get something lodged in
> a small passage, the flusher could possibly push it out.
>
> If I had a customer with a valve tap, I'd recommend trying an engine flush
> prior to engaging in extensive and costly engine repairs. What's to lose?
What's to lose is your engine if you dislodge a large piece of gunk and
clog up the passage to a main bearing in the process of opening up the
passage to the lifter. Personally, I'd try running a synthetic oil for
a change or two first. Jumping right to an engine flush is like driving
a finishing nail with a 5 lb maul. Sure, it'll drive the nail, but
it'll also leave a large dent in the finished wood!
Matt
#176
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
Matt Whiting wrote:
> hyundaitech wrote:
>
>> Another bad example. The oil from a K&N can damage your air flow sensor.
>>
>
> As the dirt passed by the filter damages your rings, pistons and
> cylinder walls.
>
> Matt
Yep. No better than using an old sock flooded with oil.
JS
> hyundaitech wrote:
>
>> Another bad example. The oil from a K&N can damage your air flow sensor.
>>
>
> As the dirt passed by the filter damages your rings, pistons and
> cylinder walls.
>
> Matt
Yep. No better than using an old sock flooded with oil.
JS
#177
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
Matt Whiting wrote:
> hyundaitech wrote:
>
>> Another bad example. The oil from a K&N can damage your air flow sensor.
>>
>
> As the dirt passed by the filter damages your rings, pistons and
> cylinder walls.
>
> Matt
Yep. No better than using an old sock flooded with oil.
JS
> hyundaitech wrote:
>
>> Another bad example. The oil from a K&N can damage your air flow sensor.
>>
>
> As the dirt passed by the filter damages your rings, pistons and
> cylinder walls.
>
> Matt
Yep. No better than using an old sock flooded with oil.
JS
#178
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
Matt Whiting wrote:
> hyundaitech wrote:
>
>> Another bad example. The oil from a K&N can damage your air flow sensor.
>>
>
> As the dirt passed by the filter damages your rings, pistons and
> cylinder walls.
>
> Matt
Yep. No better than using an old sock flooded with oil.
JS
> hyundaitech wrote:
>
>> Another bad example. The oil from a K&N can damage your air flow sensor.
>>
>
> As the dirt passed by the filter damages your rings, pistons and
> cylinder walls.
>
> Matt
Yep. No better than using an old sock flooded with oil.
JS
#179
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
Matt Whiting wrote:
> Dave in Lake Villa wrote:
>
>> 'Dave, you've said you are a Christian. So am I' Glad to hear that
>> Matt. So, if you were to die very unexpectedly tonight and stand
>> before God immediatly, how would you
>> answer the question of him asking you :" Matt, why should i let you into
>> Heaven for eternity ?" .
>> That is a topic for a different newsgroup.
>>
>> REPLY: Then feel free to email me with the answer you would give.
>
>
> It isn't relevant to engine flushing.
>
>
>> 'And you have the manufacturer's manual for your Hyundai also. It is
>> called the owner's manual. Does it specify engine flushing using the
>> Bilstein machine? If not, then why do you think it is necessary?'
>>
>> REPLY: I dont believe i ever said 'it is necessary' (??) However i do
>> think it is advantageous . Does the Hyundai Manual recommend using
>> synthetic fluids in the drivetrain ... even though synthetic fluids have
>> a distinct advantage over the non types ?
>
>
> No, and I would never say that anyone should use them unless they want
> the very well documented benefits. I use synthetics purely for the cold
> starting advantage. They are overkill in pretty much every other way as
> I don't run extended drain intervals and I don't race, etc. However,
> for me the cold start benefit alone is worth the incremental cost. The
> "data" at the Bilstein site was feeble even if true, with claimed
> performance that isn't even above the measurement noise floor. This
> isn't true with synthetic lubricants. There is tons of data from many
> sources as to the benefit, so much so that some car makers (Chevrolet
> with the Vette and Porsche) actually specify it.
>
> Comparing engine flushing with synthetic oil is as specious as your
> comparision to electronic ignition.
>
>
>> 'I have investigated what I saw published about the Bilstein machine. It
>> is simply an unnecessary gimmick, just like so many others designed to
>> separate people from their money. Things such as transmission flushing
>> machines, oil additives, etc. Matt '
>>
>> REPLY: Good...then youve taken the first step. If you have a Pep Boys
>> or other place that uses the exact machine, then stop by and ask them if
>> you can watch it being used as you have the desire to fully evaluate it.
>
>
> I wouldn't let a Pep Boys employee within 10 feet of my car. I stopped
> at an Autozone once to get the free scan tool read on my Plymouth van as
> the MIL was lit. They gave me a code that made no sense at all as it
> was a part that had been just recently replaced. I went to a Chrysler
> dealer and they gave me the correct problem code. Places like that
> can't even use a scan tool correctly. You think I'd let them access the
> internals of my engine? Not going to happen.
>
> Well, it is obvious that you are one of the folks that P.T. Barnum
> talked about. Reason won't work with you so I'm done with this thread.
It appears that his religious fervor extends to the Bilstein machine.
Remember, in his world science and facts don't matter, all that counts
is faith and belief. ;-)
> Dave in Lake Villa wrote:
>
>> 'Dave, you've said you are a Christian. So am I' Glad to hear that
>> Matt. So, if you were to die very unexpectedly tonight and stand
>> before God immediatly, how would you
>> answer the question of him asking you :" Matt, why should i let you into
>> Heaven for eternity ?" .
>> That is a topic for a different newsgroup.
>>
>> REPLY: Then feel free to email me with the answer you would give.
>
>
> It isn't relevant to engine flushing.
>
>
>> 'And you have the manufacturer's manual for your Hyundai also. It is
>> called the owner's manual. Does it specify engine flushing using the
>> Bilstein machine? If not, then why do you think it is necessary?'
>>
>> REPLY: I dont believe i ever said 'it is necessary' (??) However i do
>> think it is advantageous . Does the Hyundai Manual recommend using
>> synthetic fluids in the drivetrain ... even though synthetic fluids have
>> a distinct advantage over the non types ?
>
>
> No, and I would never say that anyone should use them unless they want
> the very well documented benefits. I use synthetics purely for the cold
> starting advantage. They are overkill in pretty much every other way as
> I don't run extended drain intervals and I don't race, etc. However,
> for me the cold start benefit alone is worth the incremental cost. The
> "data" at the Bilstein site was feeble even if true, with claimed
> performance that isn't even above the measurement noise floor. This
> isn't true with synthetic lubricants. There is tons of data from many
> sources as to the benefit, so much so that some car makers (Chevrolet
> with the Vette and Porsche) actually specify it.
>
> Comparing engine flushing with synthetic oil is as specious as your
> comparision to electronic ignition.
>
>
>> 'I have investigated what I saw published about the Bilstein machine. It
>> is simply an unnecessary gimmick, just like so many others designed to
>> separate people from their money. Things such as transmission flushing
>> machines, oil additives, etc. Matt '
>>
>> REPLY: Good...then youve taken the first step. If you have a Pep Boys
>> or other place that uses the exact machine, then stop by and ask them if
>> you can watch it being used as you have the desire to fully evaluate it.
>
>
> I wouldn't let a Pep Boys employee within 10 feet of my car. I stopped
> at an Autozone once to get the free scan tool read on my Plymouth van as
> the MIL was lit. They gave me a code that made no sense at all as it
> was a part that had been just recently replaced. I went to a Chrysler
> dealer and they gave me the correct problem code. Places like that
> can't even use a scan tool correctly. You think I'd let them access the
> internals of my engine? Not going to happen.
>
> Well, it is obvious that you are one of the folks that P.T. Barnum
> talked about. Reason won't work with you so I'm done with this thread.
It appears that his religious fervor extends to the Bilstein machine.
Remember, in his world science and facts don't matter, all that counts
is faith and belief. ;-)
#180
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: sludge
Matt Whiting wrote:
> Dave in Lake Villa wrote:
>
>> 'Dave, you've said you are a Christian. So am I' Glad to hear that
>> Matt. So, if you were to die very unexpectedly tonight and stand
>> before God immediatly, how would you
>> answer the question of him asking you :" Matt, why should i let you into
>> Heaven for eternity ?" .
>> That is a topic for a different newsgroup.
>>
>> REPLY: Then feel free to email me with the answer you would give.
>
>
> It isn't relevant to engine flushing.
>
>
>> 'And you have the manufacturer's manual for your Hyundai also. It is
>> called the owner's manual. Does it specify engine flushing using the
>> Bilstein machine? If not, then why do you think it is necessary?'
>>
>> REPLY: I dont believe i ever said 'it is necessary' (??) However i do
>> think it is advantageous . Does the Hyundai Manual recommend using
>> synthetic fluids in the drivetrain ... even though synthetic fluids have
>> a distinct advantage over the non types ?
>
>
> No, and I would never say that anyone should use them unless they want
> the very well documented benefits. I use synthetics purely for the cold
> starting advantage. They are overkill in pretty much every other way as
> I don't run extended drain intervals and I don't race, etc. However,
> for me the cold start benefit alone is worth the incremental cost. The
> "data" at the Bilstein site was feeble even if true, with claimed
> performance that isn't even above the measurement noise floor. This
> isn't true with synthetic lubricants. There is tons of data from many
> sources as to the benefit, so much so that some car makers (Chevrolet
> with the Vette and Porsche) actually specify it.
>
> Comparing engine flushing with synthetic oil is as specious as your
> comparision to electronic ignition.
>
>
>> 'I have investigated what I saw published about the Bilstein machine. It
>> is simply an unnecessary gimmick, just like so many others designed to
>> separate people from their money. Things such as transmission flushing
>> machines, oil additives, etc. Matt '
>>
>> REPLY: Good...then youve taken the first step. If you have a Pep Boys
>> or other place that uses the exact machine, then stop by and ask them if
>> you can watch it being used as you have the desire to fully evaluate it.
>
>
> I wouldn't let a Pep Boys employee within 10 feet of my car. I stopped
> at an Autozone once to get the free scan tool read on my Plymouth van as
> the MIL was lit. They gave me a code that made no sense at all as it
> was a part that had been just recently replaced. I went to a Chrysler
> dealer and they gave me the correct problem code. Places like that
> can't even use a scan tool correctly. You think I'd let them access the
> internals of my engine? Not going to happen.
>
> Well, it is obvious that you are one of the folks that P.T. Barnum
> talked about. Reason won't work with you so I'm done with this thread.
It appears that his religious fervor extends to the Bilstein machine.
Remember, in his world science and facts don't matter, all that counts
is faith and belief. ;-)
> Dave in Lake Villa wrote:
>
>> 'Dave, you've said you are a Christian. So am I' Glad to hear that
>> Matt. So, if you were to die very unexpectedly tonight and stand
>> before God immediatly, how would you
>> answer the question of him asking you :" Matt, why should i let you into
>> Heaven for eternity ?" .
>> That is a topic for a different newsgroup.
>>
>> REPLY: Then feel free to email me with the answer you would give.
>
>
> It isn't relevant to engine flushing.
>
>
>> 'And you have the manufacturer's manual for your Hyundai also. It is
>> called the owner's manual. Does it specify engine flushing using the
>> Bilstein machine? If not, then why do you think it is necessary?'
>>
>> REPLY: I dont believe i ever said 'it is necessary' (??) However i do
>> think it is advantageous . Does the Hyundai Manual recommend using
>> synthetic fluids in the drivetrain ... even though synthetic fluids have
>> a distinct advantage over the non types ?
>
>
> No, and I would never say that anyone should use them unless they want
> the very well documented benefits. I use synthetics purely for the cold
> starting advantage. They are overkill in pretty much every other way as
> I don't run extended drain intervals and I don't race, etc. However,
> for me the cold start benefit alone is worth the incremental cost. The
> "data" at the Bilstein site was feeble even if true, with claimed
> performance that isn't even above the measurement noise floor. This
> isn't true with synthetic lubricants. There is tons of data from many
> sources as to the benefit, so much so that some car makers (Chevrolet
> with the Vette and Porsche) actually specify it.
>
> Comparing engine flushing with synthetic oil is as specious as your
> comparision to electronic ignition.
>
>
>> 'I have investigated what I saw published about the Bilstein machine. It
>> is simply an unnecessary gimmick, just like so many others designed to
>> separate people from their money. Things such as transmission flushing
>> machines, oil additives, etc. Matt '
>>
>> REPLY: Good...then youve taken the first step. If you have a Pep Boys
>> or other place that uses the exact machine, then stop by and ask them if
>> you can watch it being used as you have the desire to fully evaluate it.
>
>
> I wouldn't let a Pep Boys employee within 10 feet of my car. I stopped
> at an Autozone once to get the free scan tool read on my Plymouth van as
> the MIL was lit. They gave me a code that made no sense at all as it
> was a part that had been just recently replaced. I went to a Chrysler
> dealer and they gave me the correct problem code. Places like that
> can't even use a scan tool correctly. You think I'd let them access the
> internals of my engine? Not going to happen.
>
> Well, it is obvious that you are one of the folks that P.T. Barnum
> talked about. Reason won't work with you so I'm done with this thread.
It appears that his religious fervor extends to the Bilstein machine.
Remember, in his world science and facts don't matter, all that counts
is faith and belief. ;-)