expensive

In article <3F289927.86AF51C6@spam.now>, Eric <say.no@spam.now> wrote:

> Had you shopped around, you would have had other choices. The ignitor can be
> obtained new from Honda for $150, http://tinyurl.com/il7p. Other options
> might
> have included buying one from a wrecking yard or from someone parting out
> their
> wrecked car. Why, you probably could've picked up an entire used distributor
> for one of those units for $20.

It's been several years since I saw an '81 Honda in a wrecking yard.
They've all been crushed, melted down, and have gone to meet their
maker (or some other car maker).

I don't have time to shop the Internet for parts when the car is
broken. Besides, I have a long-term relationship with my mechanic and
would not think to save $50 off him. It's a pay me now pay me later
thing, if you know what I mean.

> It is unfortunate that the sales manager laughed. That's no way to treat
people
> who are their bread and butter.

Honda will pay for that. Not in terms of the billions they rake in,
but in my terms -- one car at a time over the long haul. Obviously the
guy did not consider me to be a future prospect. He will never know
it, but I will undo a few sales for him before he ever gets a whiff of
them. I am reminded of the dealer arrogance of the 1960's when the
American manufacturers thought they could pawn anything off on the
public. It's no coincidence that that was the time when I my first
import and said goodbye to Detroit forever.

expensive

In article <3F289927.86AF51C6@spam.now>, Eric <say.no@spam.now> wrote:

> Had you shopped around, you would have had other choices. The ignitor can be
> obtained new from Honda for $150, http://tinyurl.com/il7p. Other options
> might
> have included buying one from a wrecking yard or from someone parting out
> their
> wrecked car. Why, you probably could've picked up an entire used distributor
> for one of those units for $20.

It's been several years since I saw an '81 Honda in a wrecking yard.
They've all been crushed, melted down, and have gone to meet their
maker (or some other car maker).

I don't have time to shop the Internet for parts when the car is
broken. Besides, I have a long-term relationship with my mechanic and
would not think to save $50 off him. It's a pay me now pay me later
thing, if you know what I mean.

> It is unfortunate that the sales manager laughed. That's no way to treat
people
> who are their bread and butter.

Honda will pay for that. Not in terms of the billions they rake in,
but in my terms -- one car at a time over the long haul. Obviously the
guy did not consider me to be a future prospect. He will never know
it, but I will undo a few sales for him before he ever gets a whiff of
them. I am reminded of the dealer arrogance of the 1960's when the
American manufacturers thought they could pawn anything off on the
public. It's no coincidence that that was the time when I my first
import and said goodbye to Detroit forever.

expensive

In article <bo1Wa.14905$2l1.1386@news02.roc.ny>, Dave M.
<gadget@frontiernet.net> wrote:

> That part should not ever fail for the life of the car, but you should tally
> the cost of maintanence to this point. My gripe would be the reliability
> failure. Your not supposed to get stuck in a Honda.

I'm neither happy nor unhappy with the cost of maintenance so far.
It's always sapping but not killing me, sort of like a tapeworm. I've
had to purchase expensive parts before, but I've never felt truly
ripped off like I do this time. These are hard times for me. $193 for
a $27 part and embarrassing treatment by the sales manager was just a
bit much for me to bear. I think I got drilled pretty good by Honda,
and it's going to take a long time to get over it.

expensive

In article <bo1Wa.14905$2l1.1386@news02.roc.ny>, Dave M.
<gadget@frontiernet.net> wrote:

> That part should not ever fail for the life of the car, but you should tally
> the cost of maintanence to this point. My gripe would be the reliability
> failure. Your not supposed to get stuck in a Honda.

I'm neither happy nor unhappy with the cost of maintenance so far.
It's always sapping but not killing me, sort of like a tapeworm. I've
had to purchase expensive parts before, but I've never felt truly
ripped off like I do this time. These are hard times for me. $193 for
a $27 part and embarrassing treatment by the sales manager was just a
bit much for me to bear. I think I got drilled pretty good by Honda,
and it's going to take a long time to get over it.

Max

> I reject your analysis. It's a derivative of my comparison, which
> doubles any error. As a matter of fact, the part has a steel plate on
> the bottom, steel sleeves, and several metal electrodes and connectors,
> not to mention having been filled/sealed with some sort of resin. My
> comparison is just fine, thank you. Even a 50% error still makes the
> part outrageously expensive.

LOL. You REALLY missed the point. Sense of humor and sarcasm are clearly too
expensive for your taste as well. :-)

> Apple computers are great. A lot of people who work with IBM
> compatibles go home to Macs. Very few people who work with Macs go
> home to an IBM compatible. I like 'em. I've never used an IBM
> compatible, mainly because I see my friends struggle with them. No
> thanks.

So it is ok for Apple to "rip you off" because you like them? How
hypocritical of you.

Look, in all seriousness, things are worth what people are willing to pay
for them. You are willing to pay $2400 for a computer even though a
comprable machine can be bought for half the cost, because you like it
better. It has nothing to do with size or weight. My company produces
software that weighs nothing (ok, you can count weight of the CD we could
theoretically put it on) and we sell it for millions of dollars - and we
have buyers because they believe it is worth it. If $200 part was not worth
it to you, you should have bought the $60 aftermarket part and installed it
yourself. You had a choice, but you paid for it, which means it was worth it
to you at the time. Do not kid yourself, this has NOTHING to do with Honda
or any other car maker. You are just bitter you had something break on you,
even though it happened after 22 years of use (and all things considered,
did not cost that much.) You are bitter you did not have towing coverage.
But get over yourself, cuz happens. The bottom line is that if your car
was of any other make, it would have been a similar price. This has nothing
to do with Honda. I am sure Honda's prices are not any different that any
other maker. And yes, the dealer parts will always cost more than
aftermarket parts, because for them the cost of that part is not the just
the cost of the materials and manufacturing - it's the millions of dollars
that went into the design. Grow up and take some responsibility.

-M

Max

> I reject your analysis. It's a derivative of my comparison, which
> doubles any error. As a matter of fact, the part has a steel plate on
> the bottom, steel sleeves, and several metal electrodes and connectors,
> not to mention having been filled/sealed with some sort of resin. My
> comparison is just fine, thank you. Even a 50% error still makes the
> part outrageously expensive.

LOL. You REALLY missed the point. Sense of humor and sarcasm are clearly too
expensive for your taste as well. :-)

> Apple computers are great. A lot of people who work with IBM
> compatibles go home to Macs. Very few people who work with Macs go
> home to an IBM compatible. I like 'em. I've never used an IBM
> compatible, mainly because I see my friends struggle with them. No
> thanks.

So it is ok for Apple to "rip you off" because you like them? How
hypocritical of you.

Look, in all seriousness, things are worth what people are willing to pay
for them. You are willing to pay $2400 for a computer even though a
comprable machine can be bought for half the cost, because you like it
better. It has nothing to do with size or weight. My company produces
software that weighs nothing (ok, you can count weight of the CD we could
theoretically put it on) and we sell it for millions of dollars - and we
have buyers because they believe it is worth it. If $200 part was not worth
it to you, you should have bought the $60 aftermarket part and installed it
yourself. You had a choice, but you paid for it, which means it was worth it
to you at the time. Do not kid yourself, this has NOTHING to do with Honda
or any other car maker. You are just bitter you had something break on you,
even though it happened after 22 years of use (and all things considered,
did not cost that much.) You are bitter you did not have towing coverage.
But get over yourself, cuz happens. The bottom line is that if your car
was of any other make, it would have been a similar price. This has nothing
to do with Honda. I am sure Honda's prices are not any different that any
other maker. And yes, the dealer parts will always cost more than
aftermarket parts, because for them the cost of that part is not the just
the cost of the materials and manufacturing - it's the millions of dollars
that went into the design. Grow up and take some responsibility.

-M

'Curly Q. Links'

expensive wrote:
>
> In article <bo1Wa.14905$2l1.1386@news02.roc.ny>, Dave M.
> <gadget@frontiernet.net> wrote:
>
> > That part should not ever fail for the life of the car, but you should tally
> > the cost of maintanence to this point. My gripe would be the reliability
> > failure. Your not supposed to get stuck in a Honda.
>
> I'm neither happy nor unhappy with the cost of maintenance so far.
> It's always sapping but not killing me, sort of like a tapeworm. I've
> had to purchase expensive parts before, but I've never felt truly
> ripped off like I do this time. These are hard times for me. $193 for
> a $27 part and embarrassing treatment by the sales manager was just a
> bit much for me to bear. I think I got drilled pretty good by Honda,
> and it's going to take a long time to get over it.

------------------------------
That guy's response sould be rewarded with a 21 gun salute, with
blindfold, at dawn. But I think it's a credit that you were able to even
GET the part you needed in a timely fashion, for a car of that age. I'm
not saying that your car is THAT old, just that lots of car makers
wouldn't have been able to come up with that part at all. I agree it is
awfully expensive, though. 'Curly'

------------------------------
--

To REPLY: You must remove two underscores from the return address to
reply directly . . . . . .

Regarding stage performances: When everyone else has finished playing,
you should not play any notes you have left over. -

'Curly Q. Links'

expensive wrote:
>
> In article <bo1Wa.14905$2l1.1386@news02.roc.ny>, Dave M.
> <gadget@frontiernet.net> wrote:
>
> > That part should not ever fail for the life of the car, but you should tally
> > the cost of maintanence to this point. My gripe would be the reliability
> > failure. Your not supposed to get stuck in a Honda.
>
> I'm neither happy nor unhappy with the cost of maintenance so far.
> It's always sapping but not killing me, sort of like a tapeworm. I've
> had to purchase expensive parts before, but I've never felt truly
> ripped off like I do this time. These are hard times for me. $193 for
> a $27 part and embarrassing treatment by the sales manager was just a
> bit much for me to bear. I think I got drilled pretty good by Honda,
> and it's going to take a long time to get over it.

------------------------------
That guy's response sould be rewarded with a 21 gun salute, with
blindfold, at dawn. But I think it's a credit that you were able to even
GET the part you needed in a timely fashion, for a car of that age. I'm
not saying that your car is THAT old, just that lots of car makers
wouldn't have been able to come up with that part at all. I agree it is
awfully expensive, though. 'Curly'

------------------------------
--

To REPLY: You must remove two underscores from the return address to
reply directly . . . . . .

Regarding stage performances: When everyone else has finished playing,
you should not play any notes you have left over. -

SusanR

what about a couple having trouble conceiving a baby and going for in vitro
fertilization? For about a fraction of an ounce of sperm and a speck of an
egg the couple will pay $15,000 and up.

you can't judge the cost of a part on its weight, that's patently
ridiculous!

I once had to have the motor mounts replaced on my old Nissan.

They're just a tiny piece of metal sandwiched between two pieces of rubber
but only available from the dealer. One of them was $93.

its not just the mileage on a car, its also the age.


--
SusanR
sam3r@msn.com
"Max" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:BS%Va.6790$dk4.315872@typhoon.sonic.net...
> This is about the funniest thing I've heard in a while.
>
> Putting aside the ignorant ridiculousness of comparing completely
unrelated
> items based on weight, consider this:
>
> In your apple laptop most of the weight is the battery, LCD, case,
keyboard
> etc.
>
> Actuall electronics are probably less then 10 ounces, not even, but we'll
> stick to 10 ounces. Divide 10 by 1.25 you get 8, so divide your 2400 by 8
> you get $300. Now you are twice the idiot because Apple clearly ripped you
> off too. Never buy Apple computers again!!!
>
> Then for kicks and gigles ask how much similar part costs for any other
> make.
>
> Looks like you are walking from now on.
>
> -M
>
>
>
> "expensive" <common_sense@emodgnik.com> wrote in message
> news:300720031914480532%common_sense@emodgnik.com. ..
> >
> > I'm very angry. And for good cause.
> >
> > While zooming along the freeway in my '81 Honda (my second Honda, which
> > has 109,000 miles on it), I suddenly lost power. After a $100 tow, the
> > Honda mechanic replaced the igniter. I didn't know what it was, so it
> > was explained to me that it replaces the points.
> >
> > Okay, so the repair bill was $193 for just the part! It's a little
> > sucka that ain't much bigger than your average rotor. After getting
> > home, I took the old igniter and pulled off a little cap to see what
> > was inside. Just a few electronic components not much unlike the kind
> > I see in computers.
> >
> > The whole gizmo with the cap on weighs 1.25 ounces. Comparing with my
> > notebook computer at 7 pounds, that's 7 pounds times 16 ounces = 112
> > ounces; divided by 1.25 ounces I get a factor of close to 90. 90 times
> > $193 comes to approximately $17,000.
> >
> > That's pretty astounding. And I thought Apple computers were
> > expensive! Listen, my Apple notebook, a marvel of miniaturization, was
> > $2,400. Dividing $2,400 by 90 I get about $27, which seems like a
> > reasonable price for the part.
> >
> > So how does Honda figure they can both sell outrageously expensive
> > parts like this while, at the same time, keep customers? I went into
> > the sales room and confronted the sales manager with the part and the
> > price. He simply laughed.
> >
> > There is no way I will ever buy another Honda. I don't care what the
> > price is for parts for the next car (my last car, when I retire), Honda
> > is not on my shopping list. And something the manufacturer does not
> > count on... I will carry that part on my dashboard as a conversation
> > piece. I should be able to turn a few people away from Honda with it.
> > It shouldn't make much of a dent in Honda's sales, but, as everyone
> > knows, the landscape is littered with the corpses of companies that
> > abused their customers.
> >
> > $193 for a $27 part, indeed! That's abusive!
>
>

SusanR

what about a couple having trouble conceiving a baby and going for in vitro
fertilization? For about a fraction of an ounce of sperm and a speck of an
egg the couple will pay $15,000 and up.

you can't judge the cost of a part on its weight, that's patently
ridiculous!

I once had to have the motor mounts replaced on my old Nissan.

They're just a tiny piece of metal sandwiched between two pieces of rubber
but only available from the dealer. One of them was $93.

its not just the mileage on a car, its also the age.


--
SusanR
sam3r@msn.com
"Max" <nospam@nospam.com> wrote in message
news:BS%Va.6790$dk4.315872@typhoon.sonic.net...
> This is about the funniest thing I've heard in a while.
>
> Putting aside the ignorant ridiculousness of comparing completely
unrelated
> items based on weight, consider this:
>
> In your apple laptop most of the weight is the battery, LCD, case,
keyboard
> etc.
>
> Actuall electronics are probably less then 10 ounces, not even, but we'll
> stick to 10 ounces. Divide 10 by 1.25 you get 8, so divide your 2400 by 8
> you get $300. Now you are twice the idiot because Apple clearly ripped you
> off too. Never buy Apple computers again!!!
>
> Then for kicks and gigles ask how much similar part costs for any other
> make.
>
> Looks like you are walking from now on.
>
> -M
>
>
>
> "expensive" <common_sense@emodgnik.com> wrote in message
> news:300720031914480532%common_sense@emodgnik.com. ..
> >
> > I'm very angry. And for good cause.
> >
> > While zooming along the freeway in my '81 Honda (my second Honda, which
> > has 109,000 miles on it), I suddenly lost power. After a $100 tow, the
> > Honda mechanic replaced the igniter. I didn't know what it was, so it
> > was explained to me that it replaces the points.
> >
> > Okay, so the repair bill was $193 for just the part! It's a little
> > sucka that ain't much bigger than your average rotor. After getting
> > home, I took the old igniter and pulled off a little cap to see what
> > was inside. Just a few electronic components not much unlike the kind
> > I see in computers.
> >
> > The whole gizmo with the cap on weighs 1.25 ounces. Comparing with my
> > notebook computer at 7 pounds, that's 7 pounds times 16 ounces = 112
> > ounces; divided by 1.25 ounces I get a factor of close to 90. 90 times
> > $193 comes to approximately $17,000.
> >
> > That's pretty astounding. And I thought Apple computers were
> > expensive! Listen, my Apple notebook, a marvel of miniaturization, was
> > $2,400. Dividing $2,400 by 90 I get about $27, which seems like a
> > reasonable price for the part.
> >
> > So how does Honda figure they can both sell outrageously expensive
> > parts like this while, at the same time, keep customers? I went into
> > the sales room and confronted the sales manager with the part and the
> > price. He simply laughed.
> >
> > There is no way I will ever buy another Honda. I don't care what the
> > price is for parts for the next car (my last car, when I retire), Honda
> > is not on my shopping list. And something the manufacturer does not
> > count on... I will carry that part on my dashboard as a conversation
> > piece. I should be able to turn a few people away from Honda with it.
> > It shouldn't make much of a dent in Honda's sales, but, as everyone
> > knows, the landscape is littered with the corpses of companies that
> > abused their customers.
> >
> > $193 for a $27 part, indeed! That's abusive!
>
>

SusanR

was this just for the part or part plus labor?

--
SusanR
sam3r@msn.com
"expensive" <common_sense@emodgnik.com> wrote in message
news:300720032141583514%common_sense@emodgnik.com. ..
> In article <3F288D9B.3B45EC11@junkmail.com>, Randolph
> <trash@junkmail.com> wrote:
>
> > So you have gotten 22 years of use out of the Honda, and you are
> > bitching laying out $200 for a part?
>
> No, it's given me good service despite the fact that it was a bad year
> for paint and has rust spots all over. I don't care how it looks,
> though. I have noticed that parts are expensive, but I've lived with
> it. It's hard to tolerate $193 for a $27 part that only had a few
> diodes in it, though. And it should not burn out after only 110,000
> miles.
>
> But remember, I have mentioned that 22 years is irrelevant. It's miles
> that count. Mechanically, it's perfect because I take it to a Honda
> mechanic regularly and tell him "Do what has to be done to make it safe
> and reliable." It had ALL of the required warranty-type service done
> by the book.
>
> I will vote with my $$$. Some other manufacturer gets my business for
> my retirement (last) car. I wonder if someone at Honda wondered if the
> high price on that part would prevent a sale. Or that the offended
> buyer of that part would try to prevent other sales. I am not easily
> offended, but I am hell on wings when it happens.
>
> On the other hand, is it possible that Honda intended the part to be
> $19.30 and not $193.00. The igniter really does look like a $19.30
> part. If so, then Honda needs to get back to me (here, soon) with a
> refund offer because I intend to cost them a heck of a lot more than
> they cost me.

SusanR

was this just for the part or part plus labor?

--
SusanR
sam3r@msn.com
"expensive" <common_sense@emodgnik.com> wrote in message
news:300720032141583514%common_sense@emodgnik.com. ..
> In article <3F288D9B.3B45EC11@junkmail.com>, Randolph
> <trash@junkmail.com> wrote:
>
> > So you have gotten 22 years of use out of the Honda, and you are
> > bitching laying out $200 for a part?
>
> No, it's given me good service despite the fact that it was a bad year
> for paint and has rust spots all over. I don't care how it looks,
> though. I have noticed that parts are expensive, but I've lived with
> it. It's hard to tolerate $193 for a $27 part that only had a few
> diodes in it, though. And it should not burn out after only 110,000
> miles.
>
> But remember, I have mentioned that 22 years is irrelevant. It's miles
> that count. Mechanically, it's perfect because I take it to a Honda
> mechanic regularly and tell him "Do what has to be done to make it safe
> and reliable." It had ALL of the required warranty-type service done
> by the book.
>
> I will vote with my $$$. Some other manufacturer gets my business for
> my retirement (last) car. I wonder if someone at Honda wondered if the
> high price on that part would prevent a sale. Or that the offended
> buyer of that part would try to prevent other sales. I am not easily
> offended, but I am hell on wings when it happens.
>
> On the other hand, is it possible that Honda intended the part to be
> $19.30 and not $193.00. The igniter really does look like a $19.30
> part. If so, then Honda needs to get back to me (here, soon) with a
> refund offer because I intend to cost them a heck of a lot more than
> they cost me.

Max

>
> The arrogance of the dealer really put me off as much as the cost of
> the part. Someone who sells something should not laugh at the anguish
> of a customer. Until a few days ago, I'd planned my last car to be a
> Honda. Not any more.
>

I think him laughing at you had less to do with the cost of the part, and
more to do with what you were saying. Of course I wasn't there, and it is
just a guess.

Of course if you want a fun dealer experience, buy a dodge. It's a kind of a
"once in a lifetime" mistake. And I quote the dealer: "That backfire-type
noise you keep mentioning is actually a normal function of the afterburners"
I almost fell off the chair when he told this to me. I never knew there was
an F-16 Dakota. Plus another gem: "Well, since it took us over a week to
figure out what was wrong and clean up the aluminum chips from the oil pump
that broke into pieces and got into the oil and thus into the engine, and
Dodge extended warranty you purchased on this brand new truck only pays for
3 days labor for such an event, so you owe us..." - he never got to finish
THAT sentence.

-M

Max

>
> The arrogance of the dealer really put me off as much as the cost of
> the part. Someone who sells something should not laugh at the anguish
> of a customer. Until a few days ago, I'd planned my last car to be a
> Honda. Not any more.
>

I think him laughing at you had less to do with the cost of the part, and
more to do with what you were saying. Of course I wasn't there, and it is
just a guess.

Of course if you want a fun dealer experience, buy a dodge. It's a kind of a
"once in a lifetime" mistake. And I quote the dealer: "That backfire-type
noise you keep mentioning is actually a normal function of the afterburners"
I almost fell off the chair when he told this to me. I never knew there was
an F-16 Dakota. Plus another gem: "Well, since it took us over a week to
figure out what was wrong and clean up the aluminum chips from the oil pump
that broke into pieces and got into the oil and thus into the engine, and
Dodge extended warranty you purchased on this brand new truck only pays for
3 days labor for such an event, so you owe us..." - he never got to finish
THAT sentence.

-M

Den and Barb

I have tried to follow this thread and have yet to read "WHY" a $28. part
retails for $193.
You see, the "parts business" is one of the most lucrative businesses
around. ALL auto parts are subject to the rule of "doubling". The
manufacturer of the part (a Honda subcontractor) charges his normal selling
price plus at least 100% since this is a "spare" part. (This is true of ALL
auto parts suppliers.) Then add another 100% for the factory markup; then
another 100% for the dealer markup.
Therefore $193. /2 /2 /2 = $24.+ which is the price of the part that the
manufacturer paid on the assembly line. The only modifier to this universal
gouging is when some independent manufacturer begins making similar
replacement parts because there's money to be made e.g. brake pads, air/oil
filters, etc. This forces everyone on the gravy train to restructure their
pricing to be competitive.
Obviously, the Honda rotor is not replaced often enough to entice someone to
make their own replacement part. I paid $20.+ for a PCV valve which was no
available at Wal-Mart. Wal-Mart had a shelf full of other car makes for
under $5.
Bottom line, it's the way capitalism works, if you need prescription drugs
it's gonna cost you. If you want a infrequently replaced part it's gonna
cost you. If you shoot all of the "gougers" you will be living alone.

"expensive" <common_sense@emodgnik.com> wrote in message
news:300720032225491946%common_sense@emodgnik.com. ..
> In article <3F289927.86AF51C6@spam.now>, Eric <say.no@spam.now> wrote:
>
> > Had you shopped around, you would have had other choices. The ignitor
can be
> > obtained new from Honda for $150, http://tinyurl.com/il7p. Other
options
> > might
> > have included buying one from a wrecking yard or from someone parting
out
> > their
> > wrecked car. Why, you probably could've picked up an entire used
distributor
> > for one of those units for $20.
>
> It's been several years since I saw an '81 Honda in a wrecking yard.
> They've all been crushed, melted down, and have gone to meet their
> maker (or some other car maker).
>
> I don't have time to shop the Internet for parts when the car is
> broken. Besides, I have a long-term relationship with my mechanic and
> would not think to save $50 off him. It's a pay me now pay me later
> thing, if you know what I mean.
>
> > It is unfortunate that the sales manager laughed. That's no way to
treat
> people
> > who are their bread and butter.
>
> Honda will pay for that. Not in terms of the billions they rake in,
> but in my terms -- one car at a time over the long haul. Obviously the
> guy did not consider me to be a future prospect. He will never know
> it, but I will undo a few sales for him before he ever gets a whiff of
> them. I am reminded of the dealer arrogance of the 1960's when the
> American manufacturers thought they could pawn anything off on the
> public. It's no coincidence that that was the time when I my first
> import and said goodbye to Detroit forever.