hyundaitech

The information provided in the link is incorrect. Hyundai does recommend
4 years or 60k miles on all their vehicles with timing belts. If you have
a Hyundai and you doubt me, you should check your owner's manual. The
vehicle owner's manual is the maintenance god. If you don't do what it
says, you should expect to foot the bill for any consequences from not
performing your maintenance.

While what's said about it not being likely that the belt will fail
immediately is true for most engines, it's not a gamble I recommend people
take. If you're outside the maintenance interval and you didn't replace
the belt, you'll be picking up the dime for any resulting damage. I had
to put an engine in an XG once. The bill was about $10,000. (Granted, in
most cases, timing belt failure doesn't equal engine, but I'm hoping you
get the picture. If you think the timing belt is expensive, you're not
going to want to hear about the repairs due to damage from a broken timing
belt).

hyundaitech

The information provided in the link is incorrect. Hyundai does recommend
4 years or 60k miles on all their vehicles with timing belts. If you have
a Hyundai and you doubt me, you should check your owner's manual. The
vehicle owner's manual is the maintenance god. If you don't do what it
says, you should expect to foot the bill for any consequences from not
performing your maintenance.

While what's said about it not being likely that the belt will fail
immediately is true for most engines, it's not a gamble I recommend people
take. If you're outside the maintenance interval and you didn't replace
the belt, you'll be picking up the dime for any resulting damage. I had
to put an engine in an XG once. The bill was about $10,000. (Granted, in
most cases, timing belt failure doesn't equal engine, but I'm hoping you
get the picture. If you think the timing belt is expensive, you're not
going to want to hear about the repairs due to damage from a broken timing
belt).

Brian Nystrom

Paradox wrote:
> you know hyundai just buries the cost into the price of the car

Yet they still manage to offer lower prices and higher value than the
Chevys you allude to. No wonder GM is laying off 30,000 workers and
bankruptcy is not out of the question. If I was forced to own GM junk,
I'd buy an extended warranty, since it's a good bet that I'd need it.

Brian Nystrom

Paradox wrote:
> you know hyundai just buries the cost into the price of the car

Yet they still manage to offer lower prices and higher value than the
Chevys you allude to. No wonder GM is laying off 30,000 workers and
bankruptcy is not out of the question. If I was forced to own GM junk,
I'd buy an extended warranty, since it's a good bet that I'd need it.

Paradox

"Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:lyMgf.4653$8o6.1608@trndny03...
> Paradox wrote:
> > you know hyundai just buries the cost into the price of the car
>
> Yet they still manage to offer lower prices and higher value than the
> Chevys you allude to. No wonder GM is laying off 30,000 workers and
> bankruptcy is not out of the question. If I was forced to own GM junk,
> I'd buy an extended warranty, since it's a good bet that I'd need it.

Apples and oranges, I doubt Hyundai employee's have as good benefits, alot
easier to sell cars cheaper if you don't have alot of overhead. Unions are
what have done GM in, forcing more and more benefits without looking at
whats happening to the company that is supporting them. There is a rule
about biting the hand that feeds you.

As for quality issues, you get what you pay for.

Paradox

"Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:lyMgf.4653$8o6.1608@trndny03...
> Paradox wrote:
> > you know hyundai just buries the cost into the price of the car
>
> Yet they still manage to offer lower prices and higher value than the
> Chevys you allude to. No wonder GM is laying off 30,000 workers and
> bankruptcy is not out of the question. If I was forced to own GM junk,
> I'd buy an extended warranty, since it's a good bet that I'd need it.

Apples and oranges, I doubt Hyundai employee's have as good benefits, alot
easier to sell cars cheaper if you don't have alot of overhead. Unions are
what have done GM in, forcing more and more benefits without looking at
whats happening to the company that is supporting them. There is a rule
about biting the hand that feeds you.

As for quality issues, you get what you pay for.

Victor A. Garcia

Sorry, you got it wrong.

Look at "Management" to put the blame on, not on the workers, workers do not
made stupid decisions like to built Plants with 200% the capacity of the
best estimate of how many cars will be sold by GM.
As for quality .... GM has the worse in the USA, drove a Chevy 8 months ago
(rental) worse piece of manure I have seen in my life.
Got tired of problems with Fords, switched to Japs/Koreans ..... HAPPY and
with more money in my pocket .... Detroit completely lost it.

"Paradox" <parallaxaz@***.net> wrote in message
news:9kQgf.1924$Wu.1251@fed1read05...
>
> "Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:lyMgf.4653$8o6.1608@trndny03...
>> Paradox wrote:
>> > you know hyundai just buries the cost into the price of the car
>>
>> Yet they still manage to offer lower prices and higher value than the
>> Chevys you allude to. No wonder GM is laying off 30,000 workers and
>> bankruptcy is not out of the question. If I was forced to own GM junk,
>> I'd buy an extended warranty, since it's a good bet that I'd need it.
>
> Apples and oranges, I doubt Hyundai employee's have as good benefits, alot
> easier to sell cars cheaper if you don't have alot of overhead. Unions are
> what have done GM in, forcing more and more benefits without looking at
> whats happening to the company that is supporting them. There is a rule
> about biting the hand that feeds you.
>
> As for quality issues, you get what you pay for.
>
>

Victor A. Garcia

Sorry, you got it wrong.

Look at "Management" to put the blame on, not on the workers, workers do not
made stupid decisions like to built Plants with 200% the capacity of the
best estimate of how many cars will be sold by GM.
As for quality .... GM has the worse in the USA, drove a Chevy 8 months ago
(rental) worse piece of manure I have seen in my life.
Got tired of problems with Fords, switched to Japs/Koreans ..... HAPPY and
with more money in my pocket .... Detroit completely lost it.

"Paradox" <parallaxaz@***.net> wrote in message
news:9kQgf.1924$Wu.1251@fed1read05...
>
> "Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:lyMgf.4653$8o6.1608@trndny03...
>> Paradox wrote:
>> > you know hyundai just buries the cost into the price of the car
>>
>> Yet they still manage to offer lower prices and higher value than the
>> Chevys you allude to. No wonder GM is laying off 30,000 workers and
>> bankruptcy is not out of the question. If I was forced to own GM junk,
>> I'd buy an extended warranty, since it's a good bet that I'd need it.
>
> Apples and oranges, I doubt Hyundai employee's have as good benefits, alot
> easier to sell cars cheaper if you don't have alot of overhead. Unions are
> what have done GM in, forcing more and more benefits without looking at
> whats happening to the company that is supporting them. There is a rule
> about biting the hand that feeds you.
>
> As for quality issues, you get what you pay for.
>
>

Brian Nystrom

Paradox wrote:
> "Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:lyMgf.4653$8o6.1608@trndny03...
>
>>Paradox wrote:
>>
>>>you know hyundai just buries the cost into the price of the car
>>
>>Yet they still manage to offer lower prices and higher value than the
>>Chevys you allude to. No wonder GM is laying off 30,000 workers and
>>bankruptcy is not out of the question. If I was forced to own GM junk,
>>I'd buy an extended warranty, since it's a good bet that I'd need it.
>
>
> Apples and oranges, I doubt Hyundai employee's have as good benefits,

I guess "benefits" is a relative term. With the UAW, it seems to mean
"whatever we can force the company to give us TODAY, regardless of the
what will happen tomorrow."

As for Hyundai workers, it's not like they're working in sweatshops for
slave wages.

> alot
> easier to sell cars cheaper if you don't have alot of overhead. Unions are
> what have done GM in, forcing more and more benefits without looking at
> whats happening to the company that is supporting them. There is a rule
> about biting the hand that feeds you.

Absolutely. Unions like the UAW exist more for their own sake than for
the workers or the companies. It's about power, not workers or product
quality and it comes back to bite them in the *** periodically. BTW, I
don't think you can let GM management off the hook, either. The workers
didn't make the decisons to continually build crappy products and bet
the farm on gas guzzling trucks and SUVs. The shortsightedness and
environment irresponsibility of GM is amazing.
>
> As for quality issues, you get what you pay for.

Hmmm. Hyundai quality ranks right up there with Honda and Toyota, the
two best, but their prices are substantially lower. The reasons are
obvious; their costs are lower and they actually care about quality.

There's a big difference between the general asian attitude of "How can
we make it better for the price?" and the GM attitude of "How little do
we have to do to fool people into paying too much for it?" It seems that
asian companies are geared toward the thinking buyer, whereas GM has
always bet there will be enough of a "herd mentality" in the marketplace
to maintain their momentum. They were wrong.

There's a quote from Alfred P. Sloan, Jr., former President of GM that
really sums it up well. He state emphatically: "General Motors is not in
the business of making cars. General Motors is in the business of making
money!" GM has never learned that if you concentrate on the product, the
profits will naturally follow.

Brian Nystrom

Paradox wrote:
> "Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
> news:lyMgf.4653$8o6.1608@trndny03...
>
>>Paradox wrote:
>>
>>>you know hyundai just buries the cost into the price of the car
>>
>>Yet they still manage to offer lower prices and higher value than the
>>Chevys you allude to. No wonder GM is laying off 30,000 workers and
>>bankruptcy is not out of the question. If I was forced to own GM junk,
>>I'd buy an extended warranty, since it's a good bet that I'd need it.
>
>
> Apples and oranges, I doubt Hyundai employee's have as good benefits,

I guess "benefits" is a relative term. With the UAW, it seems to mean
"whatever we can force the company to give us TODAY, regardless of the
what will happen tomorrow."

As for Hyundai workers, it's not like they're working in sweatshops for
slave wages.

> alot
> easier to sell cars cheaper if you don't have alot of overhead. Unions are
> what have done GM in, forcing more and more benefits without looking at
> whats happening to the company that is supporting them. There is a rule
> about biting the hand that feeds you.

Absolutely. Unions like the UAW exist more for their own sake than for
the workers or the companies. It's about power, not workers or product
quality and it comes back to bite them in the *** periodically. BTW, I
don't think you can let GM management off the hook, either. The workers
didn't make the decisons to continually build crappy products and bet
the farm on gas guzzling trucks and SUVs. The shortsightedness and
environment irresponsibility of GM is amazing.
>
> As for quality issues, you get what you pay for.

Hmmm. Hyundai quality ranks right up there with Honda and Toyota, the
two best, but their prices are substantially lower. The reasons are
obvious; their costs are lower and they actually care about quality.

There's a big difference between the general asian attitude of "How can
we make it better for the price?" and the GM attitude of "How little do
we have to do to fool people into paying too much for it?" It seems that
asian companies are geared toward the thinking buyer, whereas GM has
always bet there will be enough of a "herd mentality" in the marketplace
to maintain their momentum. They were wrong.

There's a quote from Alfred P. Sloan, Jr., former President of GM that
really sums it up well. He state emphatically: "General Motors is not in
the business of making cars. General Motors is in the business of making
money!" GM has never learned that if you concentrate on the product, the
profits will naturally follow.

Bill Dotrie

On Tue, 15 Nov 2005 18:12:46 -0600, DaveInLakeVilla@webtv.net (Dave in
Lake Villa) wrote:

>To the consumer , 'bumper to bumper' warranty gives the impresssion that
>EVERY defective part is covered at no cost . Not so. The 2004 Santa Fe
>i bought my folks have had 2 license plate bulbs go bad within a 3 month
>period with just over 12,000 miles on the car. The Hyundai Dealer
>wanted $21 to change out the bulb because the 'bumper to bumper'
>warranty doesnt cover light bulbs. Light bulbs going bad (even the same
>one within a 3 month time frame) are not covered ; according to the
>Service Manager : " Light bulbs are considered a maintenance item". I
>say , thats fine if one goes out every 3 or 4 years...but the same one
>within 3 months at just over 12,000 miles ??? Come on.
>
>I post this just so you are aware. There are other things which the
>'bumper to bumper warranty' does not cover as well.

I must say I had no such misgivings when I bought my Hyundai.
Clearly the warranty is spelled out in plain english, all you have to
do is read the owner's manual or check the website. The reason why
your bulbs went so quickly after replacement is more than likely the
tech did not wear gloves while installing them. The bulbs have a
component that oil on your hands breaks down. Always wear gloves while
changing them... I know someone had posted before that they had clutch
trouble with their Tiburon and was SHOCKED it wasn't covered under the
50k waranty.
Come on people, if you find anyone that warranties a clutch for 50k
let me know...that is definitely considered a "wear item" (ever drove
with anyone who 'rides the clutch')?
So far I have had one recall on my Tiburon which was the positioning
of the rear brake line and had door lock issues which was covered
under the warranty. Sure, it would be nice if EVERYTHING was covered
under the "bumper to bumper" warranty but as I said, the things that
are not are cleary spelled out to the consumer and it's still a better
warranty than a Ford or GM.

Bill Dotrie

On Tue, 15 Nov 2005 18:12:46 -0600, DaveInLakeVilla@webtv.net (Dave in
Lake Villa) wrote:

>To the consumer , 'bumper to bumper' warranty gives the impresssion that
>EVERY defective part is covered at no cost . Not so. The 2004 Santa Fe
>i bought my folks have had 2 license plate bulbs go bad within a 3 month
>period with just over 12,000 miles on the car. The Hyundai Dealer
>wanted $21 to change out the bulb because the 'bumper to bumper'
>warranty doesnt cover light bulbs. Light bulbs going bad (even the same
>one within a 3 month time frame) are not covered ; according to the
>Service Manager : " Light bulbs are considered a maintenance item". I
>say , thats fine if one goes out every 3 or 4 years...but the same one
>within 3 months at just over 12,000 miles ??? Come on.
>
>I post this just so you are aware. There are other things which the
>'bumper to bumper warranty' does not cover as well.

I must say I had no such misgivings when I bought my Hyundai.
Clearly the warranty is spelled out in plain english, all you have to
do is read the owner's manual or check the website. The reason why
your bulbs went so quickly after replacement is more than likely the
tech did not wear gloves while installing them. The bulbs have a
component that oil on your hands breaks down. Always wear gloves while
changing them... I know someone had posted before that they had clutch
trouble with their Tiburon and was SHOCKED it wasn't covered under the
50k waranty.
Come on people, if you find anyone that warranties a clutch for 50k
let me know...that is definitely considered a "wear item" (ever drove
with anyone who 'rides the clutch')?
So far I have had one recall on my Tiburon which was the positioning
of the rear brake line and had door lock issues which was covered
under the warranty. Sure, it would be nice if EVERYTHING was covered
under the "bumper to bumper" warranty but as I said, the things that
are not are cleary spelled out to the consumer and it's still a better
warranty than a Ford or GM.

Paradox

Yes actually all the blame can be put on the management, they hired the
crappy designers, and allowed the unions to strong arm them into giving away
so much for so little. Mostly its a design issue though.

"Victor A. Garcia" <vgarcia1@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
newseWgf.10393$bx3.1402@tornado.tampabay.rr.com. ..
> Sorry, you got it wrong.
>
> Look at "Management" to put the blame on, not on the workers, workers do
not
> made stupid decisions like to built Plants with 200% the capacity of the
> best estimate of how many cars will be sold by GM.
> As for quality .... GM has the worse in the USA, drove a Chevy 8 months
ago
> (rental) worse piece of manure I have seen in my life.
> Got tired of problems with Fords, switched to Japs/Koreans ..... HAPPY and
> with more money in my pocket .... Detroit completely lost it.
>
> "Paradox" <parallaxaz@***.net> wrote in message
> news:9kQgf.1924$Wu.1251@fed1read05...
> >
> > "Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
> > news:lyMgf.4653$8o6.1608@trndny03...
> >> Paradox wrote:
> >> > you know hyundai just buries the cost into the price of the car
> >>
> >> Yet they still manage to offer lower prices and higher value than the
> >> Chevys you allude to. No wonder GM is laying off 30,000 workers and
> >> bankruptcy is not out of the question. If I was forced to own GM junk,
> >> I'd buy an extended warranty, since it's a good bet that I'd need it.
> >
> > Apples and oranges, I doubt Hyundai employee's have as good benefits,
alot
> > easier to sell cars cheaper if you don't have alot of overhead. Unions
are
> > what have done GM in, forcing more and more benefits without looking at
> > whats happening to the company that is supporting them. There is a rule
> > about biting the hand that feeds you.
> >
> > As for quality issues, you get what you pay for.
> >
> >
>
>

Paradox

Yes actually all the blame can be put on the management, they hired the
crappy designers, and allowed the unions to strong arm them into giving away
so much for so little. Mostly its a design issue though.

"Victor A. Garcia" <vgarcia1@tampabay.rr.com> wrote in message
newseWgf.10393$bx3.1402@tornado.tampabay.rr.com. ..
> Sorry, you got it wrong.
>
> Look at "Management" to put the blame on, not on the workers, workers do
not
> made stupid decisions like to built Plants with 200% the capacity of the
> best estimate of how many cars will be sold by GM.
> As for quality .... GM has the worse in the USA, drove a Chevy 8 months
ago
> (rental) worse piece of manure I have seen in my life.
> Got tired of problems with Fords, switched to Japs/Koreans ..... HAPPY and
> with more money in my pocket .... Detroit completely lost it.
>
> "Paradox" <parallaxaz@***.net> wrote in message
> news:9kQgf.1924$Wu.1251@fed1read05...
> >
> > "Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
> > news:lyMgf.4653$8o6.1608@trndny03...
> >> Paradox wrote:
> >> > you know hyundai just buries the cost into the price of the car
> >>
> >> Yet they still manage to offer lower prices and higher value than the
> >> Chevys you allude to. No wonder GM is laying off 30,000 workers and
> >> bankruptcy is not out of the question. If I was forced to own GM junk,
> >> I'd buy an extended warranty, since it's a good bet that I'd need it.
> >
> > Apples and oranges, I doubt Hyundai employee's have as good benefits,
alot
> > easier to sell cars cheaper if you don't have alot of overhead. Unions
are
> > what have done GM in, forcing more and more benefits without looking at
> > whats happening to the company that is supporting them. There is a rule
> > about biting the hand that feeds you.
> >
> > As for quality issues, you get what you pay for.
> >
> >
>
>

Paradox

"Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
news:dKZgf.12914$8o6.12682@trndny03...
> Paradox wrote:
> > "Brian Nystrom" <brian.nystrom@verizon.net> wrote in message
> > news:lyMgf.4653$8o6.1608@trndny03...
> >
> >>Paradox wrote:
> >>
> >>>you know hyundai just buries the cost into the price of the car
> >>
> >>Yet they still manage to offer lower prices and higher value than the
> >>Chevys you allude to. No wonder GM is laying off 30,000 workers and
> >>bankruptcy is not out of the question. If I was forced to own GM junk,
> >>I'd buy an extended warranty, since it's a good bet that I'd need it.
> >
> >
> > Apples and oranges, I doubt Hyundai employee's have as good benefits,
>
> I guess "benefits" is a relative term. With the UAW, it seems to mean
> "whatever we can force the company to give us TODAY, regardless of the
> what will happen tomorrow."

Exactly, Unions asked for too much to benefit themselves without looking at
the future to see how sustainable it would be, they looked at the company as
an enemy instead of a partner in keeping the workers happy and keeping the
company profitable.

> As for Hyundai workers, it's not like they're working in sweatshops for
> slave wages.

I'm sure they arn't, building cars requires some degree of skill.

> > alot
> > easier to sell cars cheaper if you don't have alot of overhead. Unions
are
> > what have done GM in, forcing more and more benefits without looking at
> > whats happening to the company that is supporting them. There is a rule
> > about biting the hand that feeds you.
>
> Absolutely. Unions like the UAW exist more for their own sake than for
> the workers or the companies. It's about power, not workers or product
> quality and it comes back to bite them in the *** periodically. BTW, I
> don't think you can let GM management off the hook, either. The workers
> didn't make the decisons to continually build crappy products and bet
> the farm on gas guzzling trucks and SUVs. The shortsightedness and
> environment irresponsibility of GM is amazing.

Yeah management has blown it the last 30 years or so, they should have seen
this coming in the 80's when the Japaneses started rolling out good cars.

> >
> > As for quality issues, you get what you pay for.
>
> Hmmm. Hyundai quality ranks right up there with Honda and Toyota, the
> two best, but their prices are substantially lower. The reasons are
> obvious; their costs are lower and they actually care about quality.
>

Yeah Hyundai has definately changed alot from 1995 to present, much like how
honda went from the 70's to the mid 90's to today, BIG change, its a change
that the big 3 in detroit will have to make if they expect to last to the
end of the decade.

> There's a big difference between the general asian attitude of "How can
> we make it better for the price?" and the GM attitude of "How little do
> we have to do to fool people into paying too much for it?" It seems that
> asian companies are geared toward the thinking buyer, whereas GM has
> always bet there will be enough of a "herd mentality" in the marketplace
> to maintain their momentum. They were wrong.
>
> There's a quote from Alfred P. Sloan, Jr., former President of GM that
> really sums it up well. He state emphatically: "General Motors is not in
> the business of making cars. General Motors is in the business of making
> money!" GM has never learned that if you concentrate on the product, the
> profits will naturally follow.
>

Every company is in the business to make money, GM just didn't look to the
long term "how can we make money today and tommorow and into the forseable
future? not counting service work on the old cars that were sold, hmm wait
thats why things break..