Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

My 98 DX Hatch has 280,000KM, original PCV valve (everything else under
the hood is still original...except timing belt, spark plug and air
filter). The car's been a regular beater since new and usually kisses
the Redline when in first or 2nd gear.

For the past 3 years, I've extended the oil change interval from
every 5000km to every 15,000km. The car looses about a quart every
3000km (less when not driven aggressively or during winter). Since the
Mobel-1 gets very expensive from constantly topping up (costing
$8/quart), I've since switched to Mobel-1 0w40 (instead of 5w30), in
the hopes that the heavier oil will reduce oil loss. It seems to work.
In my last oil change, I did about 20,000km and only needed 2 quarts
for topping up (normally, it should be twice as much).

The only downfall from having a base engine that's completely
broken-in for aggressive driving, is that upgraded to a more power full
GSR engine is unnecessary. I guess I'll have to content with the
public's assumption that I have something much more powerful under
the hood.

Pars

Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

Michael Pardee wrote:
> "SoCalMike" <Mikein562athotmail@hotmail.com> wrote in message
> news:Q-qdnanv4tPFRlTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@comcast.com...
>> merlotbrougham@hotmail.com wrote:
>>> After all's said and done, probably peace of mind. There's no doubt
>>> that synthetics and their additives are superior to dino oil, but I
>>> don't know anyone who's had problems due to the oil either as long as
>>> it's changed at relatively decent intervals.
>>
>> did toyota ever find out what was behind the "sludging" problem?
>
> They identified a design problem with the baffles in the valve cover as
> being the trigger for a more complex situation involving too much heat
> difference between the lower levels of the lubrication system and the oil
> under the valve cover. IIRC a redesigned valve cover was the fix. Toyota

oil gets hot, valve cover gets hotter. oil splashes on valve cover,
vapors attract on valve cover, both bake and get sludgy. sludge drops
down, impedes flow through pump strainer screen, etc? makes sense.

> maintained to the last that the problem was never documented in any engine
> that strictly followed their oil change schedule, leading to speculation
> that the margin of tolerance for oil changes was oo close for the V6.

i heard some 4s were involved too. and ill bet a lot of em were just off
lease :)
>
> Unfortunately, I didn't save the link on that.
>
> Mike
>
>

Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

Elle wrote:
> If I didn't have time and had money to throw away, I'd be a
> lot more open to switching to synthetic.

theres always walmart synthetic- $12 for a 5qt jug.

Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

pars wrote:
> $8/quart), I've since switched to Mobel-1 0w40 (instead of 5w30),

is that the stuff that had a red cap, now its yellow? is it labelled
"energy conserving", aka: has the starburst symbol?

Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

"SoCalMike" <Mikein562athotmail@hotmail.com> wrote
> Elle wrote:
> > If I didn't have time and had money to throw away, I'd
be a
> > lot more open to switching to synthetic.
>
> theres always walmart synthetic- $12 for a 5qt jug.

I meant that if I had money to throw away on the (apparently
only) outside possibility that there'd be a serious seal
failure, then I'd probably go for it.

Otherwise, I agree the price of the synthetic oil itself is
probably justified, given that it will require less frequent
oil changes.

Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

"SoCalMike" <Mikein562athotmail@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:YZydnSDZcqeOaVfenZ2dnUVZ_tadnZ2d@comcast.com. ..
> Michael Pardee wrote:
>> "SoCalMike" <Mikein562athotmail@hotmail.com> wrote in message
>> news:Q-qdnanv4tPFRlTenZ2dnUVZ_tydnZ2d@comcast.com...
>>> merlotbrougham@hotmail.com wrote:
>>>> After all's said and done, probably peace of mind. There's no doubt
>>>> that synthetics and their additives are superior to dino oil, but I
>>>> don't know anyone who's had problems due to the oil either as long as
>>>> it's changed at relatively decent intervals.
>>>
>>> did toyota ever find out what was behind the "sludging" problem?
>>
>> They identified a design problem with the baffles in the valve cover as
>> being the trigger for a more complex situation involving too much heat
>> difference between the lower levels of the lubrication system and the oil
>> under the valve cover. IIRC a redesigned valve cover was the fix. Toyota
>
> oil gets hot, valve cover gets hotter. oil splashes on valve cover, vapors
> attract on valve cover, both bake and get sludgy. sludge drops down,
> impedes flow through pump strainer screen, etc? makes sense.
>
>> maintained to the last that the problem was never documented in any
>> engine that strictly followed their oil change schedule, leading to
>> speculation that the margin of tolerance for oil changes was oo close for
>> the V6.
>
> i heard some 4s were involved too. and ill bet a lot of em were just off
> lease :)

From a link on TeGGeR's FAQs: http://www.yotarepair.com/Sludge_Zone.html

Mike

Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

i found Amsoil at the local Canadian Tire (canadian version of i guess
walmart but we have those too).

$10 a liter though, wow....
t

Rob B wrote:
>> <snip gibberish>
>> >
>[quoted text clipped - 7 lines]
>> youthful posters who think it's cool or avant garde, but which I find
>> unimpressive.
>
>well i consider myself youthful (in spirit) but that is relative and i am
>certainly not cool i am just practical / lazy
>
>i am a three finger typist, finding shift with pinky and then hunting for
>the letter causes 2 problems (1) too much time or (2) hitting caps lock ,
>then backspace alot and start again which violates problem 1
>
>also an unfortunate problem derived from my early carreer, a problem not
>unlike those old draftsmen engineers that write everything in CAPITAL BLOCK
>LETTERS
>
>> > Ah yes, there is the information i had requested in the
>> > original posting to this news group. Castrol GTX 5w30 is the oil you
>[quoted text clipped - 6 lines]
>> various oils done by Consumer Reports about about fifteen years ago.
>> Castrol GTX was one of the top-rated oils in those tests.
>
>i was going by some recent oil study surveys showing propeties such as
>viscocity index, thermal break down (flash) and formulation additives
>viscocity improvers, ( Eg Mobil 1 and Amsoil uses no viscocity improver
>additives in the 5w30 and 10w30 oils)
>
>high on list were... Amsoil, Red Line, Mobil 1, Castrol GTX
>
>could not find Amsoil or Red Lne local but Mobil 1 can be found at wally
>world
>
>> Surely things have changed since then, as oil formulations now are rather
>> different than they were in 1991. Engine metallurgy is not greatly changed
>[quoted text clipped - 11 lines]
>>
>> Don't I sound more coherent this morning?
>
>yes, welcome back ;)
>I am thinking of kicking the synthetic habit , hope my asphalt chariot does
>not get withdrawl symptoms
>thanks for the info
>robb

--
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Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

isn't tech 2000 (walmart brand) made by safety kleen? and arent they a used
oil recycler? just wondering if the stuff with the walmart label is in fact
reconditioned used oil??

i have no data to back that up, but dealt with safety kleen in my former
employ with a company that used them to dispose of hazardous waste.
(Furniture factory, our old used rags and sludge in the paint shop).

t

SoCalMike wrote:
>> If I didn't have time and had money to throw away, I'd be a
>> lot more open to switching to synthetic.
>
>theres always walmart synthetic- $12 for a 5qt jug.

--
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http://www.carkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx...-cars/200601/1

Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

"Elle" <honda.lioness@earthlink.net> wrote in message
news:dGCyf.7997$ZA2.4620@newsread1.news.atl.earthl ink.net...
>
> I meant that if I had money to throw away on the (apparently
> only) outside possibility that there'd be a serious seal
> failure, then I'd probably go for it.
>
> Otherwise, I agree the price of the synthetic oil itself is
> probably justified, given that it will require less frequent
> oil changes.
>
>

I sure understand that. The risk/benefit on changing to synthetic really
isn't compelling on an older engine.

Mike

Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

"T L via CarKB.com" <u10197@uwe> wrote in message news:5a6cacfeb4eae@uwe...
>
> isn't tech 2000 (walmart brand) made by safety kleen? and arent they a
used
> oil recycler? just wondering if the stuff with the walmart label is in
fact
> reconditioned used oil??
>

from what i understand of synthetic oil production that would be probably
be a cheap way to get the base oil used to mfg the synthetic, i presume they
send it back through a refinement process to gather the base oil used for
various grades and since it is engineered oil then the oil produced is
probably not suspect ( ? )

>
> i have no data to back that up, but dealt with safety kleen in my former
> employ with a company that used them to dispose of hazardous waste.
> (Furniture factory, our old used rags and sludge in the paint shop).
>
> t
>
> SoCalMike wrote:
> >> If I didn't have time and had money to throw away, I'd be a
> >> lot more open to switching to synthetic.
> >
> >theres always walmart synthetic- $12 for a 5qt jug.

robb

Make synthetic from recycled oil
 

> Date: Mon, Jan 16 2006 3:55 am
> From: "Rob B"
>
> > Date: Mon, Jan 16 2006 3:54 am
> > From: "T L via CarKB.com"
> >
> > isn't tech 2000 (walmart brand) made by safety kleen?
> > and arent they a used oil recycler? just wondering if
> > the stuff with the walmart label is in fact
> > reconditioned used oil??
>
> from what i understand of synthetic oil production
> that would be probably be a cheap way to get the base
> oil used to mfg the synthetic, i presume they send it
> back through a refinement process to gather the base
> oil used for various grades and since it is engineered
> oil then the oil produced is probably not suspect ( ? )


?? What does this mean? Make synthetic from recycled oil?

Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

"Rob B" <RobB@where.on.net> wrote in
news:xQLyf.41$rH5.32@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink. net:

>>
>
> from what i understand of synthetic oil production that would be
> probably be a cheap way to get the base oil used to mfg the synthetic,



It is extremely expensive to recover post-consumer motor oil, just like
it's extremely expensive to recover *anything* post-consumer except
aluminum. That would NOT be a "cheap way" to acquire a base stock. Unless
you ignore the millions it will/would cost in tax monies that are/would be
required to cajole refineries into taking the stuff.



> i presume they send it back through a refinement process to gather
> the base oil used for various grades and since it is engineered oil
> then the oil produced is probably not suspect ( ? )



It's the re-refinement that IS suspect, since some re-refining is done
better than others.


--
TeGGeR®

The Unofficial Honda/Acura FAQ
www.tegger.com/hondafaq/

Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

still the question: is Tech 2000 (walmart Brand) recycled? I don't think
Safety Kleen is in the oil refining business.....

TeGGeR® wrote:
>> from what i understand of synthetic oil production that would be
>> probably be a cheap way to get the base oil used to mfg the synthetic,
>
>It is extremely expensive to recover post-consumer motor oil, just like
>it's extremely expensive to recover *anything* post-consumer except
>aluminum. That would NOT be a "cheap way" to acquire a base stock. Unless
>you ignore the millions it will/would cost in tax monies that are/would be
>required to cajole refineries into taking the stuff.
>
>> i presume they send it back through a refinement process to gather
>> the base oil used for various grades and since it is engineered oil
>> then the oil produced is probably not suspect ( ? )
>
>It's the re-refinement that IS suspect, since some re-refining is done
>better than others.
>

--
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http://www.carkb.com/Uwe/Forums.aspx...-cars/200601/1

Re: poll - high mileage civics, what oil U burn ?
 

"TeGGeR®" <tegger@tegger.c0m> wrote in message
news:Xns974D9499EC770tegger@207.14.113.17...
> "Rob B" <RobB@where.on.net> wrote in
> news:xQLyf.41$rH5.32@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink. net:
> >
> > from what i understand of synthetic oil production that would be
> > probably be a cheap way to get the base oil used to mfg the synthetic
>
> It is extremely expensive to recover post-consumer motor oil, just like
> it's extremely expensive to recover *anything* post-consumer except
> aluminum. That would NOT be a "cheap way" to acquire a base stock. Unless
> you ignore the millions it will/would cost in tax monies that are/would be
> required to cajole refineries into taking the stuff.
>

well by cheap i mean a recycler probably does not have to pay for the used
oil as in buying crude or derivatives at some cost per barrel and may even
get some incentive or payed for recycling.

i do not know what if any cleansing would be required before the refining
process to remove various contaminants ?

anyways it sounded like an interesting idea, "synthetic mfg from recycling
used oil"

>
> > i presume they send it back through a refinement process to gather
> > the base oil used for various grades and since it is engineered oil
> > then the oil produced is probably not suspect ( ? )
>
> It's the re-refinement that IS suspect, since some re-refining is done
> better than others.
>
well ok i concur with that point, and i am wondering what is in the walmart
labeled synthetic ?

Make synthetic from recycled oil
 

> Date: Mon, Jan 16 2006 3:55 am
> From: "Rob B"
>
> > Date: Mon, Jan 16 2006 3:54 am
> > From: "T L via CarKB.com"
> >
> > isn't tech 2000 (walmart brand) made by safety kleen?
> > and arent they a used oil recycler? just wondering if
> > the stuff with the walmart label is in fact
> > reconditioned used oil??
>
> from what i understand of synthetic oil production
> that would be probably be a cheap way to get the base
> oil used to mfg the synthetic, i presume they send it
> back through a refinement process to gather the base
> oil used for various grades and since it is engineered
> oil then the oil produced is probably not suspect ( ? )



> Date: Mon, Jan 16 2006 3:12 pm
> From: "Rob B"
snip
> well by cheap i mean a recycler probably does not have
> to pay for the used oil as in buying crude or
> derivatives at some cost per barrel and may even get
> some incentive or payed for recycling.
>
> i do not know what if any cleansing would be required
> before the refining process to remove various
> contaminants ?
>
> anyways it sounded like an interesting idea, "synthetic
> mfg from recycling used oil"


It surely is most interesting - to make synthetic from
recycling used oil.